|
Post by Rangers13 on Apr 28, 2021 13:20:40 GMT -5
Record wise they improved to 6-10 Where do you feel they should be (record-wise) by now? What would you have considered to be success? Could write a book on where they should be yet the Barkley, Eli, OBJ, dead money, change in defensive alignment and Gettleman direction derailed what should be a playoff team by now imo They need to continue building this OL, especially the right side, add depth and ensure Tomlinson is adequately replaced, a pass rush beyond the DL b/c i anticipate fewer backup QB's on the schedule, add to receiving corp and l would part ways with Engram. Decide on the 5th year option for a HB which is a cap problem and hope this QB is the answer. They are a 6 win team coming from a division with fewer wins than i believe any division for 4 decades. They should not have this many questions and should be winning as often as both Cleveland and Buffalo have been.
|
|
|
Post by Sarcasman on Apr 28, 2021 13:27:28 GMT -5
Has someone actually told you that you should change your feelings? That seems extremely far fetched to me. Why would anyone actually care so much about someone else's opinion of the team that they literally want other posters' feelings to mimic their feelings? That is ludicrous. The results aren't in dispute, they're factual. Fan's feelings about the results are just that: fan's feelings. And when it comes to opinions, everybody is right and everybody is wrong, sometimes. But since they're just opinions, who cares? I haven't seen any state that others need to feel as they do. We see very little of that kind of immaturity here. most posters are more than mature enough to sustain a live and let live approach. Really?? Or are you just messing with me?? This is what Jmike is doing and she's expressed it with multiple responses so I don't understand this response that you haven't seen it.. No, I'm not messing with you. I read her posts as describing how she has chosen to decide to react to the team's decisions, not dictating how everyone else should react. If you see posts dictating that you change your feelings, I'd like to see a link to it because I haven't read that. Not that I'd suggest that anyone should listen to anyone else here about their fandom. I mean what's less important than that?
|
|
|
Post by Sarcasman on Apr 28, 2021 13:34:28 GMT -5
I don't do projection and I don't seeing giving one's personal opinion - even if contradictory to another's - as telepathy. Has she actually told you to change how you feel about the team? If so, I missed that post. Then you missed it a COUPLE of times and probably more.. See previous reply. You have been invited to validate that view. Other than one innocuous reply saying "I suggest you try it..." or something like that, I don't see what you are implying at all. But that's the beauty of message boards, it stays in the ether and can all be easily verified.
|
|
|
Post by McCherry on Apr 28, 2021 13:46:07 GMT -5
Good one! The hypocrisy these days is the common thing.. Just say anything that helps my agenda and making lies up is now normal behavior.. You are aware that making an observation that may not be correct is not a lie. Generally speaking, those who complain a lot are not viewed as being happy. This may surprise you but it is true. There are quite a number of people who seem do nothing but complain about the team. It is not unreasonable to think that they are likely unhappy with the team. Being miserable is every New Yorkers God-given right.
|
|
|
Post by jmike on Apr 28, 2021 13:53:55 GMT -5
You are aware that making an observation that may not be correct is not a lie. Generally speaking, those who complain a lot are not viewed as being happy. This may surprise you but it is true. There are quite a number of people who seem do nothing but complain about the team. It is not unreasonable to think that they are likely unhappy with the team. Being miserable is every New Yorkers God-given right. Too many things in life can make you unhappy; I prefer not allowing my entertainment choice to be one of frustration and unhappiness. So if the team can't do it for me, I'll find my own way to make it that way. If I can't, I'll find something else to do.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2021 13:57:33 GMT -5
Then you missed it a COUPLE of times and probably more.. See previous reply. You have been invited to validate that view. Other than one innocuous reply saying "I suggest you try it..." or something like that, I don't see what you are implying at all. But that's the beauty of message boards, it stays in the ether and can all be easily verified. So her admitting to you about doing it doesn't count.. Come on now stop being like this..
|
|
|
Post by Sarcasman on Apr 28, 2021 14:02:04 GMT -5
See previous reply. You have been invited to validate that view. Other than one innocuous reply saying "I suggest you try it..." or something like that, I don't see what you are implying at all. But that's the beauty of message boards, it stays in the ether and can all be easily verified. So her admitting to you about doing it doesn't count.. Come on now stop being like this.. Don't deflect. If you are saying that you are completely unable to support what you are claiming, just say that.
