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Post by Roosevelt on May 16, 2020 19:57:25 GMT -5
Or Ozzie Newsome’s for that matter. Really? This man is clearly a racist. In his time as the GM he has hired 3 head coaches and all of them were white.
He's either racist; or hired the person/s he felt most comfortable with and were most qualified. Of course had he been given an incentive to hire non-white coaches and front office staff perhaps he would have. Someone needs to ask him.
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Post by Roosevelt on May 16, 2020 22:38:09 GMT -5
I agree with coach. This is a case of the wrong ideas being suggested to do right thing.
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katcavage75
Special Teams
Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence.- Vince Lombardi
Posts: 354
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Post by katcavage75 on May 17, 2020 11:30:36 GMT -5
Percentage of NFL players who are people of color- approximately 70% Percentage of NFL coaches who are people of color- 12.5% In every industry, throughout history, people have wanted leaders who have been there, who have been in the trenches. Small mom and pop businesses all the way up to the United States military have always put a priority on hiring leaders that have performed on the front lines. This has been prioritized because often times (though certainly not always) those with the front-line experience know all the important intricacies and nuances of the industry and can use said knowledge to achieve success. One would therefore expect that leadership in an industry reflects the diversity of those who are doing the grunt work in that industry. Why then do we see the massive disparity between the percentage of players of color and the percentage of coaches of color? There really only two possible answers: 1.) People of color are biologically inferior and don't have the intelligence to succeed as coaches (KKK members often choose this answer). or 2.) There is systemic racism in the NFL and larger American society that either funnels white men to the top, or acts as a barrier to people of color trying to get into the top positions. So, my question to the people who opposed this idea is: How do we rectify this systemic racism that we all know is happening? Perhaps the suggestion in this article is not the answer, but that doesn't mean we abandon the cause, right? We can't simply shrug our shoulders and say "oh well." I support the measure suggested in the article. I don't think it's perfect and I think it can cause various problems. I support it, however, because it's a step in the right direction. When equality is achieved the industry and the product becomes better. Putting aside the inequality and moral implications of all this, even a selfish person would agree that having a stronger industry and better product would be a good thing. The problem lies with ownership. 31 old white males are owners, only one "non-white" owner in Carolina. No "rules" will change this. Only new owners can affect the desired representative hiring in the future. It's 2020 and people still see races. There really aren't race, all of us are the human race.
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Post by Sarcasman on May 17, 2020 11:48:53 GMT -5
Percentage of NFL players who are people of color- approximately 70% Percentage of NFL coaches who are people of color- 12.5% In every industry, throughout history, people have wanted leaders who have been there, who have been in the trenches. Small mom and pop businesses all the way up to the United States military have always put a priority on hiring leaders that have performed on the front lines. This has been prioritized because often times (though certainly not always) those with the front-line experience know all the important intricacies and nuances of the industry and can use said knowledge to achieve success. One would therefore expect that leadership in an industry reflects the diversity of those who are doing the grunt work in that industry. Why then do we see the massive disparity between the percentage of players of color and the percentage of coaches of color? There really only two possible answers: 1.) People of color are biologically inferior and don't have the intelligence to succeed as coaches (KKK members often choose this answer). or 2.) There is systemic racism in the NFL and larger American society that either funnels white men to the top, or acts as a barrier to people of color trying to get into the top positions. So, my question to the people who opposed this idea is: How do we rectify this systemic racism that we all know is happening? Perhaps the suggestion in this article is not the answer, but that doesn't mean we abandon the cause, right? We can't simply shrug our shoulders and say "oh well." I support the measure suggested in the article. I don't think it's perfect and I think it can cause various problems. I support it, however, because it's a step in the right direction. When equality is achieved the industry and the product becomes better. Putting aside the inequality and moral implications of all this, even a selfish person would agree that having a stronger industry and better product would be a good thing. How can any one answer a question based on a fallacy? The NFL can and should create a system of equal opportunity. This seems to be a system of equal outcomes which is as illogical as the assumption in paragraph two above.
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Post by IrishMike on May 17, 2020 14:03:52 GMT -5
I agree with coach. This is a case of the wrong ideas being suggested to do right thing.
I agree.
The real issue is they are trying to fix the wrong thing. The Rooney rule did too. They are trying to get more HCs and GMs but what they need to do is create an avenue to those positions. Get more assistants, create a player to coach path and player to executive path. They need to fill the LOWER ranks giving these guys exposure and then if they are good they can move up the ranks on their own merit instead of as part of a quota or reward system.
Affirmative action did the same thing. Police tests were too hard for people growing up in crappy neighborhoods so they gave them extra points on the test, what should have happened is they should have fixed the crap education in those areas instead. The world generally looks for the "easy" fix which is never the right fix.
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Post by IrishMike on May 17, 2020 14:05:55 GMT -5
How can any one answer a question based on a fallacy? The NFL can and should create a system of equal opportunity. This seems to be a system of equal outcomes which is as illogical as the assumption in paragraph two above. Nailed it. Too many people think equal opportunity means equal outcomes. It doesn't and shouldn't. Otherwise we need to consider why 70% of this country is white and only 10% of the NFL is white. "We need more white players" is something no one would ever say.
