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Post by TEM on Nov 29, 2021 8:26:29 GMT -5
This is something that is perplexing to me. An observation on what was happening in the game yesterday. We were smacking Hurts every time he handed off the ball. We weren't pulling up. He was getting buried. No flag.
So I question that whole "we want to protect the QB dialog". So why if he throws throws the ball and we engaged in the exact same activity. It will draw a ruffing the passer flag everytime ? Yet he is open season on a handoff. Why the contradictory rules? Is a vulnerable QB not vulnerable QB no matter what action he engages in behind the LOS? He was not running the ball. These were post handoff hits. If you can wack him after a handoff. Why can't you wack him after passing the ball?
Sometimes I do not see the logic in the rule book the NFL is displaying.
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Post by cdngfan on Nov 29, 2021 8:52:47 GMT -5
I see it both ways.
If he’s a threat to tuck and run it’s unfair to protect him as if he’s passing. Theoretically a passing QB is trying to pay attention to pressure and his targets so he’s more vulnerable to a hit, an option play has 100% of his attention on LOS defenders.
But if you’re removing logic and just holding up QB protection above everything else, it’s inconsistent. .
Not a popular opinion but the NFL’s goal of keeping QBs healthy makes a ton of sense to me. Some fans are infuriated with it but even with the huge emphasis on protecting QBs there’s still plenty of QB injuries.
It’s necessary.
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FBomb
Special Teams
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Post by FBomb on Nov 29, 2021 8:53:55 GMT -5
Because they were RPO plays. The QB is a runner at that point.
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Post by DandyDon on Nov 29, 2021 9:19:19 GMT -5
This is something that is perplexing to me. An observation on what was happening in the game yesterday. We were smacking Hurts every time he handed off the ball. We weren't pulling up. He was getting buried. No flag. So I question that whole "we want to protect the QB dialog". So why if he throws throws the ball and we engaged in the exact same activity. It will draw a ruffing the passer flag everytime ? Yet he is open season on a handoff. Why the contradictory rules? Is a vulnerable QB not vulnerable QB no matter what action he engages in behind the LOS? He was not running the ball. These were post handoff hits. If you can wack him after a handoff. Why can't you wack him after passing the ball? Sometimes I do not see the logic in the rule book the NFL is displaying. They are deception plays -trying to deceive the defenders about who has the ball. Are you proposing to give a 15 yard penalty because a defender falls for the deception? As long as it's a clean hit, if the offense wants to put their QB in that position, he's fair game. |
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Post by Rangers13 on Nov 29, 2021 9:24:04 GMT -5
Like last year vs backup or bad QB’s, the defense looked good. Hurts was horrendous. Great to beat Philly but my gosh, we win so few we might be blinded that was an awful 13-7 game between two lost teams.
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Post by Roswell on Nov 29, 2021 9:25:39 GMT -5
It was good to see. Probably, over the course of the game, those RPO's become less and less convincing as the QB takes more and more hits. He's a runner and is fair game if they hit him from the hips to the shoulders without spearing.
