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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 8, 2019 16:36:45 GMT -5
Heh
If Shepprd has to retire...
Here is a scary thought
The only legit options we would have on our roster are Tate and Slayton...with Core being the special teams ace.
And there are people here who still are "anything but wr" days one and 2 because "WRs" are a luxury and "the Giants never won super bowls" with good recievers
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mikethenygfan
Special Teams
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Posts: 1,219
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Post by mikethenygfan on Oct 8, 2019 17:27:16 GMT -5
Just draft WRs and Edge rushers next draft.............. if it were only that simple. What about oline or linebackers or a free safety? |
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Post by TEM on Oct 8, 2019 17:29:21 GMT -5
What about a Center? A true #2 RB?
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Post by Parademon1 on Oct 8, 2019 17:42:57 GMT -5
I'd draft in order: DE-LB-WR-OL-LB-
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 8, 2019 18:11:35 GMT -5
I'd draft in order: DE-LB-WR-OL-LB- No order BPA we are reaching and probably badly if we stick strictly to an order and most likely miss out on a really good player at another need. |
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Post by TCHOF on Oct 8, 2019 18:17:56 GMT -5
I'd draft in order: DE-LB-WR-OL-LB- Good formula for a terrible draft |
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 8, 2019 18:22:54 GMT -5
I'd draft in order: DE-LB-WR-OL-LB- Good formula for a terrible draft Flip the order any way you like it's still a good formula for a terrible draft |
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Post by TCHOF on Oct 8, 2019 18:24:59 GMT -5
Good formula for a terrible draft Flip the order any way you like it's still a good formula for a terrible draft Yep - can’t go into a draft with a predetermined order of what positions you are going to draft. Silly.... |
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Post by TEM on Oct 8, 2019 18:26:26 GMT -5
Flip the order any way you like it's still a good formula for a terrible draft Yep - can’t go into a draft with a predetermined order of what positions you are going to draft. Silly.... Outside a Qb . It is not a good methodology to draft for position. If BPA and position merge. That is all the better. |
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 8, 2019 19:55:19 GMT -5
Flip the order any way you like it's still a good formula for a terrible draft Yep - can’t go into a draft with a predetermined order of what positions you are going to draft. Silly.... Also combine with where the percieved value of the draft is per area of draft. Argument sake using this year WR,D line and secondary seem deep early,O line(especially interior linemen)and linebackers deep on day 2. Now let's take QB out of the equation Your stacking your board First with BPA,then a secondary board with positions and players in each position with a round grade. Then obviously you have needs weighted. Let's say for example a team has decided in this order needs,OT,D line(3/4 linemen)then secondary. They are picking 7th...so Thomas is the target but they also know the backup plan will be there (the D linemen from Auburn..side note,too bad we are very well set with d linemen because this guy paired with Lawrence wouldn't be fair,but I digress).So Thomas is taken..but while they are all set to take the d linemen they see Jeudy has fallen to him.hypothetical team is loaded at WR,however their number one is in year 5 of his rookie deal and starting to show slight pain in the ass tendencies.They have money tied up here. Jeudy is by far the BPA.. Curveball,they take Jeudy,but while they discuss this they are on the phone with X team about a potential trade that gets them back a DT also in his final year that while not the ceiling as the WR they are replacing fits their defense .. So now they have cycled through their number 1 X recievers and basicly getting 8 years with a rookie contract from studs. All the while they do this they know the value for their 2 other big needs are plentiful on day 2... This is what smart teams do.. Predetermined positions for the draft = dumb teams |
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Post by lasion2 on Oct 8, 2019 21:08:09 GMT -5
It is simple.
Highest rated guy on the board that isn’t a qb or rb....maybe not a guard. Maybe.
Position almost doesn’t matter to me. Just get the best football players. Whoever those guys are, we need them. And we need them everywhere.
I suspect that, considering where we are picking and the make up of the draft class (as of now), it will be a WR in rd 1. Could be a tackle, but DG doesn’t do that early. Could be one of the 2 pass rushers. Really doesn’t matter to me, Joe Shmoe fan, as long as it’s not a reach or a project.
Edit: I just reiterated a bunch of posts above me without reading the thread. My fault.
