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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2021 2:50:28 GMT -5
After looking at this game I see a WR who is very average versus press coverage, average enough for the #1 pick at QB that year to consistently look him off at the snap.
Also, average enough for Auburn's DC to consistently press him at the line matched up against their #1, #2, or slot DB.
Your opinions are cool & welcomed, but first have a look at the actual tape before you give it.
Imo, Chase is fool's gold. (and just for context, Auburn's corners that year were the equivalent of the bottom half of an NFL training camp roster)
I see why he opted out now.
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Post by piddy283 on Feb 27, 2021 3:32:51 GMT -5
Calling him fool's gold based on his struggles to break press coverage in a single game? He ended up with 8 catches and 123 yards that game.
Honestly, I don't think you'll have to worry about Chase. He should be long gone by #11.
Of the Big4, the only "can't miss" player in my opinion is Pitts. If all 4 were to somehow fall to us, he'd be my pick.
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Post by TCHOF on Feb 27, 2021 6:28:21 GMT -5
lol
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Post by GameTime on Feb 27, 2021 7:20:10 GMT -5
One game sample. Show what you are talking about in maybe 4 or 5 games. Also I saw a game plan where Chase was one of 4 receivers to catch at least 7 passes and he caught 8. How many times do you want Burrow to target Chase? I really dont see the "fools gold" at all. At least not from this game.
Not saying Chase is the best or will have a HOF NFL career but this kid can play and is worth a top 10 pick.
To assume he opted out because you claim he cant beat press coverage after a season where he caught 84 passes with a 21+ yard average and 20 TDs is not accurate at all. Why risk the covid season with nothing left to prove?
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Post by TEM on Feb 27, 2021 7:28:41 GMT -5
I am a Smith proponent . I would not be upset with Chase or Waddle
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Post by Fletch842 on Feb 27, 2021 9:21:24 GMT -5
I would love it if Chase fell into our lap. I'll be mighty surprised if he gets anywhere near pick 11 though. Of the other 3, my preference sways with the wind, really can't make up my mind, so I'd be quite happy with any of the other three. Usually I end up with conviction about one player or the other, this truly has been one odd year!!
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Post by jaymas on Feb 27, 2021 9:25:16 GMT -5
I would love it if Chase fell into our lap. I'll be mighty surprised if he gets anywhere near pick 11 though. Of the other 3, my preference sways with the wind, really can't make up my mind, so I'd be quite happy with any of the other three. Usually I end up with conviction about one player or the other, this truly has been one odd year!! I'm in the same boat. My preference for Smith, Waddle, and Pitts changes by the several days. I'm on a Smith kick right now. Just a buttery smooth player.
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Post by JoeyCush on Feb 27, 2021 9:29:51 GMT -5
Fools Gold. Ok.
You know best.
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Post by SG88 on Feb 27, 2021 10:08:43 GMT -5
Oh boy........
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Post by giantlegacy on Feb 27, 2021 10:17:42 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2021 11:09:55 GMT -5
If not for Burrow, Jefferson, Edwards-Helaire and Joe Brady drawing up the plays i dont think Chase generates no where near those numbers.
He's a solid WR don't get me wrong, but a top 10 pick? Nah
He's more of a early-mid 2nd round pick imo. Draft him anywhere near the top 10 and you're taking fool's gold.
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Post by imgrate on Feb 27, 2021 11:14:43 GMT -5
As easy as it is for people to jump on the OP. Keep in mind these top prospects bust all the time.
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Post by McCherry on Feb 27, 2021 11:19:09 GMT -5
As easy as it is for people to jump on the OP. Keep in mind these top prospects bust all the time. It's fun to just say things on the internet that have no facts behind them, but there is literally nobody in the legitimate scouting world saying what the OP is. I'll trust them.
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Feb 27, 2021 11:22:54 GMT -5
Any of these 4 receivers would be our best receiver. Chase has size, speed, and good hands there isn't much else to assess. In watching the film he did get open vs the press coverage once he went a little deeper in his routes.
I do want to thank you for pointing something out that has not been mentioned before as far as I know. There's a lot of coaching coming these athletes way in the future. Whatever weakness is seen it will be worked on and schemed to help him. Chase could go in motion or the bunch formation so the press is ineffective often enough so that it doesn't slow him too much.
Chase is big and strong enough to fight thru it. I don't see it effecting his draft status at all. Maybe we'll keep this in mind when we play him and see how it works.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2021 11:23:35 GMT -5
As easy as it is for people to jump on the OP. Keep in mind these top prospects bust all the time. It's fun to just say things on the internet that have no facts behind them, but there is literally nobody in the legitimate scouting world saying what the OP is. I'll trust them. The same one's who ranked Josh Rosen ahead of Lamar Jackson? You should've learned your lesson by now. Always add in a bit of your own research.
