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Post by SemperFi on Jan 7, 2020 22:20:15 GMT -5
You're misappropriating his skill set. His value is being the boss. The man who manages all the parts into a well running machine. He communicates, puts out fires, strategizes, assembles his staff, and leaves the tactical stuff to his coaches. That is what we are looking for.
His strength is not a coordinator, but a leader. That's what he has been groomed for. Judge is obviously one smart dude and from what i read he will take no shit. (By the way, an important consideration is his hiring coordinators that are respectful of his position as head coach being younger than them. But then, that's all about leading, isn't it...)
What makes fans so sure he is this leader and " boss"? I do see what you are saying, you are looking at it from a military background. To me a HC should know all facets of the game, one should also know Defense, this is where guys like mac shurmur fell short imo. I totally agree that a HC should know all facets of the game and a ST coordinator has a better feel for that than a O or D specialist, I would think. Lets face it, no knows it all at the most detailed level, that's just impossible. That's why you have a staff. You need to keep you eye on the big picture. The old saying, "You can't see the forest for the trees" is so true. You must make good hires and then trust them to carry out your plan.
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Post by TheAnalyst on Jan 7, 2020 22:22:17 GMT -5
to me this is backwards , hire him as a cordinator and someone with more experience as hc if you are so high on the guy . You're misappropriating his skill set. His value is being the boss. The man who manages all the parts into a well running machine. He communicates, puts out fires, strategizes, assembles his staff, and leaves the tactical stuff to his coaches. That is what we are looking for.
His strength is not a coordinator, but a leader. That's what he has been groomed for. Judge is obviously one smart dude and from what i read he will take no shit. (By the way, an important consideration is his hiring coordinators that are respectful of his position as head coach being younger than them. But then, that's all about leading, isn't it...)
How do you know all of this about him? I scoured the internet all day and cant find much substance on him. Wiki page. Some opinions on him. But that's it.
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Post by IrishMike on Jan 7, 2020 22:29:02 GMT -5
What makes fans so sure he is this leader and " boss"? I do see what you are saying, you are looking at it from a military background. To me a HC should know all facets of the game, one should also know Defense, this is where guys like mac shurmur fell short imo. May I pose your own question back to you? What makes you so sure he doesn't know all facets of the game? He played college ball, he has been on great staffs. He played QB, he was a LBs coach, he was a WRs coach, he was a ST coordinator. Seems pretty well rounded, I admittedly have no idea how much he actually knows though.
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Post by IrishMike on Jan 7, 2020 22:31:00 GMT -5
You're misappropriating his skill set. His value is being the boss. The man who manages all the parts into a well running machine. He communicates, puts out fires, strategizes, assembles his staff, and leaves the tactical stuff to his coaches. That is what we are looking for.
His strength is not a coordinator, but a leader. That's what he has been groomed for. Judge is obviously one smart dude and from what i read he will take no shit. (By the way, an important consideration is his hiring coordinators that are respectful of his position as head coach being younger than them. But then, that's all about leading, isn't it...)
How do you know all of this about him? I scoured the internet all day and cant find much substance on him. Wiki page. Some opinions on him. But that's it. All of that is out there from people. Good leader, very good football mind, very smart, hard nose "old school" type tough coach. Different opinions from people out there, who knows how it will turn out here though.
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 7, 2020 22:31:05 GMT -5
I tend to agree with your analysis. The Titans need Henry to be successful in order for them to win. The Pats tried to stop him, but we’re unable to do so. The Titans also have a good defense. If the Ravens cannot contain him it will be a dogfight I just don’t see that outcome however. The Ravens will give their three TE look and try to run the ball down their throat. If the Titans cannot stop it, they have already lost. If they can stop it, Brown deep and Andrews underneath will likely skewer them. If all that fails, Lamar will make them pay. No one has had an answer for him to date. For the NFC, I see either the Niners or Packers in the SB. The Ravens already beat the Niners and I believe wil do so again. I believe the Ravens would blow out the Packers. I honestly believe that the toughest game for the Ravens will be at home against the Chiefs in the AFC championship game. I have to give the edge to Baltimore’s D over a now healthy Mahomes. Turnovers aside, the winner of this game will win the SB. Only the Niners can stand in their way. That’s a solid football team. Harbaugh already has a game plan to beat the mediocre Chiefs D in the rematch. I don’t think that anyone is considering that the respective conference championships are not going to be between the four bye teams. Interesting you think the Ravens and Niners are the two top teams, also the two top rushing attacks in the league. You know what really helps young QBs? Running the ball. The Ravens are great because like you said they can run it, or pass it or Lamar it; plus great D. The 49ers are the same without the Lamar option. To be a great team in this league you need to be able to pass AND run it. There is a reason the 4 top high flying pass it all day teams are home watching the playoffs...because you can't win like that. You need to have the ability to play nuclear war type football and have a high octane passing attack even when run heavy It's not like the old days,fear of getting nuked opens up the running game and you can be as run heavy as you want,provided you have a good o line and a productive back of course.. If you don't have the firepower you are dead against a good team in the playoffs if you get down by 2 scores or more,because you are not promised your defense having a great day,hell..you could catch a day where the refs decide any kind of defense is illegal (everything is pass interference but holding on the O line is allowed) Give me an OC that has brings a modern style balanced offense that can take advantage of having weapons outside to open up the box..and vice a versa,able to scheme and gameplan our future offense (with another dynamic speed plamaker opposite Slayton that is a threat everywhere on the field)that runs a base 12 with Smith and Engram..with Jones running RPO type runs with Barkley.. And go uptempo if you hit a big run and run it up tempo ala the Eagles and the 49ers do to destroy the energy level of the opposing front 7. Modern offense is all.about speed and pace .