|
|
|
Post by jmike on Apr 28, 2021 14:12:22 GMT -5
See previous reply. You have been invited to validate that view. Other than one innocuous reply saying "I suggest you try it..." or something like that, I don't see what you are implying at all. But that's the beauty of message boards, it stays in the ether and can all be easily verified. So her admitting to you about doing it doesn't count.. Come on now stop being like this.. Offering advice or suggesting an alternative point of view, is not telling you how to feel. All I did was present an alternative perspective and explain why I made that choice. How you interpret my words is out of my control. I really do not understand why you have taken offense to such an innocuous suggestion. Though, I am sorry my words have offended you to such a degree, it was not my intent.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 28, 2021 14:13:54 GMT -5
So her admitting to you about doing it doesn't count.. Come on now stop being like this.. Don't deflect. If you are saying that you are completely unable to support what you are claiming, just say that. Believe whatever you want because I'm not interested in searching all the hidden responses for you.. If her admitting it is deflecting then that's on you.. The list is growing out here.. LOL
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Apr 28, 2021 14:19:37 GMT -5
I am an optimistic NYGs fan. Every season I have them at 10- until they prove me wrong. I get pissed but usually dont necessarily trash one individual or one player for the state of the team as whole because its a group effort in success and failure.
I can easily be a miserable Giants fan and an optimistic Giants fan at the same time. I have been doing it for the last 10 seasons.
|
|
|
Post by Sarcasman on Apr 28, 2021 14:21:34 GMT -5
Don't deflect. If you are saying that you are completely unable to support what you are claiming, just say that. Believe whatever you want because I'm not interested in searching all the hidden responses for you.. If her admitting it is deflecting then that's on you.. The list is growing out here.. LOL I'm fully aware that you are unable to back up this charade, that has been clear all along.
|
|
|
Post by BlueReign on Apr 28, 2021 14:26:04 GMT -5
Where do you feel they should be (record-wise) by now? What would you have considered to be success? Could write a book on where they should be yet the Barkley, Eli, OBJ, dead money, change in defensive alignment and Gettleman direction derailed what should be a playoff team by now imo They need to continue building this OL, especially the right side, add depth and ensure Tomlinson is adequately replaced, a pass rush beyond the DL b/c i anticipate fewer backup QB's on the schedule, add to receiving corp and l would part ways with Engram. Decide on the 5th year option for a HB which is a cap problem and hope this QB is the answer. They are a 6 win team coming from a division with fewer wins than i believe any division for 4 decades. They should not have this many questions and should be winning as often as both Cleveland and Buffalo have been. The Barkley pick is simply a matter of opinion so I'm not going to really get into that. I agree that it's poor value at 2nd overall, but when he's playing, he's one of the best in the game. As for the Odell saga/dead cap associated with it: Odell had to go. He was a great player for us while he was here, but he talked himself out of town and seemed to create a less than team-centric atmosphere within the locker room and it looks like Cleveland is realizing he might not be worth it too. I'm of the mindset that cap should be used as an asset for rebuilding teams. Take on salary to receive better packages. The team wasn't going to be competitive, so dead cap didn't really bother me all that much. They returned Peppers, Zeitler and what turned into Lawrence. That's a much better haul than we would've gotten using the money we would've saved by NOT paying OBJ. I don't think this team has been playoff caliber for quite some time now. Ownership bought into the fool's gold that was 2016 and miscalculated what this team actually was and most likely made it a stipulation for whoever took the job after Reese that Eli was to be built around. That's not on Gettleman. Speaking of the OL, yes, it's still in progress. Solder and Omameh were swings and misses; it happens to all GMs. Luckily, his draft picks have shown some very good potential and he has some premium picks to work with this weekend to address some of the weaknesses you alluded to. Lastly, I wouldn't want to compare ourselves to Cleveland or Buffalo. Those two haven't exactly been the most successful franchises.
