Maybe Tiki just did Saquon a favor

[BigBlueDog42]

Tiki just stated on Tierney and Tiki just said that Saquon might not be a 3 down back do to his pass pro issues his issues have been well documented coming out of college that was not supposed to be the case. Tiki went on to say that he was a 3rd down back long before he was a star and had to learn to protect and it frustrates him to watch a big strong back like Saquon not willing to do the dirty work. I agree with Tiki here not so much he is not a 3 down back but that he needs to clean this part of his game up key blocks from backs on 3rd downs are difference makers. They matter in the win loss column Barkely came out of college with this skill set he needs to use it. Think maybe this criticism from a great Giants back might light the match. To be fare on Monday night he was to quick to help Thomas a few time and that led to some pressure others he was strong picking up blitzes.

[grapenut]

Sept 16, 2020 10:49:16 GMT -5 BigBlueDog42 said:

Tiki just stated on Tierney and Tiki just said that Saquon might not be a 3 down back do to his pass pro issues his issues have been well documented coming out of college that was not supposed to be the case. Tiki went on to say that he was a 3rd down back long before he was a star and had to learn to protect and it frustrates him to watch a big strong back like Saquon not willing to do the dirty work. I agree with Tiki here not so much he is not a 3 down back but that he needs to clean this part of his game up key blocks from backs on 3rd downs are difference makers. They matter in the win loss column Barkely came out of college with this skill set he needs to use it. Think maybe this criticism from a great Giants back might light the match. To be fare on Monday night he was to quick to help Thomas a few time and that led to some pressure others he was strong picking up blitzes.

“He can not pass protect, and it is starting to become glaring,” Barber said on the Tiki and Tierney Show. “It was probably the only issue he had coming in to the NFL, because he wasn’t asked to do it at Penn State. And now you see him diving on the ground, not sticking his head into people’s chest. It’s going to be a liability, because people see it not, it’s on tape, and it’s going to come out.



“If you watch him for the last couple years, he doesn’t want to block. I learned this early on in my career, because I was a third down back before I was a ‘star’ running back, if you can’t block, you can’t be on the field on third down. You just can’t, because you know those are high blitz and dog downs. You know someone is going to be coming from the safety [position], so you have to recognize what a defense is trying to do, how they’re going to dog or blitz you. Recognition is one, and then two, you gotta go hit a dude! Saquon Barkley is a big man, and he doesn’t want to hit anybody. That is frustrating to watch, he’s a great back, but he’s frustrating to watch trying to pass protect.”

Read article:  
www.bigblueview.com/2020/9/16/21439614/2020-ny-giants-pittsburgh-steelers-saquon-barkley-tiki-barber-news

[Kruunch]

Before fans bash Tiki, he has a fair point. Like Tiki said, when he came out of Virginia he was a kick off and punt returner, and our 3rd down back. He HAD to learn to pass protect. If not, he would of been out of a job.

Barkley has the ideal size to pick up a blitz. Hell, half the backs in this league would kill to have his size. What I saw Monday night is he doesn’t diagnose where the blitz comes fast enough. Sounds simple enough but it’s not, those defensive coordinators get paid a lot of money to make your job that much harder. Will they come from the outside, is that corner blitzing? Is the mike shooting he A gap? Talk about keeping your head on a swivel. Even when he does engage with the defender he gets outmanned. That can not happen.. Either he’s not getting low enough, or that defender just wants it more than him. Either way it has become evident he’s not a good blocker. Which is a deterrent, in 3rd down we can’t always have him run a route. You’re basically telling the defense he’s not saying in to pass protect.

Before we bash Barkley, remember this. Not all backs our 3 down backs. Yes, he’s the 2nd overall pick and he better be. But come to realization it’s not in the cards. Accept it, because he’s not going to be good over night. This is his 3rd year and it’s the same as his rookie year.

[Martin]

Sept 16, 2020 11:14:57 GMT -5 Kruunch said:

Before fans bash Tiki, he has a fair point. Like Tiki said, when he came out of Virginia he was a kick off and punt returner, and our 3rd down back. He HAD to learn to pass protect. If not, he would of been out of a job.

