|
|
Post by BigBlueDog42 on Jun 23, 2021 7:48:53 GMT -5
Most of us were happy with the trade vs. taking Slater or anyone else. My point about Slater is that he is a LT. If we want to compare him, compare him to Thomas. I have no doubt he'll be great, but he's going to start at LT from his first day to his last day, but he never made much sense here. We have a LT and if we wanted a RT or G there were better value players later in my opinion. Our need was interior linemen and Guys like Banks or Watts are the ones to watch if we want to make comparisons down the line. Yes, the trade was nice. That was certainly what most were happy about...the picks next year. However, while the Giants might of known about every aspect of Toney's "red flags"...fans were limited in much of this information before the pick. Slater could have easily been made a guard as a rookie, and still might end up there...his feet are great but his NFL length is very suspect. We can speculate all we want...so I will now as well.... I'm believing we would of taken Vera-Tucker if he hung around...and taken Slater if no trade was available. There were very strong rumors of the Giants being interested in Landon Dickerson 2nd round, all pro potential and versatile if he stays healthy...another Giant interest taken by the Eagles....a possible reason we traded back again in the 2nd round. So yeah, I believe we would have taken Slater with no trade partner, then hoping Vera-Tucker slid...and finally were hoping for a Dickerson in round 2. We need more talent on the OL... In a perfect world Aris, they find that Jones is their man and next year they take those 2 firsts and get the ad to the OL if necessary and definitely build the edge up. In the end they may find out this young OL will be fine and just needs to keep adding talent to the pipe line. remember this is a perfect world were talking about, it's about time some thing start breaking right for this team it has been a while. |
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Jun 23, 2021 7:49:29 GMT -5
I like that Judge had him with the second team too at the few practices he was at.
Although maybe all the rookies were. Not sure about that.
|
|
ratbastich
Special Teams
Posts: 2,017
Member is Online
|
Post by ratbastich on Jun 23, 2021 7:55:50 GMT -5
The first pass this kid drops he's gonna get booed out of the stadium. If his understanding of the English language is anything like his spelling. He’ll think he’s being celebrated. What did this kid major in at the University of Florida? Show and tell? I was interested in finding out bekause there are a lot of guys that go into the NFL majoring in kommunikations and was wondering if he was one. That would be irony at its finest. Unfortunately, I see nothing. Question: Do I replace all C's with K's or just the hard C's? |
|
|
|
Post by Kruunch on Jun 23, 2021 11:10:34 GMT -5
If his understanding of the English language is anything like his spelling. He’ll think he’s being celebrated. What did this kid major in at the University of Florida? Show and tell? I was interested in finding out bekause there are a lot of guys that go into the NFL majoring in kommunikations and was wondering if he was one. That would be irony at its finest. Unfortunately, I see nothing. Question: Do I replace all C's with K's or just the hard C's? Ask him. Just make sure to post in cryptic, he might get confused otherwise. |
|
|
|
Post by McCherry on Jun 23, 2021 11:37:10 GMT -5
Most of us were happy with the trade vs. taking Slater or anyone else. My point about Slater is that he is a LT. If we want to compare him, compare him to Thomas. I have no doubt he'll be great, but he's going to start at LT from his first day to his last day, but he never made much sense here. We have a LT and if we wanted a RT or G there were better value players later in my opinion. Our need was interior linemen and Guys like Banks or Watts are the ones to watch if we want to make comparisons down the line. Yes, the trade was nice. That was certainly what most were happy about...the picks next year. However, while the Giants might of known about every aspect of Toney's "red flags"...fans were limited in much of this information before the pick. Slater could have easily been made a guard as a rookie, and still might end up there...his feet are great but his NFL length is very suspect. We can speculate all we want...so I will now as well.... I'm believing we would of taken Vera-Tucker if he hung around...and taken Slater if no trade was available. There were very strong rumors of the Giants being interested in Landon Dickerson 2nd round, all pro potential and versatile if he stays healthy...another Giant interest taken by the Eagles....a possible reason we traded back again in the 2nd round. So yeah, I believe we would have taken Slater with no trade partner, then hoping Vera-Tucker slid...and finally were hoping for a Dickerson in round 2. We need more talent on the OL... I never understood the idea of taking a LT with the 11th overall pick and make him a Guard? Again, he is a day 1 starter at LT for the Chargers. If the Giants wanted a backup Guard, there were better value picks later in the draft. Again though, they are confident in what they have so I am fine with those decisions. The OL is set. We have our starting Guards. I trust the coaches' evaluation, not fans. As far as Toney we knew there were red flags about his commitment, durability, lateness to practice. It was all out there. He's already demonstrated all of these things. I am not going to make any judgements until the seasons begins. |
|
|
|
Post by vinnie on Jun 23, 2021 12:51:04 GMT -5
