PFF - 4 Do's / Don'ts - NY Giants

[Deleted]

In short

Get a cornerback - they love Love, Peppers and Baker...last 6 games...but we need another CB desperately ...allocate more in this area

That is where the optimism ends, as the Giants need quality starting options and depth behind those players when it comes to both the slot and the second outside cornerback position. If you haven’t read PFF’s own Eric Eager’s piece on the fragility of defense, do yourself a favor and read it. After parsing through it, you'll soon realize that three quality coverage defenders — assuming Love, Peppers and Baker all continue to develop — across the linebacker, cornerback and safety positions is just not enough.

Do not sign Leonard Williams.... run defenders are overrated and we already have too many

Dave Gettleman, I implore you — you do not need another run-stuffing interior defender. I know the old saying is that “the game is won in the trenches,” and that “the top priority for any defense should be stopping the run and forcing the opposing team to pass.” That simply isn’t true in the year 2020. Sure, your run defense can’t be nonexistent to the point that you get repeatedly trampled on, à la the Green Bay Packers in the NFC Championship against the San Francisco 49ers last season, but making run defense the top priority in 2020 is just doing it wrong.

Trade back - JJ pick value is not correct anymore...best value in early middle rounds 11-15...trade back from 4 

PFF’s Timo Riske recently explored draft slots, pick value and the related salary implications in a piece that revisited Cade Massey and Richard H. Thaler’s work on surplus value and The Loser’s Curse. Some relevant findings for Giants fans — with accompanying charts from Timo’s work — include that PFF WAR indicates the drop-off in player performance isn’t as steep at the top of the draft as other draft value charts would indicate.

New York needs to add cornerbacks, linebackers, edge rushers, offensive linemen and a top option at wide receiver

Sign a wide receiver in the 1st round to help Jones, more value than even a OT...but helping Jones is priority one. 

The Giants believe that Jones is their guy at quarterback, and they need to figure out sooner rather than later whether that is truly the case. The most valuable thing that the Giants can give Jones to succeed better is not an offensive tackle (though that would help matters); it’s a true No. 1 wide receiver who can win at all levels of the field.

[Deleted]

I'm just the messenger...and remember, PFF is not one guy...they have well over 300 doing the data...this is one writers article.

[Kase1]

Interesting.....

Kind of wild how they value a 1st round WR over an OT for Jones

[ThatGuyRich]

When we had OBJ as good a WR as there is in the NFL this board was screaming he can't help us win. Are we gonna find anyone better than him in the 1st rd ? Now there are 20 WR's according to Mel Kiper going in the 1st 3 rds. Now in the 2nd rd I'm not against it or even if we somehow get a 2nd first rd pick. But no matter what PFF says I think we should go OT at #4 or anyone of the fab 4 OT's if we trade back to #12 or less.

You know in FA there are some big name WR's available.

[IrishMike]

First off they are referring to Peppers as a LB, which he is not. Second they are saying draft a WR #1.....so I can't wait until Aris changes his profile pick to Jeudy or Ruggs.


Here is my real problem with the "it's a passing league" thing. Obviously passing is important, always has been in my lifetime anyway. No I don't have all the "data" they supposedly have; but it seems people generally never mention how it is much easier to stop the pass when you make the team 1 dimensional. The quote you posted also incorrectly assume that Williams is just a run stuffer, he is not.

"Among 87 interior defenders with 200 or more pass-rushing snaps, Williams ranked 13th in pressure rate at 11.3% but his one sack in 424 pass-rushing snaps put him near the bottom of the list in sack rate. On the other hand, Williams led the position with 19 quarterback hits. A few fractions of a second faster on several of those plays and that sack total looks a whole lot more respectable."

Not sure you want to trust my quote...it's from PFF. In a year when pass rushing talent is going to be very hard to find we should look very hard at keeping Williams.

[TEM]

PFF Parasite Football Fiction.

