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Post by myronguyton29 on Apr 17, 2024 6:26:46 GMT -5
He says the following: "It is really unusual because most of us won't ever get a second chance like that. You know when you make a decision like that — drafting a quarterback high or signing one to a huge deal — it's either going to get you a new contract someday or it'll get you fired. It's the biggest decision you can make, and most places don't let you make it twice." 1. He never never drafted Jones 2. He didn’t go shopping on the open market for a QB Jones was in the unique position to get drafted, had multiple coaches, on his 2nd GM and the entire organization has been upside down. They declined his 5th yr option and it didn’t appear to make much sense to go shopping for QBs who didn’t seem to workout elsewhere. Jones questionable health is in question as much as his ability now. This draft, could quickly be it for this bunch. Go QB and miss their dead and pass on a QB and stick with Jones who isn’t good or healthy they might be dead. yup almost the same situation as to winning a playoff game and having he season we had in their first year and having to make that decision on Jones............
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Post by inthezone on Apr 17, 2024 6:37:29 GMT -5
Has a GM given a bad at best a backup level QB 90m guaranteed and survived? I can't think of one.In comparison the following bad QBs got: Brock Oswieler got 37m guaranteed Blake Bortles got 26m guaranteed DJs deal truly stands alone Lynch with Garoppolo was a pretty high contract and your examples were both high contracts at the time they were signed. Making the criteria at $90 million only doesn't make sense due to the inflation of current contracts jeez.
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Post by cdngfan on Apr 17, 2024 6:39:06 GMT -5
He says the following: "It is really unusual because most of us won't ever get a second chance like that. You know when you make a decision like that — drafting a quarterback high or signing one to a huge deal — it's either going to get you a new contract someday or it'll get you fired. It's the biggest decision you can make, and most places don't let you make it twice." 1. He never never drafted Jones 2. He didn’t go shopping on the open market for a QB Jones was in the unique position to get drafted, had multiple coaches, on his 2nd GM and the entire organization has been upside down. They declined his 5th yr option and it didn’t appear to make much sense to go shopping for QBs who didn’t seem to workout elsewhere. Jones questionable health is in question as much as his ability now. This draft, could quickly be it for this bunch. Go QB and miss their dead and pass on a QB and stick with Jones who isn’t good or healthy they might be dead. well said. Their ability (or inability) to fix the o line I think is more critical in 24’. I can envision an improved offence with below average QB play coupled with average o line play. I have a hard time picturing one of our existing QBs or a rookie improving our offence without decent o line play. Given Mara’s publically stated frustration with the line, I’d rather stand in front of him in 25’ saying we’ve fixed the o line but need a QB, vs saying we’ve drafted our future franchise QB but it won’t look like it until we fix the o line.
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Post by bluebuddha on Apr 17, 2024 7:06:11 GMT -5
1. He never never drafted Jones 2. He didn’t go shopping on the open market for a QB Jones was in the unique position to get drafted, had multiple coaches, on his 2nd GM and the entire organization has been upside down. They declined his 5th yr option and it didn’t appear to make much sense to go shopping for QBs who didn’t seem to workout elsewhere. Jones questionable health is in question as much as his ability now. This draft, could quickly be it for this bunch. Go QB and miss their dead and pass on a QB and stick with Jones who isn’t good or healthy they might be dead. well said. Their ability (or inability) to fix the o line I think is more critical in 24’. I can envision an improved offence with below average QB play coupled with average o line play. I have a hard time picturing one of our existing QBs or a rookie improving our offence without decent o line play. Given Mara’s publically stated frustration with the line, I’d rather stand in front of him in 25’ saying we’ve fixed the o line but need a QB, vs saying we’ve drafted our future franchise QB but it won’t look like it until we fix the o line. You do what the boss tells you to do if you want too keep your job. If it works out you let the world know it was your boss. If it doesn't you take the blame and wait for new instructions.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 17, 2024 7:11:13 GMT -5
1. He never never drafted Jones 2. He didn’t go shopping on the open market for a QB Jones was in the unique position to get drafted, had multiple coaches, on his 2nd GM and the entire organization has been upside down. They declined his 5th yr option and it didn’t appear to make much sense to go shopping for QBs who didn’t seem to workout elsewhere. Jones questionable health is in question as much as his ability now. This draft, could quickly be it for this bunch. Go QB and miss their dead and pass on a QB and stick with Jones who isn’t good or healthy they might be dead. well said. Their ability (or inability) to fix the o line I think is more critical in 24’. I can envision an improved offence with below average QB play coupled with average o line play. I have a hard time picturing one of our existing QBs or a rookie improving our offence without decent o line play. Given Mara’s publically stated frustration with the line, I’d rather stand in front of him in 25’ saying we’ve fixed the o line but need a QB, vs saying we’ve drafted our future franchise QB but it won’t look like it until we fix the o line. you could go OL yet you’re sending one of your FA or potential starters to the bench. Then again, could bank on injury which appears to happen yearly and rely on depth rather than spare parts.
