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Post by BlueReign on Sept 15, 2020 13:22:36 GMT -5
Barkley needs to work on his pass protection. Give this line some time to gel before rushing to rash conclusions.
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Post by Speedman on Sept 15, 2020 13:55:00 GMT -5
Delete Eli and insert Barkley for some posters on here.
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Post by GameTime on Sept 15, 2020 14:10:54 GMT -5
Barkley needs to work on his pass protection. Give this line some time to gel before rushing to rash conclusions. its been a problem for him since day one. He may never be good at it
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Post by jaymas on Sept 15, 2020 14:29:45 GMT -5
This is such a silly rebuttal to anything. Teams need to have collections of good players at varying tiers most likely, to win football games. The closest thing to one guy being able to win games is a QB (certainly has the most impact). Us not winning games has nothing to do with Saquon Barkley individually. We certainly have a better chance of winning games with him on the field than we do without him on the field. I also saw him almost put the team on his back a few times his rookie year, taking over some contests. iv seen rbs like AP and Gurley carry a team to many wins. Im not saying he is the reason for losing. I am saying he hasnt translated to many wins. So its hard to justify #2 pick and rookie qb money. Not saying he isnt good either. You didn't see Saquon Barkley help carry this team to any wins his rookie year? Again you're trying to directly attribute our lack of wins to a player's presence. There's a difference between, we haven't won much with him, but when we have he's been a big part of it, to "he's not leading to wins."
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yoho
Special Teams
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Post by yoho on Sept 15, 2020 16:19:58 GMT -5
I see that the immature fans are looking for a scapegoat already. Buckle you seat belts kids, there is no silver bullet. This is going to take some time.
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Post by FundamentallySoundJones on Sept 15, 2020 17:05:37 GMT -5
Delete Eli and insert Barkley for some posters on here. I dont think there is an agenda to slate him off. Some fans have a hard time with honesty with certain players , if someone was honest about flowers for example , no one cared. The oline certainly needs help , however its not %100 on them. Barkley has had blocking issues, and had some games ,even last season, where he was out of it mentally after a bad start. Barkley certainly is a great player when he is in space. that should be the focus, how to use him better., he is not imo a featured back.
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Post by TCHOF on Sept 15, 2020 18:18:30 GMT -5
He's gotta start doing the dirty work and stop just playing solely for the home run. He's becoming our Dave Kingman. Hard to do when your vision is generally poor. BUT he really didn't have any help yesterday. He'll have better days but IMO should not be resigned. If Gettleman is still here, he’ll re-sign him
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Post by TCHOF on Sept 15, 2020 18:18:49 GMT -5
Delete Eli and insert Barkley for some posters on here. You mean you?
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Post by jaxnygmen on Sept 15, 2020 18:52:18 GMT -5
Barkley can not be blames for the poor run blocking there was no holes and the OL was getting man handled. Now what I will criticize Barkley on is his poor blocking and same thing with Engram.
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mj312
Special Teams
Posts: 1,131
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Post by mj312 on Sept 15, 2020 20:27:23 GMT -5
This is one of the worst thread titles I have seen on any message board. It seems like we have fans that try to run every good player we get out of town. Giants fans have turned into a direct reflection of an organization that is a perennial loser.. the giants have become a consistent bottom dweller .. of course Barkley isn't the damn prob but in all honesty that line last night looked worst then I've seen a giants line look in a long time .. gettleman has had 3 years to fix this crap and it's getting worst ... it's only game 1 but it looks like there's a really good chance we are going backwards.
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Post by GameTime on Sept 15, 2020 20:43:03 GMT -5
This is one of the worst thread titles I have seen on any message board. It seems like we have fans that try to run every good player we get out of town. Giants fans have turned into a direct reflection of an organization that is a perennial loser.. the giants have become a consistent bottom dweller .. of course Barkley isn't the damn prob but in all honesty that line last night looked worst then I've seen a giants line look in a long time .. gettleman has had 3 years to fix this crap and it's getting worst ... it's only game 1 but it looks like there's a really good chance we are going backwards. 2 seasons and 3 drafts I dont think they will be going backwards. Not this season. The run game was worse then pathetic last night. This is true. I can still pick lots of really good stuff out as well in other areas. Let see if they can finally start minimizing the bad parts of their game.
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Post by Speedman on Sept 15, 2020 21:17:20 GMT -5
Delete Eli and insert Barkley for some posters on here. You mean you? I was thinking you and a few others on here.
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Post by krappdetector on Sept 15, 2020 21:26:26 GMT -5
Will someone explain how the same oline can pass protect so much better than run protect? Is it possible the run blocking schemes are too new and complex? Check out the play where Dupree trashes Barkley 5 yards off the LOS. www.steelers.com/video/highlight-dupree-drops-barkley-for-big-lossThomas is not attempting to block him so who IS? Zeitler was pulling seemingly to block Saquon for a run to the right... which never happened due to the Dupree TFL. Was this Zeitler's fault? Was the scheme flawed? Were they simply planning to run the play away from Dupree? ...and is that even a 'thing'? Was Saquon slow to reach the hand off since Dupree was there a split second later? I have NO IDEA why this got so ugly so fast.. Can someone more knowledgeable please enlighten me?
