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Post by GameTime on Jan 18, 2020 11:15:34 GMT -5
My biggest question is why did the Dallas offense take off under Moore after Garrett was calling the plays for years? Exactly. I mean its is really that cut and dry? no its not... Does the HC get credit? they sure get the blame...
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Post by shocknaweny on Jan 18, 2020 11:20:10 GMT -5
He got the Cowboys to the Playoffs A LOT !!!
and do not give me talent....the Giants offense has oodles of talent with Jones, Barkley and Slayton
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Post by nygiantsfan1029 on Jan 18, 2020 11:33:36 GMT -5
He got the Cowboys to the Playoffs A LOT !!! and do not give me talent....the Giants offense has oodles of talent with Jones, Barkley and Slayton Garrett? Actually as a head coach no. 3 times in almost 10 years.’
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Post by shocknaweny on Jan 18, 2020 11:36:56 GMT -5
Really feels like more
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Post by nygiantsfan1029 on Jan 18, 2020 11:39:09 GMT -5
Well when you root for the giants and they only been to the playoffs once since 2011 I can see that
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Post by bluejayc on Jan 18, 2020 11:45:09 GMT -5
Did you save post links to play "gotcha" with posters? I guess it's easy to track those posters because they aren't constantly changing their username and avatar so they can hide behind a new persona ever now and then like some......it's like having burner accounts
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Post by bluejayc on Jan 18, 2020 11:49:16 GMT -5
Not wow'd by the hire nor overly dismayed....the only concern I have is Judge preached bringing coaches in who could get the most out of their players yet that was one of the reasons Garrett was not retained in Dallas....underachieving. Hopefully it pans out.
Hell I think all you have to really do to have a successful offense with the Giants is make a concentrated effort to get Barkley the ball in open space or one on one edge situations instead of pounding his head into the back of interior lineman's asses 30 times a game.....playcalling was nauseating. You put him in the right situations that'll lead to a ton of points on its own.
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Post by GameTime on Jan 18, 2020 11:54:49 GMT -5
Not wow'd by the hire nor overly dismayed....the only concern I have is Judge preached bringing coaches in who could get the most out of their players yet that was one of the reasons Garrett was not retained in Dallas....underachieving. Hopefully it pans out. Hell I think all you have to really do to have a successful offense with the Giants is make a concentrated effort to get Barkley the ball in open space or one on one edge situations instead of pounding his head into the back of interior lineman's asses 30 times a game.....playcalling was nauseating. You put him in the right situations that'll lead to a ton of points on its own. he was in Dallas for over 9 seasons.........not a 3 and out type coaching tenure there. he has had enough success in his career to warrant as good hire for OC. If had won a championship or a SB he would not have been available....,lol
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Post by TEM on Jan 18, 2020 12:17:11 GMT -5
Please, no more shotgun draw plays. All teams run this (and all team's fans complain about it) And it only produced . The RB caught in the backfield. Put the Qb behind center . Let Saquon hit the hole with momentum.
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Post by nygiantsfan1029 on Jan 18, 2020 12:26:29 GMT -5
When you consider some other candidates its not a bad move. However we could see this on a barkley 1 yard gain. That’s what I’ve been saying Jones. We could’ve done a lot worse the Garrett. I’d rather Garrett with his experience then a big name college coach with no NFL experience to help Judge
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2020 12:29:11 GMT -5
He got the Cowboys to the Playoffs A LOT !!! and do not give me talent....the Giants offense has oodles of talent with Jones, Barkley and Slayton 3 times in 10 years. Granted it's more than the Giants, but it doesn't quite equal "alot".
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Post by Eagles R. Guano on Jan 18, 2020 12:31:43 GMT -5
He got the Cowboys to the Playoffs A LOT !!! and do not give me talent....the Giants offense has oodles of talent with Jones, Barkley and Slayton Garrett? Actually as a head coach no. 3 times in almost 10 years.’ Beat me to it. 3 years when he was calling plays they were 8-8. Shoulda progressed in the playoffs in 2014, 2016, and 2018 and was out coached every time. Callahan left (2015) when they gave play calling to Linehan and he wanted it.(2014). I think Garrett took over play calling many times this season. It seemed evident when the offense became stale and predictable. It would lose that deceptive look characteristic of Kellen Moore. I'm telling y'all, JG is a line your guys up and I'll line mine up and I'll see if mine can whup yours. Don't think he was a brainiac because he went to Princeton ... his dad was HC there.
