|
Post by thetruth on Apr 19, 2021 22:54:29 GMT -5
As the draft draws near and with the fact that D. Smith (what I think is the Giants #1 target) is off the board at 11, what do they do?
I believe it will come down to these two players if they dont trade down, it wouldn't be this way for me but from what im reading/hearing they are going EDGE.
Between these two? id be happy with Ojulari. To me, Paye is a reach. He's a high floor player who doesn't have any pass rush moves, very raw. However, he's a great player against the run.
I'd rather go over Phillips if they force EDGE, but I think the Giants choose between these two players.
|
|
|
Post by allnygin on Apr 19, 2021 22:58:29 GMT -5
They better be trading back, if they go edge.. but rolling my eyes.. if they don't and they do I'd rather the pick be Ojulari. I personally think Phillips is the best talent at the position in this class, he just comes with way to much risk.
|
|
|
Post by giantlegacy on Apr 19, 2021 23:06:08 GMT -5
Hell of they are going to reach on defense Zevon Collins
|
|
|
Post by McCherry on Apr 19, 2021 23:15:45 GMT -5
Ojulari. Both are close comparisons though.
|
|
|
Post by Sarcasman on Apr 20, 2021 0:34:45 GMT -5
If there is a top OL available I want them to go there.
If they go D, I just want them to be right.
|
|
|
Post by fifthavephil on Apr 20, 2021 0:38:06 GMT -5
Paye,Ojulari and Parsons are 6 ft 2inches tall. Ojulari and Parsons weigh 245 lbs , Paye 265 lbs. Should the Giants go edge at 11, i think they will go Parsons. Judge, Graham and Spencer, did not go to Penn State ( Pro Day ) , for R&R.
I would like to see, the Giants trade down and pick up additional picks.
|
|
|
Post by TCHOF on Apr 20, 2021 4:24:29 GMT -5
Paye,Ojulari and Parsons are 6 ft 2inches tall. Ojulari and Parsons weigh 245 lbs , Paye 265 lbs. Should the Giants go edge at 11, i think they will go Parsons. Judge, Graham and Spencer, did not go to Penn State ( Pro Day ) , for R&R. I would like to see, the Giants trade down and pick up additional picks. Parsons isn’t an edge rusher
|
|
|
Post by Rangers13 on Apr 20, 2021 5:00:48 GMT -5
Doubt they pass on Parsons for either of those two.
|
|
|
Post by IrishMike on Apr 20, 2021 5:15:12 GMT -5
Hard to say without know who else is there. I personally think anyone saying "they are going edge" is kind of foolish. They are going to follow their draft board. If 4-5 QBs go before them I don't see how an edge can be even near the top of their board. Surtain, Slater, Parsons, Pitts, Waddle, Smith, Chase should all be rated significantly higher than the edges.
With that said and in respect for the OP and his thread I think they go Ojulari. Paye is a very good player but does not add enough to the pass rush game to warrant pick 11. Now maybe they think they can get more out of him. Averaging last year (4 games) out he would have hit 12 TFL and 6 sacks in each of the last two seasons. Those are respectable numbers. Ojulari has better numbers and on film has more of what's needed for pass rushing edge rushers.
Also my son just woke up and put on the TV and David Diehl is on TV saying Ojulari is the best edge.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2021 6:25:14 GMT -5
Azeez Ojulari if I had to choose
A bit light, but a much better scheme fit for a 3-4.
Got to watch a lot of his games...he's at times as dominant a SEC pass rusher can be.
Not at 11...as Mike says, too much talent going to be there for us at 11...especially if Jones goes to SF...might have 5 QB's taken top 10...that will be pushing down some top 5 player our way.
|
|
|
Post by Fletch842 on Apr 20, 2021 6:33:20 GMT -5
I'd take a flyer on the kid from Miami with the concussions over either of these two. I think his play has a lot more potential, would just hold my breath every time he makes a big hit. I still would only be ok with any of these edge guys is if we trade down though. I think there is going to be much better value at 11.
