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Post by TEM on Dec 23, 2019 8:00:08 GMT -5
Josh Allen registered his 10th sack of the season (14 games) yesterday. Tied for 9th in the NFL with Joey Bosa. Kid is really good and only going to get better. We need to get Chase Young. we just played ourselves out of the Chase Young market with a meaningless win over the meaningless Redskins, too bad. I know Shurmur wanted the win to help save his job, but a win over a terrible team like the Skins shouldn't change anything, Shurmur made too many bad decisions this season and last year too, i hope the owners are smart enough to look passed this win and see things the way they really are.... How is it the Rookie marching the offence down the field in OT to win the game was meaningless ?
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Post by snyder55 on Dec 23, 2019 8:31:33 GMT -5
we just played ourselves out of the Chase Young market with a meaningless win over the meaningless Redskins, too bad. I know Shurmur wanted the win to help save his job, but a win over a terrible team like the Skins shouldn't change anything, Shurmur made too many bad decisions this season and last year too, i hope the owners are smart enough to look passed this win and see things the way they really are.... How is it the Rookie marching the offence down the field in OT to win the game was meaningless ? its simple, by winning that game we will probably not be in position to draft Chase Young and we needed him more than the win..don't misunderstand me, liked seeing the kid do good but I think the team needs Young more than the win in a season going nowhere...
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Post by TEM on Dec 23, 2019 8:39:58 GMT -5
How is it the Rookie marching the offence down the field in OT to win the game was meaningless ? its simple, by winning that game we will probably not be in position to draft Chase Young and we needed him more than the win..don't misunderstand me, liked seeing the kid do good but I think the team needs Young more than the win in a season going nowhere... Since when has a draft pick the end all? There are 2 sides to that coin. The NFl has proven can't miss player miss
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Post by snyder55 on Dec 23, 2019 8:42:38 GMT -5
its simple, by winning that game we will probably not be in position to draft Chase Young and we needed him more than the win..don't misunderstand me, liked seeing the kid do good but I think the team needs Young more than the win in a season going nowhere... Since when has a draft pick the end all? There are 2 sides to that coin. The NFl has proven can't miss player miss you have to go by how the player is rated right now, and right now we need pass rush really bad.
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Post by TEM on Dec 23, 2019 8:45:23 GMT -5
Since when has a draft pick the end all? There are 2 sides to that coin. The NFl has proven can't miss player miss you have to go by how the player is rated right now, and right now we need pass rush really bad. so there is only one pass rusher in the draft? Strahan 2nd round pick Osi 2nd round pick Tuck 3rd round pick
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Post by snyder55 on Dec 23, 2019 8:48:22 GMT -5
you have to go by how the player is rated right now, and right now we need pass rush really bad. so there is only one pass rusher in the draft? Strahan 2nd round pick Osi 2nd round pick Tuck 3rd round pick I'm just stating my personal preference, sports writers have said Young is the best D player to come along since LT, don't know if that's true but what else do we have to go by...
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Post by snyder55 on Dec 23, 2019 8:53:35 GMT -5
Josh Allen registered his 10th sack of the season (14 games) yesterday. Tied for 9th in the NFL with Joey Bosa. Kid is really good and only going to get better. We need to get Chase Young. looks like the only way we get Chase Young now is if we trade up for him and that would be very costly.....
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Post by TEM on Dec 23, 2019 8:56:07 GMT -5
so there is only one pass rusher in the draft? Strahan 2nd round pick Osi 2nd round pick Tuck 3rd round pick I'm just stating my personal preference, sports writers have said Young is the best D player to come along since LT, don't know if that's true but what else do we have to go by... athlonsports.com/nfl/30-most-infamous-nfl-draft-busts-where-are-they-now-2017#11Vernon Gholston (No. 6 overall, 2008 NFL Draft) Of the New York Jets’ many NFL draft blunders, Gholston was the worst. Compared to Lawrence Taylor among his arrival in New York City, Gholston instead finished his NFL career without a single sack As I said there is 2 sides to that draft pick coin.
