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Post by trueblueatnyc on Nov 26, 2019 10:54:49 GMT -5
Barkley’s not even on the injury report at all. Did his ankle make him drop that pass right in his hands against the Bears? Or cause him to put up zero resistance on his pass blocking? If excuses were wins, this team would be undefeated. [br DG, this Oline, and Saquon Barkley are all intertwined. The line and Barkley were DG’s stamp on this roster. Both are his. Yet the Jokeksnd Raiders put together a better running game in their managements 2 years. The Browns GM was hired at the same time as well, Chubb is 10 yards off the rushing lead and they hand Kareem Hunt to boot, both playing behind a line that is weaker than ours they just took Zeitler from them. Then there is record. Raiders 6-5, Browns 5-6, Giants 2-9. These guys all took over at the same time. Others are improving, for the Giants it’s “too soon to evaluate”. NO IT ISNT. Browns were supposed to be a playoff contending team this year. The Raiders have a veteran QB while we are playing a rookie, and for all the flak people give DG for the signing ODB then trading him, but yet you seem to have forgotten about the Raiders trading for AB, giving him a huge contract and then cutting him. Yes, when you have a team with a Rookie QB and having replaced the vast majority of it's veterans with young players, you give the team time to grow.
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Post by TCHOF on Nov 26, 2019 10:57:18 GMT -5
Barkley was the best player on the Giants last year and that includes OBJ. Now all of the idiots come out to bash Barkley. ****ing amazing. lol ... are you going to repeat this pattern again? Refusing to criticize a player because of what he did in the past?
Maybe if you stopped actually falling in love with these players, you would have the objectivity to see when they are not playing well in the present.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2019 10:58:58 GMT -5
[br DG, this Oline, and Saquon Barkley are all intertwined. The line and Barkley were DG’s stamp on this roster. Both are his. Yet the Jokeksnd Raiders put together a better running game in their managements 2 years. The Browns GM was hired at the same time as well, Chubb is 10 yards off the rushing lead and they hand Kareem Hunt to boot, both playing behind a line that is weaker than ours they just took Zeitler from them. Then there is record. Raiders 6-5, Browns 5-6, Giants 2-9. These guys all took over at the same time. Others are improving, for the Giants it’s “too soon to evaluate”. NO IT ISNT. Browns were supposed to be a playoff contending team this year. The Raiders have a veteran QB while we are playing a rookie, and for all the flak people give DG for the signing ODB then trading him, but yet you seem to have forgotten about the Raiders trading for AB, giving him a huge contract and then cutting him. Yes, when you have a team with a Rookie QB and having replaced the vast majority of it's veterans with young players, you give the team time to grow. They tried to play this season with a veteran QB but he wasn't getting it done. The biggest mess with this team is the oline so please give an excuse for this unit since they are 4 vets with one high draft pick?
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Post by TheAnalyst on Nov 26, 2019 11:12:29 GMT -5
Browns were supposed to be a playoff contending team this year. The Raiders have a veteran QB while we are playing a rookie, and for all the flak people give DG for the signing ODB then trading him, but yet you seem to have forgotten about the Raiders trading for AB, giving him a huge contract and then cutting him. Yes, when you have a team with a Rookie QB and having replaced the vast majority of it's veterans with young players, you give the team time to grow. They tried to play this season with a veteran QB but he wasn't getting it done. The biggest mess with this team is the oline so please give an excuse for this unit since they are 4 vets with one high draft pick? The thing even more concerning is that is Gettlemans rebuilt OL completely.
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soflo
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Post by soflo on Nov 26, 2019 11:17:39 GMT -5
I think my head would explode from the irony of Barkley turning into a 1 year hit / draft bust and Daniel Jones a HOF quarterback.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2019 11:17:41 GMT -5
They tried to play this season with a veteran QB but he wasn't getting it done. The biggest mess with this team is the oline so please give an excuse for this unit since they are 4 vets with one high draft pick? The thing even more concerning is that is Gettlemans rebuilt OL completely. This should be the nail in his coffin for his job!!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2019 11:18:29 GMT -5
I think my head would explode from the irony of Barkley turning into a 1 year hit / draft bust and Daniel Jones a HOF quarterback. Nice one.. That could happen but never though of it.