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Post by GameTime on Sept 15, 2020 21:34:24 GMT -5
Will someone explain how the same oline can pass protect so much better than run protect? Is it possible the run blocking schemes are too new and complex? Check out the play where Dupree trashes Barkley 5 yards off the LOS. www.steelers.com/video/highlight-dupree-drops-barkley-for-big-lossThomas is not attempting to block him so who IS? Zeitler was pulling seemingly to block Saquon for a run to the right... which never happened due to the Dupree TFL. Was this Zeitler's fault? Was the scheme flawed? Were they simply planning to run the play away from Dupree? ...and is that even a 'thing'? Was Saquon slow to reach the hand off since Dupree was there a split second later? I have NO IDEA why this got so ugly so fast.. Can someone more knowledgeable please enlighten me? without even having to break things down you could just see they were not blocking as a unit. Beyond that there was blown assigments like the Zietler example you mentioned, Gates getting schooled often, Fleming not getting it done. It was just a mess. Not one issue.
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Post by DandyDon on Sept 15, 2020 21:57:34 GMT -5
Delete Eli and insert Barkley for some posters on here. I dont think there is an agenda to slate him off. Some fans have a hard time with honesty with certain players , if someone was honest about flowers for example , no one cared. The oline certainly needs help , however its not %100 on them. Barkley has had blocking issues, and had some games ,even last season, where he was out of it mentally after a bad start. Barkley certainly is a great player when he is in space. that should be the focus, how to use him better., he is not imo a featured back. Coming from you, that's pretty funny.
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Post by krappdetector on Sept 15, 2020 22:24:07 GMT -5
Will someone explain how the same oline can pass protect so much better than run protect? Is it possible the run blocking schemes are too new and complex? Check out the play where Dupree trashes Barkley 5 yards off the LOS. www.steelers.com/video/highlight-dupree-drops-barkley-for-big-lossThomas is not attempting to block him so who IS? Zeitler was pulling seemingly to block Saquon for a run to the right... which never happened due to the Dupree TFL. Was this Zeitler's fault? Was the scheme flawed? Were they simply planning to run the play away from Dupree? ...and is that even a 'thing'? Was Saquon slow to reach the hand off since Dupree was there a split second later? I have NO IDEA why this got so ugly so fast.. Can someone more knowledgeable please enlighten me? without even having to break things down you could just see they were not blocking as a unit. Beyond that there was blown assigments like the Zietler example you mentioned, Gates getting schooled often, Fleming not getting it done. It was just a mess. Not one issue. Thank you. But I was hoping for a more specific explanation, especially of this particular play. Was it really Zeitler's job at RG to block Dupree coming from the left? That sounds unnecessarily complex.. and strange. Is this done often?
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Post by thetruth on Sept 15, 2020 22:50:58 GMT -5
Hard to do when your vision is generally poor. BUT he really didn't have any help yesterday. He'll have better days but IMO should not be resigned. If Gettleman is still here, he’ll re-sign him 100%
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Post by DandyDon on Sept 15, 2020 23:08:10 GMT -5
If Gettleman is still here, he’ll re-sign him 100% As a silly Russian "thetruth" how do you think we are doing now? I mean as Americans?
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Post by thetruth on Sept 16, 2020 0:07:02 GMT -5
As a silly Russian "thetruth" how do you think we are doing now? I mean as Americans? Dont you have a flat earth convention to attend to you? Weirdo Man, this pandemic has not been good for mental health. Case in point with this nut
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Post by GameTime on Sept 16, 2020 4:19:44 GMT -5
without even having to break things down you could just see they were not blocking as a unit. Beyond that there was blown assigments like the Zietler example you mentioned, Gates getting schooled often, Fleming not getting it done. It was just a mess. Not one issue. Thank you. But I was hoping for a more specific explanation, especially of this particular play. Was it really Zeitler's job at RG to block Dupree coming from the left? That sounds unnecessarily complex.. and strange. Is this done often? on that play....sorry I was not being specific. I was going on a general view of the oline performance
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Post by PennState1 on Sept 16, 2020 6:32:57 GMT -5
“We had a commitment and we weren’t going to be bashful about that commitment,’’ coach Mike Tomlin said. “We thought that guy was a catalyst for whatever that they were going to do offensively. We put our secondary in harm’s way some in an effort to do so. We needed to stack the line of scrimmage. We needed to bring people … and we did. We did what thought was necessary to minimize his impact on the game.’’
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Post by jimmieray on Sept 16, 2020 6:44:04 GMT -5
Thank you. But I was hoping for a more specific explanation, especially of this particular play. Was it really Zeitler's job at RG to block Dupree coming from the left? That sounds unnecessarily complex.. and strange. Is this done often? on that play....sorry I was not being specific. I was going on a general view of the oline performance I would think in general terms, a new line in it's first game needs to concentrate on pass protection first, and the run blocking would not look adequate at most times. But the back can see blown assignments and extra rushers coming in much better than the QB, there are decisions and adjustments he can make to not have it look so disasterous.
