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Post by SG88 on Apr 24, 2024 13:12:23 GMT -5
For those making excuses for the Maras…stop. Yes, every owner can do what they want. But, at least own it. Fans have known for years the Maras stick their nose in football decisions, but he doesn’t admit it because they’ve been terrible. It’s weak. I agree with this. They should at least be real about their involvement. They keep saying that they aren't involved yet their actions and their words indicate otherwise. Tische is totally out of sight and mind. He also does not act like he is a football guy. Personally, I think that an owner should simply let the people they hired make these decisions and then dismiss them if they don't do a good job. I mean, isn't that why you hired them to begin with?
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 24, 2024 13:18:53 GMT -5
I don’t need to search the web to know Mara has been a disaster since he became CEO/President yet apparently you do. Yeah you do, you keep proving how little you know. 💊 💊 it’s going to be ok. Breath
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Post by vinnie on Apr 24, 2024 13:22:45 GMT -5
For those making excuses for the Maras…stop. Yes, every owner can do what they want. But, at least own it. Fans have known for years the Maras stick their nose in football decisions, but he doesn’t admit it because they’ve been terrible. It’s weak. What's weak is your bitch about "The Mara's". Fans know shitt they make assumptions and make up conspiracy theories to justify their own delusions. Does Ownership ,make calls yes, only a moron would think different but the fact that you only call out the Mara's" and not the Tisch' proves my point. Mara's are 50% Owners share 11 ways. I will all so re iterate that Phil Simms was not always beloved by Giant fans and didn't become the Simms we do love till his 6th season, he was benched his 5th by Parcel's. Mara and Tish have given Schoen the ok to pull the trigger on what ever they want, that is their input So what?. Just like you don’t know shit but act as if everything you say is a fact? You even go as far as to accuse other posters of saying things they never did to try and prove a worthless point and when asked for quotes you disappear, funny how that works.
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Post by SG88 on Apr 24, 2024 13:25:34 GMT -5
It is what it is. No one here is going to stop being a Giants fan because of Mara involvement. They're not losing any money, so they will never switch tactics. In their minds, they may feel like what they're doing is working considering that the net income has actually increased annually. I've come to accept Mara involvement as a drawback (something that no one can do anything about) as a Giants fan.
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Post by giantbob71 on Apr 24, 2024 13:41:55 GMT -5
I rarely agree with Mara's decisions...but if true, I'm on board with this. Schoen bet big and has wasted over $100 million on DJ, now he wants to move off him in hopes of saving his job? It reeks of incompetence and I hope Mara sees it. Mara said he'd be fine with drafting a QB...not trading away the future for one. So far, Schoen has been below average at talent evaluation, this is one time an owner needs to protect the franchise and it's future. Schoen decided to keep SB and X to give him and Daboll a better chance to win meaningless games...now he has the 6th pick. Schoen has dug his own grave...let him get out it or let the new GM pick his QB next year. This season is most likely over before it starts, regardless of who is picked.
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Modog
Special Teams
Posts: 1,177
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Post by Modog on Apr 24, 2024 13:49:43 GMT -5
Saying something and actually it being true are two different things. Mara has let slip himself on multiple occasions that final say on major roster decisions is his.
He can do whatever he wants, he's the owner afterall.
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Post by Roosevelt on Apr 24, 2024 13:58:34 GMT -5
I have never heard John Mara claim that he wasn't involved. On the contrary I have heard Joe Schoen say that him and Brian are communicating daily with John.
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Post by Kruunch on Apr 24, 2024 14:10:09 GMT -5
It is what it is. No one here is going to stop being a Giants fan because of Mara involvement. They're not losing any money, so they will never switch tactics. In their minds, they may feel like what they're doing is working considering that the net income has actually increased annually. I've come to accept Mara involvement as a drawback (something that no one can do anything about) as a Giants fan. Owners are generally meddlers by trade.. It comes with the territory of being Teflon in Armani suits. Besides a few of the lucky sperm club. Most of these CEO’s dominated in their line of business and joined the fraternity by buying in. They’re whales in a fish pond. Nothing gets in their way other than other giants of the sea. Wellington who is universally respected and is the sole purpose of why the league went from the back alley.. To the penthouse. Couldn’t get out of his own way until the league intervened. The best owners check their egos at the door.. And put the team ahead of their own beliefs.
