giantsalmon
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Came over from a defunct board. Formerly LakeO Giant fan
Posts: 3,901
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Post by giantsalmon on Mar 11, 2024 19:48:11 GMT -5
Thank you all for the opinions, insight, and sometimes downright hilarity. I've enjoyed this thread and the humorous banter. Some observations: This is what many of us have been waiting for-- for Daboll and Schoen to start putting their own stamp on this organization. Yes, solid players from the last admin had to walk. We would've lost our minds if NYG matched the money 26 and X got. At least X went to a classy organization outside the division. I do not understand some of the snickers NYG got for signing Singletary. I for one, hoped this would happen. Why? I saw every snap he played for Buffalo. I dont care about his size--he plays MUCH bigger. He's tough as nails, does not shy away from contact, can pass block, and is excellent in the pass game. For a small guy he doesnt go down easy and I would say hes at least as good as 26 in short yardage situations. He is a great teammate and locker room guy. I also dont understand why its looked down on because he played under Daboll for several years. The fact that Daboll and Schoen wanted him again says alot--trust! Smart, tough and dependable? Absolutely. Whats missed in all of this is when you assume a roster with a big name star(which the team spent a number 2 draft pick on) there is not only an expectation of a certain amount of touches but it shackles what style of offense the new admin may have wanted to conduct. In our teams case, this was exacerbated by salary cap issues and roster limitations. I love bolstering the O line without spending stupid money. The Burns acquisition speaks for itself. Stellar! I have full faith in Schoen and Daboll and look forward to the rest of the FA season and the draft.
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miggs
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Posts: 4,222
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Post by miggs on Mar 11, 2024 19:49:50 GMT -5
Why do you waste your time? Because it's a joyous day for Giants fans... and Schoen. I want to kick the teeth in of the 49ers/Eagles fan who has been shitting on the lord and savior Joe Schoen for a long time. Probably a good idea to remind Miggs that he called Schoen "the biggest idiot to trade Toney for a 3rd round pick because Toney is going to become an All Pro with KC." Toney was good, but doesn't have his head on right. He still might turn his career around. Does have two SB rings. Not good that Wallef missed games last season and may not play for Giants this year. If that happens one can hardly say it's a good trade for the Giants. . Do like Hawkins who was the sixth pick the Giants received in the trade and he has potential.
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Post by piddy283 on Mar 11, 2024 19:50:09 GMT -5
A nice little nugget to keep in mind, the fact we traded for Burns and he wasn’t a FA acquisition means his contract doesn’t impact any potential comp picks we might receive for Barkley and McKinney.
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miggs
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Posts: 4,222
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Post by miggs on Mar 11, 2024 19:52:05 GMT -5
A nice little nugget to keep in mind, the fact we traded for Burns and he wasn’t a FA acquisition means his contract doesn’t impact any potential comp picks we might receive for Barkley and McKinney. Good point. Would Giants get comp Picks in up-coming draft?
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 11, 2024 19:53:03 GMT -5
Because it's a joyous day for Giants fans... and Schoen. I want to kick the teeth in of the 49ers/Eagles fan who has been shitting on the lord and savior Joe Schoen for a long time. Probably a good idea to remind Miggs that he called Schoen "the biggest idiot to trade Toney for a 3rd round pick because Toney is going to become an All Pro with KC." Toney was good, but doesn't have his head on right. He still might turn his career around. Does have two SB rings. Not good that Wallef missed games last season and may not play for Giants this year. If that happens one can hardly say it's a good trade for the Giants. . Do like Hawkins who was the sixth pick the Giants received in the trade and he has potential. Toney sucks. Charlie Batch also has two SB rings. You're still a ****ing idiot.
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Post by piddy283 on Mar 11, 2024 19:56:32 GMT -5
A nice little nugget to keep in mind, the fact we traded for Burns and he wasn’t a FA acquisition means his contract doesn’t impact any potential comp picks we might receive for Barkley and McKinney. Good point. Would Giants get comp Picks in up-coming draft? No. As far as I’m aware comp picks are awarded the next year.
