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Post by Sarcasman on Dec 13, 2020 17:24:43 GMT -5
You are obsessed with every single angle and moment to make you potentially right about this guy. Every thread you can, every other post. Just watch a game and root for the team. It's unbelievable. What if the Giants win out and make the playoffs while he plays well? What if they miss and he has a great year next year? What if he plays average, they make the playoffs, but he plays well in the playoffs? What if they miss the playoffs but he has a great year next year? What if he gets injured next year and they stink, but comes back the following year and plays great? What if he never wins enough with the Giants but wins with another team? And what if he flames out totally? All my years on a message board, this one, the old Giants one or the one some of us were a part of for Eli's first superbowl in in 07/08, I've never seen such an obsession with being right about a young player who's likable, by every definition. He's not like screaming at guys in the locker room like Ryan Leaf haha. What fan of a team is so obsessed with being right about a high draft pick that every 6th post is about how they shouldn't have won so they could have had Trevor Lawrence or just completely ignores the countless stories about the story of a QBs career never being decided in year two? What happened to being realistic, but still rooting for a guy? We're in the middle of a season where there's a shot to make the playoffs and the only thing you can ever talk about is every step Daniel Jones takes and why it's a problem. Sounds miserable to me. Dude, Jones sucks. Who cares how likable he is? Fans like wins. When we don't win, we look at the cause of the loss, and all too many times now it's Daniel Jones (and our O line). Do you honestly believe that QB was the only difference in that game?
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Post by Sarcasman on Dec 13, 2020 17:26:44 GMT -5
You can respond how you wish without personally attacking one another. Attack positions, not people. FFS, it ain't like either one of you is holding any aces here, lol. I dont mind the personal shots. I actually happen to find them substantially more thoughtful that his football positions which are quite generic. Question them and he gets sensitive. Rinse and repeat. Nothing is personal, its alllll good If you two are fine, I'm happy to stay out of the middle.
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Post by GameTime on Dec 13, 2020 17:27:19 GMT -5
to me it looked liked no one was open or he missed the reads. He stunk bad Nobody was open..... The Cards defense also sat on all our short/intermediate routes we have been running as well,Slayton injured.... This is not good to have on film for the last 3 games with our passing attack as we are what we are WR wise... yeah....Jones still needs to make something happen. So does Garrett and the WRs. Figure something ut to get a few damn plays!!!! He's the QB and better play the last three games and he better do well!!!
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 13, 2020 17:32:01 GMT -5
Nobody was open..... The Cards defense also sat on all our short/intermediate routes we have been running as well,Slayton injured.... This is not good to have on film for the last 3 games with our passing attack as we are what we are WR wise... yeah....Jones still needs to make something happen. So does Garrett and the WRs. Figure something ut to get a few damn plays!!!! He's the QB and better play the last three games and he better do well!!! Dunno what he can do Get Pettis on the field ? Call up Dillon just for KOs and backfield jet sweeps and stuff? We now have 13 games of tendencies on tape and it shows our receivers are not good enough to warrant any specific attention other than contain the short/intermediate stuff and live witb a fluke over the top play or 2.. And this effects the ground game ... This isn't on Garrett at all either
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 13, 2020 17:34:41 GMT -5
You're kind of missing my point, which is realistic, but rooting for. What is bought in? What makes you buy in...in year 2? Outside of Patrick Mahomes and Russell Wilson, and a young Tom Brady being clutch what year 2 Qb has done enough that you're "bought in." I'm not bought in, in that regard. No one should be. Also, wall of text? I thought there were nice paragraphs there. Can't please everyone, I guess. Josh Allen Baker Mayfield Year 3 Tannyhill took nearly 8 years and having to get away from the incompetence of Miami to become legit... DJ is a little behind they restarted him this year and he has a little bit of the injury bug last years he missed a few games and it looks like we will be seeing Colt for a little bit. No one is sold but there are some guys who look like they never played ball before DJ has some pretty good traits and others he needs to work on, before he was hurt he seemed to be going through his progressions today it looked like he took a step back with that.
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Post by thetruth on Dec 13, 2020 17:36:45 GMT -5
Alright, you can lower your expectations to 'meet' Jones where he's at. Some fans want more. Heck, Dak Prescott has 9 TDs on the year. Jones has 8. I hope with weapons Jones can become Kirk Cousins. I do hope that. That's not what I said nor is that where my expectations as a fan are set. But I look at players in context because it's football, not baseball. If you are under the impression that simply swapping the QBs would have made any material difference to the outcome of this game, then yeah, we don't have much to discuss because I would find that assertion completely ludicrous. That said, I'm in no way shape or form happy with the performance the Giants have gotten from the QB position in most games this year. That's a separate issue. Unless I'm to pretend that other than the team that lost today getting no help from their QB, neither QB was the prime difference in this game. I just can't get with that simpleton football tee-vee talking head pablum. That's the kind of idiocy that splashes the "markus golden makes the Giants sorry" type of headline, sure it sells a few papers or gets a few clicks and sure some highly tepid thinkers and football PR people in the media will gobble that all up while nodding their heads and good for them. It's a form of bliss. Like our pasts talks about Eli. I always said that later in his career, Eli was more apart of the problem then he is the solution. Currently we have issues offensively, however, Jones is more apart of the problem than he is the solution. We need players to give us solutions. Especially at the most important one.
