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Post by Fletch842 on Mar 4, 2024 9:02:15 GMT -5
Would be a dream! Move Neal inside (hope he does well) and you've fixed two positions with one FA addition Only question i have is. Why are the pats letting him walk? Especially considering their more than ample cap space I've read that they will make every effort to resigh him.
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 4, 2024 9:10:12 GMT -5
In 2 years The GM Has Used a top 10 draft pick on an OT Now we need a new one. Gave a QB a big contract. Now we need a new one. Gave an OG a 18MM contract. He sat on the bench. Traded for A TE with history of not being able to stay on the field attached to a 36MM dollar contract. IR most of the season. Singed 20 odd Offensive linemen. Not one worked out. You guys should be screaming about the incompetence. Not promoting it. TEM you seem to be stating your opinion as facts or skewing the truth to fit your narrative. Glowinski started 22 of 32 games here in two years, he didn't sit on the bench until the very end which is why he is being cut and not getting $18m dollars (smart contract to fill a hole and have an out). As for those "20 odd offensive linemen" he signed 5 in 2022, 4 were camp bodies with minimum 1 year/~$1m contracts; in 2023 he signed 1 who torn his tricep on August first.
As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out? Onwenu, all things considered, is the best OL in free agency. We might want to protect that $40m QB and not have to keep that oft injured $36m TE in to block all the time.
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 4, 2024 9:12:29 GMT -5
Only question i have is. Why are the pats letting him walk? Especially considering their more than ample cap space It's a fair question but good players walk every single year in free agency. The easy answer is that the player has a choice. Maybe he doesn't want to stick around for the rebuild, maybe he hates the area, maybe he misses his old OL coach (Bricillo) Lots of reasons why he might walk. If he doesn't then he's not an option and we have to move on to the next option.
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Post by TEM on Mar 4, 2024 9:40:49 GMT -5
In 2 years The GM Has Used a top 10 draft pick on an OT Now we need a new one. Gave a QB a big contract. Now we need a new one. Gave an OG a 18MM contract. He sat on the bench. Traded for A TE with history of not being able to stay on the field attached to a 36MM dollar contract. IR most of the season. Singed 20 odd Offensive linemen. Not one worked out. You guys should be screaming about the incompetence. Not promoting it. TEM you seem to be stating your opinion as facts or skewing the truth to fit your narrative. Glowinski started 22 of 32 games here in two years, he didn't sit on the bench until the very end which is why he is being cut and not getting $18m dollars (smart contract to fill a hole and have an out). As for those "20 odd offensive linemen" he signed 5 in 2022, 4 were camp bodies with minimum 1 year/~$1m contracts; in 2023 he signed 1 who torn his tricep on August first.
As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out? Onwenu, all things considered, is the best OL in free agency. We might want to protect that $40m QB and not have to keep that oft injured $36m TE in to block all the time.
A) Glowaski sucked. Why he was benched. B) Name ne offensive lineman he singed of drafted that is not I suck, or I hope so. C) He traded for A TE that played 1 full season in his career. As far as The QB and OT we will see after the draft.
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 4, 2024 11:21:00 GMT -5
A) Glowaski sucked. Why he was benched. B) Name ne offensive lineman he singed of drafted that is not I suck, or I hope so. C) He traded for A TE that played 1 full season in his career. As far as The QB and OT we will see after the draft. A) I'm not debating that, you said "he sat on the bench" when in fact he played over 2/3rds of the games here and was our best OG for one of those years (when we made the playoffs).
B) He's been here two years, everyone he drafted is still an "I hope so". JMS certainly seems good...too soon to tell of couse. You said he brought in "20 odd" offensive lineman, he didn't, not even close and the majority were camp fodder as every single GM does. Andrew Thomas was still an "I hope so" two years in.
C) Yes he took a chance trading an extra 3rd round pick he had for the potential Waller can add something to this offense. I'm good with taking that chance.
Now why did you ignore my question... As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out?
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Post by TEM on Mar 4, 2024 14:00:40 GMT -5
A) Glowaski sucked. Why he was benched. B) Name ne offensive lineman he singed of drafted that is not I suck, or I hope so. C) He traded for A TE that played 1 full season in his career. As far as The QB and OT we will see after the draft. A) I'm not debating that, you said "he sat on the bench" when in fact he played over 2/3rds of the games here and was our best OG for one of those years (when we made the playoffs).