Barkley has the ideal size to pick up a blitz. Hell, half the backs in this league would kill to have his size. What I saw Monday night is he doesn’t diagnose where the blitz comes fast enough. Sounds simple enough but it’s not, those defensive coordinators get paid a lot of money to make your job that much harder. Will they come from the outside, is that corner blitzing? Is the mike shooting he A gap? Talk about keeping your head on a swivel. Even when he does engage with the defender he gets outmanned. That can not happen.. Either he’s not getting low enough, or that defender just wants it more than him. Either way it has become evident he’s not a good blocker. Which is a deterrent, in 3rd down we can’t always have him run a route. You’re basically telling the defense he’s not saying in to pass protect.

Before we bash Barkley, remember this. Not all backs our 3 down backs. Yes, he’s the 2nd overall pick and he better be. But come to realization it’s not in the cards. Accept it, because he’s not going to be good over night. This is his 3rd year and it’s the same as his rookie year.

What ever the technical reasons are for Barkley not being able to block the out come will be a negative. DJ will either get hurt or fumble which will lose games. There is not denying that your RB must be able to pick up the blitz. Its fundamental football and now all teams are aware of it. Weak link. 

[Kruunch]

Sept 16, 2020 11:19:44 GMT -5 Martin said:

Sept 16, 2020 11:14:57 GMT -5 Kruunch said:

Before fans bash Tiki, he has a fair point. Like Tiki said, when he came out of Virginia he was a kick off and punt returner, and our 3rd down back. He HAD to learn to pass protect. If not, he would of been out of a job.

Barkley has the ideal size to pick up a blitz. Hell, half the backs in this league would kill to have his size. What I saw Monday night is he doesn’t diagnose where the blitz comes fast enough. Sounds simple enough but it’s not, those defensive coordinators get paid a lot of money to make your job that much harder. Will they come from the outside, is that corner blitzing? Is the mike shooting he A gap? Talk about keeping your head on a swivel. Even when he does engage with the defender he gets outmanned. That can not happen.. Either he’s not getting low enough, or that defender just wants it more than him. Either way it has become evident he’s not a good blocker. Which is a deterrent, in 3rd down we can’t always have him run a route. You’re basically telling the defense he’s not saying in to pass protect.

Before we bash Barkley, remember this. Not all backs our 3 down backs. Yes, he’s the 2nd overall pick and he better be. But come to realization it’s not in the cards. Accept it, because he’s not going to be good over night. This is his 3rd year and it’s the same as his rookie year.

What ever the technical reasons are for Barkley not being able to block the out come will be a negative. DJ will either get hurt or fumble which will lose games. There is not denying that your RB must be able to pick up the blitz. Its fundamental football and now all teams are aware of it. Weak link. 

Agreed. We were spoiled with Jacobs and Bradshaw. Both of them looked for a defender to hit.. 

[Deleted]

Sept 16, 2020 11:14:57 GMT -5 Kruunch said:

Before fans bash Tiki, he has a fair point. Like Tiki said, when he came out of Virginia he was a kick off and punt returner, and our 3rd down back. He HAD to learn to pass protect. If not, he would of been out of a job.

Barkley has the ideal size to pick up a blitz. Hell, half the backs in this league would kill to have his size. What I saw Monday night is he doesn’t diagnose where the blitz comes fast enough. Sounds simple enough but it’s not, those defensive coordinators get paid a lot of money to make your job that much harder. Will they come from the outside, is that corner blitzing? Is the mike shooting he A gap? Talk about keeping your head on a swivel. Even when he does engage with the defender he gets outmanned. That can not happen.. Either he’s not getting low enough, or that defender just wants it more than him. Either way it has become evident he’s not a good blocker. Which is a deterrent, in 3rd down we can’t always have him run a route. You’re basically telling the defense he’s not saying in to pass protect.

Before we bash Barkley, remember this. Not all backs our 3 down backs. Yes, he’s the 2nd overall pick and he better be. But come to realization it’s not in the cards. Accept it, because he’s not going to be good over night. This is his 3rd year and it’s the same as his rookie year.