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Post by GameTime on Dec 13, 2020 17:36:59 GMT -5
yeah....Jones still needs to make something happen. So does Garrett and the WRs. Figure something ut to get a few damn plays!!!! He's the QB and better play the last three games and he better do well!!! Dunno what he can do Get Pettis on the field ? Call up Dillon just for KOs and backfield jet sweeps and stuff? We now have 13 games of tendencies on tape and it shows our receivers are not good enough to warrant any specific attention other than contain the short/intermediate stuff and live witb a fluke over the top play or 2.. And this effects the ground game ... This isn't on Garrett at all either I am sick of it...It is on Garrett too. Figure it out with the guys you have. I am not asking then to win the SB I am asking them to SCORE SOME ****ING POINTS!!!! Get 5 yards on a pass play!!!. Is that so ****ing hard to do!! This is where Jones has to show he is the guy. Tell his receivers to get open!! Its 100% on Jones and Garrett to find a way the last three games to show this kid is going to get it done
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Post by GameTime on Dec 13, 2020 17:40:54 GMT -5
Dallas won
Philthy beating the Saints 17-0
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Post by vbgiantsfan on Dec 13, 2020 17:41:12 GMT -5
Dude, Jones sucks. Who cares how likable he is? Fans like wins. When we don't win, we look at the cause of the loss, and all too many times now it's Daniel Jones (and our O line). Do you honestly believe that QB was the only difference in that game? The ONLY difference? Absolutely not. A main culprit of the ineptitude? Yes.
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Post by vbgiantsfan on Dec 13, 2020 17:42:03 GMT -5
Dallas won Philthy beating the Saints 17-0 Dalton, Hurts, Smith > Daniel Jones. And they were all backups to start the season. Anyone who thinks we don't have a QB problem is dreaming.
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 13, 2020 17:43:40 GMT -5
Dallas won Philthy beating the Saints 17-0 Both teams getting out of the Sewell range as well (can't have them get a free shot at the franchise LT the past 15 years )......
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Post by Sarcasman on Dec 13, 2020 17:45:03 GMT -5
That's not what I said nor is that where my expectations as a fan are set. But I look at players in context because it's football, not baseball. If you are under the impression that simply swapping the QBs would have made any material difference to the outcome of this game, then yeah, we don't have much to discuss because I would find that assertion completely ludicrous. That said, I'm in no way shape or form happy with the performance the Giants have gotten from the QB position in most games this year. That's a separate issue. Unless I'm to pretend that other than the team that lost today getting no help from their QB, neither QB was the prime difference in this game. I just can't get with that simpleton football tee-vee talking head pablum. That's the kind of idiocy that splashes the "markus golden makes the Giants sorry" type of headline, sure it sells a few papers or gets a few clicks and sure some highly tepid thinkers and football PR people in the media will gobble that all up while nodding their heads and good for them. It's a form of bliss. Like our pasts talks about Eli. I always said that later in his career, Eli was more apart of the problem then he is the solution. Currently we have issues offensively, however, Jones is more apart of the problem than he is the solution. We need players to give us solutions. Especially at the most important one. That's fair. Since both situations exist while the team is defective, I have no disagreement with this. I'm not interested in short term succor if the main issues are not addressed. As I said, if winning a game requires the Giants being able to theoretically plug in Rodgers or Wilson, my solution priority for the team would not start with the QB.
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Post by Sarcasman on Dec 13, 2020 17:45:51 GMT -5
Do you honestly believe that QB was the only difference in that game? The ONLY difference? Absolutely not. A main culprit of the ineptitude? Yes. Me neither.
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Post by Sarcasman on Dec 13, 2020 17:47:50 GMT -5
Dallas won Philthy beating the Saints 17-0 Dalton, Hurts, Smith > Daniel Jones. And they were all backups to start the season. Anyone who thinks we don't have a QB problem is dreaming. I'm not saying we do and I'm not saying we don't. I am saying unequivocally that I disagree with the idea that Hurts, Dalton or Smith playing for the Giants today makes that game a W or that replacing Jones with any of them makes the Giants a better team.
