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Post by myronguyton29 on Jan 22, 2022 22:43:22 GMT -5
Yeah, Joe Burrow is a generationally great talent that is translating it in the NFL. Daniel Jones ceiling is...well...maybe...Ryan Tannehill? You got the wrong Ryan…. It’s Ryan Fitzpatrick shit Fitzy might be better than Tannyhill lol. but both are better than Jonezy...........
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 22, 2022 22:43:24 GMT -5
Ask Mahomes how that went last Super Bowl.. This is uncharted territory lol yup. Now to be honest last week was really the first game I watched cincy a good bit and missed most of the game today but saw maybe 30 mins of it or so. So I'm not sure how Burrow is surviving and making plays if they have long developing plays and their O line is as bad or worst than ours It's not sustainable Just as I say it's not sustainable to have your defense carry a team and run a big guy up the middle all day and win 9-6...this is also just as non sustainable Burrow does show a special it factor though
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Post by kerryisdaman on Jan 23, 2022 10:58:48 GMT -5
Com’on, that’s also a rested #1 seed Tennessee playoff team. a better OC might consider shorter patterns. Burrow holds the ball forever.Exactly. They send their wideouts 20-35 yards down field. They have great receivers so I do not blame them but in our last 6 games we were scared to send anyone even 15 yards deep at times.
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Post by kerryisdaman on Jan 23, 2022 11:01:20 GMT -5
They’re both bad lines. The Bengals bad line is just good enough given their talent at QB. The amount of talent they have at QB isn’t as common as great o linemen. There’s more than one way to build a great team. The Bengals also have amazing wide receivers. Chase turns a 3 yard pass in to a 40-50 yard pass. Watching Brown on the other side catch the ball with 1 hand made me laugh thinking of all Slaton and Golladays drops with 2 hands.
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Post by mac85 on Jan 23, 2022 11:03:07 GMT -5
Yeah their line sucks difference is they win, we still lose More than just the line the whole franchise and it's mentality suck. Perhaps now we can make some headway with Shoen however it is still a rebuild so don't hold your beath for another 2-3 years Maybe!
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Post by kerryisdaman on Jan 23, 2022 11:07:21 GMT -5
It actually Defies all logic how bad that line is and they are still winning 3 elite WR's and a top TE. Probably the most dynamic group of receivers in football. Edit: We obviously agree. Mixon is a pretty good RB as well. They are loaded at skill positions so that helps overcome a horrible oline. Still if that was our team people would be complaining that they won the game with 4 field goals not tds despite 3 Tannahill ints.
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Post by kerryisdaman on Jan 23, 2022 11:09:45 GMT -5
3 elite WR's and a top TE. Probably the most dynamic group of receivers in football. *1 elite WR. One excellent/very good one. Elite is top 10. Not to mention, Chase is a rookie that you pre-draft said shouldn't be taken in the first round, as both him and Slater didnt play in the NCAA last year. So lets not forget what we started with this off-season. Jones has everything Burrows has in Golloday in Toney, we spent as much on our pair as the bengals have on theirs, no one thought Golloday was anything other than a top-10 WR, thats why no one flinched when he was given that sort of contract, you included correct?. Sorry I can't help but laugh. I do not know if you are joking or trolling but either way good one!
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Post by Kruunch on Jan 23, 2022 11:35:07 GMT -5
One team has a franchise quarterback. The other, a fugazi.. It’s well known that a great quarterback, can overcome a lot of deficiencies. Should I remind everyone we won a super bowl in 2011 with a horrid offense line? As bad as our offensive line has been over the years, we have fans who use it as a crutch.
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Post by Rangers13 on Jan 23, 2022 11:40:06 GMT -5
Com’on, that’s also a rested #1 seed Tennessee playoff team. a better OC might consider shorter patterns. Burrow holds the ball forever.Exactly. They send their wideouts 20-35 yards down field. They have great receivers so I do not blame them but in our last 6 games we were scared to send anyone even 15 yards deep at times. not sure how many Giants receivers were healthy or if the QB could throw it that far.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2022 11:41:18 GMT -5
lol yup. Now to be honest last week was really the first game I watched cincy a good bit and missed most of the game today but saw maybe 30 mins of it or so. So I'm not sure how Burrow is surviving and making plays if they have long developing plays and their O line is as bad or worst than ours It's not sustainable Just as I say it's not sustainable to have your defense carry a team and run a big guy up the middle all day and win 9-6...this is also just as non sustainable Burrow does show a special it factor though Smart and poised...does not get rattled. They are superbowl contenders once they fix the OL...
