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Post by McCherry on Dec 5, 2021 16:39:27 GMT -5
You didn't answer the question When has this team even been half healthy on offense (which includes no lingering things) Once...Saints game .... And... You are 100% right about the injuries but I think you may be overrating KG, Lemieux, and Solder. We miss Gates. We miss Sheppard. We miss KT. I just do not think our wr were nearly as good as you think even when healthy. I think if healthy our Oline was still in the lower 3rd of the league. I think if healthy our receivers were still middle of the pack at best. Gates was a huge loss, no question. Golloday has averaged 16 ypc this season. Injuries ruined his season. He needs to get himself healthy next year.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 5, 2021 16:40:37 GMT -5
You didn't answer the question When has this team even been half healthy on offense (which includes no lingering things) Once...Saints game .... And... You are 100% right about the injuries but I think you may be overrating KG, Lemieux, and Solder. We miss Gates. We miss Sheppard. We miss KT. I just do not think our wr were nearly as good as you think even when healthy. I think if healthy our Oline was still in the lower 3rd of the league. I think if healthy our receivers were still middle of the pack at best. When healthy I would say we are much better then what has been put on tape during this 4 game offensive slump when you are into the 2nd team at multiple positions and in some cases 3rd team on the OL you are in deep shit now Cornerback has green into it and QB. We lost a corner in Jackson who has been playing maybe the best at that position for us the past 5 games.
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Post by kerryisdaman on Dec 5, 2021 16:48:18 GMT -5
You are 100% right about the injuries but I think you may be overrating KG, Lemieux, and Solder. We miss Gates. We miss Sheppard. We miss KT. I just do not think our wr were nearly as good as you think even when healthy. I think if healthy our Oline was still in the lower 3rd of the league. I think if healthy our receivers were still middle of the pack at best. Gates was a huge loss, no question. Golloday has averaged 16 ypc this season. Injuries ruined his season. He needs to get himself healthy next year. I hope you are right about the injuries being the issue with KG. I see a lack of separation (often) and a lack of effort (at times)
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Post by kerryisdaman on Dec 5, 2021 16:50:47 GMT -5
You are 100% right about the injuries but I think you may be overrating KG, Lemieux, and Solder. We miss Gates. We miss Sheppard. We miss KT. I just do not think our wr were nearly as good as you think even when healthy. I think if healthy our Oline was still in the lower 3rd of the league. I think if healthy our receivers were still middle of the pack at best. When healthy I would say we are much better then what has been put on tape during this 4 game offensive slump when you are into the 2nd team at multiple positions and in some cases 3rd team on the OL you are in deep shit now Cornerback has green into it and QB. We lost a corner in Jackson who has been playing maybe the best at that position for us the past 5 games. Injuries definitely hurt us a lot. I'd be the first person to say that, Jackson had been playing well. We miss Gates. We miss Sheppard. I think we might have won today with DJ and Sheppard. The problem is when your line was ranked 31st last season, then you lose your best guard (Zeitler) before the season even if healthy your line is not going to be good.
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Post by McCherry on Dec 5, 2021 16:52:33 GMT -5
Gates was a huge loss, no question. Golloday has averaged 16 ypc this season. Injuries ruined his season. He needs to get himself healthy next year. I hope you are right about the injuries being the issue with KG. I see a lack of separation (often) and a lack of effort (at times) None of our QB's have established any chemistry with him or put him in position to fight for the ball which is his strength. I just know that in the past, when healthy, this was a very productive WR.
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Post by Kruunch on Dec 5, 2021 16:52:49 GMT -5
Gates was a huge loss, no question. Golloday has averaged 16 ypc this season. Injuries ruined his season. He needs to get himself healthy next year. I hope you are right about the injuries being the issue with KG. I see a lack of separation (often) and a lack of effort (at times) Difficult to separate when your wallet is holding you down.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 5, 2021 16:55:39 GMT -5
When healthy I would say we are much better then what has been put on tape during this 4 game offensive slump when you are into the 2nd team at multiple positions and in some cases 3rd team on the OL you are in deep shit now Cornerback has green into it and QB. We lost a corner in Jackson who has been playing maybe the best at that position for us the past 5 games. Injuries definitely hurt us a lot. I'd be the first person to say that, Jackson had been playing well. We miss Gates. We miss Sheppard. I think we might have won today with DJ and Sheppard. The problem is when your line was ranked 31st last season, then you lose your best guard (Zeitler) before the season even if healthy your line is not going to be good. Just goes right back to why Gettlemen and several others need to be gone they have failed.
