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Post by believernyg10 on Jun 18, 2018 10:56:07 GMT -5
New York Giants:
Letting Jerry Reese linger
The New York Giants won the Super Bowl in Jerry Reese's first season as the team's general manager, and then they did it again four years later. That bought Reese a hell of a lot of rope. Too much rope, in fact. Reese dropped the ball time and again in the seasons that followed that 2011 championship. He drafted just two Pro Bowlers (Beckham and Collins) in seven years, while first-rounders David Wilson, Justin Pugh, Eli Apple and Ereck Flowers have already either gone bust or are in the process of doing so. He continually tried and failed to rebuild the offensive line and running game, didn't do enough to support quarterback Eli Manning, wasted money on Brandon Myers and Dwayne Harris when the team was taking a conservative approach in free agency (and then overcompensated by desperately overpaying Olivier Vernon and Janoris Jenkins when the first strategy didn't work), and let Martellus Bennett walk in his prime. Oh, and he hired Ben McAdoo as head coach. Enough said. Reese should have been gone after a second consecutive losing season in 2014, but he lingered until this past season. bleacherreport.com/articles/2780953-every-nfl-teams-biggest-mistake-of-the-past-decade#slide0
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Post by Delicreep on Jun 18, 2018 11:44:40 GMT -5
Wow...that one seems unfair on a number of fronts.
1) Reese did not hire McAdoo
2) SB, losing season, losing season = fired seems like 20/20 hindsight to me.
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Post by JoeBigBlue on Jun 18, 2018 12:04:15 GMT -5
Yeah, at least be fair and get the facts straight. Reese didn't hire McDoofus.
Ehh.....the Giants biggest mistake was not letting Reese go when TC went, therefore beginning the dreaded 2 year Mcdoofus era and prolonging Reese's tenure.
I was no fan of Reese, but McAdope was the bigger mistake in a way.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2018 12:10:39 GMT -5
The reasoning is completely off as mentioned above.
But letting Reese completely fail as a personnel evaluator and GM for so long is the biggest mistake.
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Post by Fletch842 on Jun 18, 2018 12:13:16 GMT -5
Yeah, at least be fair and get the facts straight. Reese didn't hire McDoofus. Ehh.....the Giants biggest mistake was not letting Reese go when TC went, therefore beginning the dreaded 2 year Mcdoofus era and prolonging Reese's tenure. I was no fan of Reese, but McAdope was the bigger mistake in a way. bout sums it up!! |
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Post by GameTime on Jun 18, 2018 12:24:36 GMT -5
New York Giants:
Letting Jerry Reese linger
The New York Giants won the Super Bowl in Jerry Reese's first season as the team's general manager, and then they did it again four years later. That bought Reese a hell of a lot of rope. Too much rope, in fact. Reese dropped the ball time and again in the seasons that followed that 2011 championship. He drafted just two Pro Bowlers (Beckham and Collins) in seven years, while first-rounders David Wilson, Justin Pugh, Eli Apple and Ereck Flowers have already either gone bust or are in the process of doing so. He continually tried and failed to rebuild the offensive line and running game, didn't do enough to support quarterback Eli Manning, wasted money on Brandon Myers and Dwayne Harris when the team was taking a conservative approach in free agency (and then overcompensated by desperately overpaying Olivier Vernon and Janoris Jenkins when the first strategy didn't work), and let Martellus Bennett walk in his prime. Oh, and he hired Ben McAdoo as head coach. Enough said. Reese should have been gone after a second consecutive losing season in 2014, but he lingered until this past season. bleacherreport.com/articles/2780953-every-nfl-teams-biggest-mistake-of-the-past-decade#slide0 I agree he was around too long but Wilson got a career ending injury, Apple still will probably pan out, and Pugh is a good player. No busts there at all imo |
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Post by KingCap88 on Jun 18, 2018 12:33:49 GMT -5
Letting JR and TC linger was the biggest mistake. Both should have been shown the door at the same time. But the decision to hold onto a GM and HC for too long ultimately falls on Mara. Loyalty is a good thing until it starts to work against your best interests.