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Post by jimmieray on Apr 17, 2024 7:52:18 GMT -5
well said. Their ability (or inability) to fix the o line I think is more critical in 24’. I can envision an improved offence with below average QB play coupled with average o line play. I have a hard time picturing one of our existing QBs or a rookie improving our offence without decent o line play. Given Mara’s publically stated frustration with the line, I’d rather stand in front of him in 25’ saying we’ve fixed the o line but need a QB, vs saying we’ve drafted our future franchise QB but it won’t look like it until we fix the o line. you could go OL yet you’re sending one of your FA or potential starters to the bench. Then again, could bank on injury which appears to happen yearly and rely on depth rather than spare parts. All true. Do you think there can be anything revealed between now and the draft about what the new line coach can do with the current group, and Neal in particular? That would seem to be a major factor.
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Modog
Special Teams
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Post by Modog on Apr 17, 2024 7:52:35 GMT -5
Has a GM given a bad at best a backup level QB 90m guaranteed and survived? I can't think of one. In comparison the following bad QBs got: Brock Oswieler got 37m guaranteed Blake Bortles got 26m guaranteed DJs deal truly stands alone d sadly it's what the so called market is to where one fool gets paid now everyone after him gets around the same or more. crazy backasswards world we live in where folks who entertain are golden smmfh............. Market does always go up, but some teams are smart like the Bucs who only gave 50m guaranteed to Baker Mayfield. Dan Jones deal truly is an outlier.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 17, 2024 7:58:30 GMT -5
you could go OL yet you’re sending one of your FA or potential starters to the bench. Then again, could bank on injury which appears to happen yearly and rely on depth rather than spare parts. All true. Do you think there can be anything revealed between now and the draft about what the new line coach can do with the current group, and Neal in particular? That would seem to be a major factor. Not sure what can revealed. Heck, even if the Giants did go OL can we trust the unit can block until we actually see it come Sept rather than the Dottinos’, Ranaan’ Vachianos’ etc speculating from now until then?
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Post by jimmieray on Apr 17, 2024 8:13:13 GMT -5
All true. Do you think there can be anything revealed between now and the draft about what the new line coach can do with the current group, and Neal in particular? That would seem to be a major factor. Not sure what can revealed. Heck, even if the Giants did go OL can we trust the unit can block until we actually see it come Sept rather than the Dottinos’, Ranaan’ Vachianos’ etc speculating from now until then? Yep, I'm living in some fantasy world where players who know they're not doing their jobs well but have a new coach all get together long before required and do everything they can to improve - like I would, if I didn't excel at my job. But they're not even allowed to meet with any coaches until now, and any real contact will be minimal.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 17, 2024 9:00:09 GMT -5
Not sure what can revealed. Heck, even if the Giants did go OL can we trust the unit can block until we actually see it come Sept rather than the Dottinos’, Ranaan’ Vachianos’ etc speculating from now until then? Yep, I'm living in some fantasy world where players who know they're not doing their jobs well but have a new coach all get together long before required and do everything they can to improve - like I would, if I didn't excel at my job. But they're not even allowed to meet with any coaches until now, and any real contact will be minimal. lol, idk but if the Giants do go OL with pick #6 I cannot think of another team in history drafting 3 OL within the top 6 a few years apart and collectively we all watch with our fingers crossed hoping we don’t witness a jailbreak to the QB b/c nobody can block.
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Post by jimmieray on Apr 17, 2024 9:15:33 GMT -5
Yep, I'm living in some fantasy world where players who know they're not doing their jobs well but have a new coach all get together long before required and do everything they can to improve - like I would, if I didn't excel at my job. But they're not even allowed to meet with any coaches until now, and any real contact will be minimal. lol, idk but if the Giants do go OL with pick #6 I cannot think of another team in history drafting 3 OL within the top 6 a few years apart and collectively we all watch with our fingers crossed hoping we don’t witness a jailbreak to the QB b/c nobody can block. Most are saying you absolutely cannot draft a LT like Alt and put him at RT, among other reasons. But if they did anyway, it would seem unfathomable that the line in general does not drastically improve.
