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Post by Jomo on Apr 13, 2024 16:17:47 GMT -5
Tell that to the Niners and Cowboys. But those teams compete and have hope. Sure there is heartbreak yet they aren’t going on a decade plus of having 90% of their seasons over by October. I think I read somewhere that we have the worst win/loss record over the past decade. If it's not true, it has to be close. That is a long enough sampling for anyone with a brain to conclude that there is something fundamentally wrong with how this franchise is run. .......and the only person in a position of power through all of that would be John F. Mara. The prosecution rests..
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giantbob71
Special Teams
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Post by giantbob71 on Apr 13, 2024 16:53:58 GMT -5
The owner saying "We want Daniel Jones here" is not meddling. They were already in the middle of negotiations, of course they want him here. Mara is the one paying the contract, he can chime in to show public support for the QB. Exactly he was just doing his part to get negotiation moving and finished owners do this yes not just Mara. You can't be serious. When the GM is negotiating a contract, and the owner comes out and strongly favors the player, even going so far as calling the player to express his desire to get a deal done, it completely undermines the GMs bargaining power and gives it all to the player. Look at how Jerry is handling the Dak stuff...the front office is asserting they'll move on if they don't get a fair deal. Dak still has a lot of control, but he's got to decide if he wants to leave the Cowgirls, and all the endorsements that come with being the Cowgirls QB. That sets the tone for negotiations and helps the GM control some of the narrative. If Jerry was running around telling everyone he wants to get a deal done, Dak would know he holds all the cards...like DJ did. I think Mara was part of the reason we signed DJ, but he's a big reason DJs agent took Schoen to the woodshed. Schoen had no bargaing power because it was obvious the desire to resign DJ was made over his head. It was also stupid of Daboll and Schoen to express interest in resigning DJ right after the season. Mara, on down, should've said, "I hope we can get a deal done, but it will have to be on our terms."...and left it at that. Also, you just got your dream job making millions. Your boss comes out and expresses sympathy and desire to resign an employee you're negotiating a contract with. Are you really going to go against your boss and not resign him? That's meddling...and Mara knows exactly what he's doing. He can cover his ass...he gets his boy resigned but can still say he didn't directly tell his GM to resign him. How you don't see Mara's actions as meddling is silly!
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mendy
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Post by mendy on Apr 13, 2024 18:28:44 GMT -5
Yes you can but those are seats for sale by ticket holders or tickets sold back to the Giants. You’re telling us that the Giants buy tickets back? That’s news to me as I requested that back in 2018 and my request was ignored. Based on your information, I was discriminated against by the Giants. ok, I could be wrong. Brother in Law has season Tickets and there was a situation where he would be credited for next season if the Giants could resell his seat it was a game per game not the whole season, maybe I misunderstood , I will check again.
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Post by McCherry on Apr 13, 2024 18:29:28 GMT -5
Tell that to the Niners and Cowboys. But those teams compete and have hope. Sure there is heartbreak yet they aren’t going on a decade plus of having 90% of their seasons over by October. True, but the conversation was specifically about winning Superbowls.
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mendy
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Post by mendy on Apr 13, 2024 18:31:40 GMT -5
But those teams compete and have hope. Sure there is heartbreak yet they aren’t going on a decade plus of having 90% of their seasons over by October. I think I read somewhere that we have the worst win/loss record over the past decade. If it's not true, it has to be close. That is a long enough sampling for anyone with a brain to conclude that there is something fundamentally wrong with how this franchise is run. .......and the only person in a position of power through all of that would be John F. Mara. The prosecution rests.. I'm throwing your case out due to "hearsay and lack of evidence".