And as I said before after this year he will want a similar contract to what Mccaffrey got. If his blocking doesn’t improve he won’t be worth it. You can’t just lose a #2 pick after his rookie contract. It’s a huge reason we are in the position we are in

[Deleted]

Sept 16, 2020 11:21:46 GMT -5 Kruunch said:

Sept 16, 2020 11:19:44 GMT -5 Martin said:

What ever the technical reasons are for Barkley not being able to block the out come will be a negative. DJ will either get hurt or fumble which will lose games. There is not denying that your RB must be able to pick up the blitz. Its fundamental football and now all teams are aware of it. Weak link. 

Agreed. We were spoiled with Jacobs and Bradshaw. Both of them looked for a defender to hit.. 

I loved Jacobs and hated him. Loved when he crushed guys and hated when he would get tackled by his laces

[McCherry]

Suddenly one of the most hated former Giants is the voice of reason around here.... Good god.

[ratbastich]

Sept 16, 2020 11:42:04 GMT -5 McCherry said:

Suddenly one of the most hated former Giants is the voice of reason around here.... Good god.

It's 2020....the world is in chaos! 


"Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together... mass hysteria!"

[nick030567]

Sept 16, 2020 11:14:57 GMT -5 Kruunch said:

Before fans bash Tiki, he has a fair point. Like Tiki said, when he came out of Virginia he was a kick off and punt returner, and our 3rd down back. He HAD to learn to pass protect. If not, he would of been out of a job.

Barkley has the ideal size to pick up a blitz. Hell, half the backs in this league would kill to have his size. What I saw Monday night is he doesn’t diagnose where the blitz comes fast enough. Sounds simple enough but it’s not, those defensive coordinators get paid a lot of money to make your job that much harder. Will they come from the outside, is that corner blitzing? Is the mike shooting he A gap? Talk about keeping your head on a swivel. Even when he does engage with the defender he gets outmanned. That can not happen.. Either he’s not getting low enough, or that defender just wants it more than him. Either way it has become evident he’s not a good blocker. Which is a deterrent, in 3rd down we can’t always have him run a route. You’re basically telling the defense he’s not saying in to pass protect.

Before we bash Barkley, remember this. Not all backs our 3 down backs. Yes, he’s the 2nd overall pick and he better be. But come to realization it’s not in the cards. Accept it, because he’s not going to be good over night. This is his 3rd year and it’s the same as his rookie year.

I think his indecision effects his strength. He's unsure, thus cannot focus any momentum on anyone desire being significantly stronger than CBs and safeties.in fact I'd say he's probably stronger than a lot of LBs.

I think he'll improve as the season goes. He isn't always terrible, just was especially exposed Monday.

[moecoastie]

Smaller and less talented RBs have learned to passblock. Its time to walk the walk. Cats out of the bag...he needs to fix it.

[BigBlueDog42]

Sept 16, 2020 11:14:57 GMT -5 Kruunch said:

Before fans bash Tiki, he has a fair point. Like Tiki said, when he came out of Virginia he was a kick off and punt returner, and our 3rd down back. He HAD to learn to pass protect. If not, he would of been out of a job.

Barkley has the ideal size to pick up a blitz. Hell, half the backs in this league would kill to have his size. What I saw Monday night is he doesn’t diagnose where the blitz comes fast enough. Sounds simple enough but it’s not, those defensive coordinators get paid a lot of money to make your job that much harder. Will they come from the outside, is that corner blitzing? Is the mike shooting he A gap? Talk about keeping your head on a swivel. Even when he does engage with the defender he gets outmanned. That can not happen.. Either he’s not getting low enough, or that defender just wants it more than him. Either way it has become evident he’s not a good blocker. Which is a deterrent, in 3rd down we can’t always have him run a route. You’re basically telling the defense he’s not saying in to pass protect.