B) He's been here two years, everyone he drafted is still an "I hope so". JMS certainly seems good...too soon to tell of couse. You said he brought in "20 odd" offensive lineman, he didn't, not even close and the majority were camp fodder as every single GM does. Andrew Thomas was still an "I hope so" two years in.
C) Yes he took a chance trading an extra 3rd round pick he had for the potential Waller can add something to this offense. I'm good with taking that chance.
Now why did you ignore my question... As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out?
Most of last season. He sucked. At 30 years old. He is still in his prime. No way if he was as good as you say. He should have been that bad.
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 4, 2024 14:10:51 GMT -5
Most of last season. He sucked. At 30 years old. He is still in his prime. No way if he was as good as you say. He should have been that bad. Let me be clear, I don't think Glowinski was very good. He was our best OG the year we went to the playoffs though. Worth the $12m we ended up paying for him over two seasons? Absolutely.
Again you ignored my question...why is that TEM?
As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out?
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Post by TEM on Mar 4, 2024 14:19:25 GMT -5
Most of last season. He sucked. At 30 years old. He is still in his prime. No way if he was as good as you say. He should have been that bad. Let me be clear, I don't think Glowinski was very good. He was our best OG the year we went to the playoffs though. Worth the $12m we ended up paying for him over two seasons? Absolutely.
Again you ignored my question...why is that TEM?
As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out?
NO. Being the best not good enough OG on a crap O-Line is like saying; it is a good sandwich using 2 slices of bread with the least amount of mold on them.
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Post by Fletch842 on Mar 4, 2024 14:25:03 GMT -5
Let me be clear, I don't think Glowinski was very good. He was our best OG the year we went to the playoffs though. Worth the $12m we ended up paying for him over two seasons? Absolutely.
Again you ignored my question...why is that TEM?
As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out?
NO. Being the best not good enough OG on a crap O-Line is like saying; it is a good sandwich using 2 slices of bread with the least amount of mold on them. lok, there is something to be said about that...
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 4, 2024 18:54:05 GMT -5
Let me be clear, I don't think Glowinski was very good. He was our best OG the year we went to the playoffs though. Worth the $12m we ended up paying for him over two seasons? Absolutely.
Again you ignored my question...why is that TEM?
As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out?
NO. Being the best not good enough OG on a crap O-Line is like saying; it is a good sandwich using 2 slices of bread with the least amount of mold on them. As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out?
Stop ducking the question.
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Aris
Special Teams
Posts: 496
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Post by Aris on Mar 4, 2024 19:17:13 GMT -5
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Post by bavarobeast on Mar 4, 2024 21:03:43 GMT -5
🥱 Neal is a tackle.
MO was a guard at Michigan - he was solid/good. Surprised he made a positive transformation to tackle. Sign him to fight it out with Neal for the guard tackle spots. I wouldn’t like that price tag for a guard though so……..
I’m ready for FAgency and the draft to conclude. Speculation is fun and redundant at the same time.
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Post by TEM on Mar 9, 2024 10:47:36 GMT -5
NO. Being the best not good enough OG on a crap O-Line is like saying; it is a good sandwich using 2 slices of bread with the least amount of mold on them. As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out?
Stop ducking the question.
I am not ducking anything. I am using statistical evidence to determine a logical conclusion. This crew's O-line in 2 years 2022 Kevin Zeitler (Let him walk) Jamil Douglas Matt Gono Mark Glowinski Jon Feliciano (Singed then let walk) Roy Mbaeteka Kyle Murphy Devery Hamilton Will Holden Korey Cunningham Solomon Kindley KC McDermott Max Garcia Garrett McGhin Josh Rivas Chris Owens Kamaal Seymour Eric Smith Wes Martin Evan Neal (Drafted 2022 Pick 7) Joshua Ezeudu (Drafted 2022 Pick 67) Marcus McKethan (Drafted 2022 Pick 173) 2023 Joshua Miles Jalen Mayfield Sean Harlow Justin Pugh Jack Anderson Tyre Phillips Sean Harlow Jack Anderson Julién Davenport J.C. Hassenauer John Michael Schmitz (Drafted 2023 Pick 57) Not including Gettelman holdovers What The GM and HC own. 3 top 70 Draft picks and one day 3 29 FAs 's One top guard Let walk. Their track record is 0-29 And 3 I hope so's Neil, Schmitz and Ezeudu) 1 day 3 pick. And Allowing 1 top OG walk. Total of 34 Offensive Linemen Statistically (dumb luck) They should have gotten at least 1 move correct so far. (3% probability). The league average is 11%. That including UDFAs that drives the stats down. The Draft alone (all 7 rounds) has a 35% success rate. Gettelman holdovers Andrew Thomas (Top OT in the league) Matt Peart Shane Lemieux Ben Bredeson Nick Gates We were the # 1 sacked team in 2023 with 85. (cap era record) The worst O-line in the cap era (Let that sink in for a minute) Not what any GM and HC want attached to them. The NFL record is 102 (86 Eagals) The #5 sacked team in 2022 with 49. Not good in any definition. How can anyone defend this? I hope this the year they get it right. Nail it correct!!!! (And The 4 O-linemen that they drafted do not hit a celling) The injury and lack of cap funds do not hold water. (All 32 team are in that boat with them)
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Post by myronguyton29 on Mar 9, 2024 12:06:07 GMT -5
NO. Being the best not good enough OG on a crap O-Line is like saying; it is a good sandwich using 2 slices of bread with the least amount of mold on them. As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out?
