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Post by allnygin on Aug 22, 2019 0:56:54 GMT -5
Just help contribute to winning football thats it. Manning's careers is really f'n weird. You could write a book analyzing it honestly. Those superbowls were huge, but I want more consistency I want the giants to be a winning football team again. I'll take Daniel contributing to this teams turn around for a couple of seasons, then I expect at least three superbowls!
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Post by IrishMike on Aug 22, 2019 5:40:09 GMT -5
If his career matches Eli's, I will be estatic as well. You mean Eli the guy who other than two Super Bowl runs has been “one and done” in the playoffs the four other times he has made it in 16 years. The guy that lead the league in interceptions three times, one year throwing 27. and who has a career QB rating of 84.1. Eli Manning is a very average QB. I am hoping Jones far exceeds Eli. Yes that Eli.
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Post by IrishMike on Aug 22, 2019 5:46:13 GMT -5
how many of today's franchise QB's stay healthy.....they're all made out of paper. Tom Brady was quoted about 2 years ago saying that he thinks the #1 most important thing for a QB is being healthy. If you're not healthy you can't help win.
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Post by Speedman on Aug 22, 2019 6:49:34 GMT -5
You sound like a bitter Patriots fan. Actually I’m a bitter Giants fan because the guy that showed up for two Super Bowl runs but really for two drives at the end of two super bowls never performed at that level since. Still sound like a bitter Patriots fan. Doesn’t seem like you watched the other playoff games in those two runs.
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smitty
Special Teams
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Post by smitty on Aug 22, 2019 13:45:00 GMT -5
You sound like a bitter Patriots fan. Actually I’m a bitter Giants fan because the guy that showed up for two Super Bowl runs but really for two drives at the end of two super bowls never performed at that level since. This fails to acknowledge the other 6 playoff games on those two SB winning teams and his stats during those runs. They were impressive, with some big road wins, like in Dallas, GB (twice) and SF. It is not like they made the playoffs and went straight to the SB. Quite the contrary. The road to the big game is what makes winning a championship so difficult. In their two SB runs, I believe they had zero byes and a total of one home playoff game. Compare that to Brady and the Patsies, who routinely had the bye, with the only question being whether they were hosting the Championship game or going on the road. Under Brady, the Patriots have been to 13 AFC Championship games, winning 9, but with only three of those nine wins on the road, (2 in Pitt, one in KC). All six of N.E.'s SB victories under Brady have occurred when they were awarded a first round bye.
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Post by bringsimmsback on Aug 22, 2019 14:45:04 GMT -5
This question is on every team's mind as well. Assuming there are no major changes to free agency with the new CBA, starting QBs on a second contract will be taking up huge portions of CAP space. Prescott, the poster boy for easy to replace QB, has turned down 30 mil a year. For those saying it is just about winning, I think it is more about the ability to win more than actual wins. The QB is the most important part of the offense, not the only part. Eli's last playoff appearance is a good example: he looked like 2011 Eli but our receivers and defense didn't look like their 2011 counterparts. There are maby 10 to 12 QBs a year who can read a defense, stay calm and make the throws. Of those, 0 to 2 can "take a team on their back" for an extended period of time. GMs are in a tough spot when they have that 13th QB who looks like he may be worth keeping instead of looking for a rookie. I think teams are going to start investing high picks on QBs in preparation for letting there current guy walk when he turns down realistic contracts. If you don't have an obviously great QB by that QBs 4th year, draft his expected replacement that year, is my opinion. If the current guy gets it together, trade the guy you drafted.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Aug 22, 2019 16:41:43 GMT -5
I would say winning but if the QB does not have talent around him it ain't gonna happen. So we have to look deeper accuracy anticipation and some wheels to move about the pocket and take what a defense gives, hart to get back up off the deck and keep slinging it whether it is a physical beating he's getting up from or a 3 pick game gotta be able get back on track physically and mentally.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Aug 22, 2019 16:49:29 GMT -5
Besides Brady what QB's have done better with the playoffs than Eli since Eli has come into the league? You know, I really appreciate the two Super Bowl runs, I really do. But when you look outside of that he has been very pedestrian. 84.1 career QB rating is very average. And you speak of his longevity, you have to realize the guy does not stand in the pocket and take a hit to make throws, actually to the contrary he is prone to get rid of the ball in a panic fashion to avoid taking the hit, which maybe contributed to his high interception rate. I don’t mean to rank on the guy, I want him to do well. I just don’t see him as this special QB that a lot of people think he is. He was special twice, and had to have a DB drop an interception, and two receivers make all world catches to get his two super bowls. Nevertheless that happened, and I’m glad it did. But if he gets into the HOF for getting hot twice, Tiki Barber should also get in for his two last seasons where was basically the Giants offense those years. Go back to San Fran in the championship game. I don't care what QB it is if you beat him down week in and week out it will get to him. The Giants took Bradey's perfect season by beating the tar out of him for a measly 4 QTs San Fran put a bigger beating on Manning and he stood tall, the Giants have been putrid the last 6-7 years on the OL in both the run game and passing game. There is much more to it then just bailing this was an accumulative thing years of hits and sacks.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Aug 22, 2019 16:55:49 GMT -5
Outside of 8 games just about all of them Agreed...if you remove all of the positives a player has, you are left with a below average player. One analyst said take away 2 throws what has Manning done lol the one to manning ham was so perfect you couldn't have handed it to him better. Now if Brady Rothlesberger or Rivers Rodgers dropped that ball in there like that no questions asked great throw. Or no one ever mentions that in big bens first superbowl he did nothing think he was or in the top 3 with the least passing yards in a superbowl they rode the run game and a great defense to the trophy stand. Eli just doesn't get much respect.