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Apr 20, 2021 6:51:55 GMT -5
Neither
BPA at 11 and that wont be a D player.
Its simple for me. They need O more than D and the picks are there to do that
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Apr 20, 2021 6:53:20 GMT -5
I'd take a flyer on the kid from Miami with the concussions over either of these two. I think his play has a lot more potential, would just hold my breath every time he makes a big hit. I still would only be ok with any of these edge guys is if we trade down though. I think there is going to be much better value at 11.exactly.....no "flyers" in round 1 please....
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2021 7:05:03 GMT -5
Neither BPA at 11 and that wont be a D player. Its simple for me. They need O more than D and the picks are there to do that Agreed 100%...not sure how some fans overlook we are in a DJ has to to do well year or this entire team gets blown up situation ....add in the fact we are knee deep on OL and WR in that make or break Jones/Giants year...why in the world would you reach for a edge when not only is it a weak class, but the WR class and OL is as talent rich as it's ever been. Need meets strength of draft class...but reach for a Paye? It lacks common sense.
|
|
|
Post by bluebuddha on Apr 20, 2021 7:09:01 GMT -5
Depends what the Giants are looking for. If they want pressure of the edge than Azeez is the guy. The guy gets around the corner better than the other edge candidates. If they want pressure from multiple spots then Paye is more versatile plus he is the best run defender in the draft.
I think Giants are looking for pass rushing help and more pressure on the QB. I think that doesn't necessarily mean they want an edge rusher. That also doesn't mean they don't have a different rating than tv and internet big boards on one or two front 7 defensive players.
|
|
|
Post by OrangeGiant on Apr 20, 2021 7:11:23 GMT -5
I really hope they don't take either of these guys at #11, I think it's a reach either way. I think Parsons is probably the only defensive player they might take at #11 if he is there...and that is if they don't believe he has character issues. However, I think Surtain could be a dark horse pick there if he is available, something nobody expects them to do...add a corner.
Personally I hope they draft an offensive player at #11, either Sewell or Slater (who will probably both be gone) or one of the receivers.
|
|
|
Post by Fletch842 on Apr 20, 2021 7:26:26 GMT -5
I really hope they don't take either of these guys at #11, I think it's a reach either way. I think Parsons is probably the only defensive player they might take at #11 if he is there...and that is if they don't believe he has character issues. However, I think Surtain could be a dark horse pick there if he is available, something nobody expects them to do...add a corner. Personally I hope they draft an offensive player at #11, either Sewell or Slater (who will probably both be gone) or one of the receivers. In Peter Schrager's latest mock, he has us taking Horn, with Slater and Smith still on the boards. I'll choke if that occurs!!
|
|
|
Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 20, 2021 7:32:48 GMT -5
They better be trading back, if they go edge.. but rolling my eyes.. if they don't and they do I'd rather the pick be Ojulari. I personally think Phillips is the best talent at the position in this class, he just comes with way to much risk. I think they are both considered mid round picks at 11 it is possible it wouldn't be a huge reach as far evaluators of talent go. As far as a fan go no thanks not in RD1 they can find probably great value at edge in RDs 2 or 3. Paye has grown on me he has everything to win power speed. All the edge guys seem to be developmental type besides the kid from Miami that had to retire from ball do to concussions at UCLA. For me first round guys especially 1-15 need to be plug and play or as close as possible, clean on and off the field.
|
|
|
Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 20, 2021 7:34:45 GMT -5
I really hope they don't take either of these guys at #11, I think it's a reach either way. I think Parsons is probably the only defensive player they might take at #11 if he is there...and that is if they don't believe he has character issues. However, I think Surtain could be a dark horse pick there if he is available, something nobody expects them to do...add a corner. Personally I hope they draft an offensive player at #11, either Sewell or Slater (who will probably both be gone) or one of the receivers. In Peter Schrager's latest mock, he has us taking Horn, with Slater and Smith still on the boards. I'll choke if that occurs!! Horn from what I'm reading is considered possibly the best corner in this class can play in any system.