Stop ducking the question.
lol
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Post by myronguyton29 on Mar 9, 2024 12:10:36 GMT -5
As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out?
Stop ducking the question.
I am not ducking anything. I am using statistical evidence to determine a logical conclusion. This crew's O-line in 2 years 2022 Kevin Zeitler (Let him walk) Jamil Douglas Matt Gono Mark Glowinski Jon Feliciano (Singed then let walk) Roy Mbaeteka Kyle Murphy Devery Hamilton Will Holden Korey Cunningham Solomon Kindley KC McDermott Max Garcia Garrett McGhin Josh Rivas Chris Owens Kamaal Seymour Eric Smith Wes Martin Evan Neal (Drafted 2022 Pick 7) Joshua Ezeudu (Drafted 2022 Pick 67) Marcus McKethan (Drafted 2022 Pick 173) 2023 Joshua Miles Jalen Mayfield Sean Harlow Justin Pugh Jack Anderson Tyre Phillips Sean Harlow Jack Anderson Julién Davenport J.C. Hassenauer John Michael Schmitz (Drafted 2023 Pick 57) Not including Gettelman holdovers What The GM and HC own. 3 top 70 Draft picks and one day 3 29 FAs 's One top guard Let walk. Their track record is 0-29 And 3 I hope so's Neil, Schmitz and Ezeudu) 1 day 3 pick. And Allowing 1 top OG walk. Total of 34 Offensive Linemen Statistically (dumb luck) They should have gotten at least 1 move correct so far. (3% probability). The league average is 11%. That including UDFAs that drives the stats down. The Draft alone (all 7 rounds) has a 35% success rate. Gettelman holdovers Andrew Thomas (Top OT in the league) Matt Peart Shane Lemieux Ben Bredeson Nick Gates We were the # 1 sacked team in 2023 with 85. (cap era record) The worst O-line in the cap era (Let that sink in for a minute) Not what any GM and HC want attached to them. The NFL record is 102 (86 Eagals) The #5 sacked team in 2022 with 49. Not good in any definition. How can anyone defend this? I hope this the year they get it right. Nail it correct!!!! (And The 4 O-linemen that they drafted do not hit a celling) The injury and lack of cap funds do not hold water. (All 32 team are in that boat with them) Instead of taking a chance and signing Okenawu, what would you think would be the best premise for the 2024 OL? Starters AT, JMS, Neal ( somewhere but which?), and ?, ? (other 2?