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Post by TheAnalyst on Dec 23, 2019 8:57:15 GMT -5
Josh Allen registered his 10th sack of the season (14 games) yesterday. Tied for 9th in the NFL with Joey Bosa. Kid is really good and only going to get better. We need to get Chase Young. looks like the only way we get Chase Young now is if we trade up for him and that would be very costly..... Yeah, that dream may be shot. Still have a chance. Skins need to beat Dallas and Detroit needs to win as well. While we lose to Philly. Our pick range is officially 2-5. Right now at 4.
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Post by snyder55 on Dec 23, 2019 8:58:29 GMT -5
I'm just stating my personal preference, sports writers have said Young is the best D player to come along since LT, don't know if that's true but what else do we have to go by... athlonsports.com/nfl/30-most-infamous-nfl-draft-busts-where-are-they-now-2017#11Vernon Gholston (No. 6 overall, 2008 NFL Draft) Of the New York Jets’ many NFL draft blunders, Gholston was the worst. Compared to Lawrence Taylor among his arrival in New York City, Gholston instead finished his NFL career without a single sack As I said there is 2 sides to that draft pick coin. I'm well aware of draft busts but what else do we have to go by.
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Post by TEM on Dec 23, 2019 9:00:04 GMT -5
I'm well aware of draft busts but what else do we have to go by. A draft pick is a lottery ticket and nothing more.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2019 9:16:26 GMT -5
Josh Allen registered his 10th sack of the season (14 games) yesterday. Tied for 9th in the NFL with Joey Bosa. Kid is really good and only going to get better. We need to get Chase Young. looks like the only way we get Chase Young now is if we trade up for him and that would be very costly..... ...and silly
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2019 9:24:41 GMT -5
I'm well aware of draft busts but what else do we have to go by. A draft pick is a lottery ticket and nothing more. Well, I'd suggest better odds vs a lottery TEM A lottery? It is a science, and they usually get the first round correctly sorted out, with players having far higher percentages vs a lottery...I realize you want a left tackle, we all do...and do not want Chase Young...but his skills translate VERY well in the NFL. I'm personally back leaning towards Thomas from watching Daniel Jones kill it yesterday...he needs an offensive line to give him time, cause when he has time...he is deadly accurate. How would you feel spending the big bucks this year on all defensive talent...but legit production talent? We have some YOUNG pass rushers available to the highest bidder, and we are now in the Daniel Jones rookie QB contract...you good with spending it on a pass rush? I see no real legit free agent offensive line...especially in the prime 26/27 years old range...just more average at best vets
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Post by TEM on Dec 23, 2019 9:41:39 GMT -5
A draft pick is a lottery ticket and nothing more. Well, I'd suggest better odds vs a lottery TEM A lottery? It is a science, and they usually get the first round correctly sorted out, with players having far higher percentages vs a lottery...I realize you want a left tackle, we all do...and do not want Chase Young...but his skills translate VERY well in the NFL. I'm personally back leaning towards Thomas from watching Daniel Jones kill it yesterday...he needs an offensive line to give him time, cause when he has time...he is deadly accurate. How would you feel spending the big bucks this year on all defensive talent...but legit production talent? We have some YOUNG pass rushers available to the highest bidder, and we are now in the Daniel Jones rookie QB contract...you good with spending it on a pass rush? I see no real legit free agent offensive line...especially in the prime 26/27 years old range...just more average at best vets This has been my whole point . A pass rusher is a luxury pick . When your O- line has deficiencies. I am looking at it from the FO perspective . All 3 Owners in the FO , the GM , HC , All hedged the reputations on the QB . If a premier Offensive linemen is passed up in the up coming draft for a different position . That IMO is hedging against the QB . And when I said lottery ticket, it was not to be taken literality. It was in the context of ; it is nothing more than a chance.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2019 9:55:39 GMT -5
