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Post by Parademon1 on Sept 17, 2018 8:34:01 GMT -5
Still haven't seen highlights of the game but it seems that both the OL & Eli's inability to extend plays when facing pressure are the main factors in last nights loss. Did Dallas stack the box all night to contain SB? If so, then why didn't the Giants take advantage of that & throw the ball instead? Eli has always sucked at throwing a simple screen which would produce more yds due to having downfield blocking, all those check downs to SB would get you less yds cuz as soon as he was catching them, a Cowboys defender was there to limit his YAC. How in the heck is OBJ TDless 2 games in? Any more drops by Giants receivers? The D sound & looks to be playing very well despite giving up that opening drive TD, they pretty much held Dak in check, they kept Ewok nder 80yds, yet still lose, that's on the O as the D has given up 20ppg & any good O would at minimum put up 23, this Giants O is struggling to match last yr's 15.4ppg output by scoring only 14ppg so far. That really puts a lot of pressure on the D to try & play perfect mistake free football to limit the other team to 17 or less thanks to our inept O.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2018 9:01:46 GMT -5
Still haven't seen highlights of the game but it seems that both the OL & Eli's inability to extend plays when facing pressure are the main factors in last nights loss. Did Dallas stack the box all night to contain SB? If so, then why didn't the Giants take advantage of that & throw the ball instead? Eli has always sucked at throwing a simple screen which would produce more yds due to having downfield blocking, all those check downs to SB would get you less yds cuz as soon as he was catching them, a Cowboys defender was there to limit his YAC. How in the heck is OBJ TDless 2 games in? Any more drops by Giants receivers? The D sound & looks to be playing very well despite giving up that opening drive TD, they pretty much held Dak in check, they kept Ewok nder 80yds, yet still lose, that's on the O as the D has given up 20ppg & any good O would at minimum put up 23, this Giants O is struggling to match last yr's 15.4ppg output by scoring only 14ppg so far. That really puts a lot of pressure on the D to try & play perfect mistake free football to limit the other team to 17 or less thanks to our inept O. Our OL is very bad. As many have pointed out it's not like they are getting manhandled and tossed aside. Last night it was they looked clueless on simple stunts or slant blitzes. They looked like amateurs. That's a combination of not having the greatest talent and having piss poor coaching. And that does not excuse Eli from a putrid performance either. I feel like I'm repeating myself for years now but Eli has never been the most physically gifted QB since he was drafted. But what separated him from being "just good" and made him a great QB was his presnap intelligence, ability to read a defense, set protections, audible, go through a progression and make the right decisions. All of that seems lost now too. He can't run the offense presnap. He can't set up proper protections. He's not reading the defense. He rarely goes through a progression rather he robotically goes to his first read almost instantly which is pretty much a check down every single time. But here's the rub: There are very few great OLs in the NFL. Many OLs have weaknesses and fail to provide perfect/ample protection for the QB. Yet there are QBs, who aren't the elite of the elite, who can do just enough with their legs to help their own cause. Shift the pocket, step up, extend the play by scrambling, roll out and make throws on the run... scramble for a first down and keep D's honest. These are all critical components to a QB's game that Eli literally does not possess. It's quite simple and it has been evident for two seasons now: It's time to really rebuild this OL and move on from Eli. Both need to happen. And hopefully it happens while our young weapons are still under contract with the team.
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Post by Miked1958 on Sept 17, 2018 9:31:18 GMT -5
Barkley caught something like 14 balls and was elusive best he could be with that pathetic blocking We lost our Center who had to be taken off on a cart. Jones would if been good to have right about now. Greco had to come in. Apple also went out with groin injury. Was playing great prior You make a very good point about Barkley catching a lot of passes because the offensive line can't block for him to have positive rushing yards consistently. So I guess having an explosive RB and all the other weapons on offense doesn't mean shit If we have a crap OL that cannot pass protect or run block...go figure... exactly. Eli could have the best offensive players in the history of the game lined up with him and it wouldn't amount to a hill of beans unless you can get the ball out to them HOF Receivers or open some holes to spring those HOF RBs If you got guys coming through every play like the o line is a turnstile you are going to miss wide open guys for TDs ( Odell & Barkley ) because your running for your life the second you get the ball This O line reminds me of a scene in a movie where the o line kept letting the rushers go right through on purpose to kill the QB. Just stepping aside at the snap and letting them teeoff on the QB. That's how much of a joke this line is. Eli will continue to take sacks, throw the ball away, make turnovers and miss wide open Receivers all season. Drafting any of the 4 QBs and good chance they ruin his career before it starts possibly ( see all the QBs the Browns drafted that may of had a good NFL career had they had an O line. Instead they were marked as busts and disappeared ) so Darnold, Mayfield, etc would be worse behind this line being a rookie. It would shed their confidence quickly Odell, Barkley, Engram, Shep will be all be frustrated all season. They will be standing there knowing they could help but like having handcuffs on. Sad
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2018 9:38:00 GMT -5