|
|
|
Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 20, 2021 7:37:27 GMT -5
Paye,Ojulari and Parsons are 6 ft 2inches tall. Ojulari and Parsons weigh 245 lbs , Paye 265 lbs. Should the Giants go edge at 11, i think they will go Parsons. Judge, Graham and Spencer, did not go to Penn State ( Pro Day ) , for R&R. I would like to see, the Giants trade down and pick up additional picks. Parsons isn’t an edge rusher A lot of so called scouts saying he can rush from inside or out kind of like what they did with White in Tampa.
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Apr 20, 2021 7:39:12 GMT -5
Neither BPA at 11 and that wont be a D player. Its simple for me. They need O more than D and the picks are there to do that Agreed 100%...not sure how some fans overlook we are in a DJ has to to do well year or this entire team gets blown up situation ....add in the fact we are knee deep on OL and WR in that make or break Jones/Giants year...why in the world would you reach for a edge when not only is it a weak class, but the WR class and OL is as talent rich as it's ever been. Need meets strength of draft class...but reach for a Paye? It lacks common sense. yep...and even beyond Jones having a critical year this offense needs these things regardless of who the QB is. If Jones doesnt pan out ( I think he does BTW) then the whole things doesnt have to get blown up if the O is set. All that will happen is Gettleman goes and Judge gets to pick his QB.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2021 7:45:01 GMT -5
Agreed 100%...not sure how some fans overlook we are in a DJ has to to do well year or this entire team gets blown up situation ....add in the fact we are knee deep on OL and WR in that make or break Jones/Giants year...why in the world would you reach for a edge when not only is it a weak class, but the WR class and OL is as talent rich as it's ever been. Need meets strength of draft class...but reach for a Paye? It lacks common sense. yep...and even beyond Jones having a critical year this offense needs these things regardless of who the QB is. If Jones doesnt pan out ( I think he does BTW) then the whole things doesnt have to get blown up if the O is set. All that will happen is Gettleman goes and Judge gets to pick his QB. Oh yes, that's what I meant by blow up...new GM, and new QB. Get the weapons and OL for any future QB, if need be...makes it a lot easier for them to succeed.
|
|
|
Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 20, 2021 7:48:16 GMT -5
Neither BPA at 11 and that wont be a D player. Its simple for me. They need O more than D and the picks are there to do that Agreed 100%...not sure how some fans overlook we are in a DJ has to to do well year or this entire team gets blown up situation ....add in the fact we are knee deep on OL and WR in that make or break Jones/Giants year...why in the world would you reach for a edge when not only is it a weak class, but the WR class and OL is as talent rich as it's ever been. Need meets strength of draft class...but reach for a Paye? It lacks common sense. I agree with everything you said except the whole team being blown up, the only that will change will be they will be actively be looking to draft or sign a QB next draft/ free agent cycle. The team if the talent is right will remain, the QB at some point will be replaced. Kind of like what happened in Dallas they were building to keep Romo upright he didn't make it through Pre Season Dak did just fine, the team is built for who ever is under center and they better be able to run the offense and win once the talent is in place. That said OL / WR think DJ has enough of what it takes lets finish it off and see what he's got.
|
|
|
Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 20, 2021 7:49:34 GMT -5
yep...and even beyond Jones having a critical year this offense needs these things regardless of who the QB is. If Jones doesnt pan out ( I think he does BTW) then the whole things doesnt have to get blown up if the O is set. All that will happen is Gettleman goes and Judge gets to pick his QB. Oh yes, that's what I meant by blow up...new GM, and new QB. Get the weapons and OL for any future QB, if need be...makes it a lot easier for them to succeed. A lot of folks on here would welcome that lol.