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Post by TEM on Mar 9, 2024 14:03:59 GMT -5
I am not ducking anything. I am using statistical evidence to determine a logical conclusion. This crew's O-line in 2 years 2022 Kevin Zeitler (Let him walk) Jamil Douglas Matt Gono Mark Glowinski Jon Feliciano (Singed then let walk) Roy Mbaeteka Kyle Murphy Devery Hamilton Will Holden Korey Cunningham Solomon Kindley KC McDermott Max Garcia Garrett McGhin Josh Rivas Chris Owens Kamaal Seymour Eric Smith Wes Martin Evan Neal (Drafted 2022 Pick 7) Joshua Ezeudu (Drafted 2022 Pick 67) Marcus McKethan (Drafted 2022 Pick 173) 2023 Joshua Miles Jalen Mayfield Sean Harlow Justin Pugh Jack Anderson Tyre Phillips Sean Harlow Jack Anderson Julién Davenport J.C. Hassenauer John Michael Schmitz (Drafted 2023 Pick 57) Not including Gettelman holdovers What The GM and HC own. 3 top 70 Draft picks and one day 3 29 FAs 's One top guard Let walk. Their track record is 0-29 And 3 I hope so's Neil, Schmitz and Ezeudu) 1 day 3 pick. And Allowing 1 top OG walk. Total of 34 Offensive Linemen Statistically (dumb luck) They should have gotten at least 1 move correct so far. (3% probability). The league average is 11%. That including UDFAs that drives the stats down. The Draft alone (all 7 rounds) has a 35% success rate. Gettelman holdovers Andrew Thomas (Top OT in the league) Matt Peart Shane Lemieux Ben Bredeson Nick Gates We were the # 1 sacked team in 2023 with 85. (cap era record) The worst O-line in the cap era (Let that sink in for a minute) Not what any GM and HC want attached to them. The NFL record is 102 (86 Eagals) The #5 sacked team in 2022 with 49. Not good in any definition. How can anyone defend this? I hope this the year they get it right. Nail it correct!!!! (And The 4 O-linemen that they drafted do not hit a celling) The injury and lack of cap funds do not hold water. (All 32 team are in that boat with them) Instead of taking a chance and signing Okenawu, what would you think would be the best premise for the 2024 OL? Starters AT, JMS, Neal ( somewhere but which?), and ?, ? (other 2? My starters going into camp. From left to right: Thomas - Ezeudu - Schmitz - Robert Hunt - Neil Would re-sign Bredeson Draft Kingsley Suamataia with pick 47 Draft Javion Cohen with pick 140
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Post by myronguyton29 on Mar 9, 2024 14:10:00 GMT -5
Instead of taking a chance and signing Okenawu, what would you think would be the best premise for the 2024 OL? Starters AT, JMS, Neal ( somewhere but which?), and ?, ? (other 2? My starters going into camp. From left to right: Thomas - Ezeudu - Schmitz - Robert Hunt - Neil Would re-sign Bredeson Draft Kingsley Suamataia with pick 47 Draft Javion Cohen with pick 140 don't know who Robert Hunt is and gotta look him up ..........
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 10, 2024 11:31:01 GMT -5
My starters going into camp. From left to right: Thomas - Ezeudu - Schmitz - Robert Hunt - Neil Would re-sign Bredeson Draft Kingsley Suamataia with pick 47 Draft Javion Cohen with pick 140 don't know who Robert Hunt is and gotta look him up .......... Hunt is a good player. The problem with TEM is he thinks signing Hunt and keeping Neal at RT is somehow a better, less incompetent, move than signing Onwenu. However Onwenu is a better OG than Hunt AND he can play RT. Onwenu makes the most sense if we can afford him. I would absolutely take Hunt though and wouldn't bash people or the coaches for either signing.
Notice he still hasn't come up with a reason not to sign Onwenu other than he would rather sign Hunt.
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 10, 2024 11:35:56 GMT -5
As for promoting incompetence, should he not sign Onwenu because other moves didn't work out?
Stop ducking the question.
I am not ducking anything. I am using statistical evidence to determine a logical conclusion. All of that statistical evidence still doesn't answer the question. Should we not sign Onwenu?
You attacked the idea of signing Onwenu and there is no "logical conclusion" as to why. He's a great player and would be a tremendous asset for this team.
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Post by TEM on Mar 10, 2024 11:44:28 GMT -5
I am not ducking anything. I am using statistical evidence to determine a logical conclusion. All of that statistical evidence still doesn't answer the question. Should we not sign Onwenu?
You attacked the idea of signing Onwenu and there is no "logical conclusion" as to why. He's a great player and would be a tremendous asset for this team.
NO He is going to be 14-20 a year I would say the higher end of that price. I think you can get almost the same player in Robert Hunt for 10-12 a year.
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Post by TCHOF on Mar 10, 2024 13:10:35 GMT -5
All of that statistical evidence still doesn't answer the question. Should we not sign Onwenu?
You attacked the idea of signing Onwenu and there is no "logical conclusion" as to why. He's a great player and would be a tremendous asset for this team.
NO He is going to be 14-20 a year I would say the higher end of that price. I think you can get almost the same player in Robert Hunt for 10-12 a year. Hunt doesn’t have the same RT versatility. He also will be paid more than $10-12M
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Post by Fletch842 on Mar 10, 2024 13:47:11 GMT -5
I think there will be a lot of competition for both Hunt and Onwenu. Whomever signs them will be paying a premium. I'd probably look to the next tier for guards/tackles.