this is all in the KT twitter thread. This kid is making it harder on himself that it needs to be. He is setting him self up for fan/media blitz. Every wrong move he makes is now magnified and every right move he makes he (MAY BE) will be a "I told you so" type of player which is terrible. So far he has his head up his ass IMO. Loved the pick but so far dont like the player or better yet his approach. I have not much to go on and am making assumptions but hey....thats my privilege as a fan. Of course I hope I am 100% wrong. I couldn't give two shits about the world of rap but if you speak/tweet like an illiterate jerk off then that is what you are or perceived to be. Bwahahahahahahahaha….well said! I was indifferent about the pick but he’s done nothing but make me dislike him immensely. This guy hasn’t even stepped on the field in an NFL game and he’s already been a distraction with his attitude. I don’t see this ending well, hopefully I’m wrong. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2021 15:29:17 GMT -5
Yes, the trade was nice. That was certainly what most were happy about...the picks next year. However, while the Giants might of known about every aspect of Toney's "red flags"...fans were limited in much of this information before the pick. Slater could have easily been made a guard as a rookie, and still might end up there...his feet are great but his NFL length is very suspect. We can speculate all we want...so I will now as well.... I'm believing we would of taken Vera-Tucker if he hung around...and taken Slater if no trade was available. There were very strong rumors of the Giants being interested in Landon Dickerson 2nd round, all pro potential and versatile if he stays healthy...another Giant interest taken by the Eagles....a possible reason we traded back again in the 2nd round. So yeah, I believe we would have taken Slater with no trade partner, then hoping Vera-Tucker slid...and finally were hoping for a Dickerson in round 2. We need more talent on the OL... I never understood the idea of taking a LT with the 11th overall pick and make him a Guard? Again, he is a day 1 starter at LT for the Chargers. If the Giants wanted a backup Guard, there were better value picks later in the draft. Again though, they are confident in what they have so I am fine with those decisions. The OL is set. We have our starting Guards. I trust the coaches' evaluation, not fans. As far as Toney we knew there were red flags about his commitment, durability, lateness to practice. It was all out there. He's already demonstrated all of these things. I am not going to make any judgements until the seasons begins. BPA is the idea on how to slam drafts....we were in that position, and if the trade did not go down, Slater was the pick. Our OL is full of question marks...even our center is a bottom dweller in talent vs the rest of the league. Teams always strive to improve weaker players, and Slater would have become our most solid technician and by far, most versatile offensive linemen. You do NOT draft strictly for need (oh and we needed a guard)...and it sounds wonderful to trust the coaches and GM's and the "football" guys...but that's a copout answer on a fan message board. As fans, on a fan message board, we offer our opinions. I certainly do not believe the Giants pass on Vera-Tucker or Slater if he lasted...BPA, and the most important aspect of this team, and one with many question marks, strengthens. As far as Toney, not a single post or poster mentioned any red flags, let alone his rap career until AFTER he was chosen. Why was that? Certainly the Giants knew, and we are going to trust them...lol...but not a fan mentioned any of these red flags until after he was taken.  |
|
|
|
Post by snyder55 on Jun 23, 2021 15:33:10 GMT -5
I would've imagined that his agent would have warned him to keep his mouth shut, amazing..
|
|
|
|
Post by snyder55 on Jun 23, 2021 15:39:10 GMT -5
looks to me like Toney failed all of his remedial reading classes and then amazingly went on to college where he learned absolutely nothing, I doubt if he could pass a tryout for the 3 Stooges
|
|
|
|
Post by McCherry on Jun 23, 2021 15:42:11 GMT -5
I never understood the idea of taking a LT with the 11th overall pick and make him a Guard? Again, he is a day 1 starter at LT for the Chargers. If the Giants wanted a backup Guard, there were better value picks later in the draft. Again though, they are confident in what they have so I am fine with those decisions. The OL is set. We have our starting Guards. I trust the coaches' evaluation, not fans. As far as Toney we knew there were red flags about his commitment, durability, lateness to practice. It was all out there. He's already demonstrated all of these things. I am not going to make any judgements until the seasons begins. BPA is the idea on how to slam drafts....we were in that position, and if the trade did not go down, Slater was the pick. Our OL is full of question marks...even our center is a bottom dweller in talent vs the rest of the league. Teams always strive to improve weaker players, and Slater would have become our most solid technician and by far, most versatile offensive linemen. You do NOT draft strictly for need (oh and we needed a guard)...and it sounds wonderful to trust the coaches and GM's and the "football" guys...but that's a copout answer on a fan message board. As fans, on a fan message board, we offer our opinions. I certainly do not believe the Giants pass on Vera-Tucker or Slater if he lasted...BPA, and the most important aspect of this team, and one with many question marks, strengthens. As far as Toney, not a single post or poster mentioned any red flags, let alone his rap career until AFTER he was chosen.