Well, I'd suggest better odds vs a lottery TEM A lottery? It is a science, and they usually get the first round correctly sorted out, with players having far higher percentages vs a lottery...I realize you want a left tackle, we all do...and do not want Chase Young...but his skills translate VERY well in the NFL. I'm personally back leaning towards Thomas from watching Daniel Jones kill it yesterday...he needs an offensive line to give him time, cause when he has time...he is deadly accurate. How would you feel spending the big bucks this year on all defensive talent...but legit production talent? We have some YOUNG pass rushers available to the highest bidder, and we are now in the Daniel Jones rookie QB contract...you good with spending it on a pass rush? I see no real legit free agent offensive line...especially in the prime 26/27 years old range...just more average at best vets This has been my whole point . A pass rusher is a luxury pick . When your O- line has deficiencies. I am looking at it from the FO perspective . All 3 Owners in the FO , the GM , HC , All hedged the reputations on the QB . If a premier Offensive linemen is passed up in the up coming draft for a different position . That IMO is hedging against the QB . And when I said lottery ticket, it was not to be taken literality. It was in the context of ; it is nothing more than a chance. Why is everything on these boards a posting war? I respect and value all opinions...even wrong ones. I respectfully disagree..a pass rusher is the 2nd highest valued position...not a luxury....that is followed by blind tackle...but I ask again...do you feel we should spend the cap money on the premiere pass rushers in free agency...the guys who's value is right behind QB? I also agree with getting a left tackle...provided we don't reach at pick 2-5 for a Flowers type...and if Young is available, he is a higher value then LT, and will be a higher rated player then Thomas. No problem then, for me...taking the value of higher position, and value of higher graded player in that spot. Chase Young > Andrew Thomas...but, no crying if we take Thomas before him Now settle down and have a Merry Christmas or whatever it is you celebrate.
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Post by TEM on Dec 23, 2019 10:03:56 GMT -5
This has been my whole point . A pass rusher is a luxury pick . When your O- line has deficiencies. I am looking at it from the FO perspective . All 3 Owners in the FO , the GM , HC , All hedged the reputations on the QB . If a premier Offensive linemen is passed up in the up coming draft for a different position . That IMO is hedging against the QB . And when I said lottery ticket, it was not to be taken literality. It was in the context of ; it is nothing more than a chance. Why is everything on these boards a posting war? I respect and value all opinions...even wrong ones. I respectfully disagree..a pass rusher is the 2nd highest valued position...not a luxury....that is followed by blind tackle...but I ask again...do you feel we should spend the cap money on the premiere pass rushers in free agency...the guys who's value is right behind QB? I also agree with getting a left tackle...provided we don't reach at pick 2-5 for a Flowers type...and if Young is available, he is a higher value then LT, and will be a higher rated player then Thomas. No problem then, for me...taking the value of higher position, and value of higher graded player in that spot. Chase Young > Andrew Thomas...but, no crying if we take Thomas before him Now settle down and have a Merry Christmas or whatever it is you celebrate. How is my take a posting war? Where is any anger in that post ? If anyone needs to settle down it is you with your accusations. Merry Christmas. As to answer your Question. it has already been answered Golden and Williams will be extended.
