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Post by IrishMike on Jun 22, 2020 10:15:16 GMT -5
There is just one month left until the July 22nd deadline for Markus Golden to sign with another team. After that he is a Giant this year. It certainly can't hurt having him back.
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Post by Kruunch on Jun 22, 2020 10:42:20 GMT -5
I thought it was a smart move by the Giants placing the unrestricted free agent tender on Golden. It was such an unexpected move I had to double check to see if it was the Giants that did it.
Golden is a good player, plays hard and can generate pressure. I would stay as far away from giving him a long term contract though. Stick to the one year deal, and see how it goes. As of right now our pass rush is suspect at best. Golden can change that.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 11:17:04 GMT -5
I feel it would hurt by not playing some of those 3rd rounders they selected. After all they need to find out if they did get a gem or not and having Golden take snaps a way form them will not help with that decision..
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 12:23:05 GMT -5
I feel it would hurt by not playing some of those 3rd rounders they selected. After all they need to find out if they did get a gem or not and having Golden take snaps a way form them will not help with that decision.. Best Player Plays
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 14:29:01 GMT -5
I feel it would hurt by not playing some of those 3rd rounders they selected. After all they need to find out if they did get a gem or not and having Golden take snaps a way form them will not help with that decision.. Best Player Plays So it's a lock pass rusher will be a top priority again next season.. Got you.
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Post by IrishMike on Jun 22, 2020 14:31:10 GMT -5
I feel it would hurt by not playing some of those 3rd rounders they selected. After all they need to find out if they did get a gem or not and having Golden take snaps a way form them will not help with that decision.. Right now our "nascar" formation consists of 3 guys that combine for 950 pounds. There are plenty of places for those guys to get snaps. It would be nice to have at least one player on this team that we know can get after the QB. If he takes the LE spot then they can still get snaps at RE, OLB, OLB or MLB. I hope some of them pan out too.
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Post by Jomo on Jun 22, 2020 15:02:40 GMT -5
Cap friendly if it sticks with us. If he doesn't, the kids need to develop quickly. A good maneuver by the FO.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 22, 2020 15:10:32 GMT -5
So it's a lock pass rusher will be a top priority again next season.. Got you. My point is you don’t sit a player who is clearly better then another just to see what you got. Whoever plays better in practice or is having a better game plays. It’s not any more complicated than that
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Post by jb456 on Jun 22, 2020 15:26:10 GMT -5
I feel it would hurt by not playing some of those 3rd rounders they selected. After all they need to find out if they did get a gem or not and having Golden take snaps a way form them will not help with that decision.. What 3rd rounder are you referring to? Matt Peart is the only 3rd rounder from 2020 and he is an OT? Are you talking about the 6th and 7th rounders? Yeah, let them battle it out but there aren't any participation trophies in the NFL. Golden was the Giants best pass rusher last year and it would be a big deal if the Giants retained him. Also to your point, they are definitely going pass rush in 2021.
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Post by McCherry on Jun 22, 2020 16:13:42 GMT -5
I feel it would hurt by not playing some of those 3rd rounders they selected. After all they need to find out if they did get a gem or not and having Golden take snaps a way form them will not help with that decision.. What 3rd rounder are you referring to? Matt Peart is the only 3rd rounder from 2020 and he is an OT? Are you talking about the 6th and 7th rounders? Yeah, let them battle it out but there aren't any participation trophies in the NFL. Golden was the Giants best pass rusher last year and it would be a big deal if the Giants retained him. Also to your point, they are definitely going pass rush in 2021. He’s talking about the Linebackers.
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Post by jb456 on Jun 22, 2020 16:26:40 GMT -5
What 3rd rounder are you referring to? Matt Peart is the only 3rd rounder from 2020 and he is an OT? Are you talking about the 6th and 7th rounders? Yeah, let them battle it out but there aren't any participation trophies in the NFL. Golden was the Giants best pass rusher last year and it would be a big deal if the Giants retained him. Also to your point, they are definitely going pass rush in 2021. He’s talking about the Linebackers. I figured but there is a massive difference between a 3rd round prospects and 6th and 7th round prospects. If one of these 6th or 7th round players makes the team as a depth player its a win. You are hoping that your 3rd rounder might eventually become a starter. My point was that you don't give a low round draft pick a roster spot because you might lose a much better player the next year. Especially since most of the players won't even make the team. If the Giants hit the jackpot on one of those 6th or 7th round picks, great, but the probability is very low. The chances of one of those players beating out Golden are slim to none and he was the best pass-rusher on the team in 2019...
