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Post by Sarcasman on Aug 3, 2018 1:24:54 GMT -5
Git er done 95 mill for 5 years tacked on to this year,60 guaranteed gets it done,in 3 years it looks like a bargain I'm sorry but that is way too much. That contract would kill us.
I think it's gonna be pretty close to that. Maybe $85-$90, but still with $50 or so guaranteed. Call it three years at $55.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2018 3:05:00 GMT -5
Git er done 95 mill for 5 years tacked on to this year,60 guaranteed gets it done,in 3 years it looks like a bargain I'm sorry but that is way too much. That contract would kill us.
Even if it is too much, what's the alternative? We can tag him and try to negotiate a more reasonable deal at a later date but that's unlikely and he might not want to play under the tag. We can tag and trade him, or trade him before we need to tag him. Both options likely lead to OBJ's exit. He isn't going to take less than market value. If we want him to be a Giant long term the team is going to have to pay him top dollar to hold onto him otherwise someone else will pay him.
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Post by Fletch842 on Aug 3, 2018 6:13:46 GMT -5
I'm sorry but that is way too much. That contract would kill us.
Even if it is too much, what's the alternative? We can tag him and try to negotiate a more reasonable deal at a later date but that's unlikely and he might not want to play under the tag. We can tag and trade him, or trade him before we need to tag him. Both options likely lead to OBJ's exit. He isn't going to take less than market value. If we want him to be a Giant long term the team is going to have to pay him top dollar to hold onto him otherwise someone else will pay him. star player salaries go way up proportionally with the rest of the players. Tagging him next year will only have us pay more going forward, assuming he still produces, which I think he will. Personally I think its best to bite the bullet now, will cost less in the long run.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 3, 2018 7:05:06 GMT -5
I'm sorry but that is way too much. That contract would kill us.
Even if it is too much, what's the alternative? We can tag him and try to negotiate a more reasonable deal at a later date but that's unlikely and he might not want to play under the tag. We can tag and trade him, or trade him before we need to tag him. Both options likely lead to OBJ's exit. He isn't going to take less than market value. If we want him to be a Giant long term the team is going to have to pay him top dollar to hold onto him otherwise someone else will pay him. The alternative is to pay him less.
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Post by GameTime on Aug 3, 2018 7:12:27 GMT -5
Even if it is too much, what's the alternative? We can tag him and try to negotiate a more reasonable deal at a later date but that's unlikely and he might not want to play under the tag. We can tag and trade him, or trade him before we need to tag him. Both options likely lead to OBJ's exit. He isn't going to take less than market value. If we want him to be a Giant long term the team is going to have to pay him top dollar to hold onto him otherwise someone else will pay him. The alternative is to pay him less. it will either be top dollar or he will be on another team. All depends on how much the Giants are willing to pay him vs how much they want him in the roster.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2018 7:32:42 GMT -5
Even if it is too much, what's the alternative? We can tag him and try to negotiate a more reasonable deal at a later date but that's unlikely and he might not want to play under the tag. We can tag and trade him, or trade him before we need to tag him. Both options likely lead to OBJ's exit. He isn't going to take less than market value. If we want him to be a Giant long term the team is going to have to pay him top dollar to hold onto him otherwise someone else will pay him. The alternative is to pay him less. Not really unless they can persuade OBJ to take less to create a more competitive team like Brady has. Problem is I see OBJ wanting top dollar which he deserves. So there's not really an alternative to offer him less unless we want him playing on another team.
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Merc
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Post by Merc on Aug 3, 2018 11:37:14 GMT -5
The alternative is to pay him less. Not really unless they can persuade OBJ to take less to create a more competitive team like Brady has. Problem is I see OBJ wanting top dollar which he deserves. So there's not really an alternative to offer him less unless we want him playing on another team. Brady has already made his fortune. OBJ has not.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2018 12:49:49 GMT -5
Not really unless they can persuade OBJ to take less to create a more competitive team like Brady has. Problem is I see OBJ wanting top dollar which he deserves. So there's not really an alternative to offer him less unless we want him playing on another team. Brady has already made his fortune. OBJ has not. True, but Brady has been taking less than the going rate for a long time. I remember reading an article that said he has sacrificed at least $60 million, perhaps more, over the course of his career. Like you say Brady has made a fortune, but he's one of those rare hometown discount players. I don't see OBJ being a hometown discount kinda player, that's why I see us paying him the going rate, and if we don't it's potentially because we've traded him.