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Post by IrishMike on Jan 7, 2020 22:32:59 GMT -5
Give me an OC that has brings a modern style balanced offense No one is saying anything to contradict this. You can't be balanced without running the ball though.
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 7, 2020 22:36:37 GMT -5
Give me an OC that has brings a modern style balanced offense No one is saying anything to contradict this. You can't be balanced without running the ball though. And this I agree with Not like good ole geritol boy suggested way back 3 pages ago because his prehistoric ass (and his sick life narratives)are stuck in 1950 and can't now come to grips that this team actually is embracing analytics and probably with our staff
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Post by giants38 on Jan 7, 2020 22:44:25 GMT -5
Garrett is not coming here as OC He's literally coming here to interview as OC. Not true. Permission was asked to interview him as HC. No word has been issued on staff hirings.
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Post by McCherry on Jan 7, 2020 22:45:37 GMT -5
No one is saying anything to contradict this. You can't be balanced without running the ball though. And this I agree with Not like good ole geritol boy suggested way back 3 pages ago because his prehistoric ass (and his sick life narratives)are stuck in 1950 and can't now come to grips that this team actually is embracing analytics and probably with our staff Remember it's the Meadowlands, and you saw Jones struggle with accuracy when the weather turned bad in late November. The Giants will need to run the ball, this season more than ever. You've got a northeast football coach, I think you can look directly to the Pats offense as a model for what Judge will bring.
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Post by giants38 on Jan 7, 2020 22:47:10 GMT -5
Modern analytical style offense?!?! What nonsense is that. Do you see the Titans last weekend......nothing analytical about that, they just physically kicked the Patriot’s butt all over the field. You can leave the silly analytics stuff and just get good football players who are tough.....it worked in 1950 and it will work in 2020. Can statistics be used as a tool.....sure.....but to use it as the end-all ends up with teams like the Browns.......perennial losers. I thought running the ball was a thing of the past. Didn't the Titans QB win that game for them? Surely his 8 completions for 72 yards is the reason they won. Isn't that an astounding stat?
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Post by jaymas on Jan 7, 2020 22:56:57 GMT -5
And this I agree with Not like good ole geritol boy suggested way back 3 pages ago because his prehistoric ass (and his sick life narratives)are stuck in 1950 and can't now come to grips that this team actually is embracing analytics and probably with our staff Remember it's the Meadowlands, and you saw Jones struggle with accuracy when the weather turned bad in late November. The Giants will need to run the ball, this season more than ever. You've got a northeast football coach, I think you can look directly to the Pats offense as a model for what Judge will bring. He had one game. I'm not calling him out for struggling with accuracy in bed weather based on that alone.
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 7, 2020 23:04:55 GMT -5
And this I agree with Not like good ole geritol boy suggested way back 3 pages ago because his prehistoric ass (and his sick life narratives)are stuck in 1950 and can't now come to grips that this team actually is embracing analytics and probably with our staff Remember it's the Meadowlands, and you saw Jones struggle with accuracy when the weather turned bad in late November. The Giants will need to run the ball, this season more than ever. You've got a northeast football coach, I think you can look directly to the Pats offense as a model for what Judge will bring. He only had issues with one game(week 17) and he was on a bad ankle Seemed fine throwing it in New England in that subtropical storm where Brady had issues of all people Teams throw the ball all over the place in bad weather up north all the time,Eli did it and quite well..that myth that you have to become ultra conservative in December was busted long ago,especially considering the winds aren't half as bad. Fans need to lose the dogma about what this team was in 1990. If they can't or won't throw it or don't have weapons that scare opposing defenses we won't run it no matter how much we improve the line
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Post by jb456 on Jan 7, 2020 23:38:38 GMT -5
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 7, 2020 23:41:41 GMT -5
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Post by Morehead State on Jan 7, 2020 23:46:43 GMT -5
Sorry for coming in late on this but back to Wade Phillips. he would be a terrible pick in my view. He's good at scheming against old style offenses.....but this is a new NFL with modern offenses that break all the old rules.