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Post by thetruth on Jun 22, 2020 16:28:05 GMT -5
I thought it was a smart move by the Giants placing the unrestricted free agent tender on Golden. It was such an unexpected move I had to double check to see if it was the Giants that did it. Golden is a good player, plays hard and can generate pressure. I would stay as far away from giving him a long term contract though. Stick to the one year deal, and see how it goes. As of right now our pass rush is suspect at best. Golden can change that. Pass rush specialist that doesn't really pressure the QB consistently? Sacks never tell the whole story. There is a big reason he didn't get paid and thats because he can't rush and generate much of any pressure without scheme help. He's just a guy. Rotational piece.
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Post by McCherry on Jun 22, 2020 16:29:00 GMT -5
He’s talking about the Linebackers. I figured but there is a massive difference between a 3rd round prospects and 6th and 7th round prospects. If one of these 6th or 7th round players makes the team as a depth player its a win. You are hoping that your 3rd rounder might eventually become a starter. My point was that you don't give a low round draft pick a roster spot because you might lose a much better player the next year. Especially since most of the players won't even make the team. If the Giants hit the jackpot on one of those 6th or 7th round picks, great, but the probability is very low. The chances of one of those players beating out Golden are slim to none and he was the best pass-rusher on the team in 2019... Carter and Ximines are the other outside Linebackers.
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Post by jb456 on Jun 22, 2020 16:44:45 GMT -5
I figured but there is a massive difference between a 3rd round prospects and 6th and 7th round prospects. If one of these 6th or 7th round players makes the team as a depth player its a win. You are hoping that your 3rd rounder might eventually become a starter. My point was that you don't give a low round draft pick a roster spot because you might lose a much better player the next year. Especially since most of the players won't even make the team. If the Giants hit the jackpot on one of those 6th or 7th round picks, great, but the probability is very low. The chances of one of those players beating out Golden are slim to none and he was the best pass-rusher on the team in 2019... Carter and Ximines are the other outside Linebackers. For some reason I though he was talking about 2020...
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Post by TEM on Jun 22, 2020 17:13:21 GMT -5
It would be nice to see Golden on the roster again this season.
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Post by Kruunch on Jun 22, 2020 17:18:59 GMT -5
I thought it was a smart move by the Giants placing the unrestricted free agent tender on Golden. It was such an unexpected move I had to double check to see if it was the Giants that did it. Golden is a good player, plays hard and can generate pressure. I would stay as far away from giving him a long term contract though. Stick to the one year deal, and see how it goes. As of right now our pass rush is suspect at best. Golden can change that. Pass rush specialist that doesn't really pressure the QB consistently? Sacks never tell the whole story. There is a big reason he didn't get paid and thats because he can't rush and generate much of any pressure without scheme help. He's just a guy. Rotational piece. He’s no pass rush specialist in my eyes. Just a good player with a motor. I get what you’re saying, but as you can tell. We need help at the edge position. Gettleman sat on his thumbs and is banking on Fackrell, Ximinez and Carter to be guys who generate pressure from the outside. Too bad no one told Gettleman that is going into a knife fight with a spoon. At least with Golden we have a player who can actually sack the QB. 10 sacks no matter how you analyze it is still a good season. We haven’t had a 10 sack season from that position since LT did it 30 years ago.
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Post by trueblueatnyc on Jun 22, 2020 19:10:40 GMT -5
Getting Golden back for another year would help provide some security at the position and not make the team rely so heavily on Ximines becoming a big time rusher.
In watching Carter, I just don't see a pass rush specialist kind of player. I see him more as someone who does a little of everything fairly well, but not great at anything. Still think his better spot is at MLB.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2020 7:07:10 GMT -5
I feel it would hurt by not playing some of those 3rd rounders they selected. After all they need to find out if they did get a gem or not and having Golden take snaps a way form them will not help with that decision.. What 3rd rounder are you referring to? Matt Peart is the only 3rd rounder from 2020 and he is an OT? Are you talking about the 6th and 7th rounders? Yeah, let them battle it out but there aren't any participation trophies in the NFL. Golden was the Giants best pass rusher last year and it would be a big deal if the Giants retained him. Also to your point, they are definitely going pass rush in 2021. Ximines and Carter are the two that I'm talking about. Sorry I didn't use their names just thought everyone would pick up on it. We will have to disagree about Golden being a big deal..