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soflo
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Post by soflo on Nov 26, 2019 11:21:08 GMT -5
They tried to play this season with a veteran QB but he wasn't getting it done. The biggest mess with this team is the oline so please give an excuse for this unit since they are 4 vets with one high draft pick? The thing even more concerning is that is Gettlemans rebuilt OL completely. How is Andrew Norwell doing? If Gettleman was able to lure him then we wouldn't have this albatross LT contract from a guy who isn't even worth a quarter of that salary.
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soflo
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Post by soflo on Nov 26, 2019 11:23:05 GMT -5
I think my head would explode from the irony of Barkley turning into a 1 year hit / draft bust and Daniel Jones a HOF quarterback. Nice one.. That could happen but never though of it. What freaks me out is that Trent Richardson had a really good rookie year and then disappeared from the field...and then from the league.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 26, 2019 11:26:18 GMT -5
Nice one.. That could happen but never though of it. What freaks me out is that Trent Richardson had a really good rookie year and then disappeared from the field...and then from the league. I never thought he even had a good year.
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Post by trueblueatnyc on Nov 26, 2019 11:39:10 GMT -5
Browns were supposed to be a playoff contending team this year. The Raiders have a veteran QB while we are playing a rookie, and for all the flak people give DG for the signing ODB then trading him, but yet you seem to have forgotten about the Raiders trading for AB, giving him a huge contract and then cutting him. Yes, when you have a team with a Rookie QB and having replaced the vast majority of it's veterans with young players, you give the team time to grow. They tried to play this season with a veteran QB but he wasn't getting it done. The biggest mess with this team is the oline so please give an excuse for this unit since they are 4 vets with one high draft pick? Yes, the Giants followed the same process that the vast majority of teams with rookie QBs do, they let the veteran start the season to take pressure off their rookie. If they were truly so tied to making a run with Eli, they would not have pulled him after only two games. I do agree that the OL is certainly a concern and DG hasn't fixed it. And that happens sometimes, units don't turn out to be what you thought them to be. It comes down to this. Everyone on these boards acknowledged that Dave Gettleman was taking over a team that had suffered from nearly a decade of mismanagement. He took over a team with no cap space, a bunch of over paid vets, an aging QB that the owner wasn't ready to let go, and a locker room that had just completely imploded the season before. We all knew this was supposed to be a multi year rebuilding project. Going into next offseason the teams' cap has been fixed and will be flushed with money, the lockeroom culture if obviously improved seeing as how despite the teams' struggles you can see them all playing hard and there hasn't been any media blow-ups like we saw in 2017, we've finally moved to our (hopeful) QB of the future, and we are entering next year's draft (even with the traded picks), with a bunch of draft picks. So yeah, the OL hasn't been fixed, but unlike in previous years we actually have the cap space and the picks to try and correct mistakes.
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Post by TEM on Nov 26, 2019 11:52:14 GMT -5
This is why it takes years to judge these drafts. What if Barkley is never the same and deals with injuries ala David Wilson? That pick would look atrocious. You can make this argument with any top 5 pick. Or any pick Chad Jones.
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2018 Draft
Nov 26, 2019 11:58:04 GMT -5
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Post by giantsback2020 on Nov 26, 2019 11:58:04 GMT -5
[br DG, this Oline, and Saquon Barkley are all intertwined. The line and Barkley were DG’s stamp on this roster. Both are his. Yet the Jokeksnd Raiders put together a better running game in their managements 2 years. The Browns GM was hired at the same time as well, Chubb is 10 yards off the rushing lead and they hand Kareem Hunt to boot, both playing behind a line that is weaker than ours they just took Zeitler from them. Then there is record. Raiders 6-5, Browns 5-6, Giants 2-9. These guys all took over at the same time. Others are improving, for the Giants it’s “too soon to evaluate”. NO IT ISNT. Browns were supposed to be a playoff contending team this year. The Raiders have a veteran QB while we are playing a rookie, and for all the flak people give DG for the signing ODB then trading him, but yet you seem to have forgotten about the Raiders trading for AB, giving him a huge contract and then cutting him. Yes, when you have a team with a Rookie QB and having replaced the vast majority of it's veterans with young players, you give the team time to grow. I don’t care what anyone was supposed to be. Im talking about GMs that took over bad trans the same time as DG took over here. The Browns were coming off 0-16. Gruden was being laughed at for trading Mack and Cooper. Both the Raiders and Browns are much better than the Giants 2 years into their new programs. The Giants played Eli for 18 games, he’s a vet. The Browns Gabe played a young QB and won at a much higher rate than the Giants are winning with their young QB.
