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Post by Morehead State on Aug 30, 2022 13:23:00 GMT -5
OK...Just a theory.
Everyone is all over Kenny Golladay for having a poor season in 2021. But KG has never been a guy who creates separation. He's a guy who makes contested catches....which is a great quality in the NFL.
Well DJ clearly has been coached to avoid turnovers since his rookie year. KG not open? Don't throw it to him.
But in 2022 it seems he'll be coached to make those throws. My "hope" is that he will become comfortable with KG amid coverage.
So my conclusion is that KG will be a great weapon for us this year.
Am I rationalizing? Is this wishful thinking?
Probably, but it helps me sleep at night,
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Post by allnygin on Aug 30, 2022 13:27:22 GMT -5
I hope you're right. I think KG can be effective and make big plays with the right QB and scheme, but I'm not sure this is the scheme for him. DJ hasn't really been a gunslinger kinda QB anway and thats how KG succeeds not sure it works out at this point
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Post by cdngfan on Aug 30, 2022 13:31:57 GMT -5
The KG thing has been over simplified.
To me, this FO and HC aren’t going to take any real heat for keeping KG and seeing what he can contribute this year. In fact it’s in keeping with what they said when they came here. Players and staff will have a chance. The opportunity cost is not giving a UDFA a roster spot. UDFAs lose spots all year every year.
There is an emotional push to cut him, there’s very little upside to cutting him, and like the OP pointed out, there is a chance he can contribute this year in a way he hasn’t yet.
The truth is cutting KG next year makes alot more sense. It spreads dead money over two years. It’s an actual cap savings to cut him next year.
Cutting him to keep someone like Bachman feels good, but Bachman will most likely be on our PS anyway. And there’s a tonne of Bachman’s out there. We can grab the next one.
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Post by giantlegacy on Aug 30, 2022 13:33:37 GMT -5
I hope you're right. I think KG can be effective and make big plays with the right QB and scheme, but I'm not sure this is the scheme for him. DJ hasn't really been a gunslinger kinda QB anway and thats how KG succeeds not sure it works out at this point Jones was a bit of a gunslinger pre Judge.. My fear is that it's been completely coached out of him(,part of why I fear he us ruined beyond repair )
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Post by vbgiantsfan on Aug 30, 2022 13:34:36 GMT -5
If the only scheme Golladay fits into is "throw it to the covered receiver" then that's even more of a reason he no longer belongs in the NFL.
I hope Jones doesn't just start chucking it to him. We have a lot of small fast guys who can get separation and YAC. Golladay can collect his retirement on the bench. We'd be a bette team for it.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Aug 30, 2022 13:35:37 GMT -5
The KG thing has been over simplified. To me, this FO and HC aren’t going to take any real heat for keeping KG and seeing what he can contribute this year. In fact it’s in keeping with what they said when they came here. Players and staff will have a chance. The opportunity cost is not giving a UDFA a roster spot. UDFAs lose spots all year every year. There is an emotional push to cut him, there’s very little upside to cutting him, and like the OP pointed out, there is a chance he can contribute this year in a way he hasn’t yet. The truth is cutting KG next year makes alot more sense. It spreads dead money over two years. It’s an actual cap savings to cut him next year. Cutting him to keep someone like Bachman feels good, but Bachman will most likely be on our PS anyway. And there’s a tonne of Bachman’s out there. We can grab the next one. Not entirely true.. If they cut him this year they will have a 10 million cap hit for 23 but if they wait and cut him next year it will be 14 million..
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Post by allnygin on Aug 30, 2022 13:37:50 GMT -5
I hope you're right. I think KG can be effective and make big plays with the right QB and scheme, but I'm not sure this is the scheme for him. DJ hasn't really been a gunslinger kinda QB anway and thats how KG succeeds not sure it works out at this point Jones was a bit of a gunslinger pre Judge.. My fear is that it's been completely coached out of him(,part of why I fear he us ruined beyond repair ) Good point - He looked the best when he wasn't out there being conservative. I am not one that minds some turnovers as long as the same arm throwing them is also responsible for game winning ones I.E Manning. I am also afraid of what you are, judge/garrett had the kid nuttered out there. But I have a feeling daboll wants him to be a little more lose out there. I think I saw some sort of quote to that affect early in camp... If that's the case maybe we see him throw the ball down field and take more chances again
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 30, 2022 13:40:25 GMT -5
If the only scheme Golladay fits into is "throw it to the covered receiver" then that's even more of a reason he no longer belongs in the NFL. I hope Jones doesn't just start chucking it to him. We have a lot of small fast guys who can get separation and YAC. Golladay can collect his retirement on the bench. We'd be a bette team for it. In the NFL, if you're covered one on one....you're open. I think DJ needs to learn this with KG.