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2020 7:10:08 GMT -5
Cap friendly if it sticks with us. If he doesn't, the kids need to develop quickly. A good maneuver by the FO. Is it a good move to bring in a player and pay them less then they did the year before on a show me contract? I'm surprised most fans think it's a good idea to bring him in on a contract that he'll be upset with.. I guess getting some money is better then none on a losing team..
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Post by Roswell on Jun 23, 2020 7:25:55 GMT -5
Right about now Golden’s camp is probably still hoping for somewhere near 5-6m per from another team. But once it gets near July 22, his asking price will come down. Other teams know this.
I don’t know how Golden feels about the Giant organization, but he could take 4.3 or 4.4m from another team lying in the weeds waiting for his price to come down on July 21. Hey, 200k - 300k is still a lot of money.
So don’t get your hopes too high. It might work out for the Giants but there’s also a strong chance it won’t.
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Post by jb456 on Jun 23, 2020 7:38:07 GMT -5
Cap friendly if it sticks with us. If he doesn't, the kids need to develop quickly. A good maneuver by the FO. Is it a good move to bring in a player and pay them less then they did the year before on a show me contract? I'm surprised most fans think it's a good idea to bring him in on a contract that he'll be upset with.. I guess getting some money is better then none on a losing team.. It's a great idea. You are talking about a professional who is fighting for a big contract. Think of it like this, would you as a professional slack off if you didn't get your promotion? You would work harder right? If he has a bad year then he will get even LOWER offers than he was receiving. If he improves and shows consecutive years with over 10 sacks and more pressures, he is setting himself up for the future. A football players career is shorter than other sports and he has a very limited time to make his money. Also, he probably won't settle for a low deal somewhere else since he is familiar with the Giants and their personnel and ha d a decent season last year. He would also have to move during a Pandemic and it looks like other parts of the country are starting to get hit harder. He may end up taking more money somewhere else but I don't think he would leave to another team for the same type of money. Winning is much lower on the totem pole when a player is trying to get their first big contract....
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2020 8:11:36 GMT -5
Is it a good move to bring in a player and pay them less then they did the year before on a show me contract? I'm surprised most fans think it's a good idea to bring him in on a contract that he'll be upset with.. I guess getting some money is better then none on a losing team.. It's a great idea. You are talking about a professional who is fighting for a big contract. Think of it like this, would you as a professional slack off if you didn't get your promotion? You would work harder right? If he has a bad year then he will get even LOWER offers than he was receiving. If he improves and shows consecutive years with over 10 sacks and more pressures, he is setting himself up for the future. A football players career is shorter than other sports and he has a very limited time to make his money. Also, he probably won't settle for a low deal somewhere else since he is familiar with the Giants and their personnel and ha d a decent season last year. He would also have to move during a Pandemic and it looks like other parts of the country are starting to get hit harder. He may end up taking more money somewhere else but I don't think he would leave to another team for the same type of money. Winning is much lower on the totem pole when a player is trying to get their first big contract.... Thanks for your opinion.. What happens if he doesn't get the needed reps to fight for that big contract? I hope they field a better player then he was last year. A potential malcontent for a year on a young team is not a good idea. Don't you want to see what they have in these players they drafted the past few years? What good is a player who they already decided isn't worth it for the long term since they have already dismissed him by not giving him a multi year deal?