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Post by McCherry on Jan 23, 2022 12:32:19 GMT -5
3 elite WR's and a top TE. Probably the most dynamic group of receivers in football. *1 elite WR. One excellent/very good one. Elite is top 10. Not to mention, Chase is a rookie that you pre-draft said shouldn't be taken in the first round, as both him and Slater didnt play in the NCAA last year. So lets not forget what we started with this off-season. Jones has everything Burrows has in Golloday in Toney, we spent as much on our pair as the bengals have on theirs, no one thought Golloday was anything other than a top-10 WR, thats why no one flinched when he was given that sort of contract, you included correct?. If Burrows/Jones swapped places, the Bengals would be a 4 win team like the Giants. Burrows saw pressure on every snap today it appeared. Jones wouldn't last Jones doesn't have the skill to overcome the OL. I would argue he can't with more pieces, and well have to wait to see that next year I don't think you’re being serious with that comparison. The Bengals have some of the best weapons in the league, the Giants have the worst. You can't throw at a 70% completion in the NFL without open receivers. The Bengals WR's have also only missed 4 game between all three. Burrow has other advantages, like great coaching, which is at the opposite end of the spectrum as the Giants. Burrow is on another planet. To say that Jones should be throwing Burrow numbers because the Bengals also have a bad OL, Is Like saying my Honda should beat a Lamborghini in a street race because it has an engine.
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Post by thetruth on Jan 23, 2022 12:45:46 GMT -5
*1 elite WR. One excellent/very good one. Elite is top 10. Not to mention, Chase is a rookie that you pre-draft said shouldn't be taken in the first round, as both him and Slater didnt play in the NCAA last year. So lets not forget what we started with this off-season. Jones has everything Burrows has in Golloday in Toney, we spent as much on our pair as the bengals have on theirs, no one thought Golloday was anything other than a top-10 WR, thats why no one flinched when he was given that sort of contract, you included correct?. If Burrows/Jones swapped places, the Bengals would be a 4 win team like the Giants. Burrows saw pressure on every snap today it appeared. Jones wouldn't last Jones doesn't have the skill to overcome the OL. I would argue he can't with more pieces, and well have to wait to see that next year I don't think you’re being serious with that comparison. The Bengals have some of the best weapons in the league, the Giants have the worst. You can't throw at a 70% completion in the NFL without open receivers. The Bengals WR's have also only missed 4 game between all three. Burrow has other advantages, like great coaching, which is at the opposite end of the spectrum as the Giants. Burrow is on another planet. To say that Jones should be throwing Burrow numbers because the Bengals also have a bad OL, Is Like saying my Honda should beat a Lamborghini in a street race because it has an engine. Its funny how quickly things change in peoples minds lol
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Post by thetruth on Jan 23, 2022 12:49:33 GMT -5
*1 elite WR. One excellent/very good one. Elite is top 10. Not to mention, Chase is a rookie that you pre-draft said shouldn't be taken in the first round, as both him and Slater didnt play in the NCAA last year. So lets not forget what we started with this off-season. Jones has everything Burrows has in Golloday in Toney, we spent as much on our pair as the bengals have on theirs, no one thought Golloday was anything other than a top-10 WR, thats why no one flinched when he was given that sort of contract, you included correct?. Sorry I can't help but laugh. I do not know if you are joking or trolling but either way good one! Im really not. which fans here blinked when we made Kenny Golloday the #7 highest paid WR in the league. People here said it was an excellent signing? has perception changed now? #7 highest paid WR in the NFL which fans/management loved is not longer considered that level because he's played with trash can QBs? not im not convince. We have the weapons. Just not the QB. But we have Mike here saying "the Giants have the worst Weapons in the NFL", new season same story haha, despite a $70MM investment as the #7th highest paid WR in the league and a first round pick at WR. Even the first round pick wasn't enough. Hilarious The reason the Bengals produce is because of Burrow. Ultimately. We all know I love Chase, but Burrow is the reason that teams in the AFC championship. Franchise QB's improve their teams skill level. Daniel Jones is literally the opposite!