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Post by Eagles R. Guano on Jan 18, 2020 12:36:18 GMT -5
Not wow'd by the hire nor overly dismayed....the only concern I have is Judge preached bringing coaches in who could get the most out of their players yet that was one of the reasons Garrett was not retained in Dallas....underachieving. Hopefully it pans out. Hell I think all you have to really do to have a successful offense with the Giants is make a concentrated effort to get Barkley the ball in open space or one on one edge situations instead of pounding his head into the back of interior lineman's asses 30 times a game.....playcalling was nauseating. You put him in the right situations that'll lead to a ton of points on its own. All you really need to be successful is have a stud OL. Winning and losing begins in the trenches. Having said that having a competent QB and a stud RB like SB just makes things better.
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 18, 2020 13:07:57 GMT -5
[quote author=" TEM" source="/post/314298/thread" timestamp="1579 367831"] All teams run this (and all team's fans complain about it) And it only produced . The RB caught in the backfield. Put the Qb behind center . Let Saquon hit the hole with momentum. [/quote] I have no problem with running the offense out of shotgun...especially if you have a back that has quick instant burst like Barkley It allows for RPO,let's the qb have a better view of the defense,allows for jet sweeps and ghost motions inside..basicly adding more things one can do.. The issue is when you have a big back like Henry where the back needs time to get up to speed so getting a running start from a qb behind C is optimal,and also takes away the things that being out of shotgun can do (One of many reasons I prefer a back like Barkley over a big back)
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 18, 2020 13:10:16 GMT -5
Not wow'd by the hire nor overly dismayed....the only concern I have is Judge preached bringing coaches in who could get the most out of their players yet that was one of the reasons Garrett was not retained in Dallas....underachieving. Hopefully it pans out. Hell I think all you have to really do to have a successful offense with the Giants is make a concentrated effort to get Barkley the ball in open space or one on one edge situations instead of pounding his head into the back of interior lineman's asses 30 times a game.....playcalling was nauseating. You put him in the right situations that'll lead to a ton of points on its own. Yeah.. Let's hope he isnt rigid with his system,seemed with Moore he had a bit more diversity.... More motions
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 18, 2020 13:12:34 GMT -5
Garrett? Actually as a head coach no. 3 times in almost 10 years.’ Beat me to it. 3 years when he was calling plays they were 8-8. Shoulda progressed in the playoffs in 2014, 2016, and 2018 and was out coached every time. Callahan left (2015) when they gave play calling to Linehan and he wanted it.(2014). I think Garrett took over play calling many times this season. It seemed evident when the offense became stale and predictable. It would lose that deceptive look characteristic of Kellen Moore. I'm telling y'all, JG is a line your guys up and I'll line mine up and I'll see if mine can whup yours. Don't think he was a brainiac because he went to Princeton ... his dad was HC there. If I'm not mistake he ran the same system as Norv Turner back in the early 90s And if I recall their playbook was litteraly 25 plays,but because they had the best O line in history you couldn't stop them (interestingly the same system went with Zampeze with Mike Martz and expanded to 700 plays or something stupid)
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Post by jaymas on Jan 18, 2020 13:13:27 GMT -5
Garrett? Actually as a head coach no. 3 times in almost 10 years.’ Beat me to it. 3 years when he was calling plays they were 8-8. Shoulda progressed in the playoffs in 2014, 2016, and 2018 and was out coached every time. Callahan left (2015) when they gave play calling to Linehan and he wanted it.(2014). I think Garrett took over play calling many times this season. It seemed evident when the offense became stale and predictable. It would lose that deceptive look characteristic of Kellen Moore. I'm telling y'all, JG is a line your guys up and I'll line mine up and I'll see if mine can whup yours. Don't think he was a brainiac because he went to Princeton ... his dad was HC there. You're conspiracy theory is that when you think the Cowboys offense was underperforming it was because mid stream Garrett would randomly take over the playcalling, as if that has ever been a thing ever? Sure, definitely doesn't sound like a bizarre agenda against a guy for whatever reason.