Why was that? Certainly the Giants knew, and we are going to trust them...lol...but not a fan mentioned any of these red flags until after he was taken. I don't know that there were any discussions on this board about Toney before the draft because we didn't think he was in our proximity. We thought we were getting Waddle or Smith. He only entered the picture after the trade. Gates is not a "bottom dweller". If you're into rankings, even PFF ranked him the 20th overall C after one year at the position. Gates is the least of our issues. |
|
|
|
Post by snyder55 on Jun 23, 2021 15:45:53 GMT -5
teams should be aware of red flags before the draft and not after, kind of looks like somebody didn't do their homework and I don't meanToney who obviously never did his...
|
|
|
|
Post by lexington11 on Jun 23, 2021 20:26:59 GMT -5
Lmao, in true fan form. How about we let the kid play some football first? The fact that these writers are concerned about his life away from football is just ridiculous, these guys aren’t machines and believe it or not have other interests. If and when he does ball out these will be the same people saying we knew it all along. Non topic.
|
|
|
|
Post by IrishMike on Jun 23, 2021 21:44:20 GMT -5
I know it is a slow time of year but none of this shit matters. ODB was picture perfect, other than the injury, heading into his first season. Look how that ended. Sam Beal just plead guilty, Travis Rudolph murdered someone, Rosas had a hit and run, Kyle Lauletta tried to run over a cop, Chad Wheeler almost killed his girlfriend and even poor Clyde Hall at 80 got busted for cocaine.
You can't predict these things.
This will either end horribly or every person on this site will love Toney as he jukes defenders out of their minds and scores TDs. Nothing he says on twitter or does in the rap world will change any of that. At the end of the day he is a kid and is getting attacked from all angles and is trying to defend himself. He's obviously not prepared for this and needs some help. I actually feel kind of bad for him.
|
|
|
|
Post by IrishMike on Jun 23, 2021 21:49:21 GMT -5
As far as Toney, not a single post or poster mentioned any red flags, let alone his rap career until AFTER he was chosen. Why was that? I can answer that. Because it didn't effect his ability to play football in college so no one gave a damn. The same will be true if he can ball out in the NFL. No one will care about this stuff. Right now people need to generate views and judging by the pages this kid gets on the forum each tweet or article posted about him I'd say they are accomplishing their mission.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2021 1:10:35 GMT -5
BPA is the idea on how to slam drafts....we were in that position, and if the trade did not go down, Slater was the pick. Our OL is full of question marks...even our center is a bottom dweller in talent vs the rest of the league. Teams always strive to improve weaker players, and Slater would have become our most solid technician and by far, most versatile offensive linemen. You do NOT draft strictly for need (oh and we needed a guard)...and it sounds wonderful to trust the coaches and GM's and the "football" guys...but that's a copout answer on a fan message board. As fans, on a fan message board, we offer our opinions. I certainly do not believe the Giants pass on Vera-Tucker or Slater if he lasted...BPA, and the most important aspect of this team, and one with many question marks, strengthens. As far as Toney, not a single post or poster mentioned any red flags, let alone his rap career until AFTER he was chosen.
Why was that? Certainly the Giants knew, and we are going to trust them...lol...but not a fan mentioned any of these red flags until after he was taken. I don't know that there were any discussions on this board about Toney before the draft because we didn't think he was in our proximity. We thought we were getting Waddle or Smith. He only entered the picture after the trade. Gates is not a "bottom dweller". If you're into rankings, even PFF ranked him the 20th overall C after one year at the position. Gates is the least of our issues. Now you're finally admitting nobody knew about the red flags of Toney before the pick as you stated a few times...you're just repeating my point. The injuries obviously were known from a few stories before the draft, he missed games...read nothing about a music career until after. Slater was also thought of. Sewell, a tackle, was considered a trade up for....Vera-Tucker was traded up for....not sure the Giants expected that Every player can be upgraded on the OL until they can't...including our at best average center. OL still a HUGE question mark.... Gigantic roll of the dice |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2021 6:24:38 GMT -5
I don't know that there were any discussions on this board about Toney before the draft because we didn't think he was in our proximity. We thought we were getting Waddle or Smith. He only entered the picture after the trade. Gates is not a "bottom dweller". If you're into rankings, even PFF ranked him the 20th overall C after one year at the position. Gates is the least of our issues. Now you're finally admitting nobody knew about the red flags of Toney before the pick as you stated a few times...you're just repeating my point. The injuries obviously were known from a few stories before the draft, he missed games...read nothing about a music career until after. Slater was also thought of. Sewell, a tackle, was considered a trade up for....Vera-Tucker was traded up for....not sure the Giants expected that Every player can be upgraded on the OL until they can't...including our at best average center. OL still a HUGE question mark....