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 13, 2024 19:56:10 GMT -5
Exactly he was just doing his part to get negotiation moving and finished owners do this yes not just Mara. You can't be serious. When the GM is negotiating a contract, and the owner comes out and strongly favors the player, even going so far as calling the player to express his desire to get a deal done, it completely undermines the GMs bargaining power and gives it all to the player. Look at how Jerry is handling the Dak stuff...the front office is asserting they'll move on if they don't get a fair deal. Dak still has a lot of control, but he's got to decide if he wants to leave the Cowgirls, and all the endorsements that come with being the Cowgirls QB. That sets the tone for negotiations and helps the GM control some of the narrative. If Jerry was running around telling everyone he wants to get a deal done, Dak would know he holds all the cards...like DJ did. I think Mara was part of the reason we signed DJ, but he's a big reason DJs agent took Schoen to the woodshed. Schoen had no bargaing power because it was obvious the desire to resign DJ was made over his head. It was also stupid of Daboll and Schoen to express interest in resigning DJ right after the season. Mara, on down, should've said, "I hope we can get a deal done, but it will have to be on our terms."...and left it at that. Also, you just got your dream job making millions. Your boss comes out and expresses sympathy and desire to resign an employee you're negotiating a contract with. Are you really going to go against your boss and not resign him? That's meddling...and Mara knows exactly what he's doing. He can cover his ass...he gets his boy resigned but can still say he didn't directly tell his GM to resign him. How you don't see Mara's actions as meddling is silly! I doubt that schoen is a hard nosed negotiator and they signed him because he played them out of the QB hunt in the draft Giants Coach and GM made that decision, Also we have people acting like they were on the phone with Mara and Jones, Mara was not talking to the agents he was talking to the player just like he did with SQB this time around and OBJ. I respect your opinion but i'm not buying any of this stuff till there is proof that Mara is screwing up personnel decisions I agree he has screwed up GM searches and head coaching hires and fires. Shit people were blaming Chris Mara for 5years when he had a title but was working with his horses more than with the team.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 13, 2024 20:07:28 GMT -5
But those teams compete and have hope. Sure there is heartbreak yet they aren’t going on a decade plus of having 90% of their seasons over by October. I think I read somewhere that we have the worst win/loss record over the past decade. If it's not true, it has to be close. That is a long enough sampling for anyone with a brain to conclude that there is something fundamentally wrong with how this franchise is run. .......and the only person in a position of power through all of that would be John F. Mara. The prosecution rests.. Thats is why he hired out side of anyone with organizational ties this time around, the George young Ernie Accorsi Model and way is gone for good it ran it's course.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 13, 2024 20:24:07 GMT -5
True. But the times between have been pretty bad. Tell that to the Niners and Cowboys. Giants hired from within fro way to long they tried to keep the program running the same way the thing they didn't take into account sometimes like positions coaches that are not cut out to be Coordinators. Front office personnel who scout and do the final touches of the the draft might not be able to run the whole team they are good at what they do, Jerry Reese didn't have a guy like himself to help him like he helped Ernie Marc Ross stunk it. When the Giants traded for Eli that was a big boy move and a lot of heat got directed at Accorsi he answered by having an excellent 4 pick draft the following year. In contrast the Giants had as good a shot to trade it all for Patrick Mahomes they didn't and wouldn't have if they were offered a trade up thats where GM is different than a scout they made big signings and trades during Ernies time Plex risky, Kareem McKenzie good dude and many more. This is one thing Schoen seems to have he is not afraid to wheel and deal some will work out and some won't rather have a guy who has the intestinal fortitude to take the risk.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 13, 2024 20:58:13 GMT -5
But those teams compete and have hope. Sure there is heartbreak yet they aren’t going on a decade plus of having 90% of their seasons over by October. True, but the conversation was specifically about winning Superbowls. i get it 👍
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Post by allnygin on Apr 13, 2024 21:38:38 GMT -5
When you've consistently been one of the worst football teams for over a decade mostly while drafting a qb in the top 10 during that time span, and still haven't built a team around that asset.. yeah, people are going to call a spade a spade.
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Post by allnygin on Apr 13, 2024 22:55:40 GMT -5
It's sad the the average fan who knows nothing will still throw the crap at him without knowing the truth. Mendy enlighten us... please.
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Post by allnygin on Apr 13, 2024 23:01:33 GMT -5
Tell that to the Niners and Cowboys. Giants hired from within fro way to long they tried to keep the program running the same way the thing they didn't take into account sometimes like positions coaches that are not cut out to be Coordinators. Front office personnel who scout and do the final touches of the the draft might not be able to run the whole team they are good at what they do, Jerry Reese didn't have a guy like himself to help him like he helped Ernie Marc Ross stunk it. When the Giants traded for Eli that was a big boy move and a lot of heat got directed at Accorsi he answered by having an excellent 4 pick draft the following year. In contrast the Giants had as good a shot to trade it all for Patrick Mahomes they didn't and wouldn't have if they were offered a trade up thats where GM is different than a scout they made big signings and trades during Ernies time Plex risky, Kareem McKenzie good dude and many more. This is one thing Schoen seems to have he is not afraid to wheel and deal some will work out and some won't rather have a guy who has the intestinal fortitude to take the risk. If you like a guy you go get him... I think alot of these gms get wrapped up with draft picks like its the end all be all.. and rightfully, so, but giving up a couple firsts doesn't change much when you have the man at QB.. you can figure it out if you have a good scouting department. i mean **** when was the last time mcvay actually had some good draft capital lol? we've had number 1 picks for the last 12 years and (multiple just a few years back) for as long as we've sucked. get your QB if you can.. if not.. learn to ****ing draft for once sick of this team being garbage. Kind of off topic, but not. I like Joe. The way he's trying to build this team aligns with how I feel a good team should be built heavy investment in the Dline and oline.. it hasn't worked yet, but he's trying. Better than dumbass DG drafting irrelevant positions with premium draft capital. Regardless, the Daniel Jones contract as well as some iffy draft decisions still leaves this team in limbo. dude needs to get this draft right and burns better bet him..