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miggs
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Posts: 4,222
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Post by miggs on Mar 11, 2024 19:57:34 GMT -5
Toney was good, but doesn't have his head on right. He still might turn his career around. Does have two SB rings. Not good that Wallef missed games last season and may not play for Giants this year. If that happens one can hardly say it's a good trade for the Giants. . Do like Hawkins who was the sixth pick the Giants received in the trade and he has potential. Toney sucks. Charlie Batch also has two SB rings. You're still a ****ing idiot. We're talking about the trade knucklehead, ot Toney. If Waller retires there's no reason to say it's a good trade as Waller's days with the Giants are over plus some say he will be cut post June 1st. If that happens the Giants will have lost a 1st round drafted player for very little in return.
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 11, 2024 20:15:02 GMT -5
Toney sucks. Charlie Batch also has two SB rings. You're still a ****ing idiot. We're talking about the trade knucklehead, ot Toney. If Waller retires there's no reason to say it's a good trade as Waller's days with the Giants are over plus some say he will be cut post June 1st. If that happens the Giants will have lost a 1st round drafted player for very little in return. We're talking about Toney. And your support of him as being a "2 time SB winner" and "1st round pick." Charlie Batch is a 2 time SB winner Jamarcus Russell was the #1 overall pick. Both are incredible, right?
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Post by NAVY2323(ret) on Mar 11, 2024 20:55:09 GMT -5
I think the entirety of day 1 is a big win. SB and McKinney got contracts I wouldn’t wanted them to have received from us. We will now get solid level compensation picks for them. When you add Burns to the other work for the day, it’s huge for this team.
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miggs
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Posts: 4,222
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Post by miggs on Mar 11, 2024 21:00:07 GMT -5
We're talking about the trade knucklehead, ot Toney. If Waller retires there's no reason to say it's a good trade as Waller's days with the Giants are over plus some say he will be cut post June 1st. If that happens the Giants will have lost a 1st round drafted player for very little in return. We're talking about Toney. And your support of him as being a "2 time SB winner" and "1st round pick." Charlie Batch is a 2 time SB winner Jamarcus Russell was the #1 overall pick. Both are incredible, right? You brought up Toney in terms of the trade knucklehead. That's what I responded to. You'd be better off staying in the present as free agents are being signed.
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 11, 2024 21:20:31 GMT -5
You'd be better off staying in the present Says the one who can only revert to 2022 and 2019 in defense of Daniel Jones. Oh and 1983 and Bill Walsh. You're entertaining to say the least.
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Post by Analyst on Mar 11, 2024 21:37:38 GMT -5
John Runyan got a 3 year 30M deal?
Wow. That ain't cheap.
I'm guessing he plays LG.
And the other dude with the weird name from the Raiders plays RT? And Neal gets traded or cut?
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 11, 2024 21:40:48 GMT -5
John Runyan got a 3 year 30M deal? Wow. That ain't cheap. I'm guessing he plays LG. And the other dude with the weird name from the Raiders plays RT? And Neal gets traded or cut? Why would you cut someone on a rookie deal? Eluemunor can play guard or OT. He's our swing. My guess is he plays inside and Neal has OTAs and training camp to (hopefully) get real OL coaching and reach his potential at RT.
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Post by Analyst on Mar 11, 2024 21:44:46 GMT -5
John Runyan got a 3 year 30M deal? Wow. That ain't cheap. I'm guessing he plays LG. And the other dude with the weird name from the Raiders plays RT? And Neal gets traded or cut? Why would you cut someone on a rookie deal? Eluemunor can play guard or OT. He's our swing. My guess is he plays inside and Neal has OTAs and training camp to (hopefully) get real OL coaching and reach his potential at RT. I was joking about Neal, he just sucks so far in his career and I get mad when I'm flipping burgers thinking about it. As for Jermaine, he played RT and some LT from what I heard in 2023. Mostly RT. When was the last time he played guard?