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Post by TEM on Jun 18, 2018 12:36:03 GMT -5
Wow...that one seems unfair on a number of fronts. 1) Reese did not hire McAdoo 2) SB, losing season, losing season = fired seems like 20/20 hindsight to me. I agree both good points . you just don't fire a GM the won 2 because a few losing seasons. |
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Post by JoeyCush on Jun 18, 2018 13:44:34 GMT -5
Letting JR and TC linger was the biggest mistake. Both should have been shown the door at the same time. But the decision to hold onto a GM and HC for too long ultimately falls on Mara. Loyalty is a good thing until it starts to work against your best interests. I love Tom Coughlin and wish we still had him in the building somehow but there were too many seasons when December rolled by I was thinking "its time for a change". Firing Coughlin after 2015 and ONLY Coughlin was such a big mistake. Just saying Tom was the problem all along and we are going to hire a HC within as well as letting Reese hang around was gross to watch. I'm happy the current regime blew everything the hell up. |
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Post by KingCap88 on Jun 18, 2018 16:52:46 GMT -5
Letting JR and TC linger was the biggest mistake. Both should have been shown the door at the same time. But the decision to hold onto a GM and HC for too long ultimately falls on Mara. Loyalty is a good thing until it starts to work against your best interests. I love Tom Coughlin and wish we still had him in the building somehow but there were too many seasons when December rolled by I was thinking "its time for a change". Firing Coughlin after 2015 and ONLY Coughlin was such a big mistake. Just saying Tom was the problem all along and we are going to hire a HC within as well as letting Reese hang around was gross to watch. I'm happy the current regime blew everything the hell up. I always had a feeling that JR got spared when TC was let go because Mara wasn't ready to change HC and GM at the same time. Plus, JR may have convinced him that he never got a chance to hire his own HC and that may have played a role too. But after the debacle of 2017, Mara couldn't justify not blowing things up and getting rid of JR and BM. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2018 17:09:19 GMT -5
For the Giants I would say it’s the Left Tackle position. They skimped on it for years and years and then when they finally drafted a kid, they picked a bust. There was really very little attempt to sort out the LT position long term until spending the pick on Flowers. Busting on that pick was then multiple nails in the coffin for this team.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 18, 2018 17:24:35 GMT -5
I absolutely agree with that, I was clamoring for Reese to be fired 2-3 years sooner than he was. Coughlin was also let around too long because of the 2 SBs, unfortunately in the case of his firing the Giants made fools of themselves replacing him with McAdont.
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Post by believernyg10 on Jun 18, 2018 18:15:41 GMT -5
Wow...that one seems unfair on a number of fronts. 1) Reese did not hire McAdoo 2) SB, losing season, losing season = fired seems like 20/20 hindsight to me. 1) Reese absolutely DID hire McAdoo. That's why McAdoo stated "We're tied at the hip" and both were fired at the exact same time. |
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Post by Roosevelt on Jun 18, 2018 20:39:22 GMT -5
Wow...that one seems unfair on a number of fronts. 1) Reese did not hire McAdoo 2) SB, losing season, losing season = fired seems like 20/20 hindsight to me. 1) Reese absolutely DID hire McAdoo. That's why McAdoo stated "We're tied at the hip" and both were fired at the exact same time.
No chance. The last and probably only Giants GM to hire his own coaches was George Young. Wellington hired TC (against the wishes of JM and EA), and John hired McAdoo and now Shurmur. I read somewhere that Reese wanted someone else over McAdoo.
But I'd say Our biggest mistake was McAdoo.