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Post by Nite on Apr 24, 2024 14:14:26 GMT -5
"Mara on his recommendation to trade a future first instead of a second that year: “Because our second-round pick was so high, I talked to Ernie about instead of doing that, let’s give them next year’s one and hopefully that will be lower. We knew we were going to get a really good player at the top of the second round. We knew we needed a lot and of course the player ends up being Chris Snee"
This is THE definition of interfering with football operations. Just one small sample out of many. Those who claim that he doesn't live in an alternate reality. BTW 'suggestions' by the owner has the weight of a command... If he was good at it, I wouldn't mind so much. However he sucks at it
The defenders and deniers fall in the following categories:
1) What Aboutism - .."What about this guy and what THAT guy and this other owner blah blah blah " Who the F cares? We are talking about our team.. Nice dodge of the question
2) Ownerism - Yeah he does. He can do what he wants. Hes great in the sense that he makes money for the other owners of the NYG. He sucks because he is terrible at football operations and spits on the loyal fans with a crappy team year after year
3) Ancient History Defense - Well in the past, (insert previous owner) allowed players to develop and did this or that and eventually we won (after decades of sucking).. Well its the 21st century and things are done differently - by successful organizations
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 24, 2024 14:23:13 GMT -5
I rarely agree with Mara's decisions...but if true, I'm on board with this. Schoen bet big and has wasted over $100 million on DJ, now he wants to move off him in hopes of saving his job? It reeks of incompetence and I hope Mara sees it. Mara said he'd be fine with drafting a QB...not trading away the future for one. So far, Schoen has been below average at talent evaluation, this is one time an owner needs to protect the franchise and it's future. Schoen decided to keep SB and X to give him and Daboll a better chance to win meaningless games...now he has the 6th pick. Schoen has dug his own grave...let him get out it or let the new GM pick his QB next year. This season is most likely over before it starts, regardless of who is picked. let’s say he let Jones walk last off-season and the Giants miss the playoffs. How many would call for his head?
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Post by giantbob71 on Apr 24, 2024 14:27:57 GMT -5
I rarely agree with Mara's decisions...but if true, I'm on board with this. Schoen bet big and has wasted over $100 million on DJ, now he wants to move off him in hopes of saving his job? It reeks of incompetence and I hope Mara sees it. Mara said he'd be fine with drafting a QB...not trading away the future for one. So far, Schoen has been below average at talent evaluation, this is one time an owner needs to protect the franchise and it's future. Schoen decided to keep SB and X to give him and Daboll a better chance to win meaningless games...now he has the 6th pick. Schoen has dug his own grave...let him get out it or let the new GM pick his QB next year. This season is most likely over before it starts, regardless of who is picked. let’s say he let Jones walk last off-season and the Giants miss the playoffs. How many would call for his head? He could have tagged him. Problem solved...the contract was completely avoidable.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 24, 2024 14:30:36 GMT -5
let’s say he let Jones walk last off-season and the Giants miss the playoffs. How many would call for his head? He could have tagged him. Problem solved...the contract was completely avoidable. So he got 2 yrs instead of 1. Then Barkley would have walked. Now we would be sitting here with everybody knowing we need a QB Every move would have been an error. Thankfully, the contract was written in a way the Giants do have an out.