You make a very good point about Barkley catching a lot of passes because the offensive line can't block for him to have positive rushing yards consistently. So I guess having an explosive RB and all the other weapons on offense doesn't mean shit If we have a crap OL that cannot pass protect or run block...go figure... exactly. Eli could have the best offensive players in the history of the game lined up with him and it wouldn't amount to a hill of beans unless you can get the ball out to them HOF Receivers or open some holes to spring those HOF RBs If you got guys coming through every play like the o line is a turnstile you are going to miss wide open guys for TDs ( Odell & Barkley ) because your running for your life the second you get the ball This O line reminds me of a scene in a movie where the o line kept letting the rushers go right through on purpose to kill the QB. Just stepping aside at the snap and letting them teeoff on the QB. That's how much of a joke this line is. Eli will continue to take sacks, throw the ball away, make turnovers and miss wide open Receivers all season. Drafting any of the 4 QBs and good chance they ruin his career before it starts possibly ( see all the QBs the Browns drafted that may of had a good NFL career had they had an O line. Instead they were marked as busts and disappeared ) so Darnold, Mayfield, etc would be worse behind this line being a rookie. It would shed their confidence quickly Odell, Barkley, Engram, Shep will be all be frustrated all season. They will be standing there knowing they could help but like having handcuffs on. Sad So, we have no other problem besides the O-line.
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Post by EliQB10 on Sept 17, 2018 9:42:41 GMT -5
You make a very good point about Barkley catching a lot of passes because the offensive line can't block for him to have positive rushing yards consistently. So I guess having an explosive RB and all the other weapons on offense doesn't mean shit If we have a crap OL that cannot pass protect or run block...go figure... exactly. Eli could have the best offensive players in the history of the game lined up with him and it wouldn't amount to a hill of beans unless you can get the ball out to them HOF Receivers or open some holes to spring those HOF RBs If you got guys coming through every play like the o line is a turnstile you are going to miss wide open guys for TDs ( Odell & Barkley ) because your running for your life the second you get the ball This O line reminds me of a scene in a movie where the o line kept letting the rushers go right through on purpose to kill the QB. Just stepping aside at the snap and letting them teeoff on the QB. That's how much of a joke this line is. Eli will continue to take sacks, throw the ball away, make turnovers and miss wide open Receivers all season. Drafting any of the 4 QBs and good chance they ruin his career before it starts possibly ( see all the QBs the Browns drafted that may of had a good NFL career had they had an O line. Instead they were marked as busts and disappeared ) so Darnold, Mayfield, etc would be worse behind this line being a rookie. It would shed their confidence quickly Odell, Barkley, Engram, Shep will be all be frustrated all season. They will be standing there knowing they could help but like having handcuffs on. Sad Exactly Mike...I just can't for the life of me understand why some on here can't understand that while Eli is part of the problem and certainly deserves some of the blame that he has little to no chance of being successful behind an OL that is so inept at both pass protection and run blocking?
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Post by Miked1958 on Sept 17, 2018 9:49:12 GMT -5
exactly. Eli could have the best offensive players in the history of the game lined up with him and it wouldn't amount to a hill of beans unless you can get the ball out to them HOF Receivers or open some holes to spring those HOF RBs If you got guys coming through every play like the o line is a turnstile you are going to miss wide open guys for TDs ( Odell & Barkley ) because your running for your life the second you get the ball This O line reminds me of a scene in a movie where the o line kept letting the rushers go right through on purpose to kill the QB. Just stepping aside at the snap and letting them teeoff on the QB. That's how much of a joke this line is. Eli will continue to take sacks, throw the ball away, make turnovers and miss wide open Receivers all season. Drafting any of the 4 QBs and good chance they ruin his career before it starts possibly ( see all the QBs the Browns drafted that may of had a good NFL career had they had an O line. Instead they were marked as busts and disappeared ) so Darnold, Mayfield, etc would be worse behind this line being a rookie. It would shed their confidence quickly Odell, Barkley, Engram, Shep will be all be frustrated all season. They will be standing there knowing they could help but like having handcuffs on. Sad Exactly Mike...I just can't for the life of me understand why some on here can't understand that while Eli is part of the problem and certainly deserves some of the blame that he has little to no chance of being successful behind an OL that is so inept at both pass protection and run blocking? Eli has always been a statue. Never know as someone who can extend plays with his feet. However over the years give him some protection and he shreds defenses. I for one still believe he can do that today especially with the weapons he has now. Sad his career will end with last 5/6 years of it a team in the NY market COULDN'T give him a line worth a shit
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Post by EliQB10 on Sept 17, 2018 9:50:36 GMT -5
Exactly Mike...I just can't for the life of me understand why some on here can't understand that while Eli is part of the problem and certainly deserves some of the blame that he has little to no chance of being successful behind an OL that is so inept at both pass protection and run blocking? Eli has always been a statue. Never know as someone who can extend plays with his feet. However over the years give him some protection and he shreds defenses. I for one still believe he can do that today especially with the weapons he has now. Sad his career will end with last 5/6 years of it a team in the NY market COULDN'T give him a line worth a shit Yup so sad...