The fact is Reese helped us win 2 Super Bowls. There's no way he was the biggest mistake in the last 10 years. Clearly the writer is unqualified to speak about the Giants. |
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BigBlue58
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Post by BigBlue58 on Jun 19, 2018 8:12:56 GMT -5
Sorry, but the positives of Reese, at the time he was let go, is the real hindsight in this topic!!! I think it’s comical that people could actually try to make an argument, that Reese was somehow railroaded or scapegoated, considering all the units on the team he allowed to erode since SB46!!! I also find it ironic, that the 2 SB’s won with Reese as GM, buys him more benefit of the doubt and good will to some, than Eli, who happened to be the MVP of those two SB’s! Ironic of course, because it’s Reese, whose missteps AS GM since 2011, was responsible for the erosion of the O Line, Eli’s protection, the disappearance of the running game, a revolving door of mediocre TE’s after letting a star in Bennett walk. And that was just the Offensive side! Reese’s malpractice against the D, included but was not limited to: ignoring the LB position until it rivaled SP Teams as the weakest unit on the team. Allowing the pass rush to wither to nothing like the OLine and running game. Overpaying Vernon and criminally overpaying JPP to try to get it going again.....which it never did! And YES...hiring McAdoo as HC, because hiring and firing the coaching staff ...including the HC, is the GM’s job!!! Mara and Tisch have to ok it of course, but the recommendation had to come from Reese. And you’re all being naive, if you don’t think the new regime had everything to do with OBJ’s decision not to hold out! Reese with his his rigidity and McAdoo with his caustic personality from Mars, would have already ****ed up that whole situation by now, and succeeded only in alienating Beckham in some form or fashion!!! Reese and McAdumbass are the past.......let’s keep them there. Read more: thegiantsboard.proboards.com/thread/194/teams-biggest-mistake-last-decade?page=1#ixzz5IsPHalza |
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Post by jimmieray on Jun 19, 2018 8:38:25 GMT -5
Letting JR and TC linger was the biggest mistake. Both should have been shown the door at the same time. But the decision to hold onto a GM and HC for too long ultimately falls on Mara. Loyalty is a good thing until it starts to work against your best interests. 2015 could have possibly been a winning season, but some obviously poor on field decisions by TC were hard to overlook. In 2016, a young rookie HC came out with a very good 11-5 record. All this contributed heavily to the appearance Reese was doing his part well - even if many we as fans saw the cracks personnel wise. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 9:32:45 GMT -5
1) Reese absolutely DID hire McAdoo. That's why McAdoo stated "We're tied at the hip" and both were fired at the exact same time.
No chance. The last and probably only Giants GM to hire his own coaches was George Young. Wellington hired TC (against the wishes of JM and EA), and John hired McAdoo and now Shurmur. I read somewhere that Reese wanted someone else over McAdoo.
But I'd say Our biggest mistake was McAdoo.
The fact is Reese helped us win 2 Super Bowls. There's no way he was the biggest mistake in the last 10 years. Clearly the writer is unqualified to speak about the Giants. There are plenty of articles online where Reese has admitted to the hiring of Mcadoo. Even though he didn't sound overly excited about it, he did have a say in the decision. Reese can't be absolved from the hiring. If he really did not want McAdoo he should have been able to provide his reasons to ownership. |
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Post by TEM on Jun 19, 2018 9:49:21 GMT -5
No chance. The last and probably only Giants GM to hire his own coaches was George Young. Wellington hired TC (against the wishes of JM and EA), and John hired McAdoo and now Shurmur. I read somewhere that Reese wanted someone else over McAdoo.
But I'd say Our biggest mistake was McAdoo.
The fact is Reese helped us win 2 Super Bowls. There's no way he was the biggest mistake in the last 10 years. Clearly the writer is unqualified to speak about the Giants. There are plenty of articles online where Reese has admitted to the hiring of Mcadoo. Even though he didn't sound overly excited about it, he did have a say in the decision. Reese can't be absolved from the hiring. If he really did not want McAdoo he should have been able to provide his reasons to ownership. I do not see the relevance as it relates to the Author's narrative and logic. 10 years ago we won a SB and one more in 2012. So how is any way does a GM the won 2 in that timeframe be The biggest mistake that the franchise made? So what about the GMs from the other 23 teams that did not win in that time frame. Were they not bigger mistakes? The argument that he hired Mcadoo has nothing to do with the writers ridiculous notion that a 2 time Superbowl GM was the Franchises biggest mistake. If having a Gm that can place 2 trophies in the case in a decade is the Giants biggest mistake . I will take that mistake every 10 years until the end of time. |