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Merc
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Post by Merc on Aug 3, 2018 13:22:32 GMT -5
Brady has already made his fortune. OBJ has not. True, but Brady has been taking less than the going rate for a long time. I remember reading an article that said he has sacrificed at least $60 million, perhaps more, over the course of his career. Like you say Brady has made a fortune, but he's one of those rare hometown discount players. I don't see OBJ being a hometown discount kinda player, that's why I see us paying him the going rate, and if we don't it's potentially because we've traded him. Once he gets his big contract, who knows what he will do? He is dedicated to the game and has not held out. Brady is originally from California and OBJ from Louisiana, so neither are really hometown players.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2018 15:11:54 GMT -5
True, but Brady has been taking less than the going rate for a long time. I remember reading an article that said he has sacrificed at least $60 million, perhaps more, over the course of his career. Like you say Brady has made a fortune, but he's one of those rare hometown discount players. I don't see OBJ being a hometown discount kinda player, that's why I see us paying him the going rate, and if we don't it's potentially because we've traded him. Once he gets his big contract, who knows what he will do? He is dedicated to the game and has not held out. Brady is originally from California and OBJ from Louisiana, so neither are really hometown players. When I say hometown discount I mean giving their team a discount over taking a bigger pay day elsewhere. Hopefully he does give us a discount after his first big contract to help out when we need to pay Barkley, Engram, or any other emerging star.
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Post by jimmieray on Aug 3, 2018 15:46:21 GMT -5
Once he gets his big contract, who knows what he will do? He is dedicated to the game and has not held out. Brady is originally from California and OBJ from Louisiana, so neither are really hometown players. When I say hometown discount I mean giving their team a discount over taking a bigger pay day elsewhere. Hopefully he does give us a discount after his first big contract to help out when we need to pay Barkley, Engram, or any other emerging star. I can see where a QB would recognize certain players around him can help him be more successful, and reward that notion. I don't see a WR, not just Beckham, recognizing that.
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Post by Sarcasman on Aug 3, 2018 16:52:05 GMT -5
Brady has already made his fortune. OBJ has not. True, but Brady has been taking less than the going rate for a long time. I remember reading an article that said he has sacrificed at least $60 million, perhaps more, over the course of his career. Like you say Brady has made a fortune, but he's one of those rare hometown discount players. I don't see OBJ being a hometown discount kinda player, that's why I see us paying him the going rate, and if we don't it's potentially because we've traded him. Brady gets that money and more back on his company’s side deals with the team.
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Post by Sarcasman on Aug 3, 2018 16:53:30 GMT -5
Once he gets his big contract, who knows what he will do? He is dedicated to the game and has not held out. Brady is originally from California and OBJ from Louisiana, so neither are really hometown players. When I say hometown discount I mean giving their team a discount over taking a bigger pay day elsewhere. Hopefully he does give us a discount after his first big contract to help out when we need to pay Barkley, Engram, or any other emerging star. I don’t expect he will be giving the Giants a home town discount since I’m not aware of any player - including Brady - ever actually doing so.
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Post by TEM on Aug 3, 2018 16:56:12 GMT -5
I agree with MH we should pay him less. Hell we should pay everyone less. That way we have the Number 1 pick every season . We will never have to worry about being in QB hell ever again.
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Post by Sarcasman on Aug 3, 2018 17:03:12 GMT -5
I agree with MH we should pay him less. Hell we should pay everyone less. That way we have the Number 1 pick every season . We will never have to worry about being in QB hell ever again. lol, exactly! No player ever plays for less than they are worth. I have no idea where this crap gets conjured from.