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Post by Miked1958 on Sept 17, 2018 9:52:23 GMT -5
exactly. Eli could have the best offensive players in the history of the game lined up with him and it wouldn't amount to a hill of beans unless you can get the ball out to them HOF Receivers or open some holes to spring those HOF RBs If you got guys coming through every play like the o line is a turnstile you are going to miss wide open guys for TDs ( Odell & Barkley ) because your running for your life the second you get the ball This O line reminds me of a scene in a movie where the o line kept letting the rushers go right through on purpose to kill the QB. Just stepping aside at the snap and letting them teeoff on the QB. That's how much of a joke this line is. Eli will continue to take sacks, throw the ball away, make turnovers and miss wide open Receivers all season. Drafting any of the 4 QBs and good chance they ruin his career before it starts possibly ( see all the QBs the Browns drafted that may of had a good NFL career had they had an O line. Instead they were marked as busts and disappeared ) so Darnold, Mayfield, etc would be worse behind this line being a rookie. It would shed their confidence quickly Odell, Barkley, Engram, Shep will be all be frustrated all season. They will be standing there knowing they could help but like having handcuffs on. Sad So, we have no other problem besides the O-line. Right now it's the biggest most glaring problem. The defense has played good enough to win both games. If Eli had a link worth a crap he would be able to deliver. He has in the past and was never know as a guy who can use his feet to extend plays and drives. But he picked defenses apart with much less Talent
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Post by EliQB10 on Sept 17, 2018 9:55:59 GMT -5
exactly. Eli could have the best offensive players in the history of the game lined up with him and it wouldn't amount to a hill of beans unless you can get the ball out to them HOF Receivers or open some holes to spring those HOF RBs If you got guys coming through every play like the o line is a turnstile you are going to miss wide open guys for TDs ( Odell & Barkley ) because your running for your life the second you get the ball This O line reminds me of a scene in a movie where the o line kept letting the rushers go right through on purpose to kill the QB. Just stepping aside at the snap and letting them teeoff on the QB. That's how much of a joke this line is. Eli will continue to take sacks, throw the ball away, make turnovers and miss wide open Receivers all season. Drafting any of the 4 QBs and good chance they ruin his career before it starts possibly ( see all the QBs the Browns drafted that may of had a good NFL career had they had an O line. Instead they were marked as busts and disappeared ) so Darnold, Mayfield, etc would be worse behind this line being a rookie. It would shed their confidence quickly Odell, Barkley, Engram, Shep will be all be frustrated all season. They will be standing there knowing they could help but like having handcuffs on. Sad So, we have no other problem besides the O-line. No depth, no pass rush, thin at secondary, aging non mobile QB who needs a solid OL to be successful...did I leave anything out?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2018 10:11:11 GMT -5
So, we have no other problem besides the O-line. Right now it's the biggest most glaring problem. The defense has played good enough to win both games. If Eli had a link worth a crap he would be able to deliver. He has in the past and was never know as a guy who can use his feet to extend plays and drives. But he picked defenses apart with much less Talent "The past" being the operative words. I was a ladies' man in the past.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2018 10:13:08 GMT -5
So, we have no other problem besides the O-line. No depth, no pass rush, thin at secondary, aging non mobile QB who needs a solid OL to be successful...did I leave anything out? The defense held their opponents to 20 points in each game. If your offense can't score at least 20, then, well...