[nygfanstrick]

I think from time to time they do have some fair takes, but others I just don't agree with. WR in round one would be a mistake in my opinion unless we were able to trade back and get 2 first round picks in the mid-late first round range AND OT has to be one of those 2 picks IMO.

As far as CB I agree, we have to sign or draft someone there. At the very least they should get someone to be the nickel CB and let Ballentine and Beal battle for the CB2 spot.

I can understand the Leonard Williams take with the amount of money he is likely requesting, but I do think he brings a lot of value to this team. The question is, is it enough value to justify the price tag? That's up for debate. Personally, I feel like they almost have to bring him back in some capacity after trading away the early third for him

[IrishMike]

Mar 12, 2020 15:41:42 GMT -5 nygfanstrick said:

I think from time to time they do have some fair takes, but others I just don't agree with. WR in round one would be a mistake in my opinion unless we were able to trade back and get 2 first round picks in the mid-late first round range AND OT has to be one of those 2 picks IMO.

As far as CB I agree, we have to sign or draft someone there. At the very least they should get someone to be the nickel CB and let Ballentine and Beal battle for the CB2 spot.

I can understand the Leonard Williams take with the amount of money he is likely requesting, but I do think he brings a lot of value to this team. The question is, is it enough value to justify the price tag? That's up for debate. Personally, I feel like they almost have to bring him back in some capacity after trading away the early third for him

Solid post, I agree.

The funny thing is they used all these amazing advanced stats to figure out we need another CB lol. I read that and was thinking "no sh*t". Everyone in the NFL could use another CB, especially teams that cut their #1 CB during the season.

I agree about Williams. He brings value to this D but the price has to make sense.

[snyder55]

I try not get my head into the price of players, if we bring in a guy who fixes a problem then its all worth it as far I'm concerned, let the team worry about how to pay these guys, thats their job.

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2020 15:30:53 GMT -5 IrishMike said:

First off they are referring to Peppers as a LB, which he is not. Second they are saying draft a WR #1.....so I can't wait until Aris changes his profile pick to Jeudy or Ruggs.


Here is my real problem with the "it's a passing league" thing. Obviously passing is important, always has been in my lifetime anyway. No I don't have all the "data" they supposedly have; but it seems people generally never mention how it is much easier to stop the pass when you make the team 1 dimensional. The quote you posted also incorrectly assume that Williams is just a run stuffer, he is not.

"Among 87 interior defenders with 200 or more pass-rushing snaps, Williams ranked 13th in pressure rate at 11.3% but his one sack in 424 pass-rushing snaps put him near the bottom of the list in sack rate. On the other hand, Williams led the position with 19 quarterback hits. A few fractions of a second faster on several of those plays and that sack total looks a whole lot more respectable."

Not sure you want to trust my quote...it's from PFF. In a year when pass rushing talent is going to be very hard to find we should look very hard at keeping Williams.

Not even close to what they suggest Mike...can a poster be as argumentative and always wrong as much as you? 

While he didn’t have the same kind of success in 2019 as he did in his sophomore 2018 campaign with the Cleveland Browns, the Giants should still feel secure in Jabrill Peppers as the team’s starting strong safety. He’s a versatile player who can play in the box, in the slot, deep or even on the edge, and he has the kind of athleticism and playmaking ability that you want to see from a starting defensive player.

His PFF grade, this be advanced stats, still a very viable player. They also grade Love as a FS and good grades (I'm not sold, but they are), and Baker had a good last part to the season...as we all seen with our eyes, and reflected on the advanced PFF grade. We need another cornerback. 

While I personally believe that they should trade back if they wish to take a wide receiver — one of Jerry Jeudy, CeeDee Lamb or Henry Ruggs should be available later on, given the run on quarterbacks and tackles that figures to take place — I don’t hate the idea of the Giants selecting a wide receiver in the first round, either.