|
|
|
Post by Rangers13 on Apr 28, 2021 14:55:46 GMT -5
Could write a book on where they should be yet the Barkley, Eli, OBJ, dead money, change in defensive alignment and Gettleman direction derailed what should be a playoff team by now imo They need to continue building this OL, especially the right side, add depth and ensure Tomlinson is adequately replaced, a pass rush beyond the DL b/c i anticipate fewer backup QB's on the schedule, add to receiving corp and l would part ways with Engram. Decide on the 5th year option for a HB which is a cap problem and hope this QB is the answer. They are a 6 win team coming from a division with fewer wins than i believe any division for 4 decades. They should not have this many questions and should be winning as often as both Cleveland and Buffalo have been. The Barkley pick is simply a matter of opinion so I'm not going to really get into that. I agree that it's poor value at 2nd overall, but when he's playing, he's one of the best in the game. As for the Odell saga/dead cap associated with it: Odell had to go. He was a great player for us while he was here, but he talked himself out of town and seemed to create a less than team-centric atmosphere within the locker room and it looks like Cleveland is realizing he might not be worth it too. I'm of the mindset that cap should be used as an asset for rebuilding teams. Take on salary to receive better packages. The team wasn't going to be competitive, so dead cap didn't really bother me all that much. They returned Peppers, Zeitler and what turned into Lawrence. That's a much better haul than we would've gotten using the money we would've saved by NOT paying OBJ. I don't think this team has been playoff caliber for quite some time now. Ownership bought into the fool's gold that was 2016 and miscalculated what this team actually was and most likely made it a stipulation for whoever took the job after Reese that Eli was to be built around. That's not on Gettleman. Speaking of the OL, yes, it's still in progress. Solder and Omameh were swings and misses; it happens to all GMs. Luckily, his draft picks have shown some very good potential and he has some premium picks to work with this weekend to address some of the weaknesses you alluded to. Lastly, I wouldn't want to compare ourselves to Cleveland or Buffalo. Those two haven't exactly been the most successful franchises. i’ll compare the Giants to both Cleveland and Buffalo along with adding in Indy b/c it was those teams who were picking in the top 10 when Barkley was drafted. Those teams have had success while the Giants are still a 6 win team from a Division in which 7 wins was the winner.
|
|
|
Post by Rangers13 on Apr 28, 2021 14:58:01 GMT -5
I am an optimistic NYGs fan. Every season I have them at 10- until they prove me wrong. I get pissed but usually dont necessarily trash one individual or one player for the state of the team as whole because its a group effort in success and failure. I can easily be a miserable Giants fan and an optimistic Giants fan at the same time. I have been doing it for the last 10 seasons. so you’ve been right twice over the past 10/11 years. Hmm
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Apr 28, 2021 15:01:04 GMT -5
I am an optimistic NYGs fan. Every season I have them at 10- until they prove me wrong. I get pissed but usually dont necessarily trash one individual or one player for the state of the team as whole because its a group effort in success and failure. I can easily be a miserable Giants fan and an optimistic Giants fan at the same time. I have been doing it for the last 10 seasons. so you’ve been right twice over the past 10/11 years. Hmm Having optimism is never wrong. Its just doesn't always result in a winning season. Being optimistic has nothing to do with being right.
|
|
|
Post by jmike on Apr 28, 2021 15:09:56 GMT -5
so you’ve been right twice over the past 10/11 years. Hmm Having optimism is never wrong. Its just doesn't always result in a winning season. Being optimistic has nothing to do with being right. Careful making such an offensive suggestion around here.