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Post by thetruth on Jan 23, 2022 12:51:26 GMT -5
If Burrows/DJ switched places, the Giants would have the "Weapons" and "Bengals", not so much, Garbage in; garbage out. Burrow would help our playmakers be exactly that. Unlike having QB's who struggle almost every single snap with basic processing
lets not make excuses for Burrows play, he is what he is despite whats around him. Shocking stuff that Giants fans unfortunately can't relate to
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Post by McCherry on Jan 23, 2022 13:02:09 GMT -5
I don't think you’re being serious with that comparison. The Bengals have some of the best weapons in the league, the Giants have the worst. You can't throw at a 70% completion in the NFL without open receivers. The Bengals WR's have also only missed 4 game between all three. Burrow has other advantages, like great coaching, which is at the opposite end of the spectrum as the Giants. Burrow is on another planet. To say that Jones should be throwing Burrow numbers because the Bengals also have a bad OL, Is Like saying my Honda should beat a Lamborghini in a street race because it has an engine. Its funny how quickly things change in peoples minds lol Golloday, Toney and Shepard may look respectable on paper, but they missed 20 games between them this season. The Bengals WR's missed a combined 4. When you judge the Giant's weapons in 2021, don't forget that you're talking about Dante Pettis, Collin Johnson and David Sills.
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Post by cdngfan on Jan 23, 2022 13:06:24 GMT -5
They’re both bad lines. The Bengals bad line is just good enough given their talent at QB. The amount of talent they have at QB isn’t as common as great o linemen. There’s more than one way to build a great team. And possibly have the best group of playmakers in the NFL.... Still not a sound way to build a team because you can't replace Burrow if he gets beat up like that all the time Completely agree. “See what a difference having a QB like Burrows makes??” I hate that line. No shit having a unbelievably talented QB fixing a lot of offensive problems. Question is how many 1st round draft picks do you realistically have to spend from when you start looking to when you finally draft a rare generational talent? Daniel Jones isn’t Burrows. Neither was Eli. In the meantime, let’s fix the line instead of trying to catch lightening in a bottle.
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Post by thetruth on Jan 23, 2022 13:06:26 GMT -5
Its funny how quickly things change in peoples minds lol Golloday, Toney and Shepard may look respectable on paper, but they missed 20 games between them this season. The Bengals WR's missed a combined 4. When you judge the Giant's weapons in 2021, don't forget that you're talking about Dante Pettis, Collin Johnson and David Sills. This would be a good excuse if the all didn't suck when they did play together. QB controls directly Golloday/Toneys targets, you look at what each of these players can do but it wont happen if you dont use them correctly. Burrows throws downfield and gives his guys shots despite a shit OL. All of the Giants QB's struggle a lot with processing. Doesn't help out their "weapons". Regarding Jones/Golloday - its a horrible pairing. Jones is a "see it throw it" kind of guy, lacks anticipation. Not a weapon problem IMO, we'll find out soon enough
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Post by DJones19 on Jan 23, 2022 13:18:40 GMT -5
*1 elite WR. One excellent/very good one. Elite is top 10. Not to mention, Chase is a rookie that you pre-draft said shouldn't be taken in the first round, as both him and Slater didnt play in the NCAA last year. So lets not forget what we started with this off-season. Jones has everything Burrows has in Golloday in Toney, we spent as much on our pair as the bengals have on theirs, no one thought Golloday was anything other than a top-10 WR, thats why no one flinched when he was given that sort of contract, you included correct?. Sorry I can't help but laugh. I do not know if you are joking or trolling but either way good one! We signed a WR coming off a 300 yard year with a busted hip who probably runs a 4.7 to a 72 million dollar contract...and drafted a WR in the 1st round who is a rapper first. The media had a good time ridiculing Gettleman's overspending but a lot of the fan base thought Joe Judge was the 2nd coming of Parcells after last season ended and were high on optimism. Burrow was a disappointing rookie year and was wearing a knee brace and walking with crutches. Last offseason Bengals fans started online petitions to get their head coach fired but their owner didn't flinch and they drafted a transformational WR. Watched a few clips of the game and I noticed Chase caught a routine 5-yard pass in the flat and took it for 60 yards. What a difference a year makes.
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Post by allnygin on Jan 23, 2022 13:23:07 GMT -5
Good QBs can help bad olines. Daniel jones HAS HAD games where he's had a pocket. "Jones is a great QB, did you see that one dime he threw on 38 attempts?!?!!, if he just had an oline we'd see his greatness, if we just got him some new weapons he'd be great" STOP, please just stop. he is simply not a good QB. Joe Borrow is a good QB though, and since everyone else wants to say Daniel Jones is a good QB without actual evidence.. I'll go ahead and say Borrow would be a better QB here in NY than Daniel Jones in the same situation.
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Post by DJones19 on Jan 23, 2022 13:27:00 GMT -5
Questionable pocket awareness on this play..Burrow had a lot of time to throw, does a weird spin and misses the guy on the flat...takes a sack.