Before we bash Barkley, remember this. Not all backs our 3 down backs. Yes, he’s the 2nd overall pick and he better be. But come to realization it’s not in the cards. Accept it, because he’s not going to be good over night. This is his 3rd year and it’s the same as his rookie year.

Saw him pick a couple up in the A gap with cut blocks taking the LB down I don't think it's a desire thing. I noticed he steps up and rushes to help he got burned helping Thomas when Thomas was ok. I remember when AB and especially BJ they would be at the same depth as Eli seeing everything and picking them up giving him that extra second to win the down it's a must, he has the hunger, Burns from what I understand is an awesome RB coach lets see how the year goes. It needs to be corrected and he is capable.

[FundamentallySoundJones]

Sept 16, 2020 11:14:57 GMT -5 Kruunch said:

Before fans bash Tiki, he has a fair point. Like Tiki said, when he came out of Virginia he was a kick off and punt returner, and our 3rd down back. He HAD to learn to pass protect. If not, he would of been out of a job.

Barkley has the ideal size to pick up a blitz. Hell, half the backs in this league would kill to have his size. What I saw Monday night is he doesn’t diagnose where the blitz comes fast enough. Sounds simple enough but it’s not, those defensive coordinators get paid a lot of money to make your job that much harder. Will they come from the outside, is that corner blitzing? Is the mike shooting he A gap? Talk about keeping your head on a swivel. Even when he does engage with the defender he gets outmanned. That can not happen.. Either he’s not getting low enough, or that defender just wants it more than him. Either way it has become evident he’s not a good blocker. Which is a deterrent, in 3rd down we can’t always have him run a route. You’re basically telling the defense he’s not saying in to pass protect.

Before we bash Barkley, remember this. Not all backs our 3 down backs. Yes, he’s the 2nd overall pick and he better be. But come to realization it’s not in the cards. Accept it, because he’s not going to be good over night. This is his 3rd year and it’s the same as his rookie year.

There is a reason they brought in dion lewis , some fans just dont like to see it .  

[GameTime]

Tiki is just saying what we already know. This is not a secret.

[allnygin]

I mean he's not wrong. Barkley is suspect in that area, quite frankly he's suspect in a few areas of his game that he's been said to have been working on. We all know he's beyond gifted but he's got some serious work to do to be considered a "great". I'm not using Mondays game as a baseline. Week 1 against an insane defense.. I'll hold off on my opinion until mid season and get a better idea of how much or not barkley has improved at the pass pro aspect of his game, and just hitting a hole and picking up the dirty yards when needed. 

[giantlegacy]

Sept 16, 2020 17:11:05 GMT -5 allnygin said:

I mean he's not wrong. Barkley is suspect in that area, quite frankly he's suspect in a few areas of his game that he's been said to have been working on. We all know he's beyond gifted but he's got some serious work to do to be considered a "great". I'm not using Mondays game as a baseline. Week 1 against an insane defense.. I'll hold off on my opinion until mid season and get a better idea of how much or not barkley has improved at the pass pro aspect of his game, and just hitting a hole and picking up the dirty yards when needed. 

How could he pick up a dirty 3 or 4 yards if he can't even get to the LOS?
There was no room for him to even spin out and evade someone because it was a complete jailbreak of multiple players on him
He put on more upper body muscle this offseason so he knows and probably wants to be really good inside the tackles because if he breaks through a tackle or 2 at the POA he can go house on every touch
And thats the frustrating thing about Monday night,if he could have found a way through the tackles witb how much they sold out he could have had multiple home runs because there was nobody back there except for a single high safety and we have seen every time when he hits that gear there is no way that guy gets him

[redbeardxxv]

If he can't learn to block, his value is not on the field, it's in a trade. Gettleman has already shown he's not afraid to deal a star player, No matter the production or ability... just ask OBJ. I know I'll get killed for even suggesting it, but..... Imagine the haul we would get, on a team that has VERY few talented guys and NEEDS an infusion of talent. I know- not a popular stance, but you have to imagine Gettleman will explore the idea. What happens to his value when he demands a big payday?