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Post by TEM on Jan 18, 2020 13:16:16 GMT -5
[quote author=" TEM " source="/post/314298/thread" timestamp="1579 367831"] All teams run this (and all team's fans complain about it) And it only produced . The RB caught in the backfield. Put the Qb behind center . Let Saquon hit the hole with momentum. I have no problem with running the offense out of shotgun...especially if you have a back that has quick instant burst like Barkley It allows for RPO,let's the qb have a better view of the defense,allows for jet sweeps and ghost motions inside..basicly adding more things one can do.. The issue is when you have a big back like Henry where the back needs time to get up to speed so getting a running start from a qb behind C is optimal,and also takes away the things that being out of shotgun can do (One of many reasons I prefer a back like Barkley over a big back)[/quote] From what I seen with Barkley. He does better pounding the hole with a head of steam. He lacks that with the Shotgun draw. In that aspect he is just like Henry.
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Post by Dogecoin on Jan 18, 2020 13:26:39 GMT -5
The part that lost my sense of humor when I realized this wasn't an article from theonion/sports
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Post by Deleted on Jan 18, 2020 13:28:30 GMT -5
The part that lost my sense of humor when I realized this wasn't an article from theonion/sports lol
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 18, 2020 13:46:13 GMT -5
Beat me to it. 3 years when he was calling plays they were 8-8. Shoulda progressed in the playoffs in 2014, 2016, and 2018 and was out coached every time. Callahan left (2015) when they gave play calling to Linehan and he wanted it.(2014). I think Garrett took over play calling many times this season. It seemed evident when the offense became stale and predictable. It would lose that deceptive look characteristic of Kellen Moore. I'm telling y'all, JG is a line your guys up and I'll line mine up and I'll see if mine can whup yours. Don't think he was a brainiac because he went to Princeton ... his dad was HC there. You're conspiracy theory is that when you think the Cowboys offense was underperforming it was because mid stream Garrett would randomly take over the playcalling, as if that has ever been a thing ever? Sure, definitely doesn't sound like a bizarre agenda against a guy for whatever reason. Kinda the conspiracy theory that Coughlin was meddling with the offense in 2014 and 2015 when Mac was the OC.when it would go into a slow spurt
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soflo
Special Teams
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Post by soflo on Jan 18, 2020 13:57:49 GMT -5
Callahan is a good OL coach. Dallas OL performance was not as good after he left. As a Cowboy fan I thought I'd come on here and state some of JG's weaknesses I perceived in Dallas but I remembered this video I saw about a month ago and Chris Simms stated it pretty well. Now a lot of this pertains to JG as a HC and his systems but y'all can glean out the stuff on offense. The Analyst touched on JG's game planning and this video will reinforce it. Garrett drove me crazy with his lack of creativity. He is a product of the early 90's Cowboys when they just lined up and whipped the man in front of them and that's not today's watered down, parity infused NFL. That was his problem in Dallas. Look at their record ... for the most part they whipped weaker less talented teams and got whipped by better talent and coaching. Well, if Judge, who comes from the Patriots, is right about fundamentals always beating "fancy new schemes," then Garrett's offense should be fine if Judge sticks to what he said in the press conference about wanting an old school style that sticks to fundamentals. Garrett's offense is also a rendition of the air Coryell offense, which needs great O line play in order to be successful. So it makes sense that once Callahan left that Garrett's offense didn't have as much success and appeared as "lacking creativity."
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Post by jaymas on Jan 18, 2020 13:59:50 GMT -5
You're conspiracy theory is that when you think the Cowboys offense was underperforming it was because mid stream Garrett would randomly take over the playcalling, as if that has ever been a thing ever? Sure, definitely doesn't sound like a bizarre agenda against a guy for whatever reason. Kinda the conspiracy theory that Coughlin was meddling with the offense in 2014 and 2015 when Mac was the OC.when it would go into a slow spurt Which became so funny when Mac couldn't run a good offense without Coughlin.