|
|
|
Post by BlueReign on Apr 28, 2021 15:12:49 GMT -5
The Barkley pick is simply a matter of opinion so I'm not going to really get into that. I agree that it's poor value at 2nd overall, but when he's playing, he's one of the best in the game. As for the Odell saga/dead cap associated with it: Odell had to go. He was a great player for us while he was here, but he talked himself out of town and seemed to create a less than team-centric atmosphere within the locker room and it looks like Cleveland is realizing he might not be worth it too. I'm of the mindset that cap should be used as an asset for rebuilding teams. Take on salary to receive better packages. The team wasn't going to be competitive, so dead cap didn't really bother me all that much. They returned Peppers, Zeitler and what turned into Lawrence. That's a much better haul than we would've gotten using the money we would've saved by NOT paying OBJ. I don't think this team has been playoff caliber for quite some time now. Ownership bought into the fool's gold that was 2016 and miscalculated what this team actually was and most likely made it a stipulation for whoever took the job after Reese that Eli was to be built around. That's not on Gettleman. Speaking of the OL, yes, it's still in progress. Solder and Omameh were swings and misses; it happens to all GMs. Luckily, his draft picks have shown some very good potential and he has some premium picks to work with this weekend to address some of the weaknesses you alluded to. Lastly, I wouldn't want to compare ourselves to Cleveland or Buffalo. Those two haven't exactly been the most successful franchises. i’ll compare the Giants to both Cleveland and Buffalo along with adding in Indy b/c it was those teams who were picking in the top 10 when Barkley was drafted. Those teams have had success while the Giants are still a 6 win team from a Division in which 7 wins was the winner. That's convenient because it ignores all context. The Giants weren't "rebuilding" the year they drafted Saquon so the 2018 Draft isn't a valid starting point for that comparison. Second, Beane and the Bills took a very similar path that the Giants are now taking, they just did it a year earlier. They cleaned house, fixed up their salary cap and began competing. The difference? Beane was handed a roster that had quite a few solid draft picks on it form his predecessor, some of whom are still contributing to the Bills' success today. Which young players did Gettleman inherit from Reese? A headcase in OBJ? A turnstile in Ereck Flowers? How about the one they call the human stickum, Evan Engram? He inherited a hollowed out roster with cap/culture issues along with an edict to try and 'win-now' with Eli.
|
|
|
Post by Rangers13 on Apr 28, 2021 15:35:02 GMT -5
i’ll compare the Giants to both Cleveland and Buffalo along with adding in Indy b/c it was those teams who were picking in the top 10 when Barkley was drafted.  Those teams have had success while the Giants are still a 6 win team from a Division in which 7 wins was the winner.  That's convenient because it ignores all context. The Giants weren't "rebuilding" the year they drafted Saquon so the 2018 Draft isn't a valid starting point for that comparison. Second, Beane and the Bills took a very similar path that the Giants are now taking, they just did it a year earlier. They cleaned house, fixed up their salary cap and began competing. The difference? Beane was handed a roster that had quite a few solid draft picks on it form his predecessor, some of whom are still contributing to the Bills' success today. Which young players did Gettleman inherit from Reese? A headcase in OBJ? A turnstile in Ereck Flowers? How about the one they call the human stickum, Evan Engram? He inherited a hollowed out roster with cap/culture issues along with an edict to try and 'win-now' with Eli. Yeah ok, i'm ignoring all context while you're dismissing the entire screwup of not only drafting Barkley and the Eli fiasco but shipping out all the 4/3 personnel on the LOS besides Tomlinson who he just lost. The Bills cleaned up their cap while the Giants have botched theirs up yearly. You actually brought up OBJ? You mean the guy Gettleman resigned and then traded which botched the cap yet again? Ereck Flowers who played decent in DC, went to Miami and was just traded back to DC? He's been more stable than multiple linemen Gettleman has signed and far less costly. Seems you want to applaud Gettleman for trying to win with Eli b/c it wasn't a rebuild, ignore all the DL personnel he moved out, ignore the cap, ignore his kicking @ss everyday mouth, ignore Eli riding the bench north of $20 million, all these idiotic FA signings including Ogletree, etc, the moronic Williams trade and the botched a Head Coach. Yeah, never mind the Browns, Bills and Indy b/c of history before 2011. Ready for that 5th year option for Barkley? A do or die year for Jones already. Gettleman has been horrific and was given a gift of one more life despite not deserving it.
|
|
|
Post by Rangers13 on Apr 28, 2021 15:36:20 GMT -5
Having optimism is never wrong. Its just doesn't always result in a winning season. Being optimistic has nothing to do with being right. Careful making such an offensive suggestion around here. Yeah, like Paye being solid in coverage
|
|
|
Post by Sarcasman on Apr 28, 2021 15:36:35 GMT -5
so you’ve been right twice over the past 10/11 years. Hmm Having optimism is never wrong. Its just doesn't always result in a winning season. Being optimistic has nothing to do with being right. You should say pessimistic every time from now on. With optimism your chances of being right are really only 1 in 32. Whereas pessimism is right 31 out of 32 times. So if the goal is for your feelings to be right in a made up contest that exists only in your head, those odds are much, much better.