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Post by KingCap88 on Jun 19, 2018 9:57:15 GMT -5
Letting JR and TC linger was the biggest mistake. Both should have been shown the door at the same time. But the decision to hold onto a GM and HC for too long ultimately falls on Mara. Loyalty is a good thing until it starts to work against your best interests. 2015 could have possibly been a winning season, but some obviously poor on field decisions by TC were hard to overlook. In 2016, a young rookie HC came out with a very good 11-5 record. All this contributed heavily to the appearance Reese was doing his part well - even if many we as fans saw the cracks personnel wise. But BM was hired after TC was pushed out and JR went big-spending in free agency. Both TC and JR should have been sent packing at the same time since the problems that had simmering for years finally came to boil in 2017 and forced Mara to get rid of both the GM and HC at the same time. JR was already feeling the heat from Mara after TC was pushed out when Mara made it clear that it was all on him going forward. The combination of a losing season in 2017, and the backlash to the bungled Eli benching, just sped up the inevitable. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 10:11:31 GMT -5
New York Giants:
Letting Jerry Reese linger
The New York Giants won the Super Bowl in Jerry Reese's first season as the team's general manager, and then they did it again four years later. That bought Reese a hell of a lot of rope. Too much rope, in fact. Reese dropped the ball time and again in the seasons that followed that 2011 championship. He drafted just two Pro Bowlers (Beckham and Collins) in seven years, while first-rounders David Wilson, Justin Pugh, Eli Apple and Ereck Flowers have already either gone bust or are in the process of doing so. He continually tried and failed to rebuild the offensive line and running game, didn't do enough to support quarterback Eli Manning, wasted money on Brandon Myers and Dwayne Harris when the team was taking a conservative approach in free agency (and then overcompensated by desperately overpaying Olivier Vernon and Janoris Jenkins when the first strategy didn't work), and let Martellus Bennett walk in his prime. Oh, and he hired Ben McAdoo as head coach. Enough said. Reese should have been gone after a second consecutive losing season in 2014, but he lingered until this past season. bleacherreport.com/articles/2780953-every-nfl-teams-biggest-mistake-of-the-past-decade#slide0 Next decade's biggest mistake...not drafting Eli Manning's successor when given a golden opportunity to do so  |
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Post by TEM on Jun 19, 2018 10:23:48 GMT -5
New York Giants:
Letting Jerry Reese linger
The New York Giants won the Super Bowl in Jerry Reese's first season as the team's general manager, and then they did it again four years later. That bought Reese a hell of a lot of rope. Too much rope, in fact. Reese dropped the ball time and again in the seasons that followed that 2011 championship. He drafted just two Pro Bowlers (Beckham and Collins) in seven years, while first-rounders David Wilson, Justin Pugh, Eli Apple and Ereck Flowers have already either gone bust or are in the process of doing so. He continually tried and failed to rebuild the offensive line and running game, didn't do enough to support quarterback Eli Manning, wasted money on Brandon Myers and Dwayne Harris when the team was taking a conservative approach in free agency (and then overcompensated by desperately overpaying Olivier Vernon and Janoris Jenkins when the first strategy didn't work), and let Martellus Bennett walk in his prime. Oh, and he hired Ben McAdoo as head coach. Enough said. Reese should have been gone after a second consecutive losing season in 2014, but he lingered until this past season. bleacherreport.com/articles/2780953-every-nfl-teams-biggest-mistake-of-the-past-decade#slide0 Next decade's biggest mistake...not drafting Eli Manning's successor when given a golden opportunity to do so  OK Baba Vanga  |
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Post by Roosevelt on Jun 19, 2018 10:34:47 GMT -5
No chance. The last and probably only Giants GM to hire his own coaches was George Young. Wellington hired TC (against the wishes of JM and EA), and John hired McAdoo and now Shurmur. I read somewhere that Reese wanted someone else over McAdoo.
But I'd say Our biggest mistake was McAdoo.
The fact is Reese helped us win 2 Super Bowls. There's no way he was the biggest mistake in the last 10 years. Clearly the writer is unqualified to speak about the Giants. There are plenty of articles online where Reese has admitted to the hiring of Mcadoo. Even though he didn't sound overly excited about it, he did have a say in the decision. Reese can't be absolved from the hiring. If he really did not want McAdoo he should have been able to provide his reasons to ownership.
I wasn't trying to imply that Reese didn't have a say or wasn't part of the process, because I am sure he did. But what I am saying is that ever since Wellington Mara made the decision to hire Tom Coughlin (despite the concerns of EA), John Mara has followed that same path.