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Post by McCherry on Jan 23, 2022 13:41:38 GMT -5
Golloday, Toney and Shepard may look respectable on paper, but they missed 20 games between them this season. The Bengals WR's missed a combined 4. When you judge the Giant's weapons in 2021, don't forget that you're talking about Dante Pettis, Collin Johnson and David Sills. This would be a good excuse if the all didn't suck when they did play together. QB controls directly Golloday/Toneys targets, you look at what each of these players can do but it wont happen if you dont use them correctly. Burrows throws downfield and gives his guys shots despite a shit OL. All of the Giants QB's struggle a lot with processing. Doesn't help out their "weapons". Regarding Jones/Golloday - its a horrible pairing. Jones is a "see it throw it" kind of guy, lacks anticipation. Not a weapon problem IMO, we'll find out soon enough I would think the top priority of the new HC/OC is to get Jones, Toney and Golloday ready for next year. Getting them in a successful training program and get them working together this offseason. The success of every new hire we make depends on this 3 more than anything. Golloday missing all of camp ruined any chance to establish chemistry. Toney has got to be an active participant this offseason. If he skips OTA's gain to focus on his rapping career, family or whatever the excuse, that's going to spell doom for him with a new staff.
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Martin
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Post by Martin on Jan 23, 2022 13:42:15 GMT -5
Lets see how Burrow does against either the Bills or the Chiefs. I don't think its gonna work out to well for him.
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Post by thetruth on Jan 23, 2022 13:47:01 GMT -5
This would be a good excuse if the all didn't suck when they did play together. QB controls directly Golloday/Toneys targets, you look at what each of these players can do but it wont happen if you dont use them correctly. Burrows throws downfield and gives his guys shots despite a shit OL. All of the Giants QB's struggle a lot with processing. Doesn't help out their "weapons". Regarding Jones/Golloday - its a horrible pairing. Jones is a "see it throw it" kind of guy, lacks anticipation. Not a weapon problem IMO, we'll find out soon enough I would think the top priority of the new HC/OC is to get Jones, Toney and Golloday ready for next year. Getting them in a successful training program and get them working together this offseason. The success of every new hire we make depends on this 3 more than anything. Golloday missing all of camp ruined any chance to establish chemistry. Toney has got to be an active participant this offseason. If he skips OTA's gain to focus on his rapping career, family or whatever the excuse, that's going to spell doom for him with a new staff. As much as I didn't like the Toney pick i've NEVER seen a WR move like him. Happy to eat the crow in that pick, I think hes going to be fantastic I would love Daboll or someone with an offensive mind to get his hands on him. We need Toney to stay healthy, but he has limitless potential. Mike Renner on PFF said he's the the most elusive runner in space in the NFL. Including Tyreek, based on their numbers. When I say we have weapons im factoring all this in. I really am blown away watching Toney's tape. Thats Dallas game we used him right, need to do that consistently, and they will.
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Post by Rangers13 on Jan 23, 2022 13:51:47 GMT -5
Questionable pocket awareness on this play..Burrow had a lot of time to throw, does a weird spin and misses the guy on the flat...takes a sack. difference in the game were the Tenny turnovers.
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Post by Kruunch on Jan 23, 2022 13:55:26 GMT -5
Lets see how Burrow does against either the Bills or the Chiefs. I don't think its gonna work out to well for him. He’s already playing with house money. He got a Bengals team to the AFC championship game in only his second season. Last time they got this far, Ronald Reagan was President. And the DeLorean was still seen on the roads.
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Post by McCherry on Jan 23, 2022 13:55:55 GMT -5
I would think the top priority of the new HC/OC is to get Jones, Toney and Golloday ready for next year. Getting them in a successful training program and get them working together this offseason. The success of every new hire we make depends on this 3 more than anything. Golloday missing all of camp ruined any chance to establish chemistry. Toney has got to be an active participant this offseason. If he skips OTA's gain to focus on his rapping career, family or whatever the excuse, that's going to spell doom for him with a new staff. As much as I didn't like the Toney pick i've NEVER seen a WR move like him. Happy to eat the crow in that pick, I think hes going to be fantastic I would love Daboll or someone with an offensive mind to get his hands on him. We need Toney to stay healthy, but he has limitless potential. Mike Renner on PFF said he's the the most elusive runner in space in the NFL. Including Tyreek, based on their numbers. When I say we have weapons im factoring all this in. I really am blown away watching Toney's tape. Thats Dallas game we used him right, need to do that consistently, and they will. I thought when healthy, Toney looked as good as any of the rookie WR's taken before him. Whether he takes his career seriously and pushes himself to the next level is something else entirely. Again, the top priority of the new HC/OC are Golloday/Toney. We need another WR and a TE, but the offense only goes as far as those two.
