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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2019 16:32:17 GMT -5
How poor preparation led to New York Giants blowing 1996 first-round NFL Draft pick By GREG GABRIEL -- @greggabe If you're familiar with my work, you know I often preach that clubs have to be prepared for the worst-case scenario on draft day. How do I know this? I had to go through a draft when the team that employed me wasn’t prepared for the worst-case scenario when it came time for us to make our first selection. The year was 1996, and I was a scout with the New York Giants. Back then, Rounds 1-3 of the draft were held on Saturday, April 20th and Rounds 4-7 were on Sunday, April 21st. The scouting staff traveled to New Jersey on Easter Sunday, April 7th, so that our final meetings could begin on Monday. When I was working for the Giants, we would stack the draft board top to bottom, beginning with the first round and on through seven rounds. That meant the board would include about 155 players. As each player was brought up, we would discuss him thoroughly before placing his name on the board. We then compared him to the other players who were already stacked above him. Anyone who wrote a report on a given player could speak on the player being discussed. Arguments on certain players could get lengthy — and sometimes heated — but in the end we felt we assigned the right grades In 1996, though, the meetings were a bit different. Dan Reeves was about to begin his fourth and final season as head coach of the Giants. In his first two years, Reeves led the Giants to winning records, and we went to the playoffs following the 1993 season. Ultimately, 1993 was our best year under Reeves, as our won/lost record got worse each succeeding season. With the losses, the relationship between Reeves and the scouting department and the front office got worse every year. Read more.... www.profootballweekly.com/2019/04/08/greg-gabriel-how-poor-preparation-led-to-new-york-giants-blowing-1996-first-round-nfl-draft-pick/avry2hc/
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2019 16:38:11 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2019 16:43:23 GMT -5
For those that wonder what kind of influence on a GM a personnel staff a strong minded HC can have...
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desertash
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The rule is perfect: in all matters of opinion our adversaries are insane. - Mark Twain
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Post by desertash on Apr 8, 2019 17:00:10 GMT -5
For those that wonder what kind of influence on a GM a personnel staff a strong minded HC can have... Also an example of a clear headed GM (Newsome) making the right call in spite of ownership desires.
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Post by TheAnalyst on Apr 8, 2019 17:09:20 GMT -5
Ha! Wow. Thats some incompetence right there. You have the 5th overall pick and only had a list of 4 guys? lol. I hope DG has a list of 6 guys right now like I do. Totally embarrassing. I feel like Reese did that a couple of times with Flowers and Apple.
PS, I miss those days:
"Back then, Rounds 1-3 of the draft were held on Saturday, April 20th and Rounds 4-7 were on Sunday, April 21st."
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Post by NAVY2323(ret) on Apr 8, 2019 17:22:57 GMT -5
Thanks Dan Reeves. Asswipe.
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DJones19
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Post by DJones19 on Apr 8, 2019 17:45:14 GMT -5
So we drafted a partially blind player at #5, and didn't look at any players outside the top 4-5 when drafting 5th? Hard to believe this story, sounds like a bitter scout who got fired.
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Post by Fletch842 on Apr 8, 2019 18:01:06 GMT -5
I was so pissed when we made that pick. Hated it from day 1. Personally, I think it was the worst pick we ever made.
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Post by giantlegacy on Apr 8, 2019 18:26:12 GMT -5
So we drafted a partially blind player at #5, and didn't look at any players outside the top 4-5 when drafting 5th? Hard to believe this story, sounds like a bitter scout who got fired. If anything it sounds like he is scapegoating Reeves(who proved in Atlanta 2 years later turning a dead franchise into a 14 and 2 juggernaut in 2018)with a spin story to protect the legacy of Young,who was 15 years behind the times in 1996 and so obstinate and uncompromising that he made this team an irrelevant boring bland laughingstock
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Post by allnygin on Apr 8, 2019 18:30:47 GMT -5
How anyone had a job after that is mind boggling if true.
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Post by TEM on Apr 8, 2019 18:52:00 GMT -5
Thanks Dan Reeves. Asswipe. You do know George Young was the GM . What is and total misguided about the piece . It portrays Reeves as the GM not Young. George Young ran the Draft when he was the GM not Reeves or any other coach . The Article IMO. Is complete and utter Bull S****
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Post by Deleted on Apr 8, 2019 18:53:53 GMT -5
Thanks Dan Reeves. Asswipe. You do know George Young was the GM . Young was a disaster in his later years.