This is his opinion, and while I am not going WR at 4, he suggests a WR after a trade back, while STILL adhering to the OT need...see next

The worst thing that the Giants could possibly do is keep a struggling Jones around and tag excuses, such as not having an elite wide receiver or having to play behind a poor offensive line, onto his poor play. The Giants have the resources to give him every opportunity to succeed in 2020 with a good offense around him. They need to make that happen.

Remember, PFF, or a SINGLE writer AT PFF, does not show Jones in a favorable analytical light...and yet, this writer is doing what all of us "crap, not Jones as a QB pick" are doing...moving on, and debating the best possible ways to make him succeed...and getting a new coach not called Shurmur was not, IMHO, the correct start. (cue Shurmur was a brutal HC drones...4, 3, 2, 1...)

He believes improving the OL and a that dynamic WR would help him. Nothing nobody has not posted here in the many mocks or opinions. IOW, not earth shattering in that opinion aside from maybe leaning WR vs OT...and I disagree as I believe more WR's vs top plug and play OT's. 

Again, helping you along Mike with the hard parts...

1 - We need another corner ...Peppers is a SS...strong safeties sometimes jam the box.

2 - Do not sign Williams, run DT's are of some value, limited in todays pass league, but we have invested too much into them as is, and we need to go elsewhere vs Leonard Williams. I agree, but we KNOW that aint happening with DG.

3 - Trade back...because a 4 pick is not as valuable as the Panthers  Jaguars or Raiders 2 first round picks. The old pick values are not viable anymore...new data shows that. Best value is pick 11-15. 

4 - We need to make the offense better for Jones, with OL and a WR1...he values WR1 over OT, but not by much, and believes we need to do a Wirfs, Ruggs type combo with a trade back. 

Basically, all what we generally post in here...

[TEM]

Mar 12, 2020 16:51:40 GMT -5 Aris said:

Mar 12, 2020 15:30:53 GMT -5 IrishMike said:

First off they are referring to Peppers as a LB, which he is not. Second they are saying draft a WR #1.....so I can't wait until Aris changes his profile pick to Jeudy or Ruggs.


Here is my real problem with the "it's a passing league" thing. Obviously passing is important, always has been in my lifetime anyway. No I don't have all the "data" they supposedly have; but it seems people generally never mention how it is much easier to stop the pass when you make the team 1 dimensional. The quote you posted also incorrectly assume that Williams is just a run stuffer, he is not.

"Among 87 interior defenders with 200 or more pass-rushing snaps, Williams ranked 13th in pressure rate at 11.3% but his one sack in 424 pass-rushing snaps put him near the bottom of the list in sack rate. On the other hand, Williams led the position with 19 quarterback hits. A few fractions of a second faster on several of those plays and that sack total looks a whole lot more respectable."

Not sure you want to trust my quote...it's from PFF. In a year when pass rushing talent is going to be very hard to find we should look very hard at keeping Williams.

Not even close to what they suggest Mike...can a poster be as argumentative and always wrong as much as you? 

While he didn’t have the same kind of success in 2019 as he did in his sophomore 2018 campaign with the Cleveland Browns, the Giants should still feel secure in Jabrill Peppers as the team’s starting strong safety. He’s a versatile player who can play in the box, in the slot, deep or even on the edge, and he has the kind of athleticism and playmaking ability that you want to see from a starting defensive player.

His PFF grade, this be advanced stats, still a very viable player. They also grade Love as a FS and good grades (I'm not sold, but they are), and Baker had a good last part to the season...as we all seen with our eyes, and reflected on the advanced PFF grade. We need another cornerback. 

While I personally believe that they should trade back if they wish to take a wide receiver — one of Jerry Jeudy, CeeDee Lamb or Henry Ruggs should be available later on, given the run on quarterbacks and tackles that figures to take place — I don’t hate the idea of the Giants selecting a wide receiver in the first round, either.

This is his opinion, and while I am not going WR at 4, he suggests a WR after a trade back, while STILL adhering to the OT need...see next

The worst thing that the Giants could possibly do is keep a struggling Jones around and tag excuses, such as not having an elite wide receiver or having to play behind a poor offensive line, onto his poor play. The Giants have the resources to give him every opportunity to succeed in 2020 with a good offense around him. They need to make that happen.