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Post by jb456 on Jun 23, 2020 9:16:12 GMT -5
It's a great idea. You are talking about a professional who is fighting for a big contract. Think of it like this, would you as a professional slack off if you didn't get your promotion? You would work harder right? If he has a bad year then he will get even LOWER offers than he was receiving. If he improves and shows consecutive years with over 10 sacks and more pressures, he is setting himself up for the future. A football players career is shorter than other sports and he has a very limited time to make his money. Also, he probably won't settle for a low deal somewhere else since he is familiar with the Giants and their personnel and ha d a decent season last year. He would also have to move during a Pandemic and it looks like other parts of the country are starting to get hit harder. He may end up taking more money somewhere else but I don't think he would leave to another team for the same type of money. Winning is much lower on the totem pole when a player is trying to get their first big contract.... Thanks for your opinion.. What happens if he doesn't get the needed reps to fight for that big contract? I hope they field a better player then he was last year. A potential malcontent for a year on a young team is not a good idea. Don't you want to see what they have in these players they drafted the past few years? What good is a player who they already decided isn't worth it for the long term since they have already dismissed him by not giving him a multi year deal? He is in a difficult position. He hasn't really been paid yet and there isn't much demand for his services. Golden needs to work his ass off and ensure that he has an opportunity to land that contract that will set him up for life. He doesn't have the freedom to become disgruntled. Golden's services weren't even that desirable when he has been shown to be a team player. If the Giants end up retaining him and he pisses and moans, he will probably end up being a Journeyman for his entire career. The next contract he signs in 2021 will just be another prove it deal with another team and another year of his prime will have been wasted. If the Giants find that one of their younger players are at Golden's level or better, sure that would be great. We would all be for that but he was the Giants BEST pash-rusher and he had over 10 sacks. I'm not saying he is the best but he is a pretty good player who is productive. As for seeing what they have in these players they drafted, the coaches need to make that assessment in practive / camp / preseason. If they believe they have someone who can compete close to Golden's ability, they need to start them. But if not, I don't see how a brand new coach could justify playing someone when the alternative is better. In the end, if Golden finds his stride and gets better and better, who knows, maybe the Giants end up signing him in 2021. They already have have $52M free cap in 2021 before they cut Solder and then it's close to $70M. They could easily make a few more moves and get $80M under the cap. If they don't sign him and he has a great 2021 season with the Giants, they could get a 3rd or 4th round comp pick. If he has a down season then they don't have anymore liability. This really is a Golden situation since it gives the Giants more flexibility.
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Post by giantlegacy on Jun 23, 2020 9:17:53 GMT -5
It's a great idea. You are talking about a professional who is fighting for a big contract. Think of it like this, would you as a professional slack off if you didn't get your promotion? You would work harder right? If he has a bad year then he will get even LOWER offers than he was receiving. If he improves and shows consecutive years with over 10 sacks and more pressures, he is setting himself up for the future. A football players career is shorter than other sports and he has a very limited time to make his money. Also, he probably won't settle for a low deal somewhere else since he is familiar with the Giants and their personnel and ha d a decent season last year. He would also have to move during a Pandemic and it looks like other parts of the country are starting to get hit harder. He may end up taking more money somewhere else but I don't think he would leave to another team for the same type of money. Winning is much lower on the totem pole when a player is trying to get their first big contract.... Thanks for your opinion.. What happens if he doesn't get the needed reps to fight for that big contract? I hope they field a better player then he was last year. A potential malcontent for a year on a young team is not a good idea. Don't you want to see what they have in these players they drafted the past few years? What good is a player who they already decided isn't worth it for the long term since they have already dismissed him by not giving him a multi year deal? Or We hold his rights and he gets off to a hot start and the team starts off its usual 2-4... Tampa or someone offers up a 3rd or 4th because they are an edge rusher short.. We just bought a mid round pick in 2021 for 3 million...ane then we get to see what the kids got for 10 games My choice is to see Xman,Carter (who probably gets utilized better this year)and even Coughlin have ....