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2018 Draft
Nov 26, 2019 11:58:34 GMT -5
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Post by giantsback2020 on Nov 26, 2019 11:58:34 GMT -5
[br DG, this Oline, and Saquon Barkley are all intertwined. The line and Barkley were DG’s stamp on this roster. Both are his. Yet the Jokeksnd Raiders put together a better running game in their managements 2 years. The Browns GM was hired at the same time as well, Chubb is 10 yards off the rushing lead and they hand Kareem Hunt to boot, both playing behind a line that is weaker than ours they just took Zeitler from them. Then there is record. Raiders 6-5, Browns 5-6, Giants 2-9. These guys all took over at the same time. Others are improving, for the Giants it’s “too soon to evaluate”. NO IT ISNT. Browns were supposed to be a playoff contending team this year. The Raiders have a veteran QB while we are playing a rookie, and for all the flak people give DG for the signing ODB then trading him, but yet you seem to have forgotten about the Raiders trading for AB, giving him a huge contract and then cutting him. Yes, when you have a team with a Rookie QB and having replaced the vast majority of it's veterans with young players, you give the team time to grow. I don’t care what anyone was supposed to be. Im talking about GMs that took over bad trans the same time as DG took over here. The Browns were coming off 0-16. Gruden was being laughed at for trading Mack and Cooper. Both the Raiders and Browns are much better than the Giants 2 years into their new programs. The Giants played Eli for 18 games, he’s a vet. The Browns Gabe played a young QB and won at a much higher rate than the Giants are winning with their young QB.
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2018 Draft
Nov 26, 2019 11:59:30 GMT -5
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Post by giantsback2020 on Nov 26, 2019 11:59:30 GMT -5
This is why it takes years to judge these drafts. What if Barkley is never the same and deals with injuries ala David Wilson? That pick would look atrocious. You can make this argument with any top 5 pick. Or any pick Chad Jones. Not everybody pick had the trade value of the Barkley pick. Not close.
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Post by McCherry on Nov 26, 2019 12:00:54 GMT -5
If we're hiring a new coach, the first thing I do is trade Barkley for a late first round pick.
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2018 Draft
Nov 26, 2019 12:05:14 GMT -5
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Post by giantsback2020 on Nov 26, 2019 12:05:14 GMT -5
If we're hiring a new coach, the first thing I do is trade Barkley for a late first round pick. This GM won’t trade him. If we hired a new GM that would be a phase 1 maneuver. Reinvest those assets.
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Post by TEM on Nov 26, 2019 12:12:21 GMT -5
You can make this argument with any top 5 pick. Or any pick Chad Jones. Not everybody pick had the trade value of the Barkley pick. Not close. So how does a player's injury conclude to trade value? 1st round picks play. Players that play can get injured and at times career ending.. That is a fact. You do not have to believe that. That doesn't change the facts. To even speculate, the GM shouldn't pick him because he is going play and he may get an injury. Is not what any GM does. Especially if his injury history is low. If a team has a GM that uses what you are suggesting , then he need to get fired. Saquon problem is he is not 100% , he is showing effect of it.
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Post by giantsback2020 on Nov 26, 2019 12:26:38 GMT -5
Not everybody pick had the trade value of the Barkley pick. Not close. So how does a player's injury conclude to trade value? 1st round picks play. Players that play can get injured and at times career ending.. That is a fact. You do not have to believe that. That doesn't change the facts. To even speculate, the GM shouldn't pick him because he is going play and he may get an injury. Is not what any GM does. Especially if his injury history is low. If a team has a GM that uses what you are suggesting , then he need to get fired. Saquon problis he is not 100% , he is showing effect of it. Barkley is a RB. RBs get hurt. That’s why you don’t take one # 2 overall. If you have 2-3 RBs sharing the load, none of whom you built the team around when any of them are hurt the best goes on. The problem with Barkley is are lacking in other areas for sure, the asset it took to get him could have aided those areas greatly. Would you trade Barkley and a # 35 overall for Nick Chubb and # 2 overall? That’s the Giants v the Browns draft day 2018. The difference is when a RB is hurt they lose their impact. A high ankle sprain is not rendering a QB or OT useless. Aside from all else I don’t like Barkley’s running style. Dancers are not winning RBs. What you want is a guy who is consistently moving forward and then busting one from time to time. With Barkley the guy is averaging 2 yards a carry over 90% of his career carries. Then he pops a few to make his YPA look okay, but on the regular series he’s giving us 2 carries for 4 yards.