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Post by Eagles R. Guano on May 18, 2020 9:18:39 GMT -5
Percentage of NFL players who are people of color- approximately 70% Percentage of NFL coaches who are people of color- 12.5% In every industry, throughout history, people have wanted leaders who have been there, who have been in the trenches. Small mom and pop businesses all the way up to the United States military have always put a priority on hiring leaders that have performed on the front lines. This has been prioritized because often times (though certainly not always) those with the front-line experience know all the important intricacies and nuances of the industry and can use said knowledge to achieve success. One would therefore expect that leadership in an industry reflects the diversity of those who are doing the grunt work in that industry. Why then do we see the massive disparity between the percentage of players of color and the percentage of coaches of color? There really only two possible answers: 1.) People of color are biologically inferior and don't have the intelligence to succeed as coaches (KKK members often choose this answer). or 2.) There is systemic racism in the NFL and larger American society that either funnels white men to the top, or acts as a barrier to people of color trying to get into the top positions. So, my question to the people who opposed this idea is: How do we rectify this systemic racism that we all know is happening? Perhaps the suggestion in this article is not the answer, but that doesn't mean we abandon the cause, right? We can't simply shrug our shoulders and say "oh well." I support the measure suggested in the article. I don't think it's perfect and I think it can cause various problems. I support it, however, because it's a step in the right direction. When equality is achieved the industry and the product becomes better. Putting aside the inequality and moral implications of all this, even a selfish person would agree that having a stronger industry and better product would be a good thing. Some questions here. If we use your criteria arguments for coaches should we also use it for players? According to US Census figures the white population is 76.5% of the population and the black population is 13.4%. By the criteria listed should we use percentages in every position, all levels of the organization? 76 % of each team should be white? 13% black? Fill in the rest with other ethnicity flavors? Just where is the line drawn ? www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/US/PST045218Your post started off throwing the percentage of players as a basis for your argument so should we use the US population figures to "allow", coerce, or force these percentages to play out in every aspect of the NFL? Will this start as an "incentive" and progress to NFL by-law? Should the US Congress involve themselves throughout our society and stick to strict percentages? What about the American exceptionalism? Do we want to legislate quotas (yeah, I know that already exists)? Big old can of worms here. Now, for sure, I do not agree with any of the proposals I threw out up there but when you start incentivising racism in one aspect of the league does it apply through all aspects? Coordinators, assistants, ball boys, trainers? ( I could write a 3 page thesis on this) ... and WTH is the KKK doing in this ? The KKK was relevant in the 1920's Democrat party but are so irrelevant now they are a smashed mosquito on the windshield of this country .... like the American Black Panthers. Whew, so much for the lofty goal of a colorblind society. I guess we can bribe colorblindness into the league.
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Post by TEM on May 18, 2020 10:53:45 GMT -5
Percentage of NFL players who are people of color- approximately 70% Percentage of NFL coaches who are people of color- 12.5% In every industry, throughout history, people have wanted leaders who have been there, who have been in the trenches. Small mom and pop businesses all the way up to the United States military have always put a priority on hiring leaders that have performed on the front lines. This has been prioritized because often times (though certainly not always) those with the front-line experience know all the important intricacies and nuances of the industry and can use said knowledge to achieve success. One would therefore expect that leadership in an industry reflects the diversity of those who are doing the grunt work in that industry. Why then do we see the massive disparity between the percentage of players of color and the percentage of coaches of color? There really only two possible answers: 1.) People of color are biologically inferior and don't have the intelligence to succeed as coaches (KKK members often choose this answer). or 2.) There is systemic racism in the NFL and larger American society that either funnels white men to the top, or acts as a barrier to people of color trying to get into the top positions. So, my question to the people who opposed this idea is: How do we rectify this systemic racism that we all know is happening? Perhaps the suggestion in this article is not the answer, but that doesn't mean we abandon the cause, right? We can't simply shrug our shoulders and say "oh well." I support the measure suggested in the article. I don't think it's perfect and I think it can cause various problems. I support it, however, because it's a step in the right direction. When equality is achieved the industry and the product becomes better. Putting aside the inequality and moral implications of all this, even a selfish person would agree that having a stronger industry and better product would be a good thing. Some questions here. If we use your criteria arguments for coaches should we also use it for players? According to US Census figures the white population is 76.5% of the population and the black population is 13.4%. By the criteria listed should we use percentages in every position, all levels of the organization? 76 % of each team should be white? 13% black? Fill in the rest with other ethnicity flavors? Just where is the line drawn ? www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/US/PST045218Your post started off throwing the percentage of players as a basis for your argument so should we use the US population figures to "allow", coerce, or force these percentages to play out in every aspect of the NFL? Will this start as an "incentive" and progress to NFL by-law? Should the US Congress involve themselves throughout our society and stick to strict percentages? What about the American exceptionalism? Do we want to legislate quotas (yeah, I know that already exists)? Big old can of worms here. Now, for sure, I do not agree with any of the proposals I threw out up there but when you start incentivising racism in one aspect of the league does it apply through all aspects? Coordinators, assistants, ball boys, trainers? ( I could write a 3 page thesis on this) ... and WTH is the KKK doing in this ? The KKK was relevant in the 1920's Democrat party but are so irrelevant now they are a smashed mosquito on the windshield of this country .... like the American Black Panthers. Whew, so much for the lofty goal of a colorblind society. I guess we can bribe colorblindness into the league. No matter how the league presents this. It is a form of segregation. Instead of the old rule "black in the back" "it is now "black in the front" It still does not change the context of its demeaning undertones.
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Post by Waybackfan on May 18, 2020 17:30:30 GMT -5
Help wanted advertisement: "Black billionaires wanted to own hugely successful and lucrative sports franchises.
If interested send resume c/o R. Goodell, PO Box 100, Canton, OH.
Include references and financial statement."
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Post by TEM on May 22, 2020 7:34:14 GMT -5
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