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 11, 2024 21:48:48 GMT -5
Why would you cut someone on a rookie deal? Eluemunor can play guard or OT. He's our swing. My guess is he plays inside and Neal has OTAs and training camp to (hopefully) get real OL coaching and reach his potential at RT. I was joking about Neal, he just sucks so far in his career and I get mad when I'm flipping burgers thinking about it. As for Jermaine, he played RT and some LT from what I heard in 2023. Mostly RT. When was the last time he played guard? "For his career, Eluemunor has played 1,861 snaps at right tackle, 534 snaps at right guard, 421 snaps at left tackle, and 11 snaps at left guard"
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 11, 2024 21:50:34 GMT -5
"2023 performance Good pass-blocking numbers In terms of pressures allowed, Eluemunor appeared to perform well as a pass blocker in 2023. Pro Football Focus charged Eluemunor with allowing 28 total pressures on 552 pass-blocking snaps, a pressure rate of 5.1% that ranked 26th-best among 83 qualified tackles (min. 200 pass-blocking snaps). That puts him at the 70th percentile among qualifiers.
To Eluemunor’s credit, he pulled that off in a Raiders offense that asked slightly more of its offensive linemen than the average team. Eluemunor dropped into a true pass set (excludes plays with fewer than 4 rushers, play action, screens, short drop backs, and throws under 2 seconds) on 49.1% of his pass-blocking snaps, ranking 22nd out of 83 qualifiers.
Thanks to his above-average true pass set frequency, Eluemunor fares even better in adjusted protection metrics. His net pressure rate (which compares his pressure rate versus what he’d be expected to allow when accounting for his rate of true pass sets) was -1.6%, which ranked 20th. That’s six spots better than his standard pressure rate."
"Better at right tackle Eluemunor allowed seven pressures on 78 pass-blocking snaps (9.0%) in his two starts at left tackle. At right tackle, Eluemunor only allowed 21 pressures on 474 pass-blocking snaps (4.4%). That would’ve ranked 14th-best out of 83 qualified tackles.
If you want to cherry-pick even further, Eluemunor only allowed 13 pressures on 430 pass-blocking snaps across his 13 games at right tackle outside of the Mack game. That’s a 3.3% pressure rate, which would’ve ranked third-best (slightly ahead of Tyron Smith)."
"Good run-blocking to boot On top of his solid numbers in pass protection, Eluemunor generated solid production in the run game.
Eluemunor earned a 71.5 run-blocking grade from PFF, which ranked 23rd out of 83 qualifiers. SIS agrees that Eluemunor was a good run-blocker, giving him the ninth-lowest blown block rate among tackles (0.9%).
Kept penalties fairly low Eluemunor was called for five penalties on 905 offensive snaps, giving him an average of 5.5 penalties per 1,000 snaps that ranked 27th-lowest out of 70 qualified tackles. The position average was 7.3."
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 11, 2024 21:52:11 GMT -5
"Comparing 2023 performance to previous track record
At least based on the statistics that we have at our disposal, Eluemunor’s 2023 season was largely a continuation of the success he had in 2022. It marked his second consecutive year of good statistical production.
In 2022, Eluemunor’s pressure rate (4.5%) and run-blocking grade (75.7) were both even better than the marks he posted in 2023. The only area where he performed worse was the penalty department, as he was flagged 10 times (10.6 per 1,000 snaps).
Before 2022, Eluemunor’s career pressure rate was still fairly good at 4.7%, although he played a sizable chunk of his snaps at guard, where the positional average is lower. It’s in the run game where Eluemunor’s numbers took the biggest leap over the last two years. His career-high in run-blocking grade was only 63.4 before 2022.
Considering the impressiveness of Eluemunor’s numbers over the past two years, one glaring question emerges to the forefront: are these numbers legit?
If Eluemunor was so good in 2022, why did the free-agent market determine he was only worth a one-year, $3 million deal?
Eluemunor’s numbers are undoubtedly strong, but their legitimacy is in question. The way Eluemunor has been valued by his team and the league does not align with who the numbers say he is.
Scheme fit
The 330-pound Eluemunor has a background that almost exclusively lies with teams who are known for running power/gap schemes. He was drafted by the Ravens, spent two seasons with the Patriots, and then played under former Patriots coach Josh McDaniels with the Raiders.
The Raiders’ run scheme asked Eluemunor to lean a bit closer toward gap-blocking plays than the league average. Eluemunor had a 1.03-to-1 ratio of zone plays to gap plays in 2023, whereas the league average for tackles was 1.22-to-1. Basically, the Raiders were split nearly dead-even between both styles while most teams have an approximate 55%/45% split in favor of zone.
In 2022, Eluemunor was one of the heaviest gap-leaning tackles in the league with a 0.5-to-1 ratio of zone plays to gap plays.