Gigantic roll of the diceAre you feeling lucky?? Man I hope the oline works out another top 10 pick due to their record will suck! |
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Jun 24, 2021 6:30:41 GMT -5
I don't know that there were any discussions on this board about Toney before the draft because we didn't think he was in our proximity. We thought we were getting Waddle or Smith. He only entered the picture after the trade. Gates is not a "bottom dweller". If you're into rankings, even PFF ranked him the 20th overall C after one year at the position. Gates is the least of our issues. still a HUGE question mark.... the entire offense, its players and coaches. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2021 7:20:58 GMT -5
Vegas odds - believe the experts or the fans? I'm going over 7, despite the questions around Jones and the Offensive Line Bears, we have their 1sr rounder, are also 7. NFL season wins Team, William Hill, Station Casinos, BetMGM Chiefs, 12, 12, 12 Buccaneers, 11½, 11½ , 11½ Ravens, 11, 11, 11 Packers, 11, 10½, 11 Bills, 10½, 10½, 10½ Rams, 10½, 10½, 10 49ers, 10, 10½, 10 Browns, 10, 10, 10 Colts, 10, 10, 10 Seahawks, 10, 9½, 9½ Titans, 9½, 9½, 9 Cowboys, 9½, 9½, 9 Saints, 9½, 9, 9 Chargers, 9, 9, 9 Dolphins, 9, 9, 9 Patriots, 9, 9, 9½ Steelers, 9, 8½, 8½ Vikings, 8½, 8½, 9 Washington, 8, 8, 8 Cardinals, 8, 8, 8 Raiders, 8, 7½, 7½ Panthers, 7½, 7½, 7½ Broncos, 7½, 7½, 7½ Bears, 7½, 7, 7 Falcons, 7, 7, 7½ Giants, 7, 7, 7Eagles, 7, 6½, 6½ Bengals, 6½, 6½, 6½ Jaguars, 6, 6½, 6½ Jets, 6, 6, 6 Lions, 5, 5, 5 Texans, 4½, 4½, 4½ |
|
|
|
Post by McCherry on Jun 24, 2021 10:57:20 GMT -5
I don't know that there were any discussions on this board about Toney before the draft because we didn't think he was in our proximity. We thought we were getting Waddle or Smith. He only entered the picture after the trade. Gates is not a "bottom dweller". If you're into rankings, even PFF ranked him the 20th overall C after one year at the position. Gates is the least of our issues. as you stated a few times...you're just repeating my point. The injuries obviously were known from a few stories before the draft, he missed games...read nothing about a music career until after. Slater was also thought of. Sewell, a tackle, was considered a trade up for....Vera-Tucker was traded up for....not sure the Giants expected that Every player can be upgraded on the OL until they can't...including our at best average center. OL still a HUGE question mark.... Gigantic roll of the dice You originally said nobody here knew who Toney was before we drafted him. The red flags were prominent in his draft profile, so anyone who did their research on him before the draft knew. But again, his name wasn't a big topic of conversation here. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2021 11:22:16 GMT -5
Now you're finally admitting nobody knew about the red flags of Toney before the pick as you stated a few times...you're just repeating my point. The injuries obviously were known from a few stories before the draft, he missed games...read nothing about a music career until after. Slater was also thought of. Sewell, a tackle, was considered a trade up for....Vera-Tucker was traded up for....not sure the Giants expected that Every player can be upgraded on the OL until they can't...including our at best average center. OL still a HUGE question mark.... Gigantic roll of the dice You originally said nobody here knew who Toney was before we drafted him. The red flags were prominent in his draft profile, so anyone who did their research on him before the draft knew. But again, his name wasn't a big topic of conversation here. I read every scouting report on him before the draft....everyone I could find.... and did not see anything regarding a music career. I did find some injury warnings, and might of seen an issue with the gun...but even that I believe was after we drafted him. I was actually a fan of him and what he brought on the field. |
|
|
|
Post by giantlegacy on Jun 24, 2021 11:34:00 GMT -5
You originally said nobody here knew who Toney was before we drafted him. The red flags were prominent in his draft profile, so anyone who did their research on him before the draft knew. But again, his name wasn't a big topic of conversation here. I read every scouting report on him before the draft....everyone I could find.... and did not see anything regarding a music career. I did find some injury warnings, and might of seen an issue with the gun...but even that I believe was after we drafted him. I was actually a fan of him and what he brought on the field. That's 2 of us I never really considered him though as a real possibility only because I really didn't think we would trade back and that far.. Trust me if Judge saw red flags we would have drafted someone else,he wants people in that locker room obsessed with football |