Remember, PFF, or a SINGLE writer AT PFF, does not show Jones in a favorable analytical light...and yet, this writer is doing what all of us "crap, not Jones as a QB pick" are doing...moving on, and debating the best possible ways to make him succeed...and getting a new coach not called Shurmur was not, IMHO, the correct start. (cue Shurmur was a brutal HC drones...4, 3, 2, 1...)

He believes improving the OL and a that dynamic WR would help him. Nothing nobody has not posted here in the many mocks or opinions. IOW, not earth shattering in that opinion aside from maybe leaning WR vs OT...and I disagree as I believe more WR's vs top plug and play OT's. 

Again, helping you along Mike with the hard parts...

1 - We need another corner ...Peppers is a SS...strong safeties sometimes jam the box.

2 - Do not sign Williams, run DT's are of some value, limited in todays pass league, but we have invested too much into them as is, and we need to go elsewhere vs Leonard Williams. I agree, but we KNOW that aint happening with DG.

3 - Trade back...because a 4 pick is not as valuable as the Panthers or Raiders 2 first round picks. The old pick values are not viable anymore...new data shows that. Best value is pick 11-15. 

4 - We need to make the offense better for Jones, with OL and a WR1...he values WR1 over OT, but not by much, and believes we need to do a Wirfs, Ruggs type combo with a trade back. 

Basically, all what we generally post in here...

And that is why PFF is S### show. Jones set rookie QB records and the arrogance of Collinsworth and his hoard of yes men fail to even acknowledge those feats .  I will tell you why. They hated the pick and have to prove that initial assessment to be the correct one.  I am one of the most obstinate individuals on the site and I am not that pigheaded  to see my initial assessment of DJ was wrong. 

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2020 15:14:54 GMT -5 Kase1 said:

Interesting.....

Kind of wild how they value a 1st round WR over an OT for Jones

Not by much Kase, this writer says both needed...I am wondering if I belong to one of the elite type services with advanced data, can I post it? I know if you go insider on ESPN, you can not post their articles such as Mel Kiper (as if we need his insights) and his mocks...I aim guessing the same for any paid service.

www.pff.com/terms

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2020 17:06:07 GMT -5 TEM said:

Mar 12, 2020 16:51:40 GMT -5 Aris said:

Not even close to what they suggest Mike...can a poster be as argumentative and always wrong as much as you? 


His PFF grade, this be advanced stats, still a very viable player. They also grade Love as a FS and good grades (I'm not sold, but they are), and Baker had a good last part to the season...as we all seen with our eyes, and reflected on the advanced PFF grade. We need another cornerback. 

This is his opinion, and while I am not going WR at 4, he suggests a WR after a trade back, while STILL adhering to the OT need...see next

Remember, PFF, or a SINGLE writer AT PFF, does not show Jones in a favorable analytical light...and yet, this writer is doing what all of us "crap, not Jones as a QB pick" are doing...moving on, and debating the best possible ways to make him succeed...and getting a new coach not called Shurmur was not, IMHO, the correct start. (cue Shurmur was a brutal HC drones...4, 3, 2, 1...)

He believes improving the OL and a that dynamic WR would help him. Nothing nobody has not posted here in the many mocks or opinions. IOW, not earth shattering in that opinion aside from maybe leaning WR vs OT...and I disagree as I believe more WR's vs top plug and play OT's. 

Again, helping you along Mike with the hard parts...

1 - We need another corner ...Peppers is a SS...strong safeties sometimes jam the box.

2 - Do not sign Williams, run DT's are of some value, limited in todays pass league, but we have invested too much into them as is, and we need to go elsewhere vs Leonard Williams. I agree, but we KNOW that aint happening with DG.