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Post by giants8493 on Dec 5, 2021 16:56:57 GMT -5
When healthy I would say we are much better then what has been put on tape during this 4 game offensive slump when you are into the 2nd team at multiple positions and in some cases 3rd team on the OL you are in deep shit now Cornerback has green into it and QB. We lost a corner in Jackson who has been playing maybe the best at that position for us the past 5 games. Injuries definitely hurt us a lot. I'd be the first person to say that, Jackson had been playing well. We miss Gates. We miss Sheppard. I think we might have won today with DJ and Sheppard. The problem is when your line was ranked 31st last season, then you lose your best guard (Zeitler) before the season even if healthy your line is not going to be good. why they cut him though?
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Post by kerryisdaman on Dec 5, 2021 16:57:02 GMT -5
I hope you are right about the injuries being the issue with KG. I see a lack of separation (often) and a lack of effort (at times) Difficult to separate when your wallet is holding you down. I never blame a player for taking the money but was it a wise investment for the team? Only time will tell. To be fair I was happy when I heard he signed. I had heard some of the concerns but I was hoping they would not come true.
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Post by kerryisdaman on Dec 5, 2021 16:58:50 GMT -5
I hope you are right about the injuries being the issue with KG. I see a lack of separation (often) and a lack of effort (at times) None of our QB's have established any chemistry with him or put him in position to fight for the ball which is his strength. I just know that in the past, when healthy, this was a very productive WR. The past is the past but we have thrown to him despite him being covered. It is hard to throw to a covered guy. You dont want the ball intercepted but we have tried. Its great if he can outfight guys for the ball occasionally but that can't be his primary way to make catches. We need him to hustle more and get open more.
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Post by kerryisdaman on Dec 5, 2021 16:59:55 GMT -5
Injuries definitely hurt us a lot. I'd be the first person to say that, Jackson had been playing well. We miss Gates. We miss Sheppard. I think we might have won today with DJ and Sheppard. The problem is when your line was ranked 31st last season, then you lose your best guard (Zeitler) before the season even if healthy your line is not going to be good. why they cut him though? He was very good but I guess they thought he was not worth the money. Seems silly when our whole season collapses with our Oline.
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Post by giants8493 on Dec 5, 2021 17:00:46 GMT -5
He was very good but I guess they thought he was not worth the money. Seems silly when our whole season collapses with our Oline. I think we would have had better production with him and not Golladay.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 5, 2021 17:01:29 GMT -5
Difficult to separate when your wallet is holding you down. I never blame a player for taking the money but was it a wise investment for the team? Only time will tell. To be fair I was happy when I heard he signed. I had heard some of the concerns but I was hoping they would not come true. He made his name with Stafford as his triggerman dudes a player needs to get healthy and stay on the field. Started with him missing camp there was no timing, he did the right thing man git in position to get paid and got the money.
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Post by kerryisdaman on Dec 5, 2021 17:03:20 GMT -5
He was very good but I guess they thought he was not worth the money. Seems silly when our whole season collapses with our Oline. I think we would have had better production with him and not Golladay. I'm sure of it but after last season I'm not going to lie. I wanted some WR as well. Now I did not want a WR instead of a lineman. I wanted both. Maybe we should have traded up and grabbed a WR and Slater in the draft? Of course that is hindsight.
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Post by kerryisdaman on Dec 5, 2021 17:06:08 GMT -5
I never blame a player for taking the money but was it a wise investment for the team? Only time will tell. To be fair I was happy when I heard he signed. I had heard some of the concerns but I was hoping they would not come true. He made his name with Stafford as his triggerman dudes a player needs to get healthy and stay on the field. Started with him missing camp there was no timing, he did the right thing man git in position to get paid and got the money. I hope you are right because I think he will be here at least another 1-2 seasons based on cap money. Unless we cut him and take a 28 mill dead cap hit.