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Post by imgrate on Feb 27, 2021 11:27:23 GMT -5
As easy as it is for people to jump on the OP. Keep in mind these top prospects bust all the time. It's fun to just say things on the internet that have no facts behind them, but there is literally nobody in the legitimate scouting world saying what the OP is. I'll trust them. I'm pretty sure you've literally never heard anything from someone in the "legitimate scouting world" because they're currently hired by teams. Some guys that got fired and are on TV now? Sure. And also, even if you had, that doesn't even matter. Those legitimate scouts get it wrong at a very high rate. Likewise, you, me, and gunnervillage get it wrong all the time, too. But just appealing to what "the experts" say is a weak and boring argument.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2021 11:34:26 GMT -5
He won't see much press coverage if the Giants take him...the leg effect of Daniel Jones. Teams that dare play man risk Daniel Jones tripping into the end zone.... Oh and on edit, the rules for contact on a receiver are far more lax in college ball...
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Post by McCherry on Feb 27, 2021 11:45:39 GMT -5
It's fun to just say things on the internet that have no facts behind them, but there is literally nobody in the legitimate scouting world saying what the OP is. I'll trust them. I'm pretty sure you've literally never heard anything from someone in the "legitimate scouting world" because they're currently hired by teams. Some guys that got fired and are on TV now? Sure. And also, even if you had, that doesn't even matter. Those legitimate scouts get it wrong at a very high rate. Likewise, you, me, and gunnervillage get it wrong all the time, too. But just appealing to what "the experts" say is a weak and boring argument. I have no idea what you're trying to say here... Experts opinions are valued for a reason. There is a difference between someone with years of experience and access to people, information and analysis, and someone sitting behind a computer pulling opinions out of their ass based on one 10-minute clip.
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Post by McCherry on Feb 27, 2021 11:47:24 GMT -5
It's fun to just say things on the internet that have no facts behind them, but there is literally nobody in the legitimate scouting world saying what the OP is. I'll trust them. The same one's who ranked Josh Rosen ahead of Lamar Jackson? You should've learned your lesson by now. Always add in a bit of your own research. Like one 10-minute clip taken completely out of context?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2021 11:48:33 GMT -5
The same one's who ranked Josh Rosen ahead of Lamar Jackson? You should've learned your lesson by now. Always add in a bit of your own research. Like one 10-minute clip taken completely out of context? Lol
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Post by giantlegacy on Feb 27, 2021 11:49:41 GMT -5
It's fun to just say things on the internet that have no facts behind them, but there is literally nobody in the legitimate scouting world saying what the OP is. I'll trust them. The same one's who ranked Josh Rosen ahead of Lamar Jackson? You should've learned your lesson by now. Always add in a bit of your own research. Or Darnold the chosen one
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Post by imgrate on Feb 27, 2021 11:50:59 GMT -5
After looking at this game I see a WR who is very average versus press coverage, average enough for the #1 pick at QB that year to consistently look him off at the snap. Also, average enough for Auburn's DC to consistently press him at the line matched up against their #1, #2, or slot DB. Your opinions are cool & welcomed, but first have a look at the actual tape before you give it. Imo, Chase is fool's gold. (and just for context, Auburn's corners that year were the equivalent of the bottom half of an NFL training camp roster) I see why he opted out now. I haven't watched enough tape of Chase and other WRs against press to have a calibration of how he should be performing. That said, Chase won to the inside on basically every inbreaking route in that video you posted. Was there as much separation as there "should" be? Not sure. A few plays early on the DBs were mugging him 10 yards down the field, thats a penalty in the NFL. And I think you're also underselling the Auburn DBs. Igbinoghene (#4 in the video) was a first round pick last season. And PFF had McCreary (#23) rated as one of the best corners that 2019 season.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2021 11:56:50 GMT -5
After looking at this game I see a WR who is very average versus press coverage, average enough for the #1 pick at QB that year to consistently look him off at the snap. Also, average enough for Auburn's DC to consistently press him at the line matched up against their #1, #2, or slot DB. Your opinions are cool & welcomed, but first have a look at the actual tape before you give it. Imo, Chase is fool's gold. (and just for context, Auburn's corners that year were the equivalent of the bottom half of an NFL training camp roster) I see why he opted out now. I haven't watched enough tape of Chase and other WRs against press to have a calibration of how he should be performing. That said, Chase won to the inside on basically every inbreaking route in that video you posted. Was there as much separation as there "should" be? Not sure. A few plays early on the DBs were mugging him 10 yards down the field, thats a penalty in the NFL. And I think you're also underselling the Auburn DBs. Igbinoghene (#4 in the video) was a first round pick last season. And PFF had McCreary (#23) rated as one of the best corners that 2019 season. When you compare the releases on Smith and Bateman you see the difference in skill level and the amount of seperation off the line they generate versus Chase. Bateman explodes off the LOS and reminds me of Jarvis Landry when running routes and after the catch. We all know about Smith by now. But like I said it's just my opinion.