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Post by giantbob71 on Apr 24, 2024 14:43:23 GMT -5
He could have tagged him. Problem solved...the contract was completely avoidable. So he got 2 yrs instead of 1. Then Barkley would have walked. Now we would be sitting here with everybody knowing we need a QB Every move would have been an error. Thankfully, the contract was written in a way the Giants do have an out. 1 year, $32 million vs. 2 years, $100+ million...with dead cap hits that might go into 2026. Which makes more sense? Even 2 tagged years would've been cheaper than what Schoen did? I'm not a DJ fan, but giving him one more year to see if he could take another step, after a lucky playoff matchup, wasn't a completely ridiculous idea. Just having DJ under contract isn't fooling any GM in the NFL...they all know the Giants still NEED a QB. When your GM is constantly on the road watching college QBs, it's a pretty big sign he knows he needs a QB. And...he let Saquon walk anyway. Schoen played games with the SB negotiations, taking money off the table and not seeing SBs perceived value. He thought RB contracts were heading lower and was wrong. In hindsight, he should've signed SB and tagged DJ. Yeah, it's hindsight...but that's Schoen's job.
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Post by Morehead State on Apr 24, 2024 14:49:34 GMT -5
Suggestions about compensation have nothing to do with football decisions. I see no decisions being made by Mara here. I'm sorry......What?
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Post by GameTime on Apr 24, 2024 14:55:32 GMT -5
Mara, Schoen and Daboll ALL agreed that Jones should get a new deal. Schoen is ultimately responsible of course since he is the GM but they ALL gambled and will most likely lose on that one. Mara can always tell Schoen "you are the GM you should have known better" but I dont feel thats the case.
I am of the unsubstantiated belief that Schoen and Daboll are on the 5 year plan. With or without Jones.
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Post by jaymas on Apr 24, 2024 14:56:59 GMT -5
For those making excuses for the Maras…stop. Yes, every owner can do what they want. But, at least own it. Fans have known for years the Maras stick their nose in football decisions, but he doesn’t admit it because they’ve been terrible. It’s weak. I agree with this. They should at least be real about their involvement. They keep saying that they aren't involved yet their actions and their words indicate otherwise. Tische is totally out of sight and mind. He also does not act like he is a football guy. Personally, I think that an owner should simply let the people they hired make these decisions and then dismiss them if they don't do a good job. I mean, isn't that why you hired them to begin with? They are no more involved than the standard owner of the NFL, probably to a lesser degree than many, at least the David Teppers, Robert Krafts, Jerry Jones's, and Jim Irsays. My Ravens example highlights how even a "hands off owner" like Bisciotti is talking draft strategy, positions of need and stating his desires all the time. We suck, so people find a bogeyman and bogeyman actions. Doesn't make it true.
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jimc
Special Teams
Posts: 194
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Post by jimc on Apr 24, 2024 14:57:08 GMT -5
Totally agree. It is his team why do we moan if he makes decisions football or not. If he feels things should go one way and the GM feels another way and they can’t come to an agreement, guess who wins. We would be in much worse shape if us fans made the decisions with the amount of knowledge we have about running a professional football team. I don't disagree, but then us fans have the realization we're likely in for a long haul of disfunction. .........but only the fans that THINK they could have made better decisions under fire than the boss.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 24, 2024 15:32:25 GMT -5
So he got 2 yrs instead of 1. Then Barkley would have walked. Now we would be sitting here with everybody knowing we need a QB Every move would have been an error. Thankfully, the contract was written in a way the Giants do have an out. 1 year, $32 million vs. 2 years, $100+ million...with dead cap hits that might go into 2026. Which makes more sense? Even 2 tagged years would've been cheaper than what Schoen did? I'm not a DJ fan, but giving him one more year to see if he could take another step, after a lucky playoff matchup, wasn't a completely ridiculous idea. Just having DJ under contract isn't fooling any GM in the NFL...they all know the Giants still NEED a QB. When your GM is constantly on the road watching college QBs, it's a pretty big sign he knows he needs a QB. And...he let Saquon walk anyway. Schoen played games with the SB negotiations, taking money off the table and not seeing SBs perceived value. He thought RB contracts were heading lower and was wrong. In hindsight, he should've signed SB and tagged DJ. Yeah, it's hindsight...but that's Schoen's job. well, Barkley didn’t want to sign. They inherited a mess. There was no perfect way to do this.
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Post by McCherry on Apr 24, 2024 17:12:12 GMT -5
Suggestions about compensation have nothing to do with football decisions. I see no decisions being made by Mara here. I'm sorry......What? Can you discern the difference between a suggestion and a decision?
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