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Post by jmike on Sept 16, 2020 7:59:42 GMT -5
Barkley can not be blames for the poor run blocking there was no holes and the OL was getting man handled. Now what I will criticize Barkley on is his poor blocking and same thing with Engram. 37.5% of his career rushing yards have come on just 22 carries. If this team wants to win, they need more consistent production out of their running game. The OL has problems, but Barkley is not helping things either. Big plays are fun and all, but winning is the goal. This all or nothing play out of our running game will not lead to wins. Wins will come when the offense can reliably move the ball. I'd like less flash and more grit out of Barkley.
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Post by jmike on Sept 16, 2020 8:04:50 GMT -5
Will someone explain how the same oline can pass protect so much better than run protect? Is it possible the run blocking schemes are too new and complex? Check out the play where Dupree trashes Barkley 5 yards off the LOS. www.steelers.com/video/highlight-dupree-drops-barkley-for-big-lossThomas is not attempting to block him so who IS? Zeitler was pulling seemingly to block Saquon for a run to the right... which never happened due to the Dupree TFL. Was this Zeitler's fault? Was the scheme flawed? Were they simply planning to run the play away from Dupree? ...and is that even a 'thing'? Was Saquon slow to reach the hand off since Dupree was there a split second later? I have NO IDEA why this got so ugly so fast.. Can someone more knowledgeable please enlighten me? The Steelers were run blitzing all night. They clearly geared up to stop the run. This lead to a lot of the OL issues and they combined that with overloads that it seemed the OL was not prepared for. Not surprising that the OL struggled with 3 new pieces in key spots and no games together prior to Monday night. One thing you have to understand about offensive line play, it takes 5 players to make a good OL; it only takes 1 to make it suck.
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Post by GameTime on Sept 16, 2020 8:08:09 GMT -5
on that play....sorry I was not being specific. I was going on a general view of the oline performance I would think in general terms, a new line in it's first game needs to concentrate on pass protection first, and the run blocking would not look adequate at most times. But the back can see blown assignments and extra rushers coming in much better than the QB, there are decisions and adjustments he can make to not have it look so disasterous. not sure how a back can make adjustments getting hit by more than one defender 2 yards behind the LOS 11 times out of 15. Barkley is still accountable since he is a big part of the run game.
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Post by jimmieray on Sept 16, 2020 8:25:46 GMT -5
I would think in general terms, a new line in it's first game needs to concentrate on pass protection first, and the run blocking would not look adequate at most times. But the back can see blown assignments and extra rushers coming in much better than the QB, there are decisions and adjustments he can make to not have it look so disasterous. not sure how a back can make adjustments getting hit by more than one defender 2 yards behind the LOS 11 times out of 15. Barkley is still accountable since he is a big part of the run game. I'm not jumping on the O.P.'s claim of Barkley being the problem, but he must realize where his line is at and what their priorities will be for the first few games. He can see where the defenders are coming from, either bounce it outside or go in where the gap was supposed to be with some conviction.
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Post by GameTime on Sept 16, 2020 8:36:06 GMT -5
not sure how a back can make adjustments getting hit by more than one defender 2 yards behind the LOS 11 times out of 15. Barkley is still accountable since he is a big part of the run game. I'm not jumping on the O.P.'s claim of Barkley being the problem, but he must realize where his line is at and what their priorities will be for the first few games. He can see where the defenders are coming from, either bounce it outside or go in where the gap was supposed to be with some conviction. I didnt think you were saying SB was the problem. I am sure back do adjust when they can. But getting hit pretty much right after you get the hand off there is no time do anything except not fumble.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2020 8:38:34 GMT -5
I feel the same way. We cannot just blame Barkley. When you get tackled 2 yards behind the line of scrimmage, there isn't much you can do. We have a long way before we become a real team because we do not have all the pieces in place. Lot of work to be done on that O-line, but I knew coming in this would be a problem.. I just hoped they'd be slightly better. It's gonna be a slow grind before they start to gel. Hopefully, Peart develops quickly and can solidify that RT spot. And I am not sure Gates is the answer to Center
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Sept 16, 2020 8:44:07 GMT -5
Daniel Jones was the Giants leading rusher four attempts , for 22 yards . Tom Brady and Roethlisberger both had more rushing yards then Barkley. Not saying it’s 💯 on him but he has to take some of the heat. Look the Center calls adjustments to the line on what he sees. Obviously Gates doesn’t have the experience to adjust protection.
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Post by jimmieray on Sept 16, 2020 8:47:06 GMT -5
I'm not jumping on the O.P.'s claim of Barkley being the problem, but he must realize where his line is at and what their priorities will be for the first few games. He can see where the defenders are coming from, either bounce it outside or go in where the gap was supposed to be with some conviction. I didnt think you were saying SB was the problem. I am sure back do adjust when they can. But getting hit pretty much right after you get the hand off there is no time do anything except not fumble. If there's time to spin around as the defenders are coming in, then there's time to dig a foot in and let them feel something. That's what other bell cows his size do. Seems a fumble could come either way. I realize he's in a tough spot, but this is the year he needs to show why our team needs to bear his upcoming contract.
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