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Post by GMenNY21 on Nov 26, 2019 12:33:21 GMT -5
Alot of u guys r way overreacting a down year for a great player whose been injured since week 3. He was dominate in the first 2 weeks this year before the injury but people want to act like he's been trash since week 1 smh.
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Post by TEM on Nov 26, 2019 12:36:49 GMT -5
So how does a player's injury conclude to trade value? 1st round picks play. Players that play can get injured and at times career ending.. That is a fact. You do not have to believe that. That doesn't change the facts. To even speculate, the GM shouldn't pick him because he is going play and he may get an injury. Is not what any GM does. Especially if his injury history is low. If a team has a GM that uses what you are suggesting , then he need to get fired. Saquon problis he is not 100% , he is showing effect of it. Barkley is a RB. RBs get hurt. That’s why you don’t take one # 2 overall. If you have 2-3 RBs sharing the load, none of whom you built the team around when any of them are hurt the best goes on. The problem with Barkley is are lacking in other areas for sure, the asset it took to get him could have aided those areas greatly. Would you trade Barkley and a # 35 overall for Nick Chubb and # 2 overall? That’s the Giants v the Browns draft day 2018. The difference is when a RB is hurt they lose their impact. A high ankle sprain is not rendering a QB or OT useless. Aside from all else I don’t like Barkley’s running style. Dancers are not winning RBs. What you want is a guy who is consistently moving forward and then busting one from time to time. With Barkley the guy is averaging 2 yards a carry over 90% of his career carries. Then he pops a few to make his YPA look okay, but on the regular series he’s giving us 2 carries for 4 yards. You can not be a GM with that thinking . A fan yes . A GM must take the BPA on his board period. Or he is inept. The only time you trade out of that pick: The BPA on your board is rated as lower pick in the draft. A QB is BPA and you do not need a QB. You get an offer that is so absurd. You cannot refuse it.
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2018 Draft
Nov 26, 2019 12:45:20 GMT -5
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Post by giantsback2020 on Nov 26, 2019 12:45:20 GMT -5
Barkley is a RB. RBs get hurt. That’s why you don’t take one # 2 overall. If you have 2-3 RBs sharing the load, none of whom you built the team around when any of them are hurt the best goes on. The problem with Barkley is are lacking in other areas for sure, the asset it took to get him could have aided those areas greatly. Would you trade Barkley and a # 35 overall for Nick Chubb and # 2 overall? That’s the Giants v the Browns draft day 2018. The difference is when a RB is hurt they lose their impact. A high ankle sprain is not rendering a QB or OT useless. Aside from all else I don’t like Barkley’s running style. Dancers are not winning RBs. What you want is a guy who is consistently moving forward and then busting one from time to time. With Barkley the guy is averaging 2 yards a carry over 90% of his career carries. Then he pops a few to make his YPA look okay, but on the regular series he’s giving us 2 carries for 4 yards. You can not be a GM with that thinking . A fan yeas . A GM must take the BPA on his board period. Or he is inept. The only time you trade out of that pick: The BPA on your board is rated as lower pick in the draft. A QB is BPA and you do not need a QB. You get an offer that is so absurd. You cannot refuse it. Positional value is part of a GMs job. Positions have value, value which can be seen in salary. Certain positions are paid a premium for a reason. Our roster is void of good players at the hardest and most expensive positions to fill. If we want a great pass rusher on the open market if one ever makes it there would cost us $20 million a year. Solder an average OT cost us $15 million a year. We could sign virtually any RB in the league for half or less of that. We could have had bell for cash this offseason. This coming offseason Gordon will be out there. Very few teams value RB. The other top kid RBs drafted high the last few years are all on par with Barkley. Chubb was a better RB in college and he’s a better RB in the pros. He went 33 spots behind him. That guy averaged 6.3 YPC in the SEC, Barkley averaged 5 in the Big 10. As pros Chubb has continued to be the superior runner.