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 9, 2019 6:31:51 GMT -5
It is simple. Highest rated guy on the board that isn’t a qb or rb....maybe not a guard. Maybe. Position almost doesn’t matter to me. Just get the best football players. Whoever those guys are, we need them. And we need them everywhere. I suspect that, considering where we are picking and the make up of the draft class (as of now), it will be a WR in rd 1. Could be a tackle, but DG doesn’t do that early. Could be one of the 2 pass rushers. Really doesn’t matter to me, Joe Shmoe fan, as long as it’s not a reach or a project. Edit: I just reiterated a bunch of posts above me without reading the thread. My fault. Some people apparently would indeed take a guard every time over even generational talents. Some people also apparently are arrogant enough in their faulty think tank way with a "anybody but a pass catcher'becsuse "wrs are a luxury ",even when an obvious BPA is a WR and we only have 2 legit guys on the roster,and in a passing league where the threat of the pass with major weapons opens up the run I call it the low standards mentality And a frightening amount of this fan base has this. But your take is correct |
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Post by Nite on Oct 9, 2019 7:06:53 GMT -5
It is simple. Highest rated guy on the board that isn’t a qb or rb....maybe not a guard. Maybe. Position almost doesn’t matter to me. Just get the best football players. Whoever those guys are, we need them. And we need them everywhere. I suspect that, considering where we are picking and the make up of the draft class (as of now), it will be a WR in rd 1. Could be a tackle, but DG doesn’t do that early. Could be one of the 2 pass rushers. Really doesn’t matter to me, Joe Shmoe fan, as long as it’s not a reach or a project. Edit: I just reiterated a bunch of posts above me without reading the thread. My fault. Some people apparently would indeed take a guard every time over even generational talents. Some people also apparently are arrogant enough in their faulty think tank way with a "anybody but a pass catcher'becsuse "wrs are a luxury ",even when an obvious BPA is a WR and we only have 2 legit guys on the roster,and in a passing league where the threat of the pass with major weapons opens up the run I call it the low standards mentality And a frightening amount of this fan base has this. But your take is correct I agree. However we need the bread before you can put the butter (feel free to steal that) meaning we still need to shore up the OL and get legit pass rushers and Lbs..If a stud WR or TE comes within our orbit then you take him. There is so much talent in the minors (college) right now its almost silly |
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Post by lasion2 on Oct 9, 2019 7:39:50 GMT -5
I was banging the drum pretty hard for Nelson in 2018. But, the Barkley/Hernandez duo seems to be more productive than a hypothetical Nelson/Chubb duo. So, goes to show you what I know.
To your point legacy, it is a passing league. So, with that in mind I forgive the “pass rusher or bust” crowd. Disrupting the opponents passing attack is also key. However, everyone needs to understand the strengths of a given draft class.
If Young and Epenesa are off the board when we pick you don’t simply pick the next best EDGE guy, cause we NEED a pass rush. That’s when things go off the rails.
The “you don’t win with big time WR” group is a bit mystifying. I think we come out of 2020 draft with a bonafide X wr, and a starting caliber lineman. Pass rush, draft wise, might wait till spring 2021. Just a gut feeling.