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Post by TEM on Nov 29, 2021 9:39:18 GMT -5
I could agree . But the RB was already past the LOS when we were hitting hit the QB. The defender had 5 to 10 steps after the hand off. The only reason I even noticed it was, I was yelling at the TV why they were not going after the RB when the exchange was obvious.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2021 9:39:37 GMT -5
This is something that is perplexing to me. An observation on what was happening in the game yesterday. We were smacking Hurts every time he handed off the ball. We weren't pulling up. He was getting buried. No flag. So I question that whole "we want to protect the QB dialog". So why if he throws throws the ball and we engaged in the exact same activity. It will draw a ruffing the passer flag everytime ? Yet he is open season on a handoff. Why the contradictory rules? Is a vulnerable QB not vulnerable QB no matter what action he engages in behind the LOS? He was not running the ball. These were post handoff hits. If you can wack him after a handoff. Why can't you wack him after passing the ball? Sometimes I do not see the logic in the rule book the NFL is displaying. I was thrilled they started to smack him while even being more surprised it was Carter doing it.. That is until he decided to not and Hurts started to run by him.. Baby steps maybe by 2027 Carter will be making a couple more plays a season.. |
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Post by DandyDon on Nov 29, 2021 10:12:21 GMT -5
I could agree . But the RB was already past the LOS when we were hitting hit the QB. The defender had 5 to 10 steps after the hand off. The only reason I even noticed it was, I was yelling at the TV why they were not going after the RB when the exchange was obvious. Yeah, but again the defender could just claim he was fooled and thought hurts had the ball. Who's to say he wasn't fooled? If they start penalizing that, the game would get even more ridiculous. |
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Post by TEM on Nov 29, 2021 10:16:11 GMT -5
I could agree . But the RB was already past the LOS when we were hitting hit the QB. The defender had 5 to 10 steps after the hand off. The only reason I even noticed it was, I was yelling at the TV why they were not going after the RB when the exchange was obvious. Yeah, but again the defender could just claim he was fooled and thought hurts had the ball. Who's to say he wasn't fooled? If they start penalizing that, the game would get even more ridiculous. My point was the ruffing the passer is not what it is designed to do. Because technically every time the QB hands off the ball you can wack him. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2021 10:19:29 GMT -5
Yeah, but again the defender could just claim he was fooled and thought hurts had the ball. Who's to say he wasn't fooled? If they start penalizing that, the game would get even more ridiculous. My point was the ruffing the passer is not what it is designed to do. Because technically every time the QB hands off the ball you can wack him. You said it yourself.. Roughing the passer.. When they hand off like that they aren't passing.. |
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Nov 29, 2021 10:39:05 GMT -5
This is something that is perplexing to me. An observation on what was happening in the game yesterday. We were smacking Hurts every time he handed off the ball. We weren't pulling up. He was getting buried. No flag. So I question that whole "we want to protect the QB dialog". So why if he throws throws the ball and we engaged in the exact same activity. It will draw a ruffing the passer flag everytime ? Yet he is open season on a handoff. Why the contradictory rules? Is a vulnerable QB not vulnerable QB no matter what action he engages in behind the LOS? He was not running the ball. These were post handoff hits. If you can wack him after a handoff. Why can't you wack him after passing the ball? Sometimes I do not see the logic in the rule book the NFL is displaying. I was thrilled they started to smack him while even being more surprised it was Carter doing it.. That is until he decided to not and Hurts started to run by him.. Baby steps maybe by 2027 Carter will be making a couple more plays a season.. HaHa yet Carter played one of his best games since I don't know when. Especially the tackle at the goal line saving the TD. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2021 10:41:01 GMT -5
I was thrilled they started to smack him while even being more surprised it was Carter doing it.. That is until he decided to not and Hurts started to run by him.. Baby steps maybe by 2027 Carter will be making a couple more plays a season.. HaHa yet Carter played one of his best games since I don't know when. Especially the tackle at the goal line saving the TD. Wow.. I didn't know he made his 3rd tackle of the season!! I'm sorry I missed it. I will have to go and re-watch it just to enjoy that rare moment!! |
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Post by vinnie on Nov 29, 2021 10:52:12 GMT -5
This is something that is perplexing to me. An observation on what was happening in the game yesterday. We were smacking Hurts every time he handed off the ball. We weren't pulling up. He was getting buried. No flag. So I question that whole "we want to protect the QB dialog". So why if he throws throws the ball and we engaged in the exact same activity. It will draw a ruffing the passer flag everytime ? Yet he is open season on a handoff. Why the contradictory rules? Is a vulnerable QB not vulnerable QB no matter what action he engages in behind the LOS? He was not running the ball. These were post handoff hits. If you can wack him after a handoff. Why can't you wack him after passing the ball? Sometimes I do not see the logic in the rule book the NFL is displaying. That’s your problem bud, there is no logic. Trying to figure out the NFL rules and officiating inconsistencies not only from crew to crew but within the game itself is like trying to figure out why Gettleman wasn’t fired the minute he drafted Barkley, it doesn’t make sense and is impossible. |
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Post by Parademon1 on Nov 29, 2021 11:45:48 GMT -5
What I don't understand is why the DC just doesn't assign the DE/OLB to hit the RB & the interior linemen/ MLB to hit the QB every time they do the RPO, one of em has to have the ball, so what if both get tackled/hit at the same time, no flag can be thrown as it was a run play. Hell, wrap up both players in a damn bear hug the second both their hands are on the ball. It's very misleading to say the D was "gashed" in the run game when the QB had 77 of their 208yds, the 2 RBs combined had 128yds or 64yds each. Too bad the Giants don't utilize DJ that way with Saquan.