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Post by Miked1958 on Sept 17, 2018 10:50:28 GMT -5
Right now it's the biggest most glaring problem. The defense has played good enough to win both games. If Eli had a link worth a crap he would be able to deliver. He has in the past and was never know as a guy who can use his feet to extend plays and drives. But he picked defenses apart with much less Talent "The past" being the operative words. I was a ladies' man in the past. I know he has lost confidence over past 5 or so seasons because he has taken a beating getting no help whatsoever from his O Line I may be in the minority but I'm still one that believes he'd be effective if he was given a half way decent o line. He has been successful with much less Talent. With this group of play makers he'd be better then I'm the past. But unfortunately will never find out of that is a true statement Bec he will be gone before this line is fixed so it's a mute point
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Post by PennState1 on Sept 17, 2018 10:57:14 GMT -5
Still haven't seen highlights of the game but it seems that both the OL & Eli's inability to extend plays when facing pressure are the main factors in last nights loss. Did Dallas stack the box all night to contain SB? If so, then why didn't the Giants take advantage of that & throw the ball instead? Eli has always sucked at throwing a simple screen which would produce more yds due to having downfield blocking, all those check downs to SB would get you less yds cuz as soon as he was catching them, a Cowboys defender was there to limit his YAC. How in the heck is OBJ TDless 2 games in? Any more drops by Giants receivers? The D sound & looks to be playing very well despite giving up that opening drive TD, they pretty much held Dak in check, they kept Ewok nder 80yds, yet still lose, that's on the O as the D has given up 20ppg & any good O would at minimum put up 23, this Giants O is struggling to match last yr's 15.4ppg output by scoring only 14ppg so far. That really puts a lot of pressure on the D to try & play perfect mistake free football to limit the other team to 17 or less thanks to our inept O. Our OL is very bad. As many have pointed out it's not like they are getting manhandled and tossed aside. Last night it was they looked clueless on simple stunts or slant blitzes. They looked like amateurs. That's a combination of not having the greatest talent and having piss poor coaching. And that does not excuse Eli from a putrid performance either. I feel like I'm repeating myself for years now but Eli has never been the most physically gifted QB since he was drafted. But what separated him from being "just good" and made him a great QB was his presnap intelligence, ability to read a defense, set protections, audible, go through a progression and make the right decisions. All of that seems lost now too. He can't run the offense presnap. He can't set up proper protections. He's not reading the defense. He rarely goes through a progression rather he robotically goes to his first read almost instantly which is pretty much a check down every single time. But here's the rub: There are very few great OLs in the NFL. Many OLs have weaknesses and fail to provide perfect/ample protection for the QB. Yet there are QBs, who aren't the elite of the elite, who can do just enough with their legs to help their own cause. Shift the pocket, step up, extend the play by scrambling, roll out and make throws on the run... scramble for a first down and keep D's honest. These are all critical components to a QB's game that Eli literally does not possess. It's quite simple and it has been evident for two seasons now: It's time to really rebuild this OL and move on from Eli. Both need to happen. And hopefully it happens while our young weapons are still under contract with the team. The center calls protections for the oline.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2018 11:01:47 GMT -5
Our OL is very bad. As many have pointed out it's not like they are getting manhandled and tossed aside. Last night it was they looked clueless on simple stunts or slant blitzes. They looked like amateurs. That's a combination of not having the greatest talent and having piss poor coaching. And that does not excuse Eli from a putrid performance either. I feel like I'm repeating myself for years now but Eli has never been the most physically gifted QB since he was drafted. But what separated him from being "just good" and made him a great QB was his presnap intelligence, ability to read a defense, set protections, audible, go through a progression and make the right decisions. All of that seems lost now too. He can't run the offense presnap. He can't set up proper protections. He's not reading the defense. He rarely goes through a progression rather he robotically goes to his first read almost instantly which is pretty much a check down every single time. But here's the rub: There are very few great OLs in the NFL. Many OLs have weaknesses and fail to provide perfect/ample protection for the QB. Yet there are QBs, who aren't the elite of the elite, who can do just enough with their legs to help their own cause. Shift the pocket, step up, extend the play by scrambling, roll out and make throws on the run... scramble for a first down and keep D's honest. These are all critical components to a QB's game that Eli literally does not possess. It's quite simple and it has been evident for two seasons now: It's time to really rebuild this OL and move on from Eli. Both need to happen. And hopefully it happens while our young weapons are still under contract with the team. The center calls protections for the oline. Thank you for focusing on 0.3% of the post. That said, you don’t think Eli is calling out possible protections or audibling protections presnap? Of course he is. This is football 101 stuff.
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Post by EliQB10 on Sept 17, 2018 11:36:04 GMT -5
No depth, no pass rush, thin at secondary, aging non mobile QB who needs a solid OL to be successful...did I leave anything out? The defense held their opponents to 20 points in each game. If your offense can't score at least 20, then, well... The defense has play pretty well considering, the offense obviously is the bigger problem....
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2018 11:39:48 GMT -5
The defense held their opponents to 20 points in each game. If your offense can't score at least 20, then, well... The defense has play pretty well considering, the offense obviously is the bigger problem.... ...which is what I've been saying the last few months while many others were theorizing that our defense would be the weak link this season. What did Yogi say? "It's like deja vu all over again"?
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Post by Sarcasman on Sept 17, 2018 14:38:12 GMT -5
The defense held their opponents to 20 points in each game. If your offense can't score at least 20, then, well... The defense has play pretty well considering, the offense obviously is the bigger problem.... The defense has played decently. The offense has been putrid.
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