3days
Starter
Posts: 4,010
|
Post by 3days on May 27, 2021 15:56:47 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by giantlegacy on May 27, 2021 16:23:53 GMT -5
Definitely could be if Slayton establishes himself as a high end complimentary piece opposite Golladay.... And Toney can go deep as well ...
This could he a very fun explosive offense
|
|
|
Post by Martin on May 27, 2021 16:30:52 GMT -5
Put John Ross on the field with Toney at certain times and the opposing secondary with all our other weapons have a lot to think about.
|
|
|
Post by Kruunch on May 27, 2021 16:34:57 GMT -5
PFF has a knack of explaining meaningless stats. Our offense was embarrassing last year, but Jones is one of the best deep passers in the league? How is that possible? Look at their top 10 list. Out of all the quarterbacks, Jones has the least amount of pass attempts at 39. The second closest to him is Mayfield at 47. You would think they would at least put a minimum to 40-50 passes.
Leave it to PFF to find a silver lining in a Tsunami..
|
|
|
Post by Martin on May 27, 2021 16:43:29 GMT -5
PFF has a knack of explaining meaningless stats. Our offense was embarrassing last year, but Jones is one of the best deep passers in the league? How is that possible? Look at their top 10 list. Out of all the quarterbacks, Jones has the least amount of pass attempts at 39. The second closest to him is Mayfield at 47. You would think they would at least put a minimum to 40-50 passes. Leave it to PFF to find a silver lining in a Tsunami.. Jones has shown nothing yet same with Barkley. Consistency where is it? PFF?? who? crickets.......
|
|
|
Post by McCherry on May 27, 2021 16:55:51 GMT -5
PFF has a knack of explaining meaningless stats. Our offense was embarrassing last year, but Jones is one of the best deep passers in the league? How is that possible? Look at their top 10 list. Out of all the quarterbacks, Jones has the least amount of pass attempts at 39. The second closest to him is Mayfield at 47. You would think they would at least put a minimum to 40-50 passes. Leave it to PFF to find a silver lining in a Tsunami.. It wasn't even PFF who made the analysis. Jones was also 5th overall in the deep passing category in 2019.
|
|
|
Post by Nick6475 on May 27, 2021 17:05:17 GMT -5
PFF has a knack of explaining meaningless stats. Our offense was embarrassing last year, but Jones is one of the best deep passers in the league? How is that possible? Look at their top 10 list. Out of all the quarterbacks, Jones has the least amount of pass attempts at 39. The second closest to him is Mayfield at 47. You would think they would at least put a minimum to 40-50 passes. Leave it to PFF to find a silver lining in a Tsunami.. I like how the minimum you came up with is one attempt more than Jones' total as if the one extra attempt would now make him relevant.
|
|
|
Post by IrishMike on May 27, 2021 17:12:24 GMT -5
The issue with being a deep threat team is you need the OL to do it. Jones has always had a nice deep ball, even back in college. Golladay is a very good deep ball WR for obvious reasons. Ross has great speed, Slayton is good going deep. Toney and Shep are more short/intermediate guys. How will the OL hold up? How will Barkley effect things?
Bottom line is we look like a team that can threaten people deep but until we prove it on the field it doesn't matter.
|
|
|
Post by Kruunch on May 27, 2021 17:13:16 GMT -5
PFF has a knack of explaining meaningless stats. Our offense was embarrassing last year, but Jones is one of the best deep passers in the league? How is that possible? Look at their top 10 list. Out of all the quarterbacks, Jones has the least amount of pass attempts at 39. The second closest to him is Mayfield at 47. You would think they would at least put a minimum to 40-50 passes. Leave it to PFF to find a silver lining in a Tsunami.. It wasn't even PFF who made the analysis. Jones was also 5th overall in 2019. So what? PFF, next gen stats. Same shit. That’s great. We score as much as the elephant man at the playboy mansion. But, we can throw the deep ball as good as anyone. PFF has a knack of explaining meaningless stats. Our offense was embarrassing last year, but Jones is one of the best deep passers in the league? How is that possible? Look at their top 10 list. Out of all the quarterbacks, Jones has the least amount of pass attempts at 39. The second closest to him is Mayfield at 47. You would think they would at least put a minimum to 40-50 passes. Leave it to PFF to find a silver lining in a Tsunami.. I like how the minimum you came up with is one attempt more than Jones' total as if the one extra attempt would now make him relevant. That’s the point.. It’s ridiculous..
|
|
|
Post by ThatGuyRich on May 27, 2021 18:12:43 GMT -5
Put John Ross on the field with Toney at certain times and the opposing secondary with all our other weapons have a lot to think about. Martin ya know we have a lot of combo's. Not only Ross and Toney but Goloday and Slayton as well. You could even throw engram in there. Our OL must hold up to give Jones 4 seconds to throw deep. But this offense has pieces this year. It's up to Jones and the OL. If they can improve and step up the sky is the limit. But I think I'm at the point till I see it then I'll believe it. So many things have gone wrong the last 8 years or so. But this is the first time in 4 years I'm actually cautiously optimistic as they say.