However, McDaniels was the man behind Las Vegas’ power-running philosophies. After McDaniels was fired in Week 8 of this past season, the Raiders instantly transformed their run scheme under interim offensive coordinator Bo Hardegree.
With McDaniels as the head coach from Weeks 1-8, Eluemunor had the exact same zone-to-gap ratio that he had in 2022: 0.5-to-1. Following the ouster of McDaniels, Eluemunor’s zone-to-gap ratio was 1.47-to-1 over the rest of the season, which is even more zone-heavy than the league average.
The change seemed to benefit Eluemunor. Over the final nine weeks, PFF scored Eluemunor with a 72.4 run-blocking grade on zone plays and a 62.2 grade on gap plays. Before the coaching change, Eluemunor was doing better on gap plays (54.3 zone, 68.6 gap).
Durability
Eluemunor missed eight games in his rookie season, including the final six games of the year with a shoulder injury. After that, Eluemunor’s career game log includes a lot of DNPs due to him being inactive, although it appears he only missed four games due to injury from 2018-23. This includes one game due to illness in 2019 and three games due to ankle injury in 2020. He has not missed a game due to injury since Week 9 of 2020."
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southerner
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Bearer of Bad News
Posts: 4,220
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Post by southerner on Mar 11, 2024 21:52:47 GMT -5
1. Gunner Olszewsk, WR 2. Jon Runyan G
3. Devin Singletary, RB 4. Brian Burns, LB
5. Jermaine Eluemunor, OT
This might be the best free agent season I have ever seen……..and I go back to the Fran Tarkenton days…….Brian Burns is massive. Devin Singletary is an all-purpose back…….and we have a REAL RT, so we can bump Alabama boy inside…..this looks like a Parcell’s team.
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 11, 2024 21:54:05 GMT -5
1. Gunner Olszewsk, WR 2. Jon Runyan G
3. Devin Singletary, RB 4. Brian Burns, LB
5. Jermaine Eluemunor, OT
This might be the best free agent season I have ever seen……..and I go back to the Fran Tarkenton days…….Brian Burns is massive. Devin Singletary is an all-purpose back…….and we have a REAL RT, so we can bump Alabama boy inside…..this looks like a Parcell’s team. So Schoen isn't going to get fired before the draft? Whew!
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miggs
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Posts: 4,222
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Post by miggs on Mar 11, 2024 21:56:13 GMT -5
You'd be better off staying in the present Says the one who can only revert to 2022 and 2019 in defense of Daniel Jones. Oh and 1983 and Bill Walsh. You're entertaining to say the least. I'm use to see good football, you're not. Bill Walsh was a great HC. You're clueless about how bad coaches hurt players. That's what happened with Jones. Try to stay engaged in the present instead of taking cheap shots. Good to see Schoen finish the day a lot stronger than he started. He is prortizing the right positions, but he still has a long way to go.
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 11, 2024 21:57:57 GMT -5
Says the one who can only revert to 2022 and 2019 in defense of Daniel Jones. Oh and 1983 and Bill Walsh. You're entertaining to say the least. I'm use to see good football, you're not. Bill Walsh was a great HC. You're clueless about how bad coaches hurt players. That's what happened with Jones. Try to stay engaged in the present instead of taking cheap shots. You wouldn't know what good football was even if it was wrapped in a scrotum and teabagging your eyes.
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miggs
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Post by miggs on Mar 11, 2024 22:00:15 GMT -5
I'm use to see good football, you're not. Bill Walsh was a great HC. You're clueless about how bad coaches hurt players. That's what happened with Jones. Try to stay engaged in the present instead of taking cheap shots. You wouldn't know what good football was even if it was wrapped in a scrotum and teabagging your eyes. I said the Giants would win in 2022, few here did.
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Post by Morehead State on Mar 11, 2024 22:01:55 GMT -5
You wouldn't know what good football was even if it was wrapped in a scrotum and teabagging your eyes. I said the Giants would win in 2022, few here did. The sad thing is that you think 9-7-1 and a humiliating playoff loss in Philly is...."winning".
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 11, 2024 22:02:11 GMT -5
You wouldn't know what good football was even if it was wrapped in a scrotum and teabagging your eyes. I said the Giants would win in 2022, few here did. You said they'd win in 2023 also.