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Post by TEM on Apr 8, 2019 18:56:13 GMT -5
You do know George Young was the GM . Young was a disaster in his later years. The Article is BS. Reeves never made Draft Decisions . Ever.
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Post by giantlegacy on Apr 8, 2019 19:01:01 GMT -5
Thanks Dan Reeves. Asswipe. You do know George Young was the GM . What is and total misguided about the piece . It portrays Reeves as the GM not Young. George Young ran the Draft when he was the GM not Reeves or any other coach . The Article IMO. Is complete and utter Bull S**** Young was the reason Parcells retired(the Jarrod Bunch pick in the 1st) Young was the reason we wouldn't get a head coach until Feb after Handley I would not be surprised if Young was coaxed into "retirement " after 1997 and Mara basically had to hire Fassel
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Post by TEM on Apr 8, 2019 19:09:51 GMT -5
You do know George Young was the GM . Young was a disaster in his later years. If young did not have a top 10 pick . He was average. In his first 6 years he had 5 top 10 pics. If he did not have that core of picks? 79 Phil Simms pick 7 80 Mark Haynes pick 8 81 LT pick 2 83 Terry Kennard pick 10 84 Carl Banks pick 4
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Post by TEM on Apr 8, 2019 19:13:47 GMT -5
You do know George Young was the GM . What is and total misguided about the piece . It portrays Reeves as the GM not Young. George Young ran the Draft when he was the GM not Reeves or any other coach . The Article IMO. Is complete and utter Bull S**** Young was the reason Parcells retired(the Jarrod Bunch pick in the 1st) Young was the reason we wouldn't get a head coach until Feb after Handley I would not be surprised if Young was coaxed into "retirement " after 1997 and Mara basically had to hire Fassel He let a 2 time SB winning HC coach walk because he would not give him any say. He gave Dan reeves say . HAHAHAHAH . The funniest BS story I have read in a while.
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Post by giantlegacy on Apr 8, 2019 19:19:37 GMT -5
Young was a disaster in his later years. If young did not have a top 10 pick . He was average. In his first 6 years he had 5 top 10 pics. If he did not have that core of picks? 79 Phil Simms pick 7 80 Mark Haynes pick 8 81 LT pick 2 83 Terry Kennard pick 10 84 Carl Banks pick 4 This team has been below average drafting for a long time.. Young builds the bulk of his team in the first 5 years and seemingly everyone thinks he was a God...he got lucky and then the league changed while he stayed stagnant Acorsi gets Eli and has a good draft and hits home runs on 3 top free agents and he is seen as a God...very below average Reese hits on his first 2 drafts and has a strong 2010 free agent class.... He is the antichrist yet to he honest basicly it's just more of the same.. I really hope this trend is cut off for the next few years at least
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Post by Kruunch on Apr 8, 2019 19:25:55 GMT -5
Young was a disaster in his later years. If young did not have a top 10 pick . He was average. In his first 6 years he had 5 top 10 pics. If he did not have that core of picks? 79 Phil Simms pick 7 80 Mark Haynes pick 8 81 LT pick 2 83 Terry Kennard pick 10 84 Carl Banks pick 4 Average? He found Tiki Barber in the 2nd. Strahan in the 2nd, Armstead in the 8th. Keith Hamilton in the 4th, Chad Bratzke in the 5th. I could go on.. But you should have known this.
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Post by NAVY2323(ret) on Apr 8, 2019 19:35:36 GMT -5
Thanks Dan Reeves. Asswipe. You do know George Young was the GM . What is and total misguided about the piece . It portrays Reeves as the GM not Young. George Young ran the Draft when he was the GM not Reeves or any other coach . The Article IMO. Is complete and utter Bull S**** So the GM had 2 ranked HOFers and 2 stellar players in the top 4, Reeves whined his way into getting Cedric Jones placed on the big board out of stuborness. When it fell through it went to a guy who was blind in one eye because of that. This is all straight from a guy who was inside the process. And to you it's utter BS? Uh, OK. You're entitled to your opinion, as misguided as it is.