|
|
|
Post by McCherry on Jun 24, 2021 11:41:47 GMT -5
You originally said nobody here knew who Toney was before we drafted him. The red flags were prominent in his draft profile, so anyone who did their research on him before the draft knew. But again, his name wasn't a big topic of conversation here. I read every scouting report on him before the draft....everyone I could find.... and did not see anything regarding a music career. I did find some injury warnings, and might of seen an issue with the gun...but even that I believe was after we drafted him. I was actually a fan of him and what he brought on the field. His last record was released in January, so it was no secret. I don't know if I would consider a music career a "red flag" anyway. |
|
|
|
Post by Nick6475 on Jun 24, 2021 11:49:13 GMT -5
I read every scouting report on him before the draft....everyone I could find.... and did not see anything regarding a music career. I did find some injury warnings, and might of seen an issue with the gun...but even that I believe was after we drafted him. I was actually a fan of him and what he brought on the field. His last record was released in January, so it was no secret. I don't know if I would consider a music career a "red flag" anyway. I think social media and just the general access to so much information has caused the definition of a "red flag" to fall. 30-40 years ago a player only got a red flag if he had a criminal record. Now, if a player breathes in the wrong direction it's a red flag. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2021 11:54:46 GMT -5
I read every scouting report on him before the draft....everyone I could find.... and did not see anything regarding a music career. I did find some injury warnings, and might of seen an issue with the gun...but even that I believe was after we drafted him. I was actually a fan of him and what he brought on the field. His last record was released in January, so it was no secret. I don't know if I would consider a music career a "red flag" anyway. Could have been, questioning his love of the game...as it was on the Jaelan Phillips draft negatives with those major concussions and motorbike accident...love of music, commitment to football questions. I'm still trying to locate any gun red flag on the Toney scouting reports, and that too, is dry....I did scout Toney as a pick, and don't remember any red flags aside from injuries....nothing serious but nagging sorts, which could be more of a concern at times. |
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Jun 24, 2021 12:10:14 GMT -5
This isn’t true at all. Anyone who didn’t know who Toney was probably shouldn’t be posting on draft related threads. Aside from usmcvet, this board was overwhelmingly united about their approval of the trade/Toney pick. Red flags and all. You are wrong...people/fans did not know about Toney. They loved the 1 pick...they simply trusted the scouts. Many fans don't have the red flags down to a truth ...we hear gossip. Some red flags are not whispered into the wind until draft day....it's been like this for years. How long are we going to argue this today? 200 posts? 500? 5 more threads? The only issue I knew about on draft day was that he had a "legal firearm" in the back seat of his vehicle. He said he has it because people were after him. That is bad sign IMO. After the draft I heard about the rap thing etc. Was not happy that he was apparently going to divide his time. www.wcjb.com/content/news/UF-Football-Players-Caught-On-Video-Making-Threats-With-Weapons-489592621.html |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2021 12:20:29 GMT -5
You are wrong...people/fans did not know about Toney. They loved the 1 pick...they simply trusted the scouts. Many fans don't have the red flags down to a truth ...we hear gossip. Some red flags are not whispered into the wind until draft day....it's been like this for years. How long are we going to argue this today? 200 posts? 500? 5 more threads? The only issue I knew about on draft day was that he had a "legal firearm" in the back seat of his vehicle. He said he has it because people were after him. That is bad sign IMO. After the draft I heard about the rap thing etc. Was not happy that he was apparently going to divide his time. www.wcjb.com/content/news/UF-Football-Players-Caught-On-Video-Making-Threats-With-Weapons-489592621.htmlYeah, that's what I seen...actually the exact article. I did not see it that before the draft, and missed it. I certainly would have took a pass on a 1st round pick seeing that. |
|
|
|
Post by Rangers13 on Jun 24, 2021 12:42:03 GMT -5
Massive Genius
|
|