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Post by vbgiantsfan on Dec 13, 2020 18:03:07 GMT -5
Dalton, Hurts, Smith > Daniel Jones. And they were all backups to start the season. Anyone who thinks we don't have a QB problem is dreaming. I'm not saying we do and I'm not saying we don't. I am saying unequivocally that I disagree with the idea that Hurts, Dalton or Smith playing for the Giants today makes that game a W or that replacing Jones with any of them makes the Giants a better team. Fair. I just don't know what Daniel Jones has done to make anybody confident with his ability or play. Even his best games this season were more about the things he didn't do (fumbles, INTs) than the things he did do (0 TDs). It's like he's graded on a curve. Even if you argue it's his second year, it's been a pretty godawful year. For all the comparisons people on the board make to Josh Allen's 2nd year, Allen had 20 TDs throwing to below average WRs. Daniel Jones has thrown 8 with 3 games left in the season. That's a brutal stat line. He had 75 yards passing today. That's a brutal stat line. The worst part is, he had 24 TDs last season with basically the same receivers and trash O-line. It's a pretty steep regression from year 1 to year 2.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 13, 2020 18:22:00 GMT -5
Dunno what he can do Get Pettis on the field ? Call up Dillon just for KOs and backfield jet sweeps and stuff? We now have 13 games of tendencies on tape and it shows our receivers are not good enough to warrant any specific attention other than contain the short/intermediate stuff and live witb a fluke over the top play or 2.. And this effects the ground game ... This isn't on Garrett at all either I am sick of it...It is on Garrett too. Figure it out with the guys you have. I am not asking then to win the SB I am asking them to SCORE SOME ****ING POINTS!!!! Get 5 yards on a pass play!!!. Is that so ****ing hard to do!! This is where Jones has to show he is the guy. Tell his receivers to get open!! Its 100% on Jones and Garrett to find a way the last three games to show this kid is going to get it done The way it looks he won't be playing for couple weeks his legs are a big part of his game buying time and gaining yards. That said the last 4 games that were wins in short yardage against stouter fronts then this AZ team has, he dialed up 12 personnel and 13 and ran it on 3rd and 1 or 2 on 3rd and 3 or 4 or 5 he dialed well designed short passes and add in some QB runs. I just think if Jones can't play his game he shouldn't be on the field and it's Obvious he couldn't get away from the pressure today.
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Post by GameTime on Dec 13, 2020 18:24:21 GMT -5
Dallas won Philthy beating the Saints 17-0 Dalton, Hurts, Smith > Daniel Jones. And they were all backups to start the season. Anyone who thinks we don't have a QB problem is dreaming. today yes... Hurts is total unknown though.
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Post by GameTime on Dec 13, 2020 18:25:44 GMT -5
I am sick of it...It is on Garrett too. Figure it out with the guys you have. I am not asking then to win the SB I am asking them to SCORE SOME ****ING POINTS!!!! Get 5 yards on a pass play!!!. Is that so ****ing hard to do!! This is where Jones has to show he is the guy. Tell his receivers to get open!! Its 100% on Jones and Garrett to find a way the last three games to show this kid is going to get it done The way it looks he won't be playing for couple weeks his legs are a big part of his game buying time and gaining yards. That said the last 4 games that were wins in short yardage against stouter fronts then this AZ team has, he dialed up 12 personnel and 13 and ran it on 3rd and 1 or 2 on 3rd and 3 or 4 or 5 he dialed well designed short passes and add in some QB runs. I just think if Jones can't play his game he shouldn't be on the field and it's Obvious he couldn't get away from the pressure today. he payed like he had no idea what was going
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 13, 2020 18:26:38 GMT -5
Dalton, Hurts, Smith > Daniel Jones. And they were all backups to start the season. Anyone who thinks we don't have a QB problem is dreaming. today yes... Hurts isĀ total unknown though. These are the hot takes i LOL at after a loss
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 13, 2020 18:29:31 GMT -5
Dalton, Hurts, Smith > Daniel Jones. And they were all backups to start the season. Anyone who thinks we don't have a QB problem is dreaming. I'm not saying we do and I'm not saying we don't. I am saying unequivocally that I disagree with the idea that Hurts, Dalton or Smith playing for the Giants today makes that game a W or that replacing Jones with any of them makes the Giants a better team. Hurts is the same thing as Jones he will tease the fan base with good play and have some hiccups probably We won't know about Jones till he has a full year in an offense with a full offseason of Minnie camps and OTAs Pre season. Next year if he is still turning it over might be time to draft QB if one falls to them this draft I wouldn't be against them bringing one in. QBs are worth draft capital
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Post by thetruth on Dec 13, 2020 18:30:14 GMT -5
Alright, you can lower your expectations to 'meet' Jones where he's at. Some fans want more. Heck, Dak Prescott has 9 TDs on the year. Jones has 8. I hope with weapons Jones can become Kirk Cousins. I do hope that. That's not what I said nor is that where my expectations as a fan are set. But I look at players in context because it's football, not baseball. If you are under the impression that simply swapping the QBs would have made any material difference to the outcome of this game, then yeah, we don't have much to discuss because I would find that assertion completely ludicrous. That said, I'm in no way shape or form happy with the performance the Giants have gotten from the QB position in most games this year. That's a separate issue. Unless I'm to pretend that other than the team that lost today getting no help from their QB, neither QB was the prime difference in this game. I just can't get with that simpleton football tee-vee talking head pablum. That's the kind of idiocy that splashes the "markus golden makes the Giants sorry" type of headline, sure it sells a few papers or gets a few clicks and sure some highly tepid thinkers and football PR people in the media will gobble that all up while nodding their heads and good for them. It's a form of bliss. Simply swapping QB's is futile, and the only person thats bringing up a swap is you. Lots of variables there that we'll never have any evidence off. What I can say is that in my opinion and based on the evidence presented, the Cardinals have their franchise QB. We do not.