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Post by repeatchamps on Nov 29, 2021 15:10:36 GMT -5
What I don't understand is why the DC just doesn't assign the DE/OLB to hit the RB & the interior linemen/ MLB to hit the QB every time they do the RPO, one of em has to have the ball, so what if both get tackled/hit at the same time, no flag can be thrown as it was a run play. Hell, wrap up both players in a damn bear hug the second both their hands are on the ball. It's very misleading to say the D was "gashed" in the run game when the QB had 77 of their 208yds, the 2 RBs combined had 128yds or 64yds each. Too bad the Giants don't utilize DJ that way with Saquan. I agree. The Giants defense did try to do this on one play but the guy trying to hit the QB was a tad late and the defense got burned by a play action pass. All of these things we'd like to see happen is predicated on getting defenders into the backfield and as we all know that has not happened nearly enough all season. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 29, 2021 15:19:17 GMT -5
What I don't understand is why the DC just doesn't assign the DE/OLB to hit the RB & the interior linemen/ MLB to hit the QB every time they do the RPO, one of em has to have the ball, so what if both get tackled/hit at the same time, no flag can be thrown as it was a run play. Hell, wrap up both players in a damn bear hug the second both their hands are on the ball. It's very misleading to say the D was "gashed" in the run game when the QB had 77 of their 208yds, the 2 RBs combined had 128yds or 64yds each. Too bad the Giants don't utilize DJ that way with Saquan. Same as not understanding why the Eagles didn't run for 300+ yards yesterday.. Leaving that game in Hurts arm when they could run at will is as bad as what we see from the Giants coaches.. |
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Post by bizcliz on Nov 29, 2021 15:27:25 GMT -5
I did love them absolutely wrecking Hurts on those RPOs every chance they got. If the kid wants to play like a RB then hit him like a RB
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Post by repeatchamps on Nov 29, 2021 15:34:06 GMT -5
I did love them absolutely wrecking Hurts on those RPOs every chance they got. If the kid wants to play like a RB then hit him like a RB Yes exactly this! I think they just waited too long to start doing it. I also will say the missed FG bought Philthy more time to keep running it. If Mr. Gano-matic makes that kick and they get out to a 13-0 lead, Philthy might start abandoning the run even sooner which would have been just what Pat Graham would have wanted.  |
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Post by repeatchamps on Nov 29, 2021 16:02:28 GMT -5
I did love them absolutely wrecking Hurts on those RPOs every chance they got. If the kid wants to play like a RB then hit him like a RB This, exactly. It's what Schlereth was calling out during the game. The Giants were hitting him every time they ran the RPO whether he handed it off or not. That's what you should do. Yes! I also replied similarly above. They should have been doing that a lot earlier in the game than they did. It really all stems from the same glaring problem: Not getting defenders behind the line of scrimmage consistently enough. Been a problem for far too long season after season. |
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Post by GameTime on Nov 29, 2021 16:28:12 GMT -5
if your last name is 'Hurts" then you have to take your lumps
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Post by TEM on Nov 29, 2021 16:38:23 GMT -5
My point was the ruffing the passer is not what it is designed to do. Because technically every time the QB hands off the ball you can wack him. You said it yourself.. Roughing the passer.. When they hand off like that they aren't passing.. I don't mind the QB getting smacked. If we are conducting targeting, We may suffer the same fait. |
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Post by lasion2 on Nov 29, 2021 23:57:28 GMT -5
Howard Cross talked a lot about it during the game. I listened to it as I drove back to Philly to go to a housewarming party completely full of eagles fans.
