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Post by Roswell on Oct 27, 2021 19:11:06 GMT -5
to me he is not a 1st round 6th overall pick. To me he’s a 3rd rounder at best and it seems to me many of us are trying to see something there that just isn’t there because of his draft position. If he had been picked in a later round would we be having discussions like this ? Maybe there would be more posts about letting him walk. And no, I wouldn’t have taken Haskins either. That’s how a lot of teams spin their wheels. They force QB picks when they shouldn’t. Is this a poem? |
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Post by Roswell on Oct 27, 2021 19:12:20 GMT -5
would you give that contract to Murray at this point? Would you have given that to Josh Allen in October of last year? JOnes has not earned that in todays NFL stadards. Not many 2 1/2 season QBs do . I would to both. Murray and Allen have both proven themselves significantly more in the NFL than Jones has. Yes. And they’ve all been given the exact same chance to succeed. oh wait… |
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Post by IrishMike on Oct 27, 2021 20:19:43 GMT -5
Would you give Jones a 7 year, $200M, $130M guaranteed, $40M+ cap hit/yr type of contract (or whatever the similar going rate will be in 2022 or 2023)? That seems like a scary contract. Looks similar to the one Allen just signed. The truth is they have a very friendly team out after 3 year though and it's not that scary.
Yes I would give him that contract if he keeps playing as well as he has and we keep building around him. Zero hesitation. Keep in mind though we still have two more years to look at him, so for those hesitating keep that in mind. I'm completely sold on this kid being a great QB though. He isn't perfect yet, has work to do, but he has all the tools needed.
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Post by IrishMike on Oct 27, 2021 20:48:36 GMT -5
Yeah obviously it all comes down to the guaranteed money. But the Bills do not have any friendly out until year 5 of that contract: 2026. If they opt out after year three they're going to carry a $38M dead cap hit. In year four his cap hit is a whopping $51.2M. But the dead cap hit is $20M so maybe that's an out? And thanks for offering your opinion in this discussion. It makes sense. Allen is still serving out two years on his rookie deal. He signed a 6 year extension but has 8 years left. They have an out (2026) 3 years into his extension. So if we play Jones' deal out and give him a 6 year deal after his rookie contract I assume we would build in a similar out 3 years into his extension/new contract. Mahommes has one 4 years into his 10 year deal.
I always try to offer my wonderful opinion, especially when asked.
The question I always ask is this. Can you win with that player? The Chiefs can win with Mahommes and paid him a boat load, now he leads the league in INTs lol. The Cards will likely extend Murray as they think they can win with him. The Browns may or may not extend Baker based on that. The Jets moved on from Darnold because of that. The money does not even matter cause you can find ways to free up money (restructure the deal like Eli did many times). Do you think you can win with that QB? If so then pay him and move on. If not then cut/trade him and move on.
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Post by DandyDon on Oct 27, 2021 21:11:24 GMT -5
We have DJ cheap if we want to extend him for year 5. Which is another 2 years after this year.
Not sure why we are discussing signing DJ now?
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Post by cdngfan on Oct 27, 2021 21:19:31 GMT -5
Why make that decision before you have to? Let him play until you have to pay him. You don’t have to pay him right now. So don’t. Okay, so you didn't read the first post? This conversation is predicated upon when the time comes to pay him. No I did. If it’s just up for an interesting discussion, that’s legit fir a message board. But the decision for that contract requires a number of pieces of information that aren’t available, and some of them are unrelated to Jones’ play in the future. Not trying harp on your thread. |
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 21:22:24 GMT -5
Obviously, this thread was meant to somewhat disparage Jones (however small a gesture). False. It was to generate discourse about what is most important when talking about Jones. But kudos to you for trying to derail the conversation into more personal attacks. Clearly the exercise escapes you too. And what information is still outstanding? Personal attacks?? lol.....Are you feeling attacked, snowflake? Sorry, didn't realize that merely disagreeing with you now comes being made to feel guilty for your hurt feelings. Are there ANY men left on this board? ****ing Christ!! It's not false. You're asking whether not you should pay him an astronomical and arbitrary amount of money while there is still 10 games left in the season AND told us to ignore the 5th year option like it would have no affect on the price tag. I stand by my assessment of your intentions in this thread. Ask it again when we have all the information to decide. |
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Post by Roswell on Oct 27, 2021 21:25:48 GMT -5
Wait. Are you sure it doesn’t matter what I think? It might. I like to think my opinion matters with regards to certain things. Does it matter what you think? In terms of what I think Jones should sign a contract for? No it doesn’t matter what we think Then why discuss anything? Why make threads? Why give opinions? |
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 21:40:56 GMT -5