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Post by giantlegacy on Aug 30, 2022 13:41:43 GMT -5
Jones was a bit of a gunslinger pre Judge.. My fear is that it's been completely coached out of him(,part of why I fear he us ruined beyond repair ) Good point - He looked the best when he wasn't out there being conservative. I am not one that minds some turnovers as long as the same arm throwing them is also responsible for game winning ones I.E Manning. I am also afraid of what you are, judge/garrett had the kid nuttered out there. But I have a feeling daboll wants him to be a little more lose out there. I think I saw some sort of quote to that affect early in camp... If that's the case maybe we see him throw the ball down field and take more chances again Honestly I'd rather Jones fail going out all guns blazing as opposed to the meekness of the past 2 years Will also show what kind of offense we will have and kind of qb they would hypothetically want to loom for in 3023
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Post by jmike on Aug 30, 2022 13:43:59 GMT -5
OK...Just a theory. Everyone is all over Kenny Golladay for having a poor season in 2021. But KG has never been a guy who creates separation. He's a guy who makes contested catches....which is a great quality in the NFL. Well DJ clearly has been coached to avoid turnovers since his rookie year. KG not open? Don't throw it to him. But in 2022 it seems he'll be coached to make those throws. My "hope" is that he will become comfortable with KG amid coverage. So my conclusion is that KG will be a great weapon for us this year. Am I rationalizing? Is this wishful thinking? Probably, but it helps me sleep at night, Hopefully you are right, but he needs to catch those passes for Jones to send enough his way to have a big year. IDK, but if I'm Jones, I don't think I'd trust him with my career on the line.
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Post by allnygin on Aug 30, 2022 13:44:09 GMT -5
Good point - He looked the best when he wasn't out there being conservative. I am not one that minds some turnovers as long as the same arm throwing them is also responsible for game winning ones I.E Manning. I am also afraid of what you are, judge/garrett had the kid nuttered out there. But I have a feeling daboll wants him to be a little more lose out there. I think I saw some sort of quote to that affect early in camp... If that's the case maybe we see him throw the ball down field and take more chances again Honestly I'd rather Jones fail going out all guns blazing as opposed to the meekness of the past 2 years Will also show what kind of offense we will have and kind of qb they would hypothetically want to loom for in 3023 100%
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Post by giantlegacy on Aug 30, 2022 13:45:43 GMT -5
If the only scheme Golladay fits into is "throw it to the covered receiver" then that's even more of a reason he no longer belongs in the NFL. I hope Jones doesn't just start chucking it to him. We have a lot of small fast guys who can get separation and YAC. Golladay can collect his retirement on the bench. We'd be a bette team for it. In the NFL, if you're covered one on one....you're open. I think DJ needs to learn this with KG. Honestly if Golladay puts the effort he used to back in Detroit he will gain Jones' trust to do this Not foe nothing but Golladay is a gonner in 2023...he legit is a bad scheme fit.. We all should root for a bounce back year because if he has a 60 catch type year for 1000 yards it's the difference between cutting him and trading him for a 3rd or 4tt
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 30, 2022 13:51:11 GMT -5
In the NFL, if you're covered one on one....you're open. I think DJ needs to learn this with KG. Honestly if Golladay puts the effort he used to back in Detroit he will gain Jones' trust to do this Not foe nothing but Golladay is a gonner in 2023...he legit is a bad scheme fit.. We all should root for a bounce back year because if he has a 60 catch type year for 1000 yards it's the difference between cutting him and trading him for a 3rd or 4tt In what way is he a bad scheme fit?
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Post by piddy283 on Aug 30, 2022 13:53:22 GMT -5
I love a good optimistic outlook when it comes to the GMen. As I’ve mentioned in other posts, every offensive player not named Andrew Thomas took a noticeable step backwards in terms of their overall play under Jason Garrett. This includes KG.
My hope is an aggressive passing attack suits KG better and allowed him to play to his strengths. He’s never going to live up to that ridiculous contract, but it’d be great if he can bring consistent production.