3 - Trade back...because a 4 pick is not as valuable as the Panthers or Raiders 2 first round picks. The old pick values are not viable anymore...new data shows that. Best value is pick 11-15. 

4 - We need to make the offense better for Jones, with OL and a WR1...he values WR1 over OT, but not by much, and believes we need to do a Wirfs, Ruggs type combo with a trade back. 

Basically, all what we generally post in here...

And that is why PFF is S### show. Jones set rookie QB records and the arrogance of Collinsworth and his hoard of yes men fail to even acknowledge those feats .  I will tell you why. They hated the pick and thy have to prove that initial assessment to be the correct one.  I am one of the most obstinate individuals on the site and I am not that pigheaded  to see my initial assessment of DJ was wrong. 

Easy my stats loving friend...they can have a differing opinion. Let's not go all tin foil hat...it was ONE writer who did not like the pick...among MANY, MANY in the media, and MANY, MANY fans who did not like it either.

The worst thing that the Giants could possibly do is keep a struggling Jones around and tag excuses, such as not having an elite wide receiver or having to play behind a poor offensive line, onto his poor play. The Giants have the resources to give him every opportunity to succeed in 2020 with a good offense around him. They need to make that happen.

This ONE writer is beyond the fact we chose this guy, as all fans are... and is now saying what the team needs to make Jones a success....nothing different then what we all post in the mocks and posts in this section.

Relax...OL and a dynamic WR...we all know it down here. 

[rbe40]

LW ranked 13th in Pressure Rate among 87 qualified Interior DL

He's a pass-rusher.

Article dismissed.

[giantlegacy]

Mar 12, 2020 15:14:54 GMT -5 Kase1 said:

Interesting.....

Kind of wild how they value a 1st round WR over an OT for Jones

They have been advocating this for a while actually

[TEM]

Mar 12, 2020 17:22:45 GMT -5 Aris said:

Mar 12, 2020 17:06:07 GMT -5 TEM said:

And that is why PFF is S### show. Jones set rookie QB records and the arrogance of Collinsworth and his hoard of yes men fail to even acknowledge those feats .  I will tell you why. They hated the pick and thy have to prove that initial assessment to be the correct one.  I am one of the most obstinate individuals on the site and I am not that pigheaded  to see my initial assessment of DJ was wrong. 

Easy my stats loving friend...they can have a differing opinion. Let's not go all tin foil hat...it was ONE writer who did not like the pick...among MANY, MANY in the media, and MANY, MANY fans who did not like it either.

The worst thing that the Giants could possibly do is keep a struggling Jones around and tag excuses, such as not having an elite wide receiver or having to play behind a poor offensive line, onto his poor play. The Giants have the resources to give him every opportunity to succeed in 2020 with a good offense around him. They need to make that happen.

This ONE writer is beyond the fact we chose this guy, as all fans are... and is now saying what the team needs to make Jones a success....nothing different then what we all post in the mocks and posts in this section.

Relax...OL and a dynamic WR...we all know it down here. 

I stand by my assessment  of Collinsworth and his dreary men. I honestly believe some of what they do is agenda based. 

[IrishMike]

Mar 12, 2020 16:51:40 GMT -5 Aris said:

Basically, all what we generally post in here...

So you're saying that PFF with 300 people working there and all of the greatest advanced stats in the world say exactly what random posters on this board say?

Damn we should start charging.

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2020 17:55:32 GMT -5 IrishMike said:

Mar 12, 2020 16:51:40 GMT -5 Aris said:

Basically, all what we generally post in here...

So you're saying that PFF with 300 people working there and all of the greatest advanced stats in the world say exactly what random posters on this board say?

Damn we should start charging.

No, this must be confusing for you being Scottish and saying you are Irish.

They have employees ...but they also have opinions, mocks...articles, much data, much film.

One writer on that site, among many. They have podcasts, articles, data, advanced analytics ect...

So, recap

300 workers

1 writer opinion here.

300 workers

Another writes opinion next time.

NOT all PFF like minded...was this easier for you this post?  