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 9, 2019 7:42:18 GMT -5
Some people apparently would indeed take a guard every time over even generational talents. Some people also apparently are arrogant enough in their faulty think tank way with a "anybody but a pass catcher'becsuse "wrs are a luxury ",even when an obvious BPA is a WR and we only have 2 legit guys on the roster,and in a passing league where the threat of the pass with major weapons opens up the run I call it the low standards mentality And a frightening amount of this fan base has this. But your take is correct I agree. However we need the bread before you can put the butter (feel free to steal that) meaning we still need to shore up the OL and get legit pass rushers and Lbs..If a stud WR or TE comes within our orbit then you take him. There is so much talent in the minors (college) right now its almost silly You can't force picks on inferior players though like some are suggesting just because they have an irrational phobia for playmakers and the passing game in general. And we have to let the year play out still What if X man is indeed a legit pass rusher and we decide to resign Golden wig looks to be returning to form? Don't forget about the d line,what if our big 3 become so dominant (which we are starting to see signs of)that they can affect the game and allow our pass rush to be too notch with even the backups,remember,your linebackers are only as good as your D line? I see posters saying we need to draft 80% defense again with a token few for O line? How is that going to help Jones develop when he possibly could only have 2 legit guys next year when they advocate overdrafting the same positions over and over again in a spray and prat style? The strength of this draft early is going to be indeed WR,and like it or not (not you but other special cases),and with a huge ? around Shepoard's health it is most certainly as big a need as anything potentially next year And not for nothing I want for once to have a team where opposing fan bases shudder in fear knowing there is a chance we could hang a 50 spot on them at any time,and win in many ways at the same time,and not try to build a team circa 1978 to win games 10-6 in an era where that is suicidal to being relevant |
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 9, 2019 7:52:23 GMT -5
I was banging the drum pretty hard for Nelson in 2018. But, the Barkley/Hernandez duo seems to be more productive than a hypothetical Nelson/Chubb duo. So, goes to show you what I know. To your point legacy, it is a passing league. So, with that in mind I forgive the “pass rusher or bust” crowd. Disrupting the opponents passing attack is also key. However, everyone needs to understand the strengths of a given draft class. If Young and Epenesa are off the board when we pick you don’t simply pick the next best EDGE guy, cause we NEED a pass rush. That’s when things go off the rails. The “you don’t win with big time WR” group is a bit mystifying. I think we come out of 2020 draft with a bonafide X wr, and a starting caliber lineman. Pass rush, draft wise, might wait till spring 2021. Just a gut feeling. 100% on the same page. People forget also that many of your great lines are rarely built through the early rounds of the draft,the outleirs are Dallas and Indy,and that was out of desperation for both teams.But only Indy was able to get away with this because they did it in one draft by trading back. Dallas did this and ignored the defense,which is why they wont have a balanced team,and we tried it from 2013-2015 with similar results. And these days NFL ready tackles from day one are unicorns,teams grasping for a bbn pulse out there early are often looking for that guy's replacement 3 years later,further compromising draft recources. If you don't get a Thomas or Wirfs,punt till the mid rounds because very good chance a reach for the next guy early hurts you I personally think Epenesa is more a 4/3 fit to be honest and probably a reach pick for us as not being the right fit. I'd use next offseason to build around your franchise qb and make the offense as complete as possible long term,though bringing in a guy like Byron Jones as a FA would definitely help the defense |
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 9, 2019 8:02:31 GMT -5
And as far as o line
Trust in Getty,he has building the trenches and maintaining them the highest priority,
It's just probably not going to be the way many want it to go
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Post by Nite on Oct 9, 2019 19:04:37 GMT -5
I agree. However we need the bread before you can put the butter (feel free to steal that) meaning we still need to shore up the OL and get legit pass rushers and Lbs..If a stud WR or TE comes within our orbit then you take him. There is so much talent in the minors (college) right now its almost silly You can't force picks on inferior players though like some are suggesting just because they have an irrational phobia for playmakers and the passing game in general. And we have to let the year play out still What if X man is indeed a legit pass rusher and we decide to resign Golden wig looks to be returning to form? Don't forget about the d line,what if our big 3 become so dominant (which we are starting to see signs of)that they can affect the game and allow our pass rush to be too notch with even the backups,remember,your linebackers are only as good as your D line? I see posters saying we need to draft 80% defense again with a token few for O line? How is that going to help Jones develop when he possibly could only have 2 legit guys next year when they advocate overdrafting the same positions over and over again in a spray and prat style? The strength of this draft early is going to be indeed WR,and like it or not (not you but other special cases),and with a huge ? around Shepoard's health it is most certainly as big a need as anything potentially next year And not for nothing I want for once to have a team where opposing fan bases shudder in fear knowing there is a chance we could hang a 50 spot on them at any time,and win in many ways at the same time,and not try to build a team circa 1978 to win games 10-6 in an era where that is suicidal to being relevant Fair enough, lets see what happens during the season. I agree about the weapons but w/o protection for Jones he won't be able to get the ball to them. Its like trying to build a parachute while you are falling out of the sky...and the ground is rapidly approaching |
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