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mendy
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Post by mendy on Apr 14, 2024 6:51:48 GMT -5
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Post by Fletch842 on Apr 14, 2024 6:52:19 GMT -5
Giants hired from within fro way to long they tried to keep the program running the same way the thing they didn't take into account sometimes like positions coaches that are not cut out to be Coordinators. Front office personnel who scout and do the final touches of the the draft might not be able to run the whole team they are good at what they do, Jerry Reese didn't have a guy like himself to help him like he helped Ernie Marc Ross stunk it. When the Giants traded for Eli that was a big boy move and a lot of heat got directed at Accorsi he answered by having an excellent 4 pick draft the following year. In contrast the Giants had as good a shot to trade it all for Patrick Mahomes they didn't and wouldn't have if they were offered a trade up thats where GM is different than a scout they made big signings and trades during Ernies time Plex risky, Kareem McKenzie good dude and many more. This is one thing Schoen seems to have he is not afraid to wheel and deal some will work out and some won't rather have a guy who has the intestinal fortitude to take the risk. If you like a guy you go get him... I think alot of these gms get wrapped up with draft picks like its the end all be all.. and rightfully, so, but giving up a couple firsts doesn't change much when you have the man at QB.. you can figure it out if you have a good scouting department. i mean **** when was the last time mcvay actually had some good draft capital lol? we've had number 1 picks for the last 12 years and (multiple just a few years back) for as long as we've sucked. get your QB if you can.. if not.. learn to ****ing draft for once sick of this team being garbage. Kind of off topic, but not. I like Joe. The way he's trying to build this team aligns with how I feel a good team should be built heavy investment in the Dline and oline.. it hasn't worked yet, but he's trying. Better than dumbass DG drafting irrelevant positions with premium draft capital. Regardless, the Daniel Jones contract as well as some iffy draft decisions still leaves this team in limbo. dude needs to get this draft right and burns better bet him.. Our O lIne should be vastly different this year, between the new coach, and additions. If they can pull their heads out of their collective asses, we could have a competitive team, I'm at least hopeful that they bear some fruits for us. And if Burns and Thibs mesh well together, it could have a very positive ripple effect for the defense. Of course it could all to to shit like last year just as easily, but I try to keep my milk glass half full, and keep my rose colored glasses close...
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Post by cdngfan on Apr 14, 2024 7:02:54 GMT -5
Giants hired from within fro way to long they tried to keep the program running the same way the thing they didn't take into account sometimes like positions coaches that are not cut out to be Coordinators. Front office personnel who scout and do the final touches of the the draft might not be able to run the whole team they are good at what they do, Jerry Reese didn't have a guy like himself to help him like he helped Ernie Marc Ross stunk it. When the Giants traded for Eli that was a big boy move and a lot of heat got directed at Accorsi he answered by having an excellent 4 pick draft the following year. In contrast the Giants had as good a shot to trade it all for Patrick Mahomes they didn't and wouldn't have if they were offered a trade up thats where GM is different than a scout they made big signings and trades during Ernies time Plex risky, Kareem McKenzie good dude and many more. This is one thing Schoen seems to have he is not afraid to wheel and deal some will work out and some won't rather have a guy who has the intestinal fortitude to take the risk. If you like a guy you go get him... I think alot of these gms get wrapped up with draft picks like its the end all be all.. and rightfully, so, but giving up a couple firsts doesn't change much when you have the man at QB.. you can figure it out if you have a good scouting department. i mean **** when was the last time mcvay actually had some good draft capital lol? we've had number 1 picks for the last 12 years and (multiple just a few years back) for as long as we've sucked. get your QB if you can.. if not.. learn to ****ing draft for once sick of this team being garbage. Kind of off topic, but not. I like Joe. The way he's trying to build this team aligns with how I feel a good team should be built heavy investment in the Dline and oline.. it hasn't worked yet, but he's trying. Better than dumbass DG drafting irrelevant positions with premium draft capital. Regardless, the Daniel Jones contract as well as some iffy draft decisions still leaves this team in limbo. dude needs to get this draft right and burns better bet him.. i think what you’re saying is pretty standard draft management; if you love a QB then you move heaven and earth to get him. I feel the sam way about JS. There’s strategic direction. I didn’t like how Getty managed things, I think his reputation suffers from a piling on at this point (he did draft and sign FAs to fix the line too), but frankly he’s an inflexible old fashioned GM who didn’t want to trade up or down for picks, didn’t know or understand how to use analytics, didn’t have a strategic opinion on positional value that made sense, and couldn’t find any draft success out of the 1st rd in 4 years. The fact that I like what JS is building doesn’t remove the fact that more than the QB position, more than our W/L record, if we don’t have an average or above average o line by the end of 25’, he won’t keep his job. Of all the things the media focused on, mostly Dabs and potentially drafting a QB, they ignored the fact that Mara can’t hide his frustration about the o line. That tells me you can’t ask for a contract extension and have the line still suck.
