|
Post by BigBlueDog42 on Mar 24, 2024 18:22:45 GMT -5
They said both were disc related when he came back the ball had little zip and when he through deep it was terrible then he hurt his knee he had surgery for the first 1 supposedly even tho he denies it. This is not good if you want to believe that he is good to go feel free I think this is going nowhere fast with him as far as health goes 1 healthy year out of 5 and very little production 5 out 5 years wish it was different they have ripped the band aid off they might as well finish the job. I've never viewed him as having a great arm to begin with and it's hard to argue against what you've said.
I just prefer we don't waste a season or seasons, which is what we have done for a long time now. Tom decided it was most important to get Eli live action and the Super Balls make it difficult to argue against. But I did not like it at all at the time and I would have been very pissed had I been a STH. I was pissed when they drafted Eli and dumped Collins, after all the years rooting for the Giants and watching football have seen this Jones story a more than a few times usually going into year 6 a player is what he is. I would prefer if he had shown a sign that he was getting better by winning with his arm he did a little but not enough IMHO. I hate the thought of having to start over at QB.
|
|
|
Post by BigBlueDog42 on Mar 24, 2024 18:27:27 GMT -5
What Jones showed even in that season was not enough if he threw for 25 TDs and ran 7 in that would be much better he is a QB he needs to throw for 30 a year to be serious threat to defenses. Don't get me wrong it's on the Giants and Gettlemen but the damage is done what does he have 5 or 6 years left in him without ever producing good to greta numbers. Daboll and Schoen are stuck between a rock and a hard place they are not picking where it is Guaranteed they are gonna get a QB so they need to choose their words carefully. Only my opinion I think if they have the chance they need to take it and restart the QB position if not they should be building and revisit it next year there will be 2 maybe 3 QBs worth drafting probably or ride with Lock in 2025 and target 2026. if they miss on the top 4 QB's, I see them trying to move back and take someone like Nix or Penix. Although, if they're worried about Jones's injuries, Penix doesn't make a lot of sense. But the bottom line, I don't see ay scenario where they don't take a QB in this draft. I would for go Penix he can't get out of his own way the NFL your lucky to have 2.5 seconds to throw to compound that in college he didn't use the middle of the field. Think if it gets to that I would take Rattler or Pratt later Ratter has grown up matured and dealt with aton of pressure still has special arm talent and better pocket awareness than Penix not sure about Nix.
|
|
|
Post by BigBlueDog42 on Mar 24, 2024 18:30:30 GMT -5
What Jones showed even in that season was not enough if he threw for 25 TDs and ran 7 in that would be much better he is a QB he needs to throw for 30 a year to be serious threat to defenses. Don't get me wrong it's on the Giants and Gettlemen but the damage is done what does he have 5 or 6 years left in him without ever producing good to greta numbers. Daboll and Schoen are stuck between a rock and a hard place they are not picking where it is Guaranteed they are gonna get a QB so they need to choose their words carefully. Only my opinion I think if they have the chance they need to take it and restart the QB position if not they should be building and revisit it next year there will be 2 maybe 3 QBs worth drafting probably or ride with Lock in 2025 and target 2026. There are no set rules for how many TD's a QB should throw . Look Jones has to play better , no question but so does the rest of the team, last year was not all Jones. 3 QB's four place kickers and numerous O line and receiver injuries not to mention a Defense that couldn't tackle. I honestly think Jones is getting to much of the blame. I'm not arguing that but he is going into year 6 and has not really been anything special through out, by now they should be sure he is gonna be a to 10QB if he is not they need to still bellowing because you don't win with mid tier talent at QB.
|
|
thrax
Special Teams
Posts: 126
|
Post by thrax on Mar 24, 2024 18:35:01 GMT -5
Nothing predraft actually means anything
|
|
|
Post by ThatGuyRich on Mar 24, 2024 18:58:42 GMT -5
I'm hoping this is more to put the Lock stories to rest where he was supposedly told he would compete to be the starter, rather than taking a QB in the draft. I'm really thinking that these guys may not be bright enough to really pull of some of the conspiracies being attributed to them. I have said this before. Not getting a impact player in the first round and most likely the 2nd also. will be a death blow to this FO and coaching staff. A rookie QB with current state of this roster. Will not be that player. I am ok with WR, CB, S or O-line with the first 2 picks. I think that a QB or WR are the 2 most likely choices with our 1st rd pick. If we do go QB with the 1st pick I'm pretty sure we go WR with the 2nd rd pick. To me that would be the most sensible. Possibly a CB in the 2nd rd if we go WR with the 1st pick in the draft. The OL seems was addressed in FA. Not with the first 2 picks. The 1st rd pick needs to be impactful the WR does if he's the 1st or 2nd draft pick this year. Wouldn't expect a QB to have any impact this year. Whatever he gives is gravy. The 2nd rd pick also needs to be impactful no matter what position we draft imo.