[GameTime]

Sept 16, 2020 18:29:46 GMT -5 redbeardxxv said:

If he can't learn to block, his value is not on the field, it's in a trade. Gettleman has already shown he's not afraid to deal a star player, No matter the production or ability... just ask OBJ. I know I'll get killed for even suggesting it, but..... Imagine the haul we would get, on a team that has VERY few talented guys and NEEDS an infusion of talent. I know- not a popular stance, but you have to imagine Gettleman will explore the idea. What happens to his value when he demands a big payday?

you wont get killed....

Its a real possibility he wont get extended. 

[McCherry]

Sept 16, 2020 17:44:25 GMT -5 giantlegacy said:

Sept 16, 2020 17:11:05 GMT -5 allnygin said:

I mean he's not wrong. Barkley is suspect in that area, quite frankly he's suspect in a few areas of his game that he's been said to have been working on. We all know he's beyond gifted but he's got some serious work to do to be considered a "great". I'm not using Mondays game as a baseline. Week 1 against an insane defense.. I'll hold off on my opinion until mid season and get a better idea of how much or not barkley has improved at the pass pro aspect of his game, and just hitting a hole and picking up the dirty yards when needed. 

How could he pick up a dirty 3 or 4 yards if he can't even get to the LOS?
There was no room for him to even spin out and evade someone because it was a complete jailbreak of multiple players on him
He put on more upper body muscle this offseason so he knows and probably wants to be really good inside the tackles because if he breaks through a tackle or 2 at the POA he can go house on every touch
And thats the frustrating thing about Monday night,if he could have found a way through the tackles witb how much they sold out he could have had multiple home runs because there was nobody back there except for a single high safety and we have seen every time when he hits that gear there is no way that guy gets him

The entire game is on YouTube and I just rewatched most of the first half. 

Here are the first 7 carries, which pretty much told the story. 

1st carry - SK dropped in backfield by unblocked LB right side between RT and TE
2nd carry - Pitch to SK 8 yds.
3rd carry - SK up the middle for 2.
4th carry - Dupree unblocked left side for 2 yd SK loss. Didn't appear to be Thomas's responsibility but hard to tell.
5th carry - Lewis left side 1 yd
6th carry - Engram misses block left side. Fans done with Engram.
7th carry - Gates turned around. SK tackled for loss. Fans done with Gates, Barkely and entire OL.

4 of these runs could've worked if one man made their block.

[allnygin]

Sept 16, 2020 17:44:25 GMT -5 giantlegacy said:

Sept 16, 2020 17:11:05 GMT -5 allnygin said:

I mean he's not wrong. Barkley is suspect in that area, quite frankly he's suspect in a few areas of his game that he's been said to have been working on. We all know he's beyond gifted but he's got some serious work to do to be considered a "great". I'm not using Mondays game as a baseline. Week 1 against an insane defense.. I'll hold off on my opinion until mid season and get a better idea of how much or not barkley has improved at the pass pro aspect of his game, and just hitting a hole and picking up the dirty yards when needed. 

How could he pick up a dirty 3 or 4 yards if he can't even get to the LOS?
There was no room for him to even spin out and evade someone because it was a complete jailbreak of multiple players on him
He put on more upper body muscle this offseason so he knows and probably wants to be really good inside the tackles because if he breaks through a tackle or 2 at the POA he can go house on every touch
And thats the frustrating thing about Monday night,if he could have found a way through the tackles witb how much they sold out he could have had multiple home runs because there was nobody back there except for a single high safety and we have seen every time when he hits that gear there is no way that guy gets him

Oh, yeah I don't think for a second he could've done anything Monday night differently he had no chance. I'd like to see him grind out some tough yards a little more often under normal circumstances though when it's needed. I think you're right with the upper body strength Saquan is smart he knows what areas he needs to improve on and he truly does want to get better at those areas. 

[yoho]

On one of the plays Barkley didn’t recognize the blitzer fast enough and didn’t get there in time. I don’t recall any “afraid to hit anyone” missed blocks, but I’ll bet this criticism lights a fire under his ass, because he seems like the type of kid that wants to be the best, and will do what it takes. Plus , I think this coaching staff can teach him.