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smitty
Special Teams
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Post by smitty on Aug 22, 2019 17:05:28 GMT -5
You know, I really appreciate the two Super Bowl runs, I really do. But when you look outside of that he has been very pedestrian. 84.1 career QB rating is very average. And you speak of his longevity, you have to realize the guy does not stand in the pocket and take a hit to make throws, actually to the contrary he is prone to get rid of the ball in a panic fashion to avoid taking the hit, which maybe contributed to his high interception rate. I don’t mean to rank on the guy, I want him to do well. I just don’t see him as this special QB that a lot of people think he is. He was special twice, and had to have a DB drop an interception, and two receivers make all world catches to get his two super bowls. Nevertheless that happened, and I’m glad it did. But if he gets into the HOF for getting hot twice, Tiki Barber should also get in for his two last seasons where was basically the Giants offense those years. Go back to San Fran in the championship game. I don't care what QB it is if you beat him down week in and week out it will get to him. The Giants took Bradey's perfect season by beating the tar out of him for a measly 4 QTs San Fran put a bigger beating on Manning and he stood tall, the Giants have been putrid the last 6-7 years on the OL in both the run game and passing game. There is much more to it then just bailing this was an accumulative thing years of hits and sacks. The beating Manning took in that SF Championship game is legendary. He stood tall and kept us in the game until we were able to capitalize on the ST mistake. In six playoff trips Eli managed to be an integral part of two championships. A 33% chance to win the SB after making the playoffs is not too shabby. It sounds like a man who made the most of his limited opportunities. Do you think anyone in Green Bay or New Orleans cares about how many playoff games their QB’s have participated in?
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smitty
Special Teams
Posts: 904
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Post by smitty on Aug 22, 2019 17:22:21 GMT -5
Agreed...if you remove all of the positives a player has, you are left with a below average player. One analyst said take away 2 throws what has Manning done lol the one to manning ham was so perfect you couldn't have handed it to him better. Now if Brady Rothlesberger or Rivers Rodgers dropped that ball in there like that no questions asked great throw. Or no one ever mentions that in big bens first superbowl he did nothing think he was or in the top 3 with the least passing yards in a superbowl they rode the run game and a great defense to the trophy stand. Eli just doesn't get much respect. Roethlesberger went 9-21-123-0-2, with a rushing TD in his first SB, with a QBR of 22.6. That’s poor. He played much better in his 2nd SB victory however, but also managed to lose a SB. I’m sure all the talking heads assume he is a lock as a first-ballot HoFer.
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Post by Sarcasman on Aug 22, 2019 17:47:40 GMT -5
Agreed...if you remove all of the positives a player has, you are left with a below average player. One analyst said take away 2 throws what has Manning done lol the one to manning ham was so perfect you couldn't have handed it to him better. Now if Brady Rothlesberger or Rivers Rodgers dropped that ball in there like that no questions asked great throw. Or no one ever mentions that in big bens first superbowl he did nothing think he was or in the top 3 with the least passing yards in a superbowl they rode the run game and a great defense to the trophy stand. Eli just doesn't get much respect. A lot of people have lots and lot sf feelings and talk a lot. Not a lot of people actually analyze individuals playoff performances and stat lines and compare them. For obvious reasons.
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