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miggs
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Posts: 4,222
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Post by miggs on Mar 11, 2024 22:05:07 GMT -5
I said the Giants would win in 2022, few here did. You said they'd win in 2023 also. True. That's because I thought Schoen would fix the OL that I called for and I foresee OL injuries. My bad.
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miggs
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Post by miggs on Mar 11, 2024 22:07:50 GMT -5
I said the Giants would win in 2022, few here did. The sad thing is that you think 9-7-1 and a humiliating playoff loss in Philly is...."winning". Yes, the Giants making the playoffs and beating Minnesota is a big win, espectial since Giants were coming off a 4 win prior season. You should too, but hey you're a NYer.
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Post by Morehead State on Mar 11, 2024 22:11:53 GMT -5
The sad thing is that you think 9-7-1 and a humiliating playoff loss in Philly is...."winning". Yes, the Giants making the playoffs and beating Minnesota is a big win, espectial since Giants were coming off a 4 win prior season. You should too, but hey you're a NYer. I've been a Giants fan since 1967. I've seen it all. Nothing I've seen since our 2011 SB win represents anything close to.....winning. Rejoicing after a 9-7 season, most wins against bad football teams...is a sad moment indeed. I guess that's where we are these days. But of course you're not a Giants fan so you wouldn't understand.
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miggs
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Post by miggs on Mar 11, 2024 22:17:24 GMT -5
Yes, the Giants making the playoffs and beating Minnesota is a big win, espectial since Giants were coming off a 4 win prior season. You should too, but hey you're a NYer. I've been a Giants fan since 1967. I've seen it all. Nothing I've seen since our 2011 SB win represents anything close to.....winning. Rejoicing after a 9-7 season, most wins against bad football teams...is a sad moment indeed. I guess that's where we are these days. But of course you're not a Giants fan so you wouldn't understand. You don't even praise the Giants after so many bad seasons. And you call yourself a Giants fan?
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Post by bigbluerekncrew on Mar 11, 2024 22:25:48 GMT -5
And now, crickets…. Oh the days of dumpster diving in FA are back baby! lol The only thing more premature than your post would be me with Mila Kunis. My post was hours ago but it’s nice to know I’m still in your head rent free. Run along now kid…
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Post by repeatchamps on Mar 11, 2024 22:29:16 GMT -5
Thank you all for the opinions, insight, and sometimes downright hilarity. I've enjoyed this thread and the humorous banter. Some observations: This is what many of us have been waiting for-- for Daboll and Schoen to start putting their own stamp on this organization. Yes, solid players from the last admin had to walk. We would've lost our minds if NYG matched the money 26 and X got. At least X went to a classy organization outside the division. I do not understand some of the snickers NYG got for signing Singletary. I for one, hoped this would happen. Why? I saw every snap he played for Buffalo. I dont care about his size--he plays MUCH bigger. He's tough as nails, does not shy away from contact, can pass block, and is excellent in the pass game. For a small guy he doesnt go down easy and I would say hes at least as good as 26 in short yardage situations. He is a great teammate and locker room guy. I also dont understand why its looked down on because he played under Daboll for several years. The fact that Daboll and Schoen wanted him again says alot--trust! Smart, tough and dependable? Absolutely. Whats missed in all of this is when you assume a roster with a big name star(which the team spent a number 2 draft pick on) there is not only an expectation of a certain amount of touches but it shackles what style of offense the new admin may have wanted to conduct. In our teams case, this was exacerbated by salary cap issues and roster limitations. I love bolstering the O line without spending stupid money. The Burns acquisition speaks for itself. Stellar! I have full faith in Schoen and Daboll and look forward to the rest of the FA season and the draft. 100% agree with everything mentioned. I like the idea of still signing CB Darius Williams once I heard they brought him in for a visit. Would be a nice fit now that I read up on him so hope they can squeeze him in somehow still. Also love the idea of complimenting Singletary with Boston Scott if he can be brought in on the cheap. Losing X man hurts but I think we need to trust Bowen's input and assume they have a plan at Safety that ties into Bowen's feedback. Bowen is a proven successful defensive coordinator and we have to trust his judgment and whatever feedback he provided to the appropriate folks on X man.
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