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Post by TheAnalyst on Dec 23, 2019 10:23:51 GMT -5
This has been my whole point . A pass rusher is a luxury pick . When your O- line has deficiencies. I am looking at it from the FO perspective . All 3 Owners in the FO , the GM , HC , All hedged the reputations on the QB . If a premier Offensive linemen is passed up in the up coming draft for a different position . That IMO is hedging against the QB . And when I said lottery ticket, it was not to be taken literality. It was in the context of ; it is nothing more than a chance. Why is everything on these boards a posting war? I respect and value all opinions...even wrong ones. I respectfully disagree..a pass rusher is the 2nd highest valued position...not a luxury....that is followed by blind tackle...but I ask again...do you feel we should spend the cap money on the premiere pass rushers in free agency...the guys who's value is right behind QB? I also agree with getting a left tackle...provided we don't reach at pick 2-5 for a Flowers type...and if Young is available, he is a higher value then LT, and will be a higher rated player then Thomas. No problem then, for me...taking the value of higher position, and value of higher graded player in that spot. Chase Young > Andrew Thomas...but, no crying if we take Thomas before him Now settle down and have a Merry Christmas or whatever it is you celebrate. 100% If Pass Rusher is a luxury pick, then there is nothing outside a QB that is not a luxury pick. #1 - QB #2 - Pass rusher #3 - Offensive Tackle Those are not luxury picks. Those are needed positions to be a good football team. That said, I am still 100% sold on Young, but if we did get Thomas I still would be happy. Problem is we opened the door now to miss on both.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 23, 2019 10:28:10 GMT -5
Why is everything on these boards a posting war? I respect and value all opinions...even wrong ones. I respectfully disagree..a pass rusher is the 2nd highest valued position...not a luxury....that is followed by blind tackle...but I ask again...do you feel we should spend the cap money on the premiere pass rushers in free agency...the guys who's value is right behind QB? I also agree with getting a left tackle...provided we don't reach at pick 2-5 for a Flowers type...and if Young is available, he is a higher value then LT, and will be a higher rated player then Thomas. No problem then, for me...taking the value of higher position, and value of higher graded player in that spot. Chase Young > Andrew Thomas...but, no crying if we take Thomas before him Now settle down and have a Merry Christmas or whatever it is you celebrate. How is my take a posting war? Where is any anger in that post ? If anyone needs to settle down it is you with your accusations. Merry Christmas. As to answer your Question. it has already been answered Golden and Williams will be extended. I'm always settled...and I am accusing you of Chase Young hatred...is this a fair accusation? So, how do we improve the defense? Williams and Golden are free agents to be, and might test the bidding process...with Golden being a Bettcher player, and not much in the way of actual athletic abilities nor beating blocks quickly (system player?) ...and Williams is a bit overrated for what he is going to command, rating by me. I'm on board with going Thomas as our first pick, and hopefully Tyler or Creed as our second pick...all day long. We then pick late 3rd, and early 4...not sure we get much in the way, percentages wise, in terms of a solid NFL starter/3 down player on defense at these spots...Golden and Williams will not do much of a dent on our 70 million cap check...what players you spending it on? Knowing, we sort of have to make a few big splashes ... you on board with luxury pass rushers?
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Post by TEM on Dec 23, 2019 10:32:28 GMT -5
How is my take a posting war? Where is any anger in that post ? If anyone needs to settle down it is you with your accusations. Merry Christmas. As to answer your Question. it has already been answered Golden and Williams will be extended. I'm always settled...and I am accusing you of Chase Young hatred...is this a fair accusation? So, how do we improve the defense? Williams and Golden are free agents to be, and might test the bidding process...with Golden being a Bettcher player, and not much in the way of actual athletic abilities nor beating blocks quickly (system player?) ...and Williams is a bit overrated for what he is going to command, rating by me. I'm on board with going Thomas as our first pick, and hopefully Tyler or Creed as our second pick...all day long. We then pick late 3rd, and early 4...not sure we get much in the way, percentages wise, in terms of a solid NFL starter/3 down player on defense at these spots...Golden and Williams will not do much of a dent on our 70 million cap check...what players you spending it on? Knowing, we sort of have to make a few big splashes ... you on board with luxury pass rushers? I do not have a hatred for Young. I just think protecting the QB is and should be the priority above all else. When your Just drafted QB is taking hits behind the line. A pass rusher is a luxury pick.