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Post by giants8493 on Dec 5, 2021 17:07:06 GMT -5
I think we would have had better production with him and not Golladay. I'm sure of it but after last season I'm not going to lie. I wanted some WR as well. Now I did not want a WR instead of a lineman. I wanted both. Maybe we should have traded up and grabbed a WR and Slater in the draft? Of course that is hindsight. they were beat on the WRs waddle Smith and chase were gone. They would have needed to trade up for waddle and trade future picks for slater. It's a lot of draft capital for unknowns. In hindsight it might have been the move. Waddle and slayter look like legit stars
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 5, 2021 17:07:20 GMT -5
When healthy I would say we are much better then what has been put on tape during this 4 game offensive slump when you are into the 2nd team at multiple positions and in some cases 3rd team on the OL you are in deep shit now Cornerback has green into it and QB. We lost a corner in Jackson who has been playing maybe the best at that position for us the past 5 games. Injuries definitely hurt us a lot. I'd be the first person to say that, Jackson had been playing well. We miss Gates. We miss Sheppard. I think we might have won today with DJ and Sheppard. The problem is when your line was ranked 31st last season, then you lose your best guard (Zeitler) before the season even if healthy your line is not going to be good. I'm watching the WFT right now Hienke doesn't have a great arm but the OL has improved and he has time to throw and he is carving it up, OL play is paramount to team success. I give Rivera credit he is building this team with Physical OL and defense.
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Post by kerryisdaman on Dec 5, 2021 17:08:33 GMT -5
Injuries definitely hurt us a lot. I'd be the first person to say that, Jackson had been playing well. We miss Gates. We miss Sheppard. I think we might have won today with DJ and Sheppard. The problem is when your line was ranked 31st last season, then you lose your best guard (Zeitler) before the season even if healthy your line is not going to be good. I'm watching the WFT right now Hienke doesn't have a great arm but the OL has improved and he has time to throw and he is carving it up, OL play is paramount to team success. I give Rivera credit he is building this team with Physical OL and defense. It is funny how great a QB can look if he has time for WR to get open never mind a running game.
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Post by kerryisdaman on Dec 5, 2021 17:09:15 GMT -5
I'm sure of it but after last season I'm not going to lie. I wanted some WR as well. Now I did not want a WR instead of a lineman. I wanted both. Maybe we should have traded up and grabbed a WR and Slater in the draft? Of course that is hindsight. they were beat on the WRs waddle Smith and chase were gone. They would have needed to trade up for waddle and trade future picks for slater. It's a lot of draft capital for unknowns. In hindsight it might have been the move. Waddle and slayter look like legit stars In hindsight that is what I would have done but hindsight is 20-20.
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 5, 2021 17:11:00 GMT -5
I'm watching the WFT right now Hienke doesn't have a great arm but the OL has improved and he has time to throw and he is carving it up, OL play is paramount to team success. I give Rivera credit he is building this team with Physical OL and defense. It is funny how great a QB can look if he has time for WR to get open never mind a running game. They also have dynamic playmakers that force the defense to have to defend the entire field...and a decent O line... Teams can't stack the box to play the run.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 5, 2021 17:16:34 GMT -5
He made his name with Stafford as his triggerman dudes a player needs to get healthy and stay on the field. Started with him missing camp there was no timing, he did the right thing man git in position to get paid and got the money. I hope you are right because I think he will be here at least another 1-2 seasons based on cap money. Unless we cut him and take a 28 mill dead cap hit. I said in a post about the cap the Giants need to stand pat in freeagnecy in 2022. Im sure they were hoping for a playoff run with these new additions it didn't work, but reworking contracts and cutting guys isn't the answer it will only hurt future cap, hope they come back healthy and ready to play with hopefully a solid draft with some nice draft capital, the cap for the Giants gets better after 2022 gets right back on track unless they start playing with contracts.
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Post by kerryisdaman on Dec 5, 2021 17:19:13 GMT -5
I hope you are right because I think he will be here at least another 1-2 seasons based on cap money. Unless we cut him and take a 28 mill dead cap hit. I said in a post about the cap the Giants need to stand pat in freeagnecy in 2022. Im sure they were hoping for a playoff run with these new additions it didn't work, but reworking contracts and cutting guys isn't the answer it will only hurt future cap, hope they come back healthy and ready to play with hopefully a solid draft with some nice draft capital, the cap for the Giants gets better after 2022 gets right back on track unless they start playing with contracts. I think KG really has to show something for the new GM to say okay this is worth keeping this deal. Its not going to be an easy decision if KG does not really step up in the last 5 games.