|
|
|
Post by McCherry on Mar 24, 2024 20:47:13 GMT -5
I have said this before. Not getting a impact player in the first round and most likely the 2nd also. will be a death blow to this FO and coaching staff. A rookie QB with current state of this roster. Will not be that player. I am ok with WR, CB, S or O-line with the first 2 picks. I think that a QB or WR are the 2 most likely choices with our 1st rd pick. If we do go QB with the 1st pick I'm pretty sure we go WR with the 2nd rd pick. To me that would be the most sensible. Possibly a CB in the 2nd rd if we go WR with the 1st pick in the draft. The OL seems was addressed in FA. Not with the first 2 picks. The 1st rd pick needs to be impactful the WR this year. Wouldn't expect a QB to have any impact this year. Whatever he gives is gravy. The 2nd rd pick also needs to be impactful imo. This is a good point. It's a deep class, you can still get a good WR in the second round.
|
|
|
Post by moecoastie on Mar 24, 2024 22:39:43 GMT -5
I'll root my arse off for whoever suits up at QB for the NYG. That's how I fan
|
|
mendy
Starter
Posts: 3,922
|
Post by mendy on Mar 25, 2024 3:46:39 GMT -5
I have said this before. Not getting a impact player in the first round and most likely the 2nd also. will be a death blow to this FO and coaching staff. A rookie QB with current state of this roster. Will not be that player. I am ok with WR, CB, S or O-line with the first 2 picks.
Funny how I see it a bit differently. I see drafting a rookie QB as a means to give them a pass for a few more years. So I find this draft pretty intriguing from that perspective alone.
As for what I want, I want the player maker too because I want to see Jones work out to keep us from starting all over again. I felt the same way with Kerry with Eli. I don't like the idea of wasting players prime seasons to allow a rookie QB to get his feet wet.
We all know the idea is to do whatever is best for the NY Giants. This is going to be one interesting draft for sure. I agree with you which is why I say they get a QB but not at #6
|
|
|
Post by myronguyton29 on Mar 25, 2024 6:26:52 GMT -5
2026 Arch Manning Here we come... LMFAO lol I saw the other day Eli has a son named Charles Elisha and I said to myself, watch when he's ready or getting near, the Giants will make sure they're in position to get him....... Can you imagine that?? That'd be crazy.........
|
|
|
Post by myronguyton29 on Mar 25, 2024 6:29:56 GMT -5
and mainly because Charles is my first name............... another good omen I'll bring the Giants just like in 1989
|
|
|
Post by Bigjeep on Mar 25, 2024 7:06:23 GMT -5
That useless win against the Eagles cost us big time! Picking 5th instead of 6th is a huge difference in this draft!
|
|
|
Post by cdngfan on Mar 25, 2024 7:29:30 GMT -5
Dabs said the right thing to the right crowd.
If anyone thinks this indicates what we’ll do in the draft, I have some pristine Canadian wilderness to sell you…….