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Post by giantlegacy on Nov 26, 2019 12:46:59 GMT -5
Alot of u guys r way overreacting a down year for a great player whose been injured since week 3. He was dominate in the first 2 weeks this year before the injury but people want to act like he's been trash since week 1 smh. Many of the knee jerkers I'm getting an unfortunate sense are either sock puppet accounts of one or 2 people or new accounts of previously banned posters. The hot takes all seem to have a similar and familiar feel
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Post by McCherry on Nov 26, 2019 12:54:58 GMT -5
If we're hiring a new coach, the first thing I do is trade Barkley for a late first round pick. This GM won’t trade him. If we hired a new GM that would be a phase 1 maneuver. Reinvest those assets. And the Giants won't hire a coach who doesn't want to build with Barkley.
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Post by TEM on Nov 26, 2019 12:59:10 GMT -5
You can not be a GM with that thinking . A fan yeas . A GM must take the BPA on his board period. Or he is inept. The only time you trade out of that pick: The BPA on your board is rated as lower pick in the draft. A QB is BPA and you do not need a QB. You get an offer that is so absurd. You cannot refuse it. Positional value is part of a GMs job. Positions have value, value which can be seen in salary. Certain positions are paid a premium for a reason. Our roster is void of good players at the hardest and most expensive positions to fill. If we want a great pass rusher on the open market if one ever makes it there would cost us $20 million a year. Solder an average OT cost us $15 million a year. We could sign virtually any RB in the league for half or less of that. We could have had bell for cash this offseason. This coming offseason Gordon will be out there. Very few teams value RB. The other top kid RBs drafted high the last few years are all on par with Barkley. Chubb was a better RB in college and he’s a better RB in the pros. He went 33 spots behind him. That guy averaged 6.3 YPC in the SEC, Barkley averaged 5 in the Big 10. As pros Chubb has continued to be the superior runner. You are speaking as a fan not a GM. Fans can always use the after the fact BLAH BLAH narrative It makes the fan appear insightful, No not really The difference between the GM and the fan.
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Post by trueblueatnyc on Nov 26, 2019 13:03:03 GMT -5
Browns were supposed to be a playoff contending team this year. The Raiders have a veteran QB while we are playing a rookie, and for all the flak people give DG for the signing ODB then trading him, but yet you seem to have forgotten about the Raiders trading for AB, giving him a huge contract and then cutting him. Yes, when you have a team with a Rookie QB and having replaced the vast majority of it's veterans with young players, you give the team time to grow. I don’t care what anyone was supposed to be. Im talking about GMs that took over bad trans the same time as DG took over here. The Browns were coming off 0-16. Gruden was being laughed at for trading Mack and Cooper. Both the Raiders and Browns are much better than the Giants 2 years into their new programs. The Giants played Eli for 18 games, he’s a vet. The Browns Gabe played a young QB and won at a much higher rate than the Giants are winning with their young QB. You're the one who chose to compare the Giants those two organizations. Don't get mad when the full range of facts don't add up to the narrative that you want to convey. Again, the Browns are a bad team. Are you really harping on them having 3 more wins than this team? Also, by your same logic, the 49ers should have ousted Kyler Shannahan after two years, afterall, his first year they went 6-10 and then they got worse at 4-12 the following year. Like, what the hell do you think a rebuild looks like?
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2018 Draft
Nov 26, 2019 13:10:14 GMT -5
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Post by giantsback2020 on Nov 26, 2019 13:10:14 GMT -5
I don’t care what anyone was supposed to be. Im talking about GMs that took over bad trans the same time as DG took over here. The Browns were coming off 0-16. Gruden was being laughed at for trading Mack and Cooper. Both the Raiders and Browns are much better than the Giants 2 years into their new programs. The Giants played Eli for 18 games, he’s a vet. The Browns Gabe played a young QB and won at a much higher rate than the Giants are winning with their young QB. You're the one who chose to compare the Giants those two organizations. Don't get mad when the full range of facts don't add up to the narrative that you want to convey. Again, the Browns are a bad team. Are you really harping on them having 3 more wins than this team? Also, by your same logic, the 49ers should have ousted Kyler Shannahan after two years, afterall, his first year they went 6-10 and then they got worse at 4-12 the following year. Like, what the hell do you think a rebuild looks like? Kyle Shanahan lost his QB in year 2. They looked very good in year 1 after the Jimmy G trade. Just stop the nonsense. The Browns have 12 wins and and tie under their new GM coming off 0-16. The Giants have 7 wins and this deficit will grow over the final 5 games. Gettleman and Shurmur have been the worst GM/HC lairimginb innthe league over the last 2 years. Lynch/Shanahan is an elite pairing. Lol @ the Niners comparison.