|
|
|
Post by OrangeGiant on Apr 20, 2021 8:01:50 GMT -5
I really hope they don't take either of these guys at #11, I think it's a reach either way. I think Parsons is probably the only defensive player they might take at #11 if he is there...and that is if they don't believe he has character issues. However, I think Surtain could be a dark horse pick there if he is available, something nobody expects them to do...add a corner. Personally I hope they draft an offensive player at #11, either Sewell or Slater (who will probably both be gone) or one of the receivers. In Peter Schrager's latest mock, he has us taking Horn, with Slater and Smith still on the boards. I'll choke if that occurs!! Some people think very highly of him, even over Surtain
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2021 8:06:38 GMT -5
In Peter Schrager's latest mock, he has us taking Horn, with Slater and Smith still on the boards. I'll choke if that occurs!! Some people think very highly of him, even over Surtain I've heard Jalen Ramsey clone ...no surprise some will have Horn rated higher over Surtain.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 20, 2021 8:09:50 GMT -5
Agreed 100%...not sure how some fans overlook we are in a DJ has to to do well year or this entire team gets blown up situation ....add in the fact we are knee deep on OL and WR in that make or break Jones/Giants year...why in the world would you reach for a edge when not only is it a weak class, but the WR class and OL is as talent rich as it's ever been. Need meets strength of draft class...but reach for a Paye? It lacks common sense. I agree with everything you said except the whole team being blown up, the only that will change will be they will be actively be looking to draft or sign a QB next draft/ free agent cycle. The team if the talent is right will remain, the QB at some point will be replaced. Kind of like what happened in Dallas they were building to keep Romo upright he didn't make it through Pre Season Dak did just fine, the team is built for who ever is under center and they better be able to run the offense and win once the talent is in place. That said OL / WR think DJ has enough of what it takes lets finish it off and see what he's got. Yeah, poor choice of words with "whole team". My bad. The GM and QB get tapped out...Judge will get a new QB and GM. Jeez, we have to take OL/WR and offense...this team needs some stability going forward....not sure I can deal with more changes on a once stable proud franchise.
|
|
|
Post by moecoastie on Apr 20, 2021 8:28:30 GMT -5
Before Zo. Carter went down he almost never left the field. He was the primary edge rusher up until that point. Carter stands @ 6'5" 255
This offseason it was rumored the NYG went after Floyd aggressively. Floyd is 6'6 245
How Azeez who stands at 6'2 240lbs is rumored to "fit" this team is beyond me. IMO, the Giants are looking for more of a hybrid DE/OLB. What used to be called "tweeners." When Floyd came out he was knowns as a tweener...same with Carter. Ximines (who is bigger than Azeez) was known as more of a prototypical 3-4 and even when healthy he saw decreased play time under Graham.
Another thing I noticed about Azeez. They took him out of games A LOT! Other edge rushers in this class rarely left the field.
I guess what Im saying is I wouldnt select either of these players.
EDIT: Fackrell (Zo's primary replacement) is 6'5 245
|
|
|
Post by jmike on Apr 20, 2021 8:39:12 GMT -5
As the draft draws near and with the fact that D. Smith (what I think is the Giants #1 target) is off the board at 11, what do they do? I believe it will come down to these two players if they dont trade down, it wouldn't be this way for me but from what im reading/hearing they are going EDGE. Between these two? id be happy with Ojulari. To me, Paye is a reach. He's a high floor player who doesn't have any pass rush moves, very raw. However, he's a great player against the run. I'd rather go over Phillips if they force EDGE, but I think the Giants choose between these two players. I think Phillips is the best edge player in this draft. But his injury history scares me. So after him Paye is my preferred player. He is really a great all around player. Maybe not the guy if all you want is the best possible pass rusher, but a guy who can do it all from the edge position and will provide more on a down to down basis than anyone else.
|
|
|
Post by Fletch842 on Apr 20, 2021 8:56:56 GMT -5
Some people think very highly of him, even over Surtain I've heard Jalen Ramsey clone ...no surprise some will have Horn rated higher over Surtain. And I'll be equally unhappy if we take Surtain over Smith or Slater, but yes, I've also seen various analysts like one or the other of the 2 more.
|
|