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2020 17:53:48 GMT -5 giantlegacy said:

Mar 12, 2020 15:14:54 GMT -5 Kase1 said:

Interesting.....

Kind of wild how they value a 1st round WR over an OT for Jones

They have been advocating this for a while actually

Yep, exactly what we all believe down here in regards to WR and OT...and trading back. 

I only posted pieces of an article that verified what many here believe...and your WR 2nd round, BPA...all bets off.

Not sure why some posters are shaken to the core...must be the PFF that sets them off. 

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2020 17:25:42 GMT -5 rbe40 said:

LW ranked 13th in Pressure Rate among 87 qualified Interior DL

He's a pass-rusher.

Article dismissed.

We have snap counts, grades, pressure, tackling...each one into a sub stat such as sacks, hits, hurries and even batted balls. This is all seasons for Leonard. It gets into each game as well...and, matchups. I can put in who blocks him well....the detailing of stats is mind blowing. They look at where and how everybody else affect the play...what each pressure was, sack...point each play from a -2 - +2.....simply amazing details. Grades are incredible as to how they get them. All match the eyes too. data is endless...thanks to those 300 football nerds. 

Career is posted here, just a few of the many stats for his career...if you need a game let me know. Need to know how many snaps where he lined up...to help you further decide? Who? It's all a search away. 

Year, overall grade / run defense grade / pressure /sacks / tackles 

2015 -  79.4 / 86.1 / 52 /4 / 37

2016 - 81.4 / 82.2 / 55 / 8 / 48

2017 - 75.3 / 71.9 / 46 / 3 / 30

2018 - 78 / 77.8 / 53 / 6 /26

2019 - 70.6 / 74.2 / 48 / 1/ 29


Pass rush grade and coverage grade available as well...light green/green, this a bit above average/above average...I would assume about average for a 3-4 DE

Not sure where some have decided he is a pass rushing 3 tech guy, lol...but he is a 3-4 DE...generally having to stop the run is his first duties....does them well

Now, get another DE with hand in the dirt...would love to see LW do some 3 tech from the inside on a 4-3...

BTW, these stats, our eyes, and the position he plays suggests this...article was basically dead on...nothing to see, move along. 

Happy to help explain it.  


Here is a nice article explaining why the Ewok was so low graded LAST year...as the leading rusher...not much difference in running back talents, and all based upon OL, and again, how coaching set that box to clear out

cowboyswire.usatoday.com/2019/02/22/dallas-cowboys-ezekiel-elliott-pff-2018-grade-football-outsiders/

[TheAnalyst]

Nope

Yes

Yes

Nope


No to a CB. It's not a need. Yes to letting Williams walk. Duh. Yes to trading back (unless Young is there). No we shouldnt go WR in the 1st round over OT. Dumb.

[Sarcasman]

Mar 12, 2020 14:56:46 GMT -5 Aris said:

I'm just the messenger...and remember, PFF is not one guy...they have well over 300 doing the data...this is one writers article.

I think they’re ability to track real data and report it is an invaluable tool. I think their attempts to extrapolate their opinions into something meaningful is so contrived and poor that it hurts the credibility of the thing they do really well. But I guess they gotta chase revenue like everybody else.

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2020 15:17:21 GMT -5 ThatGuyRich said:

When we had OBJ as good a WR as there is in the NFL this board was screaming he can't help us win. Are we gonna find anyone better than him in the 1st rd ? Now there are 20 WR's according to Mel Kiper going in the 1st 3 rds. Now in the 2nd rd I'm not against it or even if we somehow get a 2nd first rd pick. But no matter what PFF says I think we should go OT at #4 or anyone of the fab 4 OT's if we trade back to #12 or less.

You know in FA there are some big name WR's available.

I'm on board with Thomas/Mims

A trade back and Wirfs/Ruggs/Terrell or Queen works too

I don't believe he was suggesting no OL, or OT...just trade back and don't forget to get the big named receiver.  