|
|
|
Post by Rangers13 on Apr 28, 2021 15:37:39 GMT -5
so you’ve been right twice over the past 10/11 years. Hmm Having optimism is never wrong. Its just doesn't always result in a winning season. Being optimistic has nothing to do with being right. I think the Giants will be undefeated this season
|
|
|
Post by jmike on Apr 28, 2021 15:41:24 GMT -5
That's convenient because it ignores all context. The Giants weren't "rebuilding" the year they drafted Saquon so the 2018 Draft isn't a valid starting point for that comparison. Second, Beane and the Bills took a very similar path that the Giants are now taking, they just did it a year earlier. They cleaned house, fixed up their salary cap and began competing. The difference? Beane was handed a roster that had quite a few solid draft picks on it form his predecessor, some of whom are still contributing to the Bills' success today. Which young players did Gettleman inherit from Reese? A headcase in OBJ? A turnstile in Ereck Flowers? How about the one they call the human stickum, Evan Engram? He inherited a hollowed out roster with cap/culture issues along with an edict to try and 'win-now' with Eli. Yeah ok, i'm ignoring all context while you're dismissing the entire screwup of not only drafting Barkley and the Eli fiasco but shipping out all the 4/3 personnel on the LOS besides Tomlinson who he just lost. The Bills cleaned up their cap while the Giants have botched theirs up yearly. You actually brought up OBJ? You mean the guy Gettleman resigned and then traded which botched the cap yet again? Ereck Flowers who played decent in DC, went to Miami and was just traded back to DC? He's been more stable than multiple linemen Gettleman has signed and far less costly. Seems you want to applaud Gettleman for trying to win with Eli b/c it wasn't a rebuild, ignore all the DL personnel he moved out, ignore the cap, ignore his kicking @ss everyday mouth, ignore Eli riding the bench north of $20 million, all these idiotic FA signings including Ogletree, etc, the moronic Williams trade and the botched a Head Coach. Yeah, never mind the Browns, Bills and Indy b/c of history before 2011. Ready for that 5th year option for Barkley? A do or die year for Jones already. Gettleman has been horrific and was given a gift of one more life despite not deserving it. Whether it was an edict from ownership or DG's own decision to not start the rebuild as soon as he arrived, it was a bad decision. But everything he did that off season looked to be decisions of a win now team. Not only was it a poor evaluation of the current state of the roster, most of his moves didn't even work out in the short term. So he is right in that the rebuild didn't start until the next season, but the Giants should not get a pass on making such a bad miscalculation that also made a deeper hole to dig out of. I'm happy DG seems to be cleaning up some of that mess, but he definitely contributed to it as well.
|
|
|
Post by jmike on Apr 28, 2021 15:42:02 GMT -5
Careful making such an offensive suggestion around here. Yeah, like Paye being solid in coverage Haven't seen anyone say that.
|
|
|
Post by jmike on Apr 28, 2021 15:43:08 GMT -5
Having optimism is never wrong. Its just doesn't always result in a winning season. Being optimistic has nothing to do with being right. I think the Giants will be undefeated this season So far they are on pace for that.