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 23, 2022 13:58:41 GMT -5
I would think the top priority of the new HC/OC is to get Jones, Toney and Golloday ready for next year. Getting them in a successful training program and get them working together this offseason. The success of every new hire we make depends on this 3 more than anything. Golloday missing all of camp ruined any chance to establish chemistry. Toney has got to be an active participant this offseason. If he skips OTA's gain to focus on his rapping career, family or whatever the excuse, that's going to spell doom for him with a new staff. As much as I didn't like the Toney pick i've NEVER seen a WR move like him. Happy to eat the crow in that pick, I think hes going to be fantastic I would love Daboll or someone with an offensive mind to get his hands on him. We need Toney to stay healthy, but he has limitless potential. Mike Renner on PFF said he's the the most elusive runner in space in the NFL. Including Tyreek, based on their numbers. When I say we have weapons im factoring all this in. I really am blown away watching Toney's tape. Thats Dallas game we used him right, need to do that consistently, and they will. Remember symptoms... We had a geriatric prehistoric play to get to 3rd and short plodding system that made all our weapons square pegs.... Dabol,Taylor,ect.... Come up with game plans and a system for each player that best utilizes their abilities That is a start...
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Post by Zimonami on Jan 23, 2022 14:09:09 GMT -5
The difference between them and us is Jones on the run... and when he runs right he cuts ooff his vision of half the field. Burrows is doing what Eli did... stand in there and take your licks. Burrows sacked 9 times. reminded me of when SF hit Eli over 30 times in the 2011 playoff game. You have to stand in there and use every last second to complete as much of your progressions as possible and get rid of the ball as fast as possible when you sense the rush. If that's only 2 seconds, so be it. DJ senses the pressure and takes off or makes a bad decision to get rid of it quick and makes a bad pass. He's always been able to use his legs to get out of trouble in HS and college. Can't do that in the NFL. Once the line improves I hope he can learn to be a QB, and not a scared scrambler. With a good line I think he'll be a very good QB. He's accurate and smart. But, not nearly as smart as someone like Brady, who despite having a much better line gets rid the the ball very quickly. He comes to the line, sees the D, and knows immediately who his most likely best target will be. Ball is snapped and when Brady is right the ball is out to that man in no time. DJ can't do that... yet. Eli always could read D's, too. It took Simms 4-5 years to learn to read defenses. When he finally did the line was much improved and it all came together for the Gmen back then. I hope DJ can get better because we can't afford to be using a high pick for another QB.
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Post by allnygin on Jan 23, 2022 14:18:55 GMT -5
The difference between them and us is Jones on the run... and when he runs right he cuts ooff his vision of half the field. Burrows is doing what Eli did... stand in there and take your licks. Burrows sacked 9 times. reminded me of when SF hit Eli over 30 times in the 2011 playoff game. You have to stand in there and use every last second to complete as much of your progressions as possible and get rid of the ball as fast as possible when you sense the rush. If that's only 2 seconds, so be it. DJ senses the pressure and takes off or makes a bad decision to get rid of it quick and makes a bad pass. He's always been able to use his legs to get out of trouble in HS and college. Can't do that in the NFL. Once the line improves I hope he can learn to be a QB, and not a scared scrambler. With a good line I think he'll be a very good QB. He's accurate and smart. But, not nearly as smart as someone like Brady, who despite having a much better line gets rid the the ball very quickly. He comes to the line, sees the D, and knows immediately who his most likely best target will be. Ball is snapped and when Brady is right the ball is out to that man in no time. DJ can't do that... yet. Eli always could read D's, too. It took Simms 4-5 years to learn to read defenses. When he finally did the line was much improved and it all came together for the Gmen back then. I hope DJ can get better because we can't afford to be using a high pick for another QB.Unfortunately, we'll likely have to, bc the team won't be able to give him a second contract either (or at least they shouldn't). Daniel Jones being selected by DG has likely put us in QB hell, although we were heading in that direction to begin with. Hopefully, Joe is as smart as experts are saying he is and figures it out. Between the oline, DJ, no cap and everything else this man really has his work cut out for him
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Martin
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Post by Martin on Jan 23, 2022 14:21:38 GMT -5
Lets see how Burrow does against either the Bills or the Chiefs. I don't think its gonna work out to well for him. He’s already playing with house money. He got a Bengals team to the AFC championship game in only his second season. Last time they got this far, Ronald Reagan was President. And the DeLorean was still seen on the roads. Funny shit! At this point the city of Cincinnati is already making plans to build a statue for this kid. Doesn't take too much in that town.
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