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Post by TheAnalyst on Dec 23, 2019 10:50:22 GMT -5
I'm always settled...and I am accusing you of Chase Young hatred...is this a fair accusation? So, how do we improve the defense? Williams and Golden are free agents to be, and might test the bidding process...with Golden being a Bettcher player, and not much in the way of actual athletic abilities nor beating blocks quickly (system player?) ...and Williams is a bit overrated for what he is going to command, rating by me. I'm on board with going Thomas as our first pick, and hopefully Tyler or Creed as our second pick...all day long. We then pick late 3rd, and early 4...not sure we get much in the way, percentages wise, in terms of a solid NFL starter/3 down player on defense at these spots...Golden and Williams will not do much of a dent on our 70 million cap check...what players you spending it on? Knowing, we sort of have to make a few big splashes ... you on board with luxury pass rushers? I do not have a hatred for Young. I just think protecting the QB is and should be the priority above all else. When your Just drafted QB is taking hits behind the line. A pass rusher is a luxury pick. I also respectfully disagree with you TEM. There is no way pass rush is a luxury pick. If we had a pass rusher, our defense would be much better than it is. 1 great pass rusher could make all the difference. And you have made it known in the past your think Young is overrated because he has talent around him. I wouldnt call it hate, but you have said many times you dont think he will be good. I get it. Everyone has opinions. Thats fine. You want to build the OL and rightfully so. We all do. Jones needs to be protected. He is our future. But we cant just dismiss the fact we need one of those elite pass rushers like a Von Miller, J Clowney, Myles Garrett, Bosa type impacting pass rusher. This team has been missing that since Tuck/Osi/Strahan/JPP days. To me, Young is the next great pass rusher. I would LOVE to get him in here. Thats said, he is the only player I would want over Thomas. Thomas looks like a stud LT. He could be our T Smith from Dallas.
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Post by TEM on Dec 23, 2019 11:13:47 GMT -5
I do not have a hatred for Young. I just think protecting the QB is and should be the priority above all else. When your Just drafted QB is taking hits behind the line. A pass rusher is a luxury pick. I also respectfully disagree with you TEM. There is no way pass rush is a luxury pick. If we had a pass rusher, our defense would be much better than it is. 1 great pass rusher could make all the difference. And you have made it known in the past your think Young is overrated because he has talent around him. I wouldnt call it hate, but you have said many times you dont think he will be good. I get it. Everyone has opinions. Thats fine. You want to build the OL and rightfully so. We all do. Jones needs to be protected. He is our future. But we cant just dismiss the fact we need one of those elite pass rushers like a Von Miller, J Clowney, Myles Garrett, Bosa type impacting pass rusher. This team has been missing that since Tuck/Osi/Strahan/JPP days. To me, Young is the next great pass rusher. I would LOVE to get him in here. Thats said, he is the only player I would want over Thomas. Thomas looks like a stud LT. He could be our T Smith from Dallas. I agree with you . I am a big pass guy I uses my all time favorite Giant Tuck as my avatar. A; this is the way I see it. At this point a Edger rusher is finalizing pick . We are not there. Not drafting Edger rusher will not set the franchise back. Your just drafted franchise Qb eating dirt from his blindside , can set the franchise back. Why I am adamant that keeping his ass upright no matter who we pass up on in the draft to archive that goal. It should be the priority. Solder has one more year before his cap hit is manageable. We need that time to groom his replacement. Start the rookie off at RT day one. Weak 8 or 9 switch the rookie to LT and move Solder to RT.
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Post by Fletch842 on Dec 23, 2019 12:58:00 GMT -5
For me, right now, if both Young and Thomas are on teh boards, I'd be taking Young as fast as I could get the pick up to the podium. If Young is gone. Thomas would be a really nice consolation prize were we to get him.
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Post by moecoastie on Dec 23, 2019 17:46:46 GMT -5
Has Josh Allen improved the Jaguars passrush this year or did he just blend in with what they have been doing the last few years? Of course he improved it. Anytime you add a double digit sack pass rusher (especially a rookie) it helps the pass rush. Why? I dont watch Sacksonville too often but looking at their sack splits from last to this year, it seems sacks were just distributed differently with no improvement on total numbers. Just curious is why I ask.
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Post by TheAnalyst on Dec 23, 2019 17:49:35 GMT -5
Of course he improved it. Anytime you add a double digit sack pass rusher (especially a rookie) it helps the pass rush. Why? I dont watch Sacksonville too often but looking at their sack splits from last to this year, it seems sacks were just distributed differently with no improvement on total numbers. Just curious is why I ask. Ah. Yeah they lost some guys too. And not having Ramsey is hurting them a bit as the coverage isnt holding down as long for the sacks to get there. Lots of moving parts. Allen is a stud though. Double digit sacks every year if he stays healthy.
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