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Post by McCherry on Feb 27, 2021 11:58:13 GMT -5
The same one's who ranked Josh Rosen ahead of Lamar Jackson? You should've learned your lesson by now. Always add in a bit of your own research. Or Darnold the chosen one There were alot of different opinions on Darnold. I don't recall that title... I wouldn't judge him based on the Adam Gase years.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2021 12:23:01 GMT -5
For comparison. Look how Bateman releases vs the same defense, same year (2019)
DB are less aggressive and try not to jam as hard off the line because they know the win rate is very low there. Bateman is 6'2 btw.
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Post by imgrate on Feb 27, 2021 12:23:58 GMT -5
I haven't watched enough tape of Chase and other WRs against press to have a calibration of how he should be performing. That said, Chase won to the inside on basically every inbreaking route in that video you posted. Was there as much separation as there "should" be? Not sure. A few plays early on the DBs were mugging him 10 yards down the field, thats a penalty in the NFL. And I think you're also underselling the Auburn DBs. Igbinoghene (#4 in the video) was a first round pick last season. And PFF had McCreary (#23) rated as one of the best corners that 2019 season. When you compare the releases on Smith and Bateman you see the difference in skill level and the amount of seperation off the line they generate versus Chase. Bateman explodes off the LOS and reminds me of Jarvis Landry when running routes and after the catch. We all know about Smith by now. But like I said it's just my opinion. Have some videos you can share of that (Smith and bateman, I bet Smith has tape against auburn in man too)? Edit, just saw your post of Bateman video, will look. Also, like people have said, this is one game of Chase's. Have you seen his others and come away with same impression? The one thing that stuck out to me as a negative was on the go routes. Chase didn't blow by anyone. That said, he could have just been making the DB feel like they could run with him and would kick in another gear if Burrow put the ball way out in front...just didn't get any throws like that in this game.
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Post by thetruth on Feb 27, 2021 12:28:21 GMT -5
I haven't watched enough tape of Chase and other WRs against press to have a calibration of how he should be performing. That said, Chase won to the inside on basically every inbreaking route in that video you posted. Was there as much separation as there "should" be? Not sure. A few plays early on the DBs were mugging him 10 yards down the field, thats a penalty in the NFL. And I think you're also underselling the Auburn DBs. Igbinoghene (#4 in the video) was a first round pick last season. And PFF had McCreary (#23) rated as one of the best corners that 2019 season. When you compare the releases on Smith and Bateman you see the difference in skill level and the amount of seperation off the line they generate versus Chase. Bateman explodes off the LOS and reminds me of Jarvis Landry when running routes and after the catch. We all know about Smith by now. But like I said it's just my opinion. So tell me, how does Smith do against the press versus Chase?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2021 12:32:42 GMT -5
When you compare the releases on Smith and Bateman you see the difference in skill level and the amount of seperation off the line they generate versus Chase. Bateman explodes off the LOS and reminds me of Jarvis Landry when running routes and after the catch. We all know about Smith by now. But like I said it's just my opinion. Have some videos you can share of that (Smith and bateman, I bet Smith has tape against auburn in man too)? Edit, just saw your post of Bateman video, will look. Also, like people have said, this is one game of Chase's. Have you seen his others and come away with same impression? The one thing that stuck out to me as a negative was on the go routes. Chase didn't blow by anyone. That said, he could have just been making the DB feel like they could run with him and would kick in another gear if Burrow put the ball way out in front...just didn't get any throws like that in this game. Tbh honest its tough to find games where Chase was consistently pressed at the LOS. Not many defenses had the talent on defense to consistently press vs LSU's offense that year.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2021 12:35:41 GMT -5
When you compare the releases on Smith and Bateman you see the difference in skill level and the amount of seperation off the line they generate versus Chase. Bateman explodes off the LOS and reminds me of Jarvis Landry when running routes and after the catch. We all know about Smith by now. But like I said it's just my opinion. So tell me, how does Smith do against the press versus Chase? It looks like Smith runs through the press and actually gains meanful yards downfield when pressed vs Chase who gets bogged down more often than not. Smith vs UGA (2020) is a good tape to watch, you'll see him fight through press coverage and get 10 yards downfield which allows the QB to stay on him longer before getting off that read.
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Post by imgrate on Feb 27, 2021 12:37:32 GMT -5
For comparison. Look how Bateman releases vs the same defense, same year (2019) DB are less aggressive and try not to jam as hard off the line because they know the win rate is very low there. Bateman is 6'2 btw. I'm not jumping to that same conclusion. Sure, it could be true but it could also be the gameplan, it could be that SEC games are more physical, basically it could be alot of things. But yes, for whatever reason, they dont try and jam him. That said, that is not good tape of Bateman. Igbinoghene had him blanketed everytime he covered him.
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