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Post by TEM on Apr 8, 2019 19:40:52 GMT -5
If young did not have a top 10 pick . He was average. In his first 6 years he had 5 top 10 pics. If he did not have that core of picks? 79 Phil Simms pick 7 80 Mark Haynes pick 8 81 LT pick 2 83 Terry Kennard pick 10 84 Carl Banks pick 4 Average? He found Tiki Barber in the 2nd. Strahan in the 2nd, Armstead in the 8th. Keith Hamilton in the 4th, Chad Bratzke in the 5th. I could go on.. But you should have known this. His drafts wee average . He never once hit like Reese did in 07 through the entire draft. Without those top 10 picks that built the core . Could he achieved what he did? Maybe, Perhaps not.
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Post by TEM on Apr 8, 2019 19:44:43 GMT -5
You do know George Young was the GM . What is and total misguided about the piece . It portrays Reeves as the GM not Young. George Young ran the Draft when he was the GM not Reeves or any other coach . The Article IMO. Is complete and utter Bull S**** So the GM had 2 ranked HOFers and 2 stellar players in the top 4 , Reeves whined his way into getting Cedric Jones placed on the big board out of stuborness. When it fell through it went to a guy who was blind in one eye because of that. This is all straight from a guy who was inside the process. And to you it's utter BS? Uh, OK. You're entitled to your opinion, as misguided as it is. Do you really believe that? The same GM the let Parcells walk because he wanted input into the team build. I can not believe you can not smell the steaming pile of Bull. I do not care if he was inside or not. He needs clicks .
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coughlinscorner
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Post by coughlinscorner on Apr 8, 2019 19:46:44 GMT -5
Young was the reason Parcells retired(the Jarrod Bunch pick in the 1st) Young was the reason we wouldn't get a head coach until Feb after Handley I would not be surprised if Young was coaxed into "retirement " after 1997 and Mara basically had to hire Fassel He let a 2 time SB winning HC coach walk because he would not give him any say. He gave Dan reeves say . HAHAHAHAH . The funniest BS story I have read in a while. What fiction book did you read that tale in? Parcells quit in May 91 months after Belichick and TC took HC jobs. He cited health concerns at the time and was back on the sidelines 2 years later with the Pats. Not sure what you are talking about. If you think recent years have been bad for the Giants, you should have folled them in the 70s. George Young turned them from a laughingstock to a SB champion.
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Post by Kruunch on Apr 8, 2019 19:48:28 GMT -5
Average? He found Tiki Barber in the 2nd. Strahan in the 2nd, Armstead in the 8th. Keith Hamilton in the 4th, Chad Bratzke in the 5th. I could go on.. But you should have known this. His drafts wee average . He never once hit like Reese did in 07 through the entire draft. Without those top 10 picks that built the core . Could he achieved what he did? Maybe, Perhaps not. The ‘89 class can go toe to toe with the ‘07 class. Average? My God.. Now I’ve heard it all.
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Post by NAVY2323(ret) on Apr 8, 2019 19:50:51 GMT -5
So the GM had 2 ranked HOFers and 2 stellar players in the top 4 , Reeves whined his way into getting Cedric Jones placed on the big board out of stuborness. When it fell through it went to a guy who was blind in one eye because of that. This is all straight from a guy who was inside the process. And to you it's utter BS? Uh, OK. You're entitled to your opinion, as misguided as it is. Do you really believe that? The same GM the let Parcells walk because he wanted input into the team build. I can not believe you can not smell the steaming pile of Bull. I do not care if he was inside or not. He needs clicks . Reeves knew the organizational structure of the job that he was willing to take along with the money. He's not the first coach to do something like this. Gabriel was encouraged to write this piece by Peter King, pretty much the insider of insiders for over 20 years. You still don't think it's accurate? That's fine, I think you're wrong, but whatever.
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Post by TEM on Apr 8, 2019 19:53:45 GMT -5
He let a 2 time SB winning HC coach walk because he would not give him any say. He gave Dan reeves say . HAHAHAHAH . The funniest BS story I have read in a while. What fiction book did you read that tale in? Parcells quit in May 91 months after Belichick and TC took HC jobs. He cited health concerns at the time and was back on the sidelines 2 years later with the Pats. Not sure what you are talking about. If you think recent years have been bad for the Giants, you should have folled them in the 70s. George Young turned them from a laughingstock to a SB champion. Parcells quit because he wanted some control over the team build . gmenhq.com/2018/02/04/the-two-bills-shows-parcells-ruined-potential-new-york-giants-dynasty/As we see, Parcells seems to be a magnet for drama. He quit every head coaching position he had in the NFL and did so because he wanted universal control. Ironically, total team control was never in the DNA of the New York Giants.