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Post by TheAnalyst on Aug 30, 2022 13:54:31 GMT -5
Define "Big Year"
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Post by Delicreep on Aug 30, 2022 13:55:49 GMT -5
OK...Just a theory. Everyone is all over Kenny Golladay for having a poor season in 2021. But KG has never been a guy who creates separation. He's a guy who makes contested catches....which is a great quality in the NFL. Well DJ clearly has been coached to avoid turnovers since his rookie year. KG not open? Don't throw it to him. But in 2022 it seems he'll be coached to make those throws. My "hope" is that he will become comfortable with KG amid coverage. So my conclusion is that KG will be a great weapon for us this year. Am I rationalizing? Is this wishful thinking? Probably, but it helps me sleep at night, I don't think DJ is going to have the luxury of waiting for guys to get open - he's going to need to have receivers make plays. Once upon a time, that was KG's strong suit.
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Tyrell
Special Teams
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Post by Tyrell on Aug 30, 2022 13:58:34 GMT -5
Im not so much concerned about last years numbers in the most pathetic unaggressive offense i think ive ever seen by the giants, but his apparent lack of effort and just baffling laziness is disturbing. maybe im wrong, maybe hes just purposefully dialing it back, but the preseason lack of output is just strange, somethings going on there. i dunno man, very weird vibe from the dude
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Post by allnygin on Aug 30, 2022 14:06:43 GMT -5
Yards of separation has everyone fooled. Is it a nice metric - sure. Some play callers and recievers can enhance it and even skew it depending on route concepts, I could have 3.0 yards of separation on a three yard drag route lol. KG creates enough space to be successful, he has done it before and still could do it. He has one of the best catch radiuses in the NFL, the giants have very rarely attempted to utilize it. He's not a tyrek hill, he's not a whoever else runs a million miles per hour, he's a guy that if used properly can be a nice piece in an offense. The giants need to figure that out.
You know hey, maybe his last injury really derailed his career and thats why the sudden drop in performance has occured, or maybe, just maybe, he played on a team with a bad offensive line, bad coaching, a starting QB who was out most of the season and had guys the likes of Glennon and fromm throwing him the ball. If you want to hand out excuses for DJ just know Golloday deserves them as well. IF you just don't like Golloday, that's fine as well, I haven't been particularly thrilled with him to this point either, BUT i'm giving him till midseason as I am Jones to criticize him harshly at this point.
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Post by jmike on Aug 30, 2022 14:14:29 GMT -5
Honestly if Golladay puts the effort he used to back in Detroit he will gain Jones' trust to do this Not foe nothing but Golladay is a gonner in 2023...he legit is a bad scheme fit.. We all should root for a bounce back year because if he has a 60 catch type year for 1000 yards it's the difference between cutting him and trading him for a 3rd or 4tt In what way is he a bad scheme fit? He doesn't catch the ball.
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Post by McCherry on Aug 30, 2022 14:24:08 GMT -5
Im not so much concerned about last years numbers in the most pathetic unaggressive offense i think ive ever seen by the giants, but his apparent lack of effort and just baffling laziness is disturbing. maybe im wrong, maybe hes just purposefully dialing it back, but the preseason lack of output is just strange, somethings going on there. i dunno man, very weird vibe from the dude Maybe Golloday is a game day player as some reporters have suggested. A lot of top receivers aren't top effort practice guys and prefer to preserve their bodies instead. Not sure if KG has earned that. Maybe he was a nursing an injury as some have suggested. He certainly seems to have turned it up in practice recently. Looking for excuses here. Whatever the case, I hope he brings it 100% for the regular season.
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Post by Nite on Aug 30, 2022 14:53:17 GMT -5
Good point - He looked the best when he wasn't out there being conservative. I am not one that minds some turnovers as long as the same arm throwing them is also responsible for game winning ones I.E Manning. I am also afraid of what you are, judge/garrett had the kid nuttered out there. But I have a feeling daboll wants him to be a little more lose out there. I think I saw some sort of quote to that affect early in camp... If that's the case maybe we see him throw the ball down field and take more chances again Honestly I'd rather Jones fail going out all guns blazing as opposed to the meekness of the past 2 years Will also show what kind of offense we will have and kind of qb they would hypothetically want to loom for in 3023 Well if Mara is still around in 3023 we'll be definitely looking for a new QB in the Robot Football League (RFL)
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Post by Nite on Aug 30, 2022 14:55:50 GMT -5
OK...Just a theory. Everyone is all over Kenny Golladay for having a poor season in 2021. But KG has never been a guy who creates separation. He's a guy who makes contested catches....which is a great quality in the NFL. Well DJ clearly has been coached to avoid turnovers since his rookie year. KG not open? Don't throw it to him. But in 2022 it seems he'll be coached to make those throws. My "hope" is that he will become comfortable with KG amid coverage. So my conclusion is that KG will be a great weapon for us this year. Am I rationalizing? Is this wishful thinking? Probably, but it helps me sleep at night, Hey you want to know what helps me sleep at night? he he he he...