Personal attacks?? lol.....Are you feeling attacked, snowflake? Sorry, didn't realize that merely disagreeing with you now comes being made to feel guilty for your hurt feelings. Are there ANY men left on this board? ****ing Christ!! It's not false. You're asking whether not you should pay him an astronomical and arbitrary amount of money while there is still 10 games left in the season AND told us to ignore the 5th year option like it would have no affect on the price tag. I stand by my assessment of your intentions in this thread. Ask it again when we have all the information to decide. Don't flatter yourself. I'm talking about you personally attacking Vinnie yesterday. And it's not an "astronomical and arbitrary amount of money." If you had any clue about the QB contracts being handed out these days you'd understand that it's right in line with them. But alas. Your assessment of my intentions of this thread are pathetic. Almost as pathetic as your tough-guy douchebag act. If you're all butthurt about the content of the thread, just scroll on by.... and leave the rational discourse up to every one else who partook. But let's make this clear: You calling anyone a "snowflake" after you quit the boards because it was emotionally affecting you, is pure irony. lol...again...attack? What a bunch of sissies you 2 are. ALL franchise QB contracts are astronomical. Asking us to decide if he's worth it right now is an obvious ploy to get people to get people to say he isn't worth it. Notice that even I, a true Jones believer, wouldn't shell out that amount if money for him before the end of this season and an opportunity to exercise his 5th year option. You're transparent. Tough guy and douchebag?? . hmmm......I wonder if the mods think THAT is an "attack"? And "butthurt". Congrats on getting all the cliche' 3rd grade trigger words in one post. No...I think I'll stick around and continue to give my honest opinions like I am allowed to do. If it bothers you so much, put me on ignore like the other girl. You don't know anything about me, my health, my prognosis or why I had to leave for awhile. Just more hot air. You got nothing. zero |
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Post by Roswell on Oct 27, 2021 21:42:22 GMT -5
Then why discuss anything? Why make threads? Why give opinions? Why do you log on every day, read the threads here and reply with your opinion? Yep. That’s what I’m asking you. You create a flawed thread, get opinions you don’t like and then tell people their opinion doesn’t matter. So what’s the point? |
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 27, 2021 21:43:57 GMT -5
Yeah obviously it all comes down to the guaranteed money. But the Bills do not have any friendly out until year 5 of that contract: 2026. If they opt out after year three they're going to carry a $38M dead cap hit. In year four his cap hit is a whopping $51.2M. But the dead cap hit is $20M so maybe that's an out? And thanks for offering your opinion in this discussion. It makes sense. Allen is still serving out two years on his rookie deal. He signed a 6 year extension but has 8 years left. They have an out (2026) 3 years into his extension. So if we play Jones' deal out and give him a 6 year deal after his rookie contract I assume we would build in a similar out 3 years into his extension/new contract. Mahommes has one 4 years into his 10 year deal.
I always try to offer my wonderful opinion, especially when asked.
The question I always ask is this. Can you win with that player? The Chiefs can win with Mahommes and paid him a boat load, now he leads the league in INTs lol. The Cards will likely extend Murray as they think they can win with him. The Browns may or may not extend Baker based on that. The Jets moved on from Darnold because of that. The money does not even matter cause you can find ways to free up money (restructure the deal like Eli did many times). Do you think you can win with that QB? If so then pay him and move on. If not then cut/trade him and move on.
All of this is why it's kinda ridiculous to even be thinking about an extension this year because we again have a shit team he has to try to carry mostly by himself. As of now he has shown he should get his 5th year option,that's it And I say this as someone who thinks he has a bigtime upside. Most of these qbs that got a quick extension after year 3 were also in the playoffs by that time and shown stuff once there,or at the least didn't show signs of being a choke artist. When is this team ever going to be a playoff caliber team to find out this next step? This adds another dynamic What good is having a good franchise qb if he is keeping a 3 win team around. 500 every year because the defense can't hold a late game lead 6 or 7 times every year ? We have 2 years and 10 games left to figure this out |
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 21:49:12 GMT -5
Yes. And they’ve all been given the exact same chance to succeed. oh wait… lol and now the excuses. lol....troll |
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Post by DandyDon on Oct 27, 2021 21:51:12 GMT -5
We have DJ cheap if we want to extend him for year 5. Which is another 2 years after this year. Not sure why we are discussing signing DJ now? Good lord. You're the third person to mention this. The first post eludes to the fact that the Giants don't have to extend Jones right now. It's baffling how a simple exercise for discussion escapes some. But I'll ask you the same: If you exercise Jones' 5th what message do you think that sends him? With respect, I'm the third person to mention it because it's a silly question at this point. Your thread is titled "Daniel Jones: The Only Question That Matters." But it really doesn't matter for another 2 years. Unless DJ totally shits the bed, he's going to be here for another 2 years, guaranteed. We need so much in so many other positions, I'm not sure why you posted it. DJ is the least of our problems. Just MO. |
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 21:59:13 GMT -5
Good lord. You're the third person to mention this. The first post eludes to the fact that the Giants don't have to extend Jones right now. It's baffling how a simple exercise for discussion escapes some. But I'll ask you the same: If you exercise Jones' 5th what message do you think that sends him? With respect, I'm the third person to mention it because it's a silly question at this point. Your thread is titled "Daniel Jones: The Only Question That Matters." But it really doesn't matter for another 2 years. Unless DJ totally shits the bed, he's going to be here for another 2 years, guaranteed. We need so much in so many other positions, I'm not sure why you posted it.