I thought it more odd more so that he actually echos what many on the draft section have been suggesting since the year began....

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2020 19:37:18 GMT -5 TheAnalyst said:

Nope

Yes

Yes

Nope


No to a CB. It's not a need. Yes to letting Williams walk. Duh. Yes to trading back (unless Young is there). No we shouldnt go WR in the 1st round over OT. Dumb.

I still believe CB is a need...Baker is still on the let's see where it goes zone, and the other B's are not making me feel it. Agreed with OT over WR in round 1, although I believe (could be wrong) he was suggesting that after a trade back. 

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2020 19:38:40 GMT -5 Sarcasman said:

Mar 12, 2020 14:56:46 GMT -5 Aris said:

I'm just the messenger...and remember, PFF is not one guy...they have well over 300 doing the data...this is one writers article.

I think they’re ability to track real data and report it is an invaluable tool. I think their attempts to extrapolate their opinions into something meaningful is so contrived and poor that it hurts the credibility of the thing they do really well. But I guess they gotta chase revenue like everybody else.

Yeah, they have a bunch of differing opinions regarding the data....I prefer when they just go just data driven, but we still have fans adhering to Kiper...I'll take my PFF over ESPN thanks. 

When it comes to the NFL and real time?...I enjoy their stats...would help a gambler and fantasy player or nerds...college stats are sort of hard to translate, and especially to the pro's with the draft...I do enjoy them for free agency. 

[IrishMike]

Mar 12, 2020 18:36:44 GMT -5 Aris said:

Mar 12, 2020 17:55:32 GMT -5 IrishMike said:

So you're saying that PFF say exactly what random posters on this board say?

No, this must be confusing for you being

Oh. Silly me I thought you just said "Basically, all what we generally post in here...".

[IrishMike]

Mar 12, 2020 19:38:40 GMT -5 Sarcasman said:

Mar 12, 2020 14:56:46 GMT -5 Aris said:

I'm just the messenger...and remember, PFF is not one guy...they have well over 300 doing the data...this is one writers article.

I think they’re ability to track real data and report it is an invaluable tool. I think their attempts to extrapolate their opinions into something meaningful is so contrived and poor that it hurts the credibility of the thing they do really well. But I guess they gotta chase revenue like everybody else.

100%.

I've been saying forever that their stats are amazing (people call me a PFF lover when I post that) but their rankings based on those stats are useless (people call me a dinosaur that hates modern analytics when I say that).

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2020 20:44:00 GMT -5 IrishMike said:

Mar 12, 2020 19:38:40 GMT -5 Sarcasman said:

I think they’re ability to track real data and report it is an invaluable tool. I think their attempts to extrapolate their opinions into something meaningful is so contrived and poor that it hurts the credibility of the thing they do really well. But I guess they gotta chase revenue like everybody else.

100%.

I've been saying forever that their stats are amazing (people call me a PFF lover when I post that) but their rankings based on those stats are useless (people call me a dinosaur that hates modern analytics when I say that).

I don't see ANY data suggesting you have been posting this forever ... please provide said data my Scottish friend. 

[Deleted]

Mar 12, 2020 20:42:16 GMT -5 IrishMike said:

Mar 12, 2020 18:36:44 GMT -5 Aris said:

No, this must be confusing for you being

Oh. Silly me I thought you just said

That there being the problem...you being silly and not quite sure what is being said 

My data will help you become enlightened....although PFF and the data does say Clowney is a hard avoid in free agency, and we're both wanting him at 20 million

PFF vs Aris and Mike...let's go at em hard Mikey 

[IrishMike]

Mar 12, 2020 20:49:29 GMT -5 Aris said:

Mar 12, 2020 20:42:16 GMT -5 IrishMike said:

Oh. Silly me I thought you just said "Basically, all what we generally post in here...".

 not quite sure what is being said

""Basically, all what we generally post in here...".

That was your exact quote. Choose your words better if that's not what you meant to say.