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Post by kerryisdaman on Aug 30, 2022 15:00:15 GMT -5
Hope you are right but I have not seen that kind of effort so far in his time here. Colin Johnson was easily out playing him in this camp.
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Post by JoeBigBlue on Aug 30, 2022 15:11:36 GMT -5
Will also show what kind of offense we will have and kind of qb they would hypothetically want to loom for in 3023Talk about a long rebuild!
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Post by hof56lt on Aug 30, 2022 15:21:47 GMT -5
I can actually stomach this post and agree with your theory. This is much improved thread than your other wacky post” Taylor is better than Jones”
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keyofgmen
Special Teams
Posts: 774
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Post by keyofgmen on Aug 30, 2022 15:25:18 GMT -5
OK...Just a theory. Everyone is all over Kenny Golladay for having a poor season in 2021. But KG has never been a guy who creates separation. He's a guy who makes contested catches....which is a great quality in the NFL. Well DJ clearly has been coached to avoid turnovers since his rookie year. KG not open? Don't throw it to him. But in 2022 it seems he'll be coached to make those throws. My "hope" is that he will become comfortable with KG amid coverage. So my conclusion is that KG will be a great weapon for us this year. Am I rationalizing? Is this wishful thinking? Probably, but it helps me sleep at night, OH, come on MS... You know your alt motive.. Throw more into tight coverage so DJ gets more INTs, so you can say how bad he is... JK...
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Post by GameTime on Aug 30, 2022 15:26:31 GMT -5
OK...Just a theory. Everyone is all over Kenny Golladay for having a poor season in 2021. But KG has never been a guy who creates separation. He's a guy who makes contested catches....which is a great quality in the NFL. Well DJ clearly has been coached to avoid turnovers since his rookie year. KG not open? Don't throw it to him. But in 2022 it seems he'll be coached to make those throws. My "hope" is that he will become comfortable with KG amid coverage. So my conclusion is that KG will be a great weapon for us this year. Am I rationalizing? Is this wishful thinking? Probably, but it helps me sleep at night, 6 targets on average per game last season. Not terrible. Most QBs throw it to a trusted receiver when he is one one one. Open or not. All WRs had a shit season last year on the NYGs. Mostly due to Jones getting hurt and having some of the worst QB from the BUs I have seen in a long time. KG has big time skills. Before he got hurt in Det he had a season with the most TDs. If he wants to work and put in 100% then he will do very well.
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Post by DJones19 on Aug 30, 2022 15:27:53 GMT -5
There are plenty of guys who are 6'3 big and who can catch...I can't think of much that separates Golladay from those guys. Other guys his size are faster and run better routes.
Seems like Golladay is giving a solid effort for the most part though...I definitely think he is better than what he showed last year. Still has size, hands, ball skills....he's just never going to match the expectations of an 80 million dollar player.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 30, 2022 15:31:05 GMT -5
I can actually stomach this post and agree with your theory. This is much improved thread than your other wacky post” Taylor is better than Jones ”That's what I'm here for......for you to stomach posts. My work is done.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 30, 2022 15:32:25 GMT -5
OK...Just a theory. Everyone is all over Kenny Golladay for having a poor season in 2021. But KG has never been a guy who creates separation. He's a guy who makes contested catches....which is a great quality in the NFL. Well DJ clearly has been coached to avoid turnovers since his rookie year. KG not open? Don't throw it to him. But in 2022 it seems he'll be coached to make those throws. My "hope" is that he will become comfortable with KG amid coverage. So my conclusion is that KG will be a great weapon for us this year. Am I rationalizing? Is this wishful thinking? Probably, but it helps me sleep at night, OH, come on MS... You know your alt motive.. Throw more into tight coverage so DJ gets more INTs, so you can say how bad he is... JK... Unfortunately, .......... I'm not that smart.
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