DJ is the least of our problems. Just MO. I know why!! |
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 22:03:31 GMT -5
Yep. That’s what I’m asking you. You create a flawed thread, get opinions you don’t like and then tell people their opinion doesn’t matter. So what’s the point? It’s not flawed. It opens up discussion about a relevant topic. If you don’t like it, here’s a novel idea: don’t click or respond. Wow.....and he was respectful. Are you that sensitive to push back? Maybe a message board isn't for you. You need to find a safer place. |
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 22:04:17 GMT -5
“Snowflake”…”troll.” Good ones. This is what you created a new account to bless the board with? Just here to give my honest opinions. Nothing more. |
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 22:07:06 GMT -5
Wow.....and he was respectful. Are you that sensitive to push back? Maybe a message board isn't for you. You need to find a safer place. Are you so hypersensitive about anything I post now? Or just obsessed with trying to get back at me for hurting your feelings? Nope. Just bored and easily amused. |
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Post by DandyDon on Oct 27, 2021 22:07:43 GMT -5
With respect, I'm the third person to mention it because it's a silly question at this point. Your thread is titled "Daniel Jones: The Only Question That Matters." But it really doesn't matter for another 2 years. Unless DJ totally shits the bed, he's going to be here for another 2 years, guaranteed. We need so much in so many other positions, I'm not sure why you posted it. DJ is the least of our problems. Just MO. Again, no one is talking about the obvious time frame. It’s a question to discuss the only thing that matters. Are the Giants going to pay him. How he compares to Allen, Mahomes, Dak…injures, OL, etc none of that matters. You are ignoring "the obvious time frame," to create a thread 2 years too early. But whatever. |
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 22:08:30 GMT -5
Just here to give my honest opinions. Nothing more. Same. You’re a cliche tough guy who quit the board because the emotional toll was affecting your health. Which is completely fine and respectful to do. Just comes off as hilarious when you call others “snowflakes.” Still talking out of your ass? You don't have a single clue about it. "Zero point zero" |
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 22:10:32 GMT -5
Still talking out of your ass? You don't have a single clue about it. "Zero point zero" Just giving my honest opinion. That’s all. That's fine. And per usual, you're opinions are based on nothing. |
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Post by Delicreep on Oct 27, 2021 22:10:36 GMT -5
We can sit here all day and argue what could have been in 2018 and 2019 if we drafted differently but that doesn't matter. We can sit here all day and make excuses/reasons why Jones' numbers are what they are, but that doesn't matter. We can sit here all day and compare Jones to other QBs or opine on what he would be like on a different team, but that doesn't matter. The only thing that matters is this question (and just ignore the 5th year option for now): Would you give Jones a 7 year, $200M, $130M guaranteed, $40M+ cap hit/yr type of contract (or whatever the similar going rate will be in 2022 or 2023)? Truly this is all that matters. And whether you believe the Giants should give him that contract or not is just another opinion* *which we can bicker about if it doesn't align with your opinion. To me, Jones has a lot of work to do before we start talking these kind of numbers. Just give me 10 games in a row like he played last week. I think we all want that as a fan base Totally with you. Assuming that he could do that, and I don’t think there are more than a small handful of QBs that could, he becomes everything we need in a QB. But the trick will be if he’s 7 out of 10…or 6…or 5. I think that’s where Cleveland finds themselves now. Tricky ground from a negotiation stand point. |
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 22:17:26 GMT -5
That's fine. And per usual, you're opinions are based on nothing. If that makes you feel better. Go for it, Chief. lol..what a ridiculously weak comeback, It doesn't even make any sense. I'm the one single person here who knows what happened and why I had to leave for a while. It's something very personal and deeply affects my life. I've never said one word to you about it and yet you try to use it as a punch line. Perhaps if you DID know, but it's none of your business and your opinion on it changes nothing. Just makes you look like a someone small enough to go there because you got nothing else. |
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 22:21:15 GMT -5
Totally with you. Assuming that he could do that, and I don’t think there are more than a small handful of QBs that could, he becomes everything we need in a QB. But the trick will be if he’s 7 out of 10…or 6…or 5. I think that’s where Cleveland finds themselves now. Tricky ground from a negotiation stand point. Of course this is the premise of the question. If Jones puts together a very solid season this year, it removes all doubt. If he’s in that gray area then it begs the conundrum. Of course there’s posters who will cry about discussing this now and those who will continue to make excuses about this team having no playmakers around him. But all of that is irrelevant noise. Jones is either going to get paid or not. More than likely this off-season. To be fair, you said NOTHING about the end of the season and if his season was solid. That makes a huge difference in your question. EVERYONE thought you meant right now. |
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Post by Martin on Oct 27, 2021 22:25:31 GMT -5
Jones IMO needs to continue to play every game and after the season is all said and done you objectively look at it. There are times when he looks very good and other times when he looks average to mediocre. Now is not the time to evaluate him. There are plenty of games left. My 2 cents.
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Post by FBomb on Oct 27, 2021 22:27:34 GMT -5
Jones IMO needs to continue to play every game and after the season is all said and done you objectively look at it. There are times when he looks very good and other times when he looks average to mediocre. Now is not the time to evaluate him. There are plenty of games left. My 2 cents. 2 common "cents", my friend. |
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