During the interview process for McAdoo's replacement, the Giants made it known that in addition to Mara and Gentleman being in on the meetings, Tisch and Abrams were part of the process as well - at least in subsequent interviews.
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Post by jimmieray on Jun 19, 2018 10:45:04 GMT -5
2015 could have possibly been a winning season, but some obviously poor on field decisions by TC were hard to overlook. In 2016, a young rookie HC came out with a very good 11-5 record. All this contributed heavily to the appearance Reese was doing his part well - even if many we as fans saw the cracks personnel wise. But BM was hired after TC was pushed out and JR went big-spending in free agency. Both TC and JR should have been sent packing at the same time since the problems that had simmering for years finally came to boil in 2017 and forced Mara to get rid of both the GM and HC at the same time. JR was already feeling the heat from Mara after TC was pushed out when Mara made it clear that it was all on him going forward. The combination of a losing season in 2017, and the backlash to the bungled Eli benching, just sped up the inevitable. Sure, but I would tend to believe an established GM who has been in place for successful runs would certainly have the allowance to fill major needs through free agency. Can't possibly go to that well, year after year, though. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 11:02:16 GMT -5
There are plenty of articles online where Reese has admitted to the hiring of Mcadoo. Even though he didn't sound overly excited about it, he did have a say in the decision. Reese can't be absolved from the hiring. If he really did not want McAdoo he should have been able to provide his reasons to ownership. I do not see the relevance as it relates to the Author's narrative and logic. 10 years ago we won a SB and one more in 2012. So how is any way does a GM the won 2 in that timeframe be The biggest mistake that the franchise made? So what about the GMs from the other 23 teams that did not win in that time frame. Were they not bigger mistakes? The argument that he hired Mcadoo has nothing to do with the writers ridiculous notion that a 2 time Superbowl GM was the Franchises biggest mistake. If having a Gm that can place 2 trophies in the case in a decade is the Giants biggest mistake . I will take that mistake every 10 years until the end of time. I disagree with a lot of what you're saying but my initial post was to show that Reese did have a say in hiring McAdoo. If anything that might be the team's worst decision the last 10 years. I am not a big fan of Reese and I believe he deserved to be let go along with Marc Ross. It seems like he had a bigger pass for constructing 2 SB winning teams who had records of 10-6 and 9-7 respectively. I would say that's TC and Eli putting in work in those 2 magical playoff runs that in reaility had no business winning. Reese got a lot of credit for riding their coattails. The real work Reese put in was post 2012 and his inability to put together a playoff caliber team for several years even with a franchise QB on the roster.What happened from 2012-2016? The team was finally able to make the playoffs in 2016 because Reese had some $$ to spend and mask his inept drafting ability. It works for a year like it did in 2011 but if you don't win a SB, you're just setting the team up for failure down the road. |
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Post by Morehead State on Jun 19, 2018 11:35:23 GMT -5
Wow...that one seems unfair on a number of fronts. 1) Reese did not hire McAdoo 2) SB, losing season, losing season = fired seems like 20/20 hindsight to me. 1) Reese absolutely DID hire McAdoo. That's why McAdoo stated "We're tied at the hip" and both were fired at the exact same time. I say this with respect and appreciation....but if you believe this you know nothing about how the Giants FO operates. Absolutely nothing. The owner hires the GM and HC. The HC hires all the assistant coaches, including the coordinators. Read Ernie's book. He was dead set against hiring Tom Coughlin as HC. He really couldn't stand him. JR had final say on the players and that was it. That is the nature of our franchise. The ONLY voice that matters in hiring the head coach is John Mara. Even Mr. Tisch has no real voice. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 19, 2018 11:38:52 GMT -5
Next decade's biggest mistake...not drafting Eli Manning's successor when given a golden opportunity to do so OK Baba Vanga  Right! Even a blind Bulgarian woman can see it!  |
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Post by Morehead State on Jun 19, 2018 11:47:33 GMT -5