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Post by giants8493 on Dec 5, 2021 17:19:41 GMT -5
they were beat on the WRs waddle Smith and chase were gone. They would have needed to trade up for waddle and trade future picks for slater. It's a lot of draft capital for unknowns. In hindsight it might have been the move. Waddle and slayter look like legit stars In hindsight that is what I would have done but hindsight is 20-20. it's tough though because you didn't have a real combine and scouting process. I actually said that I don't mind punting on that draft for extra picks next year and understand that this is going to be another development year... As painful as it would be to watch. Hopefully that bears pick turns into the next NFL great.
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Tyrell
Special Teams
Posts: 441
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Post by Tyrell on Dec 5, 2021 17:27:26 GMT -5
The guts of this team is so lousy and uncertain of itself its a number of steps by the time a well thrown ball lands in golladays outstreched arms. Itd mean good routes, and protection, a well thrown ball, timing, a healthy capable qb.
That golladay doesnt have a single td all year is hugely telling for this team. How many wide receiver and running back tds in total do we even have all year?
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 5, 2021 17:34:50 GMT -5
I said in a post about the cap the Giants need to stand pat in freeagnecy in 2022. Im sure they were hoping for a playoff run with these new additions it didn't work, but reworking contracts and cutting guys isn't the answer it will only hurt future cap, hope they come back healthy and ready to play with hopefully a solid draft with some nice draft capital, the cap for the Giants gets better after 2022 gets right back on track unless they start playing with contracts. I think KG really has to show something for the new GM to say okay this is worth keeping this deal. Its not going to be an easy decision if KG does not really step up in the last 5 games. He's gonna get next year also we will see dude has talent needs to be utilized and he needs to stay healthy.
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Post by Sarcasman on Dec 5, 2021 17:48:49 GMT -5
Injuries definitely hurt us a lot. I'd be the first person to say that, Jackson had been playing well. We miss Gates. We miss Sheppard. I think we might have won today with DJ and Sheppard. The problem is when your line was ranked 31st last season, then you lose your best guard (Zeitler) before the season even if healthy your line is not going to be good. I'm watching the WFT right now Hienke doesn't have a great arm but the OL has improved and he has time to throw and he is carving it up, OL play is paramount to team success. I give Rivera credit he is building this team with Physical OL and defense. The Giants only care if the GM and HC say that. We don't actually make them do it.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 5, 2021 17:54:58 GMT -5
I'm watching the WFT right now Hienke doesn't have a great arm but the OL has improved and he has time to throw and he is carving it up, OL play is paramount to team success. I give Rivera credit he is building this team with Physical OL and defense. The Giants only care if the GM and HC say that. We don't actually make them do it. It seems that way doesn't it lol. From now on intro pressers mean nothing to me, a vision is one thing making it happen is another.
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Post by SG88 on Dec 5, 2021 18:12:01 GMT -5
My favorite post in this thread is "if Jones were playing, we would have 13 points." LOL, picking between Jones and Glennon is like picking either the electric chair or lethal injection. This team is absolutely hopeless on offense. Adding these receivers is like putting new rims on a Ford pinto. There’s nothing even close to electric chair about either one of them .. it’s more like choosing a death penalty by getting pecked to death by small birds or getting paper cuts till you bleed out .. they are both torture . Can't dispute that, friend
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Post by kerryisdaman on Dec 5, 2021 18:17:56 GMT -5
I think KG really has to show something for the new GM to say okay this is worth keeping this deal. Its not going to be an easy decision if KG does not really step up in the last 5 games. He's gonna get next year also we will see dude has talent needs to be utilized and he needs to stay healthy. That could be true but it may not be true with a new GM if we do not see more in the last 5 games. That is a large cap investment so the new GM has to ask himself does he want to continue down that road for 2 more years.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Dec 5, 2021 18:35:02 GMT -5
He's gonna get next year also we will see dude has talent needs to be utilized and he needs to stay healthy. That could be true but it may not be true with a new GM if we do not see more in the last 5 games. That is a large cap investment so the new GM has to ask himself does he want to continue down that road for 2 more years. He is one of the few 4 year deals, I don't know what year is the best to part ways usually is sometime after the 2nd to soon it can hamstring the team longer right now they are in good cap standing after 2022. Any new GM owes to ownership to be sure about these contracts paying money to guys no longer on the roster most defeinetly pisses an owner off especially if said play goes else where and is productive.
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