[giantlegacy]

Sept 16, 2020 19:42:12 GMT -5 yoho said:

On one of the plays Barkley didn’t recognize the blitzer fast enough and didn’t get there in time. I don’t recall any “afraid to hit anyone” missed blocks, but I’ll bet this criticism lights a fire under his ass, because he seems like the type of kid that wants to be the best, and will do what it takes. Plus , I think this coaching staff can teach him.

Being unsure =tentative
Being tentative= not being aggressive with blocking and bad fundamentals


This goes for pretty much every position on the team

[NAVY2323(ret)]

Saquon is the Roger Dorn of blocking.

[DandyDon]

Sept 16, 2020 14:53:40 GMT -5 moecoastie said:

Smaller and less talented RBs have learned to passblock. Its time to walk the walk. Cats out of the bag...he needs to fix it.

JJ needs to fix it.

[DandyDon]

Sept 16, 2020 16:58:13 GMT -5 FundamentallySoundJones said:

Sept 16, 2020 11:14:57 GMT -5 Kruunch said:

Before fans bash Tiki, he has a fair point. Like Tiki said, when he came out of Virginia he was a kick off and punt returner, and our 3rd down back. He HAD to learn to pass protect. If not, he would of been out of a job.

Barkley has the ideal size to pick up a blitz. Hell, half the backs in this league would kill to have his size. What I saw Monday night is he doesn’t diagnose where the blitz comes fast enough. Sounds simple enough but it’s not, those defensive coordinators get paid a lot of money to make your job that much harder. Will they come from the outside, is that corner blitzing? Is the mike shooting he A gap? Talk about keeping your head on a swivel. Even when he does engage with the defender he gets outmanned. That can not happen.. Either he’s not getting low enough, or that defender just wants it more than him. Either way it has become evident he’s not a good blocker. Which is a deterrent, in 3rd down we can’t always have him run a route. You’re basically telling the defense he’s not saying in to pass protect.

Before we bash Barkley, remember this. Not all backs our 3 down backs. Yes, he’s the 2nd overall pick and he better be. But come to realization it’s not in the cards. Accept it, because he’s not going to be good over night. This is his 3rd year and it’s the same as his rookie year.

There is a reason they brought in dion lewis , some fans just dont like to see it .  

Who?

[FundamentallySoundJones]

Sept 16, 2020 20:18:03 GMT -5 DandyDon said:

Sept 16, 2020 16:58:13 GMT -5 FundamentallySoundJones said:

There is a reason they brought in dion lewis , some fans just dont like to see it .  

Who?

www.giants.com/news/reports-giants-agree-to-terms-with-rb-dion-lewis

[Parademon1]

Sept 16, 2020 11:42:04 GMT -5 McCherry said:

Suddenly one of the most hated former Giants is the voice of reason around here.... Good god.

I've never hated Tiki. Why, because he spoke his mind & gave his honest opinion & it butthurt people? He's the greatest RB in NYG history & had he played 1-2 more yrs, woulda cemented his place in the HOF. And plz don't bring up his personal life, that's his business & he's not the 1st person in history to do what he did nor will he be the last. People that live in glass houses shouldn't throw rocks or act holier than thou. Barkley needs to not act like a B%$^# when it comes to picking up a blitze or more DBs are gonna embarrass him the way the Jets DB did last yr when he blasted thru him on the way to mugging DJ for the ball. That play more than likely cost the team that game.

[Jomo]

What's he supposed to say, Barkley's running skills give him a free pass on pass protection?
What Tiki said is self evident. Barkley needs to round out his game and honestly, it is a little late in arriving at this point.
He needs to absorb and apply what the coaches are surely trying to teach him.

[JoeyCush]

I wouldnt feel comfortable taking our top weapon off the field on 3rd down because he is having trouble pass blocking.

[DandyDon]

www.bigblueview.com/2020/9/16/21439538/valentines-views-evan-engram-should-not-be-a-blocker-jason-garrett-saquon-barkley-giants-more