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Post by GameTime on Dec 13, 2020 18:34:18 GMT -5
today yes... Hurts is total unknown though. These are the hot takes i LOL at after a loss bottom line it doesnt matter who Jones gets compared to good or bad. The Kid was terrible today. Peroid.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 13, 2020 18:34:37 GMT -5
Dalton, Hurts, Smith > Daniel Jones. And they were all backups to start the season. Anyone who thinks we don't have a QB problem is dreaming. today yes... Hurts is total unknown though. Exactly who knows. He could be great or a backup. Everyone is talking about Hurts because Philly was up 17 - 0 on the saints and he through a TD Sanders ran for an 80 yard TD maybe on a screen. Jones had multiple 4 TD games last year you never know. When you look at jones draft class when healthy he might be the best one none of them have proven anything yet accept Murray who we had no shot at.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 13, 2020 18:36:00 GMT -5
These are the hot takes i LOL at after a loss bottom line it doesnt matter who Jones gets compared to good or bad. The Kid was terrible today. Peroid. Exactly and 10 year vets have terrible games if it keeps going like this he will needed to be drafted over.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 13, 2020 18:39:26 GMT -5
today yes... Hurts is total unknown though. These are the hot takes i LOL at after a loss It is funny it's either hind sight which shows Allen Murray or Mayfield might have been better choices 2 out of those three we had no shot at. I will take Jones over anyone from his class when healthy still.
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Post by vbgiantsfan on Dec 13, 2020 18:44:30 GMT -5
These are the hot takes i LOL at after a loss It is funny it's either hind sight which shows Allen Murray or Mayfield might have been better choices 2 out of those three we had no shot at. I will take Jones over anyone from his class when healthy still. Jones came from a garbage class of QBs. Kyler Murray is better. Who are you comparing him to Haskins and Lock? Lock sucks and has outplayed jones this season by any measure.
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Post by Nite on Dec 13, 2020 18:49:29 GMT -5
Last week I didnt have the faith. This week I am picking the Giants to win 27-24 Should have gone with the roast beef. Always a better choice
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 13, 2020 19:04:38 GMT -5
The way it looks he won't be playing for couple weeks his legs are a big part of his game buying time and gaining yards. That said the last 4 games that were wins in short yardage against stouter fronts then this AZ team has, he dialed up 12 personnel and 13 and ran it on 3rd and 1 or 2 on 3rd and 3 or 4 or 5 he dialed well designed short passes and add in some QB runs. I just think if Jones can't play his game he shouldn't be on the field and it's Obvious he couldn't get away from the pressure today. he payed like he had no idea what was going To me he looked stuck. I have seen everyone of his games and one thing he does pretty well is escape pressure even when he looks to be had some how he gets out and has an oppertunity too make a play,, today he looked stuck when he did move he looked 3/4 speed to me.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2020 19:05:23 GMT -5
Pretty clear that Daniel Jones is not the answer to the question: Who is the next franchise QB? Not him! He should have not been able to talk Joe Judge into starting today. None of it matters, DC is beating SF so they will be in first place in this garbage division. Same old crap they tease you with defense and let you down with a QB who can't make the reads and coughs up the ball. Unwatchable.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 13, 2020 19:09:15 GMT -5
Dallas won Philthy beating the Saints 17-0 Both teams getting out of the Sewell range as well (can't have them get a free shot at the franchise LT the past 15 years )...... This is the first time I have ever thought this but who ever wins this division is hurting themselves big time you lose some draft ground for that award. All of these teams need as much as they can get
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