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mendy
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Post by mendy on Apr 17, 2024 9:25:48 GMT -5
Has a GM given a bad at best a backup level QB 90m guaranteed and survived? I can't think of one. In comparison the following bad QBs got: Brock Oswieler got 37m guaranteed Blake Bortles got 26m guaranteed DJs deal truly stands alone How much is Kyler Murray making? He has a codicil in his contract he has to watch film, just saying.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 17, 2024 9:27:00 GMT -5
lol, idk but if the Giants do go OL with pick #6 I cannot think of another team in history drafting 3 OL within the top 6 a few years apart and collectively we all watch with our fingers crossed hoping we don’t witness a jailbreak to the QB b/c nobody can block. Most are saying you absolutely cannot draft a LT like Alt and put him at RT, among other reasons. But if they did anyway, it would seem unfathomable that the line in general does not drastically improve. yeah, perfect world would be sliding Neal inside and suddenly a dominant OL for Barkley. Oh wait, we fixed the OL after he left. Personally, I want a QB or move back.
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Post by Jomo on Apr 17, 2024 9:50:09 GMT -5
He's had two seasons, were they supposed to fire him because Jones was injured? Apparently....
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Post by bluebuddha on Apr 17, 2024 9:54:08 GMT -5
Has a GM given a bad at best a backup level QB 90m guaranteed and survived? I can't think of one. In comparison the following bad QBs got: Brock Oswieler got 37m guaranteed Blake Bortles got 26m guaranteed DJs deal truly stands alone How much is Kyler Murray making? He has a codicil in his contract he has to watch film, just saying. 120 Tds vs 60 Tds.
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Post by Danke Schoen on Apr 17, 2024 9:56:00 GMT -5
Second chance?
He’s had two seasons.
The draft can’t get here soon enough.
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Post by myronguyton29 on Apr 17, 2024 10:12:54 GMT -5
Yep, I'm living in some fantasy world where players who know they're not doing their jobs well but have a new coach all get together long before required and do everything they can to improve - like I would, if I didn't excel at my job. But they're not even allowed to meet with any coaches until now, and any real contact will be minimal. lol, idk but if the Giants do go OL with pick #6 I cannot think of another team in history drafting 3 OL within the top 6 a few years apart and collectively we all watch with our fingers crossed hoping we don’t witness a jailbreak to the QB b/c nobody can block. I bet it's WR and if anything go back up to get a qb if they want a qb
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Post by jimmieray on Apr 17, 2024 11:38:49 GMT -5
Most are saying you absolutely cannot draft a LT like Alt and put him at RT, among other reasons. But if they did anyway, it would seem unfathomable that the line in general does not drastically improve. yeah, perfect world would be sliding Neal inside and suddenly a dominant OL for Barkley. Oh wait, we fixed the OL after he left. Personally, I want a QB or move back. A dominant line would be so refreshing to see, after a decade of the complete opposite. For whatever RB, RB by committee, or QB. But again, the list of reasons they can't take Alt is a very long one.
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Post by inthezone on Apr 17, 2024 11:50:00 GMT -5
yeah, perfect world would be sliding Neal inside and suddenly a dominant OL for Barkley. Oh wait, we fixed the OL after he left. Personally, I want a QB or move back. A dominant line would be so refreshing to see, after a decade of the complete opposite. For whatever RB, RB by committee, or QB. But again, the list of reasons they can't take Alt is a very long one.I disagree and would be interested in this long list of yours. He would be a better choice then any WR at 6.
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Post by jimmieray on Apr 17, 2024 12:10:38 GMT -5
A dominant line would be so refreshing to see, after a decade of the complete opposite. For whatever RB, RB by committee, or QB. But again, the list of reasons they can't take Alt is a very long one.I disagree and would be interested in this long list of yours. He would be a better choice then any WR at 6. It's a compilation of what others here have posted, I don't watch college but respect and try to learn from you guys: A team can't repeatedly spend value draft capital over a short time at a single position, unless it's a QB. Neal's draft capital dictates that he deserves more time to work things out at RT, and not be "wasted" as just a Guard. Alt (I believe) has only played LT, there's no absolute guarantee he will adapt well to RT, and his draft value at #6 should not be spent for a RT. Our current roster is below average at QB and WR, with no difference makers that most other teams carry. Again, what I've read and considered to be real concerns. But if they did take Alt, I wouldn't get upset and would look forward to the results.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 17, 2024 12:17:10 GMT -5
lol, idk but if the Giants do go OL with pick #6 I cannot think of another team in history drafting 3 OL within the top 6 a few years apart and collectively we all watch with our fingers crossed hoping we don’t witness a jailbreak to the QB b/c nobody can block. I bet it's WR and if anything go back up to get a qb if they want a qb Draft a WR at #6 and then move up for one??
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Post by Nick6475 on Apr 17, 2024 12:18:42 GMT -5
A dominant line would be so refreshing to see, after a decade of the complete opposite. For whatever RB, RB by committee, or QB. But again, the list of reasons they can't take Alt is a very long one.I disagree and would be interested in this long list of yours. He would be a better choice then any WR at 6. I don't think it is a long list, but here are my three reasons. 1) Alt has only played LT. Using the #6 pick to play him at another position is not a good investment. 2) One of Neal/Eleumanor/Runyan will have to be depth which is good, but it's expensive depth. 3) That is a lot of money to invest in the OL and this could cause the Giants issues of lack of resources at other positions down the road.