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Post by jaymas on Jan 18, 2020 14:03:58 GMT -5
Anyone who actually thinks Jason Garrett is going to run Norv Turner's 90s version of the air coryell offense is being laughably silly. Things evolve, Norv Turner himself wasn't running exactly that in Carolina. The best example of what we'll be closer too is recent Cowboys and NO. While judge is not strictly an offensive guy, he will have his touch on what we look like as he is the head coach.
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Post by DandyDon on Jan 18, 2020 14:39:25 GMT -5
You're conspiracy theory is that when you think the Cowboys offense was underperforming it was because mid stream Garrett would randomly take over the playcalling, as if that has ever been a thing ever? Sure, definitely doesn't sound like a bizarre agenda against a guy for whatever reason. Kinda the conspiracy theory that Coughlin was meddling with the offense in 2014 and 2015 when Mac was the OC.when it would go into a slow spurt Kinda interesting the offense went from top 10 to bottom 10 as soon as TC left though...
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 18, 2020 14:43:29 GMT -5
Anyone who actually thinks Jason Garrett is going to run Norv Turner's 90s version of the air coryell offense is being laughably silly. Things evolve, Norv Turner himself wasn't running exactly that in Carolina. You're best example of what we'll be closer too is recent Cowboys and NO. While judge is not strictly an offensive guy, he will have his touch on what we look like as he is the head coach. I think some of the elderly old school fans are hoping this because they got a little meat chum with judge saying fundamentally sound beats fancy new schemes then coupled with a 2 game outlier in the playoffs of a big backnrunni g wild while not throwing for 100 yards..not sustainable.... People took that out of context to spin the narrative to wish hard enough that it happens that we build a prehistoric team built to only win 10-6 snoozefests. Ignoring all the other indications that this is the furthest from the truth. Judge comes from a team that was built to win shootouts or slobberknockers and anything in between. Judge said many times figuring out what players can do is more important than making them fit a scheme We do not have the personal to run such a prehistoric offense (thank God)..Barkley has the potential to be a better version of Marshall Faulk....explosive That in itself dictates creative schemes We have 2 slot receivers... meaning a better fit for the hybrid underneath air raid option routes that modern offenses run while building out a vertical game with Slayton,Engram,Smith and a rookie..this equals vertical... This also equals we have personal to run a lot of jet sweeps and the ghost motions modern NFL offenses run(oh...Dallas under Moore did a lot of the modern things) And we did not draft a qb at 6 to be a game manager running a prevent offense contrary to the belief of an ignorant loud few.....especially one that is a perfect fit for the modern NFL running RPO action.... Also This isn't 1992 when you can hoard O linemen because of no salary cap and you didnt have all the CBA rules castrating practicing and teaching the way it does today.. Dallas only ran like 25 plays,but because that line was so dominant and played together for 6 or 7 years and the old.school practice rules...you practice those 25 plays every day for months every year,yeah,you are going to execute at an insane level. I'm pretty sure Garrett has taken some of the concepts Moore brought to the table and probably has observed as a HC the trends to ass these ideas...I'm also sure Judge didn't hire a guy that went 100% against his main thing which is fit the schemes and plays around our players ....
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 18, 2020 14:47:54 GMT -5
Kinda the conspiracy theory that Coughlin was meddling with the offense in 2014 and 2015 when Mac was the OC.when it would go into a slow spurt Kinda interesting the offense went from top 10 to bottom 10 as soon as TC left though... In 2014 and 2015 we actually had a hybrid similar to the Saints in that it was a mixed WCO ame the Erheardt/Perkins system we had in all its forms with Coughlin.. We.went to a straight 90s era rigid WCO when it was obvious letting Odell and Cruz still run option routes would have opened that offense up bigtime
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Post by jaymas on Jan 18, 2020 14:56:19 GMT -5
Garrett talking to Schmelk.
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Post by Jomo on Jan 18, 2020 15:15:16 GMT -5
For real this time? No false start? Well, I dont like it, but I dont hate it for some reason. This has Mara all over it though. I know its so werd. Hopefully it works. Me too, I oddly feel better about the reality than the thought of Garrett as OC.
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Post by NAVY2323(ret) on Jan 18, 2020 15:17:24 GMT -5
I know its so werd. Hopefully it works. Me too, I oddly feel better about the reality than the thought of Garrett as OC. I feel plain good if Callahan is part of the deal.
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