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Post by nick030567 on Nov 26, 2019 13:17:16 GMT -5
Barkley will look as good or better than last season when the following happens (it's really simple)...
1. He's fully healed.
2. Shurmur stops running him right up the middle 95% of the time (starts providing BALANCE between inside and outside runs). Do you know how easy it is for the defense to stop their running game when they know where they'll run it?
3. The offensive line blocks better on a consistent, week to week basis.
Barkley did good despite an atrocious OL last season. The difference is that his coach didn't run him up the guy 95% of the time, he actually had the common sense to provide something closer to a 50/50 balance between inside and outside runs.
The biggest problem I've seen with Barkley all year is he has dropped a lot of passes going back to the 1st two games with Eli.
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2018 Draft
Nov 26, 2019 13:39:17 GMT -5
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Post by giantsback2020 on Nov 26, 2019 13:39:17 GMT -5
I don’t care what anyone was supposed to be. Im talking about GMs that took over bad trans the same time as DG took over here. The Browns were coming off 0-16. Gruden was being laughed at for trading Mack and Cooper. Both the Raiders and Browns are much better than the Giants 2 years into their new programs. The Giants played Eli for 18 games, he’s a vet. The Browns Gabe played a young QB and won at a much higher rate than the Giants are winning with their young QB. You're the one who chose to compare the Giants those two organizations. Don't get mad when the full range of facts don't add up to the narrative that you want to convey. Again, the Browns are a bad team. Are you really harping on them having 3 more wins than this team? Also, by your same logic, the 49ers should have ousted Kyler Shannahan after two years, afterall, his first year they went 6-10 and then they got worse at 4-12 the following year. Like, what the hell do you think a rebuild looks like? Lol at this response. Niners - dealt for Jimmy G during year 1 and looked excellent with him, lost him to injury year 2. Have we lost a starting QB I’m unaware of? Browns - were coming off 0-16 when their GM was hired at the same time as our GM. They’ve won 12 games with a tie, we have won 7. They’ll finish 9-7, we will finish between 2-14 and 4-12 to further that gap. Raiders - 6-5 Our GM has not solved building block positions ie pass rusher, offensive tackles, cornerback, safety. His line guy to hang his hat in right now is the QB flashing some good with some awful. His job is the overall roster and it stinks. Our present and immediate future are ugly. They’ll F up getting Chase Young guaranteed in their latest blunder. Stacking bad decisions is not a rebuild.
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2018 Draft
Nov 26, 2019 13:42:50 GMT -5
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Post by giantsback2020 on Nov 26, 2019 13:42:50 GMT -5
Positional value is part of a GMs job. Positions have value, value which can be seen in salary. Certain positions are paid a premium for a reason. Our roster is void of good players at the hardest and most expensive positions to fill. If we want a great pass rusher on the open market if one ever makes it there would cost us $20 million a year. Solder an average OT cost us $15 million a year. We could sign virtually any RB in the league for half or less of that. We could have had bell for cash this offseason. This coming offseason Gordon will be out there. Very few teams value RB. The other top kid RBs drafted high the last few years are all on par with Barkley. Chubb was a better RB in college and he’s a better RB in the pros. He went 33 spots behind him. That guy averaged 6.3 YPC in the SEC, Barkley averaged 5 in the Big 10. As pros Chubb has continued to be the superior runner. You are speaking as a fan not a GM. Fans can always use the after the fact BLAH BLAH narrative It makes the fan appear insightful, No not really The difference between the GM and the fan. Salaries and draft slots is not fan talk. Tell me the RB making as much as Nate Solder. Tell me the other NFL teams who have taken a RB # 2 overall in the last decade. Email the site admin to allow increased room for the big list. RBs dont go # 2. Barkley isn’t special. Sportscenter highlight runs created his hype. Our GM was the sucker.
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