|
|
|
Post by Rangers13 on Apr 28, 2021 15:43:36 GMT -5
Yeah ok, i'm ignoring all context while you're dismissing the entire screwup of not only drafting Barkley and the Eli fiasco but shipping out all the 4/3 personnel on the LOS besides Tomlinson who he just lost. The Bills cleaned up their cap while the Giants have botched theirs up yearly. You actually brought up OBJ? You mean the guy Gettleman resigned and then traded which botched the cap yet again? Ereck Flowers who played decent in DC, went to Miami and was just traded back to DC? He's been more stable than multiple linemen Gettleman has signed and far less costly. Seems you want to applaud Gettleman for trying to win with Eli b/c it wasn't a rebuild, ignore all the DL personnel he moved out, ignore the cap, ignore his kicking @ss everyday mouth, ignore Eli riding the bench north of $20 million, all these idiotic FA signings including Ogletree, etc, the moronic Williams trade and the botched a Head Coach. Yeah, never mind the Browns, Bills and Indy b/c of history before 2011. Ready for that 5th year option for Barkley? A do or die year for Jones already. Gettleman has been horrific and was given a gift of one more life despite not deserving it. Whether it was an edict from ownership or DG's own decision to not start the rebuild as soon as he arrived, it was a bad decision. But everything he did that off season looked to be decisions of a win now team. Not only was it a poor evaluation of the current state of the roster, most of his moves didn't even work out in the short term. So he is right in that the rebuild didn't start until the next season, but the Giants should not get a pass on making such a bad miscalculation that also made a deeper hole to dig out of. I'm happy DG seems to be cleaning up some of that mess, but he definitely contributed to it as well. If the rebuild started the next season he would have parted ways with Eli's $20 plus million which rode the bench on top of the extra dead money he created while the Williams trade was dumb b/c he gave the player all the leverage while sacrificing picks need to rebuild.
|
|
|
Post by Rangers13 on Apr 28, 2021 15:44:47 GMT -5
Yeah, like Paye being solid in coverage Haven't seen anyone say that. There is selective memory around here
|
|
|
Post by jmike on Apr 28, 2021 15:45:36 GMT -5
Haven't seen anyone say that. There is selective memory around here No, poor reading comprehension.
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Apr 28, 2021 17:18:44 GMT -5
Having optimism is never wrong. Its just doesn't always result in a winning season. Being optimistic has nothing to do with being right. You should say pessimistic every time from now on. With optimism your chances of being right are really only 1 in 32. Whereas pessimism is right 31 out of 32 times. So if the goal is for your feelings to be right in a made up contest that exists only in your head, those odds are much, much better. true...but for me optomism doesnt mean winning a Lombardi. Not each season anyway... But yes....its so much more fun to be miserable or as some would have you call it being real...
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Apr 28, 2021 17:19:10 GMT -5
Having optimism is never wrong. Its just doesn't always result in a winning season. Being optimistic has nothing to do with being right. I think the Giants will be undefeated this season thats the spirit!!
|
|
|
Post by BlueReign on Apr 28, 2021 18:39:19 GMT -5
That's convenient because it ignores all context. The Giants weren't "rebuilding" the year they drafted Saquon so the 2018 Draft isn't a valid starting point for that comparison. Second, Beane and the Bills took a very similar path that the Giants are now taking, they just did it a year earlier. They cleaned house, fixed up their salary cap and began competing. The difference? Beane was handed a roster that had quite a few solid draft picks on it form his predecessor, some of whom are still contributing to the Bills' success today. Which young players did Gettleman inherit from Reese? A headcase in OBJ? A turnstile in Ereck Flowers? How about the one they call the human stickum, Evan Engram? He inherited a hollowed out roster with cap/culture issues along with an edict to try and 'win-now' with Eli. Yeah ok, i'm ignoring all context while you're dismissing the entire screwup of not only drafting Barkley and the Eli fiasco but shipping out all the 4/3 personnel on the LOS besides Tomlinson who he just lost. The Bills cleaned up their cap while the Giants have botched theirs up yearly. You actually brought up OBJ? You mean the guy Gettleman resigned and then traded which botched the cap yet again? Ereck Flowers who played decent in DC, went to Miami and was just traded back to DC? He's been more stable than multiple linemen Gettleman has signed and far less costly. Seems you want to applaud Gettleman for trying to win with Eli b/c it wasn't a rebuild, ignore all the DL personnel he moved out, ignore the cap, ignore his kicking @ss everyday mouth, ignore Eli riding the bench north of $20 million, all these idiotic FA signings including Ogletree, etc, the moronic Williams trade and the botched a Head Coach. Yeah, never mind the Browns, Bills and Indy b/c of history before 2011. Ready for that 5th year option for Barkley? A do or die year for Jones already. Gettleman has been horrific and was given a gift of one more life despite not deserving it. Your reading comprehension needs some serious, serious work. I also question your football acumen when you’re suggesting ERECK FLOWERS was a quality piece left behind by Reese. Yes, a journeyman guard is of similar quality to TreDavious White and his ilk.
|
|