Carter was “making hurts declare himself” as early as possible while knowing he was gonna take a shot. I think it’s probably a good strategy, despite the overall rushing numbers put up by the eagles.
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Post by giantlegacy on Nov 30, 2021 0:23:26 GMT -5
This is something that is perplexing to me. An observation on what was happening in the game yesterday. We were smacking Hurts every time he handed off the ball. We weren't pulling up. He was getting buried. No flag. So I question that whole "we want to protect the QB dialog". So why if he throws throws the ball and we engaged in the exact same activity. It will draw a ruffing the passer flag everytime ? Yet he is open season on a handoff. Why the contradictory rules? Is a vulnerable QB not vulnerable QB no matter what action he engages in behind the LOS? He was not running the ball. These were post handoff hits. If you can wack him after a handoff. Why can't you wack him after passing the ball? Sometimes I do not see the logic in the rule book the NFL is displaying. I was thrilled they started to smack him while even being more surprised it was Carter doing it.. That is until he decided to not and Hurts started to run by him.. Baby steps maybe by 2027 Carter will be making a couple more plays a season.. Makes one play near the goalline.. Is the reason for many of the runs outside because he STILL crashes inside and has zero edge contain seal fundamentals.... While Roche in his limited snaps maintains edge integrity ...forces Scott outside where one of our d backs knocks him out for no gain Carter gets near Hurts and falls down on that deep sideline drop by Reager(had he caught that you know there would be a big circle around this) Roche probably knocks tbe ball out of his hand. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 30, 2021 7:09:56 GMT -5
I was thrilled they started to smack him while even being more surprised it was Carter doing it.. That is until he decided to not and Hurts started to run by him.. Baby steps maybe by 2027 Carter will be making a couple more plays a season.. Makes one play near the goalline.. Is the reason for many of the runs outside because he STILL crashes inside and has zero edge contain seal fundamentals.... While Roche in his limited snaps maintains edge integrity ...forces Scott outside where one of our d backs knocks him out for no gain Carter gets near Hurts and falls down on that deep sideline drop by Reager(had he caught that you know there would be a big circle around this) Roche probably knocks tbe ball out of his hand. I don't get why some of these polayers are getting so much playing time over others. Peart and Roche should be the starters and getting all the play! |
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Post by ratbastich on Nov 30, 2021 11:57:29 GMT -5
I see it both ways. If he’s a threat to tuck and run it’s unfair to protect him as if he’s passing. Theoretically a passing QB is trying to pay attention to pressure and his targets so he’s more vulnerable to a hit, an option play has 100% of his attention on LOS defenders. But if you’re removing logic and just holding up QB protection above everything else, it’s inconsistent. . Not a popular opinion but the NFL’s goal of keeping QBs healthy makes a ton of sense to me. Some fans are infuriated with it but even with the huge emphasis on protecting QBs there’s still plenty of QB injuries. It’s necessary. I'm okay with the rule as is but not okay on how it is enforced. There are times a defender hits a QB who tucks and runs and the defender is flagged. Human error but maybe something to be reviewable if not already. |
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Post by Martin on Nov 30, 2021 12:01:00 GMT -5
Because they were RPO plays. The QB is a runner at that point. Bingo! And sometimes the Refs will actually forget that fact and drop flags. |
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