|
|
|
Post by idkaname on Mar 25, 2024 8:17:16 GMT -5
I have said this before. Not getting an impact player in the first round and most likely the 2nd also. will be a death blow to this FO and coaching staff. A rookie QB with current state of this roster. Will not be that player. I am ok with WR, CB, S or O-line with the first 2 picks. And that is due to your watching film and college ball and not thinking any QB is franchise, and deferring it to math. Fair enough and I respect that. On the flip side, all teams will always play craps with the valued position of QB...and if the Giants do not believe Jones is the guy...disregarding the obvious answers to QB questions at conferences, they are in a close enough range to roll the dice. I've watched now endless amount of film on these QB's, and I believe each and every one has more then Daniel Jones brings to the position ...not saying your math is wrong as they get in the NFL, just what I see on breaking them down. As far as impact players, the Giants can draft the best WR and best guard in the first 2 rounds, and still be stuck in a worse position than the Jets with Zack Wilson. The Giants need a legit QB ...having a great X receiver will do nothing if he lacks the QB....and the death blow will come from losses, something Lock and Daniel Jones can give them despite having a great receiver. Speaking of, Lock would benefit from Rome Odunze whom catches the ball covered better then any receiver this year, and Lock throws many lasers into coverage. If we went WR of course I see what you meant, but craps is a bad example. Dice control is a thing which makes it way less "chance" than skill and I've won 5 figures several times before being banned from a couple casinos for it
|
|
|
Post by Rangers13 on Mar 25, 2024 8:27:54 GMT -5
That useless win against the Eagles cost us big time! Picking 5th instead of 6th is a huge difference in this draft! I’m ok with a legit win like vs Philly or Green Bay. The awful wins were Washington and New England in which the game was below NFL standard with one team winning on the scoreboard while the entire audience loses. Pathetic football.
|
|
|
Post by Roosevelt on Mar 25, 2024 9:03:09 GMT -5
Funny how I see it a bit differently. I see drafting a rookie QB as a means to give them a pass for a few more years. So I find this draft pretty intriguing from that perspective alone.
As for what I want, I want the player maker too because I want to see Jones work out to keep us from starting all over again. I felt the same way with Kerry with Eli. I don't like the idea of wasting players prime seasons to allow a rookie QB to get his feet wet.
We all know the idea is to do whatever is best for the NY Giants. This is going to be one interesting draft for sure. I agree with you which is why I say they get a QB but not at #6 That was my thought originally. No I'm not so sure.
When George Young selected Phil Simms there were those who felt Simms could have been had later in the first round to which George responded, "We didn't have a pick later in the round. We had the 7th pick".
|
|
mendy
Starter
Posts: 3,922
|
Post by mendy on Mar 25, 2024 10:05:31 GMT -5
I agree with you which is why I say they get a QB but not at #6 That was my thought originally. No I'm not so sure.
When George Young selected Phil Simms there were those who felt Simms could have been had later in the first round to which George responded, "We didn't have a pick later in the round. We had the 7th pick".
LOL, true but we have to remember Simms didn't become Simms we love for almost 5 seasons.
|
|
|
Post by Rangers13 on Mar 25, 2024 10:08:38 GMT -5
That was my thought originally. No I'm not so sure.
When George Young selected Phil Simms there were those who felt Simms could have been had later in the first round to which George responded, "We didn't have a pick later in the round. We had the 7th pick".
LOL, true but we have to remember Simms didn't become Simms we love for almost 5 seasons. We all hope Jones plays well yet enough is enough with banking on him.
|
|
|
Post by straightrazorman on Mar 25, 2024 10:13:08 GMT -5
That was my thought originally. No I'm not so sure.
When George Young selected Phil Simms there were those who felt Simms could have been had later in the first round to which George responded, "We didn't have a pick later in the round. We had the 7th pick".
LOL, true but we have to remember Simms didn't become Simms we love for almost 5 seasons. You mean there's still hope?
|
|
|
Post by Fletch842 on Mar 25, 2024 11:11:11 GMT -5
That useless win against the Eagles cost us big time! Picking 5th instead of 6th is a huge difference in this draft! I’m ok with a legit win like vs Philly or Green Bay. The awful wins were Washington and New England in which the game was below NFL standard with one team winning on the scoreboard while the entire audience loses. Pathetic football. I'll stop watching football before I root for us to lose against any of our division rivals...EVER....
|
|
|
Post by vinnie on Mar 25, 2024 11:20:11 GMT -5
That useless win against the Eagles cost us big time! Picking 5th instead of 6th is a huge difference in this draft! Don’t forget about NE and Washington. The momentum from those wins is still palpable.
|
|
|
Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 25, 2024 11:27:51 GMT -5
I’m ok with a legit win like vs Philly or Green Bay. The awful wins were Washington and New England in which the game was below NFL standard with one team winning on the scoreboard while the entire audience loses. Pathetic football. I'll stop watching football before I root for us to lose against any of our division rivals...EVER.... Or rooting to finish the season 0-10. All it would take is one pool/pizza party and all would be fine.
|
|
|
Post by Roosevelt on Mar 25, 2024 11:35:15 GMT -5
That was my thought originally. No I'm not so sure.