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Post by DandyDon on Apr 14, 2024 8:50:47 GMT -5
But those teams compete and have hope. Sure there is heartbreak yet they aren’t going on a decade plus of having 90% of their seasons over by October. True, but the conversation was specifically about winning Superbowls. The conversation is about Mara interfering, and the generally horrible product his organization produces.
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Post by SG88 on Apr 14, 2024 9:22:24 GMT -5
The only say fans have, is to participate. Yes, to an extent. But the Maras are making more money every year despite horrible performance for over a decade. I guess it's easy to blame fans for still watching, but part of the problem is that they can't help getting richer in spite of crazy incompetence. Unlike most businesses, failing to compete doesn't affect revenue. A big part of the problem, im MO. I agree. Why change if the bottom line remains unaffected. I do feel like they do care about winning. It just isn't a priority to them. I get it though. They are businessmen afterall. Where the Mara family loses me is when they act like they are real football men.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 14, 2024 10:45:12 GMT -5
Giants hired from within fro way to long they tried to keep the program running the same way the thing they didn't take into account sometimes like positions coaches that are not cut out to be Coordinators. Front office personnel who scout and do the final touches of the the draft might not be able to run the whole team they are good at what they do, Jerry Reese didn't have a guy like himself to help him like he helped Ernie Marc Ross stunk it. When the Giants traded for Eli that was a big boy move and a lot of heat got directed at Accorsi he answered by having an excellent 4 pick draft the following year. In contrast the Giants had as good a shot to trade it all for Patrick Mahomes they didn't and wouldn't have if they were offered a trade up thats where GM is different than a scout they made big signings and trades during Ernies time Plex risky, Kareem McKenzie good dude and many more. This is one thing Schoen seems to have he is not afraid to wheel and deal some will work out and some won't rather have a guy who has the intestinal fortitude to take the risk. If you like a guy you go get him... I think alot of these gms get wrapped up with draft picks like its the end all be all.. and rightfully, so, but giving up a couple firsts doesn't change much when you have the man at QB.. you can figure it out if you have a good scouting department. i mean **** when was the last time mcvay actually had some good draft capital lol? we've had number 1 picks for the last 12 years and (multiple just a few years back) for as long as we've sucked. get your QB if you can.. if not.. learn to ****ing draft for once sick of this team being garbage. Kind of off topic, but not. I like Joe. The way he's trying to build this team aligns with how I feel a good team should be built heavy investment in the Dline and oline.. it hasn't worked yet, but he's trying. Better than dumbass DG drafting irrelevant positions with premium draft capital. Regardless, the Daniel Jones contract as well as some iffy draft decisions still leaves this team in limbo. dude needs to get this draft right and burns better bet him.. Schoen needs to get himself some blue chip difference makers KT has been on the edge of that he has come up with some big 3rd down sacks and forced TOs I'm not sure he has another guy like that yet. He has drafted good players but they a the support system the game changers is the guy who makes all their hard work payoff he brings home the W.
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Post by Nite on Apr 15, 2024 11:50:33 GMT -5
But those teams compete and have hope. Sure there is heartbreak yet they aren’t going on a decade plus of having 90% of their seasons over by October. I think I read somewhere that we have the worst win/loss record over the past decade. If it's not true, it has to be close. That is a long enough sampling for anyone with a brain to conclude that there is something fundamentally wrong with how this franchise is run. .......and the only person in a position of power through all of that would be John F. Mara. The prosecution rests.. Jury: GUILTY!! Wheres my medium Pepsi? ....
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