There is a reason he got fired. Not to be cliche but the game HAS actually passed him by.
Look what the Baltimore offense did to them. He was lost.
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Post by SemperFi on Jan 7, 2020 23:51:42 GMT -5
You're misappropriating his skill set. His value is being the boss. The man who manages all the parts into a well running machine. He communicates, puts out fires, strategizes, assembles his staff, and leaves the tactical stuff to his coaches. That is what we are looking for.
His strength is not a coordinator, but a leader. That's what he has been groomed for. Judge is obviously one smart dude and from what i read he will take no shit. (By the way, an important consideration is his hiring coordinators that are respectful of his position as head coach being younger than them. But then, that's all about leading, isn't it...)
How do you know all of this about him? I scoured the internet all day and cant find much substance on him. Wiki page. Some opinions on him. But that's it. You really have to get out more. Its all over the place. Good start is to go youtube. Every one is talking about this. You want substance...all you are going to get are impressions but they are pretty decent.
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Post by DandyDon on Jan 8, 2020 0:03:53 GMT -5
"Basketball on grass" makes me lol.
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Post by giantfromtheoz on Jan 8, 2020 0:22:41 GMT -5
I feel like the best defensive coordinator we can get is actually either of the Cowboys guys. Our strength is our D-Line, however, our secondary is young and Kris Richard would be the guy for that in my opinion with his work with Seattle in the past. Marrinelli is very experienced as well, he is looking for a job too. But Richard for me.
As for the OC? Someone who will be here for a few years with Jones. I’d love to see some continuity in a system for a few years. What New Orleans are doing with Kamara is what we could and should be doing with Saquon. Brady from LSU? Is he available? I think Rhule wanted to bring him but he likely stays at LSU I think. Likely Judge brings a Pats guy for the O. No complaints there.
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Post by Sarcasman on Jan 8, 2020 1:16:35 GMT -5
Hey - just checking in. Is there any actual news or do I have to read six pages of you guys talking about who you want it to be?
I'm pressed for time.
thanks in advance
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Post by moecoastie on Jan 8, 2020 1:25:43 GMT -5
Hey - just checking in. Is there any actual news or do I have to read six pages of you guys talking about who you want it to be? I'm pressed for time. thanks in advance Don't do it
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Post by lexington11 on Jan 8, 2020 2:45:23 GMT -5
You're misappropriating his skill set. His value is being the boss. The man who manages all the parts into a well running machine. He communicates, puts out fires, strategizes, assembles his staff, and leaves the tactical stuff to his coaches. That is what we are looking for.
His strength is not a coordinator, but a leader. That's what he has been groomed for. Judge is obviously one smart dude and from what i read he will take no shit. (By the way, an important consideration is his hiring coordinators that are respectful of his position as head coach being younger than them. But then, that's all about leading, isn't it...)
How do you know all of this about him? I scoured the internet all day and cant find much substance on him. Wiki page. Some opinions on him. But that's it. its literally everywhere.
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Post by lexington11 on Jan 8, 2020 2:47:03 GMT -5
Sorry for coming in late on this but back to Wade Phillips. he would be a terrible pick in my view. He's good at scheming against old style offenses.....but this is a new NFL with modern offenses that break all the old rules. There is a reason he got fired. Not to be cliche but the game HAS actually passed him by. Look what the Baltimore offense did to them. He was lost. look what baltimore did to most defenses, lol. he had a great defense last year and he is actually acclimated to today's nfl..somebody has to be the scapegoat, it sure wasnt going to be mcvay.
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Post by TCHOF on Jan 8, 2020 5:28:46 GMT -5
Just wondering what you heard to back up your stance he is not coming here to interview for the OC job.
They interviewed Judge Monday and all reports say they negotiated (or at least started to) Monday night. Reports also say that Tuesday they requested to interview Garrett. Now there is absolutely a chance that the time lines of info are jacked up and the interview request was made before talking to Judge but didn't come out for a day; but it's equally possible they didn't request to speak to Garret until after the Judge interview/hiring decision.