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Post by nysports98 on Aug 3, 2018 19:16:24 GMT -5
I agree with MH we should pay him less. Hell we should pay everyone less. That way we have the Number 1 pick every season . We will never have to worry about being in QB hell ever again. lol, exactly! No player ever plays for less than they are worth. I have no idea where this crap gets conjured from. I have a Groupon code for bananas I'm told works for NFL contracts C-H-E-A-P
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Post by Speedman on Aug 3, 2018 19:51:46 GMT -5
I'm sorry but that is way too much. That contract would kill us.
I think it's gonna be pretty close to that. Maybe $85-$90, but still with $50 or so guaranteed. Call it three years at $55. Evans got $55 mil guaranteed. OBJ will be in the $60 mil guaranteed $90 mil total range.
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Post by giants38 on Aug 3, 2018 22:15:47 GMT -5
The franchise has placed itself in a difficult negotiating position. It is paying 16 M to an OL guy, an OL guy, who is not the best at the position. I doubt offering OBJ 1-2 M more gets the deal done. Realistically, I think it is 19-20 M.
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Post by Sarcasman on Aug 3, 2018 22:27:35 GMT -5
The franchise has placed itself in a difficult negotiating position. It is paying 16 M to an OL guy, an OL guy, who is not the best at the position. I doubt offering OBJ 1-2 M more gets the deal done. Realistically, I think it is 19-20 M. We'll see. I think contracts are tiered by position. His agent can certainly tell that anecdote and try to argue for more but I doubt anyone would listen. I believe the comps for his contract will be WRs.
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Post by NAVY2323(ret) on Aug 4, 2018 18:01:58 GMT -5
The option is to pay him less? No the option is to instigate a Laveon Bell situation. Franchise him twice, guarantee him 40 mil plus for the next two seasons, piss him off, alienate him and ensure he leaves when that time is up. Or Guarantee him an extra and more cap friendly 60 million and hold a transcendent player for the next 5 years to the betterment of the franchise. I have trouble understanding some of the train of thought that goes on with fans sometimes.
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Post by giants38 on Aug 4, 2018 22:15:09 GMT -5
The franchise has placed itself in a difficult negotiating position. It is paying 16 M to an OL guy, an OL guy, who is not the best at the position. I doubt offering OBJ 1-2 M more gets the deal done. Realistically, I think it is 19-20 M. We'll see. I think contracts are tiered by position. His agent can certainly tell that anecdote and try to argue for more but I doubt anyone would listen. I believe the comps for his contract will be WRs. OBJ is not employed by "WRs." He is employed by a franchise which has established a pay scale value of 16 M for an OL guy. That will be OBJ's metric.
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Post by Sarcasman on Aug 4, 2018 22:40:48 GMT -5
We'll see. I think contracts are tiered by position. His agent can certainly tell that anecdote and try to argue for more but I doubt anyone would listen. I believe the comps for his contract will be WRs. OBJ is not employed by "WRs." He is employed by a franchise which has established a pay scale value of 16 M for an OL guy. That will be OBJ's metric. I do not agree with you. I guess we'll find out together.
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Post by TEM on Aug 5, 2018 7:44:37 GMT -5
We'll see. I think contracts are tiered by position. His agent can certainly tell that anecdote and try to argue for more but I doubt anyone would listen. I believe the comps for his contract will be WRs. OBJ is not employed by "WRs." He is employed by a franchise which has established a pay scale value of 16 M for an OL guy. That will be OBJ's metric. That is not the way business works. An IT Administrator and a Marketing Executive are not on the same pay scale . Both Jobs are important , but are paid according to what the market rate for that job dictates. If the Janitor make 20 bucks an hour , Does that set the bar for what the CFO should be paid? www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/tackle/www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/wide-receiver/
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Post by GameTime on Aug 5, 2018 8:30:35 GMT -5
its ALL about the guaranteed money.....
north of 60 mil including signing bonus
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Post by nysports98 on Aug 5, 2018 8:49:34 GMT -5
The franchise has placed itself in a difficult negotiating position. It is paying 16 M to an OL guy, an OL guy, who is not the best at the position. I doubt offering OBJ 1-2 M more gets the deal done. Realistically, I think it is 19-20 M.