1. Reaching for Ereck Flowers.
2. Hiring Ben McAdoo....(and not hiring Doug Marrone as I suggested at the time)
3. Not firing Tom at least a year earlier
4. It all could be trumped by not drafting a QB with the #2 pick....we shall have to wait and see about that.
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Post by Sarcasman on Jun 19, 2018 12:13:12 GMT -5
New York Giants:
Letting Jerry Reese linger
The New York Giants won the Super Bowl in Jerry Reese's first season as the team's general manager, and then they did it again four years later. That bought Reese a hell of a lot of rope. Too much rope, in fact. Reese dropped the ball time and again in the seasons that followed that 2011 championship. He drafted just two Pro Bowlers (Beckham and Collins) in seven years, while first-rounders David Wilson, Justin Pugh, Eli Apple and Ereck Flowers have already either gone bust or are in the process of doing so. He continually tried and failed to rebuild the offensive line and running game, didn't do enough to support quarterback Eli Manning, wasted money on Brandon Myers and Dwayne Harris when the team was taking a conservative approach in free agency (and then overcompensated by desperately overpaying Olivier Vernon and Janoris Jenkins when the first strategy didn't work), and let Martellus Bennett walk in his prime. Oh, and he hired Ben McAdoo as head coach. Enough said. Reese should have been gone after a second consecutive losing season in 2014, but he lingered until this past season. bleacherreport.com/articles/2780953-every-nfl-teams-biggest-mistake-of-the-past-decade#slide0 Next decade's biggest mistake...not drafting Eli Manning's successor when given a golden opportunity to do so At least the Giants aren't alone on that one. They can share it with the Patriots, Saints, Steelers and Chargers. |
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Post by Morehead State on Jun 19, 2018 12:17:51 GMT -5
Sorry, but the positives of Reese, at the time he was let go, is the real hindsight in this topic!!! I think it’s comical that people could actually try to make an argument, that Reese was somehow railroaded or scapegoated, considering all the units on the team he allowed to erode since SB46!!! I also find it ironic, that the 2 SB’s won with Reese as GM, buys him more benefit of the doubt and good will to some, than Eli, who happened to be the MVP of those two SB’s! Ironic of course, because it’s Reese, whose missteps AS GM since 2011, was responsible for the erosion of the O Line, Eli’s protection, the disappearance of the running game, a revolving door of mediocre TE’s after letting a star in Bennett walk. And that was just the Offensive side! Reese’s malpractice against the D, included but was not limited to: ignoring the LB position until it rivaled SP Teams as the weakest unit on the team. Allowing the pass rush to wither to nothing like the OLine and running game. Overpaying Vernon and criminally overpaying JPP to try to get it going again.....which it never did! And YES...hiring McAdoo as HC, because hiring and firing the coaching staff ...including the HC, is the GM’s job!!! Mara and Tisch have to ok it of course, but the recommendation had to come from Reese. And you’re all being naive, if you don’t think the new regime had everything to do with OBJ’s decision not to hold out! Reese with his his rigidity and McAdoo with his caustic personality from Mars, would have already ****ed up that whole situation by now, and succeeded only in alienating Beckham in some form or fashion!!! Reese and McAdumbass are the past.......let’s keep them there. Read more: thegiantsboard.proboards.com/thread/194/teams-biggest-mistake-last-decade?page=1#ixzz5IsPHalzaI'm a guy who generally liked Jerry Reese. He DID win two SB's here and I like that he was essentially born and raised in the Giants organization and rose through the ranks and got he job as GM based on merit. Having siad that he struggled in identifying O line ability and tended to reach for O line in Round one with both Pugh and Flowers. I have no problem with him being let go because 6 years on losing is a long time. NO ONE should be safe given our dismal record since 2012. JR did pick some very good players, many of whom will be essential in our return to competitiveness. But the record the last 6 years speaks for itself. I will not let any attacks on him go without response though. He was a Giants lifer and helped bring us 2 SB wins. There comes a time when a little appreciation should rule the day. Maybe that time isn't there for some folks, but it is for me. In other words...let's cut the guy some slack. he did some great things here. |
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Post by jimmieray on Jun 19, 2018 12:36:35 GMT -5
Next decade's biggest mistake...not drafting Eli Manning's successor when given a golden opportunity to do so At least the Giants aren't alone on that one. They can share it with the Patriots, Saints, Steelers and Chargers. Those teams had "golden" opportunities, for a high percentage pick at a franchise QB? |
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