The reason I believe they didn't ask for permission to speak with Garrett is because IMO if they were going to do that they could have done that days ago. Why wait until the day they interview Judge to ask for permission unless they weren't interested in him as the HC and only wanted him as OC after deciding to go with a very young HC.
Art Stapleton and Ralph Vacciano reporting that the Giants requested to interview Garrett for the HC position on Sunday night, before Monday’s interview with Judge. The request was withdrawn after Judge hiring. No request was made to interview him for the OC position.
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Post by TCHOF on Jan 8, 2020 5:32:39 GMT -5
No one is saying anything to contradict this. You can't be balanced without running the ball though. And this I agree with Not like good ole geritol boy suggested way back 3 pages ago because his prehistoric ass (and his sick life narratives)are stuck in 1950 and can't now come to grips that this team actually is embracing analytics and probably with our staff Top 4 rushing offenses still in playoffs
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Post by TCHOF on Jan 8, 2020 5:33:52 GMT -5
I’m sure he presented a plan to the Giants for his staff, but I would sure like to start hearing rumors about it ... so far, nothing
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 8, 2020 6:02:00 GMT -5
And this I agree with Not like good ole geritol boy suggested way back 3 pages ago because his prehistoric ass (and his sick life narratives)are stuck in 1950 and can't now come to grips that this team actually is embracing analytics and probably with our staff Top 4 rushing offenses still in playoffs Again 3 of the 4 are balanced modern offenses that can run because they are a threat to pass it, 1 being a highly gimmicky style with a dynamic running qb Defenses can't play 8 in the box or they get destroyed in the passing game..
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 8, 2020 6:15:51 GMT -5
I feel like the best defensive coordinator we can get is actually either of the Cowboys guys. Our strength is our D-Line, however, our secondary is young and Kris Richard would be the guy for that in my opinion with his work with Seattle in the past. Marrinelli is very experienced as well, he is looking for a job too. But Richard for me. As for the OC? Someone who will be here for a few years with Jones. I’d love to see some continuity in a system for a few years. What New Orleans are doing with Kamara is what we could and should be doing with Saquon. Brady from LSU? Is he available? I think Rhule wanted to bring him but he likely stays at LSU I think. Likely Judge brings a Pats guy for the O. No complaints there. The Cowboys run a strict Tampa 2 4/3 I'll pass... not to mention we would have to completely rebuild our front 7 AGAIN,meaning we have to mess with our strength on defense,the D line.. People wanting to win or fire everyone next year or fire everyone if the defense doesn't improve going to be patient when we have to take another year to rebuild this again?
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Post by Fletch842 on Jan 8, 2020 7:08:02 GMT -5
I’m sure he presented a plan to the Giants for his staff, but I would sure like to start hearing rumors about it ... so far, nothing I would imagine we'll start hearing names today, as they should be moving pretty quickly with it.
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 8, 2020 7:17:01 GMT -5
Whomever we bring in on either side of the ball
1.on offense A.The TEs on this team are legit weapons,USE THEM AS SUCH.Engram can run jet sweeps and can actually be used downfield like Smith was. You see how Baltimore uses their TEs....we have 2 that can d0 this .. Opens up the running game
B We were hearing all spring that Barkley was running a bunch of Beckham's patterns.. Why did we wait till week 16 vs the Redskins to see this? Barkley should be a 2500 yards from scrimmage unicorn playmaker a year.. He us the ultimate weapon..use him as such
C.we have a very athletic fullback with Penny.You see how Baltimore and San Fran use Their fullbacks..they carry the ball,they run TE seam patterns/wheel routes. Nothing worse for a defense when you come out in a 22 and all of a.sudden the FB motions out to the slot ...because now a linebacker has to follow him...then Engram motions out the other way ..again this is what Baltimore does all the time.. All 5 non linemen on the field must be threats
Defense (This is assuming we stay in the 3/4..coming from New England this is highly probable) A..the d line is the strength...do.not experiment with stupid shit and take a d lineman off the field...ever...
B press corners are best at press press coverage
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Post by TCHOF on Jan 8, 2020 7:37:12 GMT -5
Top 4 rushing offenses still in playoffs Again 3 of the 4 are balanced modern offenses that can run because they are a threat to pass it, 1 being a highly gimmicky style with a dynamic running qb Defenses can't play 8 in the box or they get destroyed in the passing game.. I agree with you ... just thought that it was an interesting fact
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