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2020 9:35:23 GMT -5
Thanks for your opinion.. What happens if he doesn't get the needed reps to fight for that big contract? I hope they field a better player then he was last year. A potential malcontent for a year on a young team is not a good idea. Don't you want to see what they have in these players they drafted the past few years? What good is a player who they already decided isn't worth it for the long term since they have already dismissed him by not giving him a multi year deal? He is in a difficult position. He hasn't really been paid yet and there isn't much demand for his services. Golden needs to work his ass off and ensure that he has an opportunity to land that contract that will set him up for life. He doesn't have the freedom to become disgruntled. Golden's services weren't even that desirable when he has been shown to be a team player. If the Giants end up retaining him and he pisses and moans, he will probably end up being a Journeyman for his entire career. The next contract he signs in 2021 will just be another prove it deal with another team and another year of his prime will have been wasted. If the Giants find that one of their younger players are at Golden's level or better, sure that would be great. We would all be for that but he was the Giants BEST pash-rusher and he had over 10 sacks. I'm not saying he is the best but he is a pretty good player who is productive. As for seeing what they have in these players they drafted, the coaches need to make that assessment in practive / camp / preseason. If they believe they have someone who can compete close to Golden's ability, they need to start them. But if not, I don't see how a brand new coach could justify playing someone when the alternative is better. In the end, if Golden finds his stride and gets better and better, who knows, maybe the Giants end up signing him in 2021. They already have have $52M free cap in 2021 before they cut Solder and then it's close to $70M. They could easily make a few more moves and get $80M under the cap. If they don't sign him and he has a great 2021 season with the Giants, they could get a 3rd or 4th round comp pick. If he has a down season then they don't have anymore liability. This really is a Golden situation since it gives the Giants more flexibility. Last season wasn't good enough for him to get his pay day so I don't see it happening this year. The coaches aren't going to have much time in training to see who can step up so I feel that has to come with real time on the field.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2020 9:37:32 GMT -5
Thanks for your opinion.. What happens if he doesn't get the needed reps to fight for that big contract? I hope they field a better player then he was last year. A potential malcontent for a year on a young team is not a good idea. Don't you want to see what they have in these players they drafted the past few years? What good is a player who they already decided isn't worth it for the long term since they have already dismissed him by not giving him a multi year deal? Or We hold his rights and he gets off to a hot start and the team starts off its usual 2-4... Tampa or someone offers up a 3rd or 4th because they are an edge rusher short.. We just bought a mid round pick in 2021 for 3 million...ane then we get to see what the kids got for 10 games My choice is to see Xman,Carter (who probably gets utilized better this year)and even Coughlin have .... I guess that could happen also.. Since last season wasn't enough which was how I saw his play also then I don't see it changing enough to make a difference.
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Post by Jomo on Jun 26, 2020 16:20:16 GMT -5
Cap friendly if it sticks with us. If he doesn't, the kids need to develop quickly. A good maneuver by the FO. Is it a good move to bring in a player and pay them less then they did the year before on a show me contract?I'm surprised most fans think it's a good idea to bring him in on a contract that he'll be upset with.. I guess getting some money is better then none on a losing team.. Or he could sit home and earn nothing...... It is very good FO performance to give a guy like Golden a "free look" to earn more than we are offering. If he can get it, great for him. If he can't he is playing next year for us at a modest cost with an eye toward a larger pay day the following year. (with us or someone else.) Exceptionally good work by the front office. I think I get your point and it would be true in a business other than the NFL where there is a finite amount of money available to fill out the entire roster. To think that they should just pay him the same as last year falls apart when one realizes that we don't have that money. It is a non starter.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 26, 2020 19:16:10 GMT -5
Is it a good move to bring in a player and pay them less then they did the year before on a show me contract?I'm surprised most fans think it's a good idea to bring him in on a contract that he'll be upset with.. I guess getting some money is better then none on a losing team.. Or he could sit home and earn nothing...... It is very good FO performance to give a guy like Golden a "free look" to earn more than we are offering. If he can get it, great for him. If he can't he is playing next year for us at a modest cost with an eye toward a larger pay day the following year. (with us or someone else.) Exceptionally good work by the front office. I think I get your point and it would be true in a business other than the NFL where there is a finite amount of money available to fill out the entire roster. To think that they should just pay him the same as last year falls apart when one realizes that we don't have that money. It is a non starter. Then the Giants don't play him much or as much as last season and the player could end up being upset feeling they are getting cheated out of a legit chance to show off their skills for the big payout. When the Giants showed no interest with having him here long term why bother again?
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Post by NAVY2323(ret) on Jun 27, 2020 0:39:14 GMT -5
We’d have the best value edge rusher and the most overpaid interior lineman on the same roster. I’m all for balance.
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Post by giantsrock on Jun 27, 2020 6:14:05 GMT -5
Cap friendly if it sticks with us. If he doesn't, the kids need to develop quickly. A good maneuver by the FO. Is it a good move to bring in a player and pay them less then they did the year before on a show me contract? I'm surprised most fans think it's a good idea to bring him in on a contract that he'll be upset with.. I guess getting some money is better then none on a losing team.. If he comes back he'll be paid 110% of his 2019 salary or 4.1 million. If no other team is willing to pay him more why would he be upset with that?
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