When George Young selected Phil Simms there were those who felt Simms could have been had later in the first round to which George responded, "We didn't have a pick later in the round. We had the 7th pick".
LOL, true but we have to remember Simms didn't become Simms we love for almost 5 seasons.
Phil's career definitely influenced how I view the position. I believed that I was watching a quarterback we could win with if he could stay healthy and was given more help, but there were people who disagreed with that thinking.
It took even Bill Parcells extra time to realize what he had.
|
|
|
Post by Roosevelt on Mar 25, 2024 11:37:57 GMT -5
That useless win against the Eagles cost us big time! Picking 5th instead of 6th is a huge difference in this draft!
There's nothing like enjoying a good Sunday loss in order to celebrate our draft position in April.
|
|
|
Post by inconvenientruth on Mar 25, 2024 11:51:26 GMT -5
LOL, true but we have to remember Simms didn't become Simms we love for almost 5 seasons.
Phil's career definitely influenced how I view the position. I believed that I was watching a quarterback we could win with if he could stay healthy and was given more help, but there were people who disagreed with that thinking.
It took even Bill Parcells extra time to realize what he had. Ah, I didn't know Simms story, I now get the ask to add talent and see the QB succeed, if you've seen it before
|
|
|
Post by Kruunch on Mar 25, 2024 12:05:01 GMT -5
The bubonic plague.. smallpox.. and the Spanish flu must be his guys too.. The Jones epidemic which has cost the lives of coaches and players alike. Is now eating away what brain Daboll has left. We all know this time of the year to believe nothing.. Expect anything. When you’re in the jungle that is the offseason.. You have teams looking to eat you alive. The draft will do the talking for us.
|
|
|
Post by inconvenientruth on Mar 25, 2024 12:33:04 GMT -5
The bubonic plague.. smallpox.. and the Spanish flu must be his guys too.. The Jones epidemic which has cost the lives of coaches and players alike. Is now eating away what brain Daboll has left. We all know this time of the year to believe nothing.. Expect anything. When you’re in the jungle that is the offseason.. You have teams looking to eat you alive. The draft will do the talking for us. Seems to me this is just lip service from Dabes. This organization recognizes whats before them, question is, are they able to put themselves in a position to capitalize? The conviction must match the resources.
|
|
|
Post by inconvenientruth on Mar 25, 2024 12:36:46 GMT -5
this ones great for the Mara fans. Haha.
|
|
|
Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 25, 2024 12:38:10 GMT -5
That useless win against the Eagles cost us big time! Picking 5th instead of 6th is a huge difference in this draft! There's nothing like enjoying a good Sunday loss in order to celebrate our draft position in April. For a player you know nothing about.
|
|
|
Post by Nick6475 on Mar 25, 2024 12:43:33 GMT -5
The bubonic plague.. smallpox.. and the Spanish flu must be his guys too.. The Jones epidemic which has cost the lives of coaches and players alike. Is now eating away what brain Daboll has left. We all know this time of the year to believe nothing.. Expect anything. When you’re in the jungle that is the offseason.. You have teams looking to eat you alive. The draft will do the talking for us. Seems to me this is just lip service from Dabes. This organization recognizes whats before them, question is, are they able to put themselves in a position to capitalize? The conviction must match the resources. I don't think resources are even a question. They could trade their whole 2024 draft and/or multiple future first round picks if they needed. It's more does Schoen think the juice is worth the squeeze. Does Shoen and his team see enough positive traits in one of the QB's that suggests giving up a fortune will result in success. Glad my career isn't relying on that decision.
|
|
|
Post by inconvenientruth on Mar 25, 2024 13:14:16 GMT -5
Seems to me this is just lip service from Dabes. This organization recognizes whats before them, question is, are they able to put themselves in a position to capitalize? The conviction must match the resources. I don't think resources are even a question. They could trade their whole 2024 draft and/or multiple future first round picks if they needed. It's more does Schoen think the juice is worth the squeeze. Does Shoen and his team see enough positive traits in one of the QB's that suggests giving up a fortune will result in success. Glad my career isn't relying on that decision. yeah, essentially, its probability based. At least, thats how I would look at it. You define a set of characteristics you're looking for, at QB, and then bank on that. More often than not, you'll be right. Just cant let emotion creep in there.
|
|