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Modog
Special Teams
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Post by Modog on Apr 17, 2024 12:24:21 GMT -5
Has a GM given a bad at best a backup level QB 90m guaranteed and survived? I can't think of one. In comparison the following bad QBs got: Brock Oswieler got 37m guaranteed Blake Bortles got 26m guaranteed DJs deal truly stands alone How much is Kyler Murray making? He has a codicil in his contract he has to watch film, just saying. . Look at Murrays production his first three years. That's what got him paid. Having said that, I'm sure Cards regret that decision now especially after he tore his ACL in 2022. Still, he had a better body of work when he got his deal, compared to DJ who only has that one playoff win against an historically bad Vikings Defense
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mendy
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Post by mendy on Apr 17, 2024 12:37:31 GMT -5
How much is Kyler Murray making? He has a codicil in his contract he has to watch film, just saying. 120 Tds vs 60 Tds. How many playoff games has he won?
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mendy
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Post by mendy on Apr 17, 2024 12:38:27 GMT -5
How much is Kyler Murray making? He has a codicil in his contract he has to watch film, just saying. . Look at Murrays production his first three years. That's what got him paid. Having said that, I'm sure Cards regret that decision now especially after he tore his ACL in 2022. Still, he had a better body of work when he got his deal, compared to DJ who only has that one playoff win against an historically bad Vikings Defense And Murray has none..............keep trying. You asked a question and I proved you wrong.
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Post by inthezone on Apr 17, 2024 12:57:07 GMT -5
I disagree and would be interested in this long list of yours. He would be a better choice then any WR at 6. It's a compilation of what others here have posted, I don't watch college but respect and try to learn from you guys: A team can't repeatedly spend value draft capital over a short time at a single position, unless it's a QB. Neal's draft capital dictates that he deserves more time to work things out at RT, and not be "wasted" as just a Guard. Alt (I believe) has only played LT, there's no absolute guarantee he will adapt well to RT, and his draft value at #6 should not be spent for a RT. Our current roster is below average at QB and WR, with no difference makers that most other teams carry. Again, what I've read and considered to be real concerns. But if they did take Alt, I wouldn't get upset and would look forward to the results. Thanks for the response but this isn't a long list. It's wild how so many have decided Jones was a bad decision but want to keep putting Neal out there. It also seems that many college LT come into the NFL and play other positions their 1st season before being put at the LT spot so maybe my memory is wrong for the 1st time but this whole can't play another position on the oline is weak BS. So many times you can read a scouting report of a college oline player that claims they are more suited for a different position then they played in college.
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Post by inthezone on Apr 17, 2024 13:03:00 GMT -5
I disagree and would be interested in this long list of yours. He would be a better choice then any WR at 6. I don't think it is a long list, but here are my three reasons. 1) Alt has only played LT. Using the #6 pick to play him at another position is not a good investment. 2) One of Neal/Eleumanor/Runyan will have to be depth which is good, but it's expensive depth. 3) That is a lot of money to invest in the OL and this could cause the Giants issues of lack of resources at other positions down the road. Thanks for the attempt but I find these excuses pretty weak. So many times college oline players are drafted and required to play a different spot or "projected" to play a different spot in the NFL but now it's bad to do with Alt. It's like nobody wants to admit that both Neal and Thomas are injury prone which trumps any of these excuses.
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Post by inthezone on Apr 17, 2024 13:05:34 GMT -5
. Look at Murrays production his first three years. That's what got him paid. Having said that, I'm sure Cards regret that decision now especially after he tore his ACL in 2022. Still, he had a better body of work when he got his deal, compared to DJ who only has that one playoff win against an historically bad Vikings Defense And Murray has none..............keep trying. You asked a question and I proved you wrong. Good luck with this kid he has tunnel vision hatred of the Jones contract that is rivaled only by giantbob71 that he makes this type of stuff up.
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mendy
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Post by mendy on Apr 17, 2024 13:08:32 GMT -5
And Murray has none..............keep trying. You asked a question and I proved you wrong. Good luck with this kid he has tunnel vision hatred of the Jones contract that is rivaled only by giantbob71 that he makes this type of stuff up. LOL, I know . He has been shot down before, him and his buddy.
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Post by inthezone on Apr 17, 2024 13:13:43 GMT -5
Good luck with this kid he has tunnel vision hatred of the Jones contract that is rivaled only by giantbob71 that he makes this type of stuff up. LOL, I know . He has been shot down before, him and his buddy. He has me blocked because I shot him down so expect that to happen for you also.
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