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Post by TEM on Apr 8, 2019 19:55:00 GMT -5
His drafts wee average . He never once hit like Reese did in 07 through the entire draft. Without those top 10 picks that built the core . Could he achieved what he did? Maybe, Perhaps not. The ‘89 class can go toe to toe with the ‘07 class. Average? My God.. Now I’ve heard it all. That is a good point.
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Post by TEM on Apr 8, 2019 20:08:52 GMT -5
Do you really believe that? The same GM the let Parcells walk because he wanted input into the team build. I can not believe you can not smell the steaming pile of Bull. I do not care if he was inside or not. He needs clicks . Reeves knew the organizational structure of the job that he was willing to take along with the money. He's not the first coach to do something like this. Gabriel was encouraged to write this piece by Peter King, pretty much the insider of insiders for over 20 years. You still don't think it's accurate? That's fine, I think you're wrong, but whatever. Are you kidding . Young had full control . "period". He chose the Uniforms and Helmets . No way in hell, Young allows the HC to make the 5th pick in the draft. The notion of that is beyond hilarious. The guy is full of s###
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Post by NAVY2323(ret) on Apr 8, 2019 20:22:54 GMT -5
Reeves knew the organizational structure of the job that he was willing to take along with the money. He's not the first coach to do something like this. Gabriel was encouraged to write this piece by Peter King, pretty much the insider of insiders for over 20 years. You still don't think it's accurate? That's fine, I think you're wrong, but whatever. Are you kidding . Young had full control . "period". He chose the Uniforms and Helmets . No way in hell, Young allows the HC to make the 5th pick in the draft. The notion of that is beyond hilarious. The guy is full of s### Did you actually read the article? It doesn't say that, it says they fully expected one of their top 4 to be there at 5. They placed Jones in on their big board so highly to placate Reeves. Mara's close relationship made him believe that Phillips was going to be a Raven. When the top 4 were gone at 5 they panicked. I'm simply saying, as the article does, that they knee jerked and took Jones at #5 when they were unable to trade. It's a tale of the danger of lack of preparation. Jones was only at that slot to pacify Reeves. I said my initial comment as a jab at Reeves. The overall story is what can happen when there is lack of preparation and fracture in the draft decision structure. I personally believe it's 100% accurate. It also explains one of the larger draft mysteries of how we drafted such a chump with the 5th overall pick. Imagine if we took someone at #6 this year who had a known condition that we simply overlooked or didn't know about due to lack of investigation. Everyone in the process would be crucified. This is simply a look inside the process that led to one such exact "Giant" failure. I think it's 100% accurate and explains a great deal. What in the world does this guy have to gain by writing it ficticiously 23 years after the fact?
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Post by giants8493 on Apr 8, 2019 21:09:17 GMT -5
Ha! Wow. Thats some incompetence right there. You have the 5th overall pick and only had a list of 4 guys? lol. I hope DG has a list of 6 guys right now like I do. Totally embarrassing. I feel like Reese did that a couple of times with Flowers and Apple. PS, I miss those days: "Back then, Rounds 1-3 of the draft were held on Saturday, April 20th and Rounds 4-7 were on Sunday, April 21st." Should have a list 1-40. They have two first round picks and an early two you never know who is going to drop!
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Post by piddy283 on Apr 8, 2019 22:05:28 GMT -5
Ha! Wow. Thats some incompetence right there. You have the 5th overall pick and only had a list of 4 guys? lol. I hope DG has a list of 6 guys right now like I do. Totally embarrassing. I feel like Reese did that a couple of times with Flowers and Apple. PS, I miss those days: "Back then, Rounds 1-3 of the draft were held on Saturday, April 20th and Rounds 4-7 were on Sunday, April 21st." ......who're your six? Agreed about the Saturday/Sunday thing. As a kid, I loved watching it all weekend long. Now that I'm a bit older and there typically isn't anything on TV on Thurs/Fri nights, I don't mind the setup anymore. It breaks up my week, and allows me to golf on the weekend. Still, it was fun dedicating two full days to the draft rather than breaking it up for ratings purposes.
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