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 10, 2024 13:52:20 GMT -5
All of that statistical evidence still doesn't answer the question. Should we not sign Onwenu?
You attacked the idea of signing Onwenu and there is no "logical conclusion" as to why. He's a great player and would be a tremendous asset for this team.
NO He is going to be 14-20 a year I would say the higher end of that price. I think you can get almost the same player in Robert Hunt for 10-12 a year. Well I appreciate you saying why you don't want Onwenu. I think it will be tough for us to sign him because I think he will expensive. I disagree about Hunt and him being almost the same. The versatility of Onwenu would be huge for this team. I am 100% on board with Hunt (he's my top rated OG and 2nd highest rated OL), but that leaves us with Neal at RT. It's a risk for sure, one we might have to take.
If we aren't getting X or Saquon back I hope they go after the best OL in free agency.
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 10, 2024 13:56:42 GMT -5
I think there will be a lot of competition for both Hunt and Onwenu. Whomever signs them will be paying a premium. I'd probably look to the next tier for guards/tackles. IMO this is the next tier, with Risner leading the pack.
Dalton Risner Andre James Jon Runyan Jr Ezra Cleveland Tyler Biadasz
This certainly is a good year to sign some OL help, plus it's a deep draft class as well. It's our year to get this thing fixed.
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Post by TEM on Mar 10, 2024 13:59:40 GMT -5
NO He is going to be 14-20 a year I would say the higher end of that price. I think you can get almost the same player in Robert Hunt for 10-12 a year. Hunt doesn’t have the same RT versatility. He also will be paid more than $10-12M I think he is in that range. (he missed a few games in 2023) Hunt only gave up 1 sack over 547 snaps. Onwenu gave up 3 over 850 snaps (not saying that is bad) It would be a win for the O-line with either. But With Hunt we can afford an additional mid-level player.
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Post by TCHOF on Mar 10, 2024 15:48:09 GMT -5
I think there will be a lot of competition for both Hunt and Onwenu. Whomever signs them will be paying a premium. I'd probably look to the next tier for guards/tackles. Exactly. If you want one of those two guys, you are going to overpay. That’s how FA works
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Post by TCHOF on Mar 10, 2024 15:56:26 GMT -5
I think there will be a lot of competition for both Hunt and Onwenu. Whomever signs them will be paying a premium. I'd probably look to the next tier for guards/tackles. IMO this is the next tier, with Risner leading the pack.
Dalton Risner Andre James Jon Runyan Jr Ezra Cleveland Tyler Biadasz
This certainly is a good year to sign some OL help, plus it's a deep draft class as well. It's our year to get this thing fixed.
I would also have no problem with bringing Zeitler back
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Post by Zimonami on Mar 10, 2024 17:30:44 GMT -5
IMO this is the next tier, with Risner leading the pack.
Dalton Risner Andre James Jon Runyan Jr Ezra Cleveland Tyler Biadasz
This certainly is a good year to sign some OL help, plus it's a deep draft class as well. It's our year to get this thing fixed.
I would also have no problem with bringing Zeitler back I was pissed when we lost him. But now? at 34? I'd sure like at least 2-3 good years out of a FA Guard.
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 10, 2024 18:24:34 GMT -5
I would also have no problem with bringing Zeitler back Only issue with him is his age. I based my FA list off of younger (28 was the oldest) free agents thinking long term. Bringing Zeitler in for vet presence on a cheap contract isn't a bad idea, just not something that will help going forward. We had Justin Pugh starting last year, so Zeitler is definitely an upgrade there.
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 10, 2024 18:29:03 GMT -5
Hunt doesn’t have the same RT versatility. He also will be paid more than $10-12M I think he is in that range. (he missed a few games in 2023) Hunt only gave up 1 sack over 547 snaps. Onwenu gave up 3 over 850 snaps (not saying that is bad) It would be a win for the O-line with either. But With Hunt we can afford an additional mid-level player. Both have been good in pass pro, giving up very few sacks over the last 4 seasons. Onwenu gave up less overall. The downside of Hunt is his penalties. He seemed to clean that up this year but had 11, 8 and 8 penalties in the past.
Honestly though you nailed it, it's a huge win for our team if either guy is playing for us next year.
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