This roster is going to rotate our some big contracts next offseason. Eli's number is a killer b/c he's going to be 38 and counts $23 million on the cap. Refi the guy at 38? He had better be awesome b/c the Giants are going to lose out on some nice free agents and likely lose some roster players.
As of today, next year Manning - $23 million Vernon - $19.5 million Solider - $17 million Jenkins $13 million
Haven't even signed OBJ or Collins yet
IMO, Vernon is gone but will cost approx. $8 million in dead money while giving $11,500 in relief according to Over the Cap Jenkins is another $4 million dead money h9it yet saves $9,250.
Can't pay a QB, WR a #2 pick overall this much and expect to field a solid roster.
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Post by allnygin on Aug 5, 2018 17:24:54 GMT -5
The franchise has placed itself in a difficult negotiating position. It is paying 16 M to an OL guy, an OL guy, who is not the best at the position. I doubt offering OBJ 1-2 M more gets the deal done. Realistically, I think it is 19-20 M.
This roster is going to rotate our some big contracts next offseason. Eli's number is a killer b/c he's going to be 38 and counts $23 million on the cap. Refi the guy at 38? He had better be awesome b/c the Giants are going to lose out on some nice free agents and likely lose some roster players.
As of today, next year Manning - $23 million Vernon - $19.5 million Solider - $17 million Jenkins $13 million
Haven't even signed OBJ or Collins yet
IMO, Vernon is gone but will cost approx. $8 million in dead money while giving $11,500 in relief according to Over the Cap Jenkins is another $4 million dead money h9it yet saves $9,250.
Can't pay a QB, WR a #2 pick overall this much and expect to field a solid roster.
I knew the numbers were high, but damn. Really the only one in that space that looks half way worth it is Jenkins.. the rest.. no so much.
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Post by piddy283 on Aug 5, 2018 20:07:26 GMT -5
I don't care what we pay him, just make it happen. Contracts have never been something I concern myself with because the Giants hire, and pay handsomely, people to make sure we're not putting ourselves in "financial hell" long term.
Odell deserves to be the highest paid WR in the NFL. Let's get it done.
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Post by giants38 on Aug 5, 2018 22:17:24 GMT -5
OBJ is not employed by "WRs." He is employed by a franchise which has established a pay scale value of 16 M for an OL guy. That will be OBJ's metric. That is not the way business works. An IT Administrator and a Marketing Executive are not on the same pay scale . Both Jobs are important , but are paid according to what the market rate for that job dictates. If the Janitor make 20 bucks an hour , Does that set the bar for what the CFO should be paid? www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/tackle/www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/wide-receiver/"If the Janitor make 20 bucks an hour," the CFO will not accept 21 bucks an hour. Yes? OBJ is not going to sign a contract with a franchise that offers him only 1-2 M more than an OL guy.
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Post by TEM on Aug 6, 2018 3:41:57 GMT -5
That is not the way business works. An IT Administrator and a Marketing Executive are not on the same pay scale . Both Jobs are important , but are paid according to what the market rate for that job dictates. If the Janitor make 20 bucks an hour , Does that set the bar for what the CFO should be paid? www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/tackle/www.spotrac.com/nfl/rankings/average/wide-receiver/"If the Janitor make 20 bucks an hour," the CFO will not accept 21 bucks an hour. Yes? OBJ is not going to sign a contract with a franchise that offers him only 1-2 M more than an OL guy. I think that is the point I was making. He is going to get top WR pay scale not top O-line scale.
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Post by Nick6475 on Aug 6, 2018 9:16:56 GMT -5
Well, agent left with no deal...
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