|
|
|
Post by TheAnalyst on May 27, 2021 18:16:19 GMT -5
Too bad our OL could be a short to intermediate unit. They need to hold up.
|
|
|
Post by IrishMike on May 27, 2021 18:56:48 GMT -5
Too bad our OL could be a short to intermediate unit. They need to hold up. My real hope is that they do well enough in the run game to make Barkley a real threat and that sucks up the D for the play action. IMO that is how our deep game would be most effective. Sure John Ross can run past any defender in the league, but if the Safety is 20 yards down the field already it doesn't matter.
|
|
|
Post by Martin on May 27, 2021 19:31:53 GMT -5
Put John Ross on the field with Toney at certain times and the opposing secondary with all our other weapons have a lot to think about. Martin ya know we have a lot of combo's. Not only Ross and Toney but Goloday and Slayton as well. You could even throw engram in there. Our OL must hold up to give Jones 4 seconds to throw deep. But this offense has pieces this year. It's up to Jones and the OL. If they can improve and step up the sky is the limit. But I think I'm at the point till I see it then I'll believe it. So many things have gone wrong the last 8 years or so. But this is the first time in 4 years I'm actually cautiously optimistic as they say. Me too.... cautiously optimistic. Yes it all boils down to consistent play by Jones and oline. Weapons? we have plenty and lets not forget the D is gonna be real good.
|
|
|
Post by lexington11 on May 27, 2021 21:22:22 GMT -5
PFF has a knack of explaining meaningless stats. Our offense was embarrassing last year, but Jones is one of the best deep passers in the league? How is that possible? Look at their top 10 list. Out of all the quarterbacks, Jones has the least amount of pass attempts at 39. The second closest to him is Mayfield at 47. You would think they would at least put a minimum to 40-50 passes. Leave it to PFF to find a silver lining in a Tsunami.. it is so. He had the most catchable deep ball in football last year, and his senior year the most accurate deep ball in the country.
|
|
|
Post by giantlegacy on May 27, 2021 22:23:51 GMT -5
Too bad our OL could be a short to intermediate unit. They need to hold up. My real hope is that they do well enough in the run game to make Barkley a real threat and that sucks up the D for the play action. IMO that is how our deep game would be most effective. Sure John Ross can run past any defender in the league, but if the Safety is 20 yards down the field already it doesn't matter. It's not how modern NFL offenses work these days Until teams are frightened of our deep weapons they will clog the short area... It's not rum it into a brick wall a bunch of times before you try to pass it league Even the Titans passed vertical to open up lanes for Henry last year Now with that said it will be interesting how much respect Golladay gets early...maybe design deep passes to Slayton to take advantage of a lesser corner on him one on one if Golliday is bracketed... If teams fear our weapons there will be far less players in tbe box than we have become used to since the Odell trade .....which also makes it easier for the O line... Also quick hitters/missle screens to Toney will slow down pass rush as well
|
|
|
Post by ocgiant on May 27, 2021 23:00:06 GMT -5
On Paper and reading it about it; is one thing
Yes, we all dream... and I am ready for this nightmare of Giants losing for several seasons to be over
On the field, this fall, winning, is all that counts
|
|
|
Post by Sarcasman on May 28, 2021 1:03:01 GMT -5
Too bad our OL could be a short to intermediate unit. They need to hold up. That'll decide it. You can't throw deep if the OL isn't holding up.
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on May 28, 2021 5:28:13 GMT -5
they are nothing if the OL and Jones dont get their game right
|
|
Merlin
Special Teams
Posts: 344
|
Post by Merlin on May 28, 2021 7:20:16 GMT -5
Too bad our OL could be a short to intermediate unit. They need to hold up. My real hope is that they do well enough in the run game to make Barkley a real threat and that sucks up the D for the play action. IMO that is how our deep game would be most effective. Sure John Ross can run past any defender in the league, but if the Safety is 20 yards down the field already it doesn't matter. The threat of the deep ball at the same time opens up the run game. As Dbacks will need to play deeper to account for someone like Golladay. Also pulling ppl out of the box.
|
|
|
Post by piddy283 on May 28, 2021 8:19:47 GMT -5
As long as the OL can hold the line consistently, there's no reason why we shouldn't be a deep threat team.
I'm not too sure about the article claiming DJ is the best deep throwing QB, but hey.....I'll run with it.
Slayton, Engram, KT, Pettis, and Ross are all players who can take the top off of any defense.
KG is a deep threat in his own right, along with Barkley coming out of the backfield.
Our offense is in good shape.
|
|
|
Post by TEM on May 28, 2021 8:32:09 GMT -5
We are deep TE, WR and RB. ? OL and QB.
|
|
te88
Special Teams
Posts: 1,963
|
Post by te88 on May 28, 2021 8:39:25 GMT -5
The issue with being a deep threat team is you need the OL to do it. Jones has always had a nice deep ball, even back in college. Golladay is a very good deep ball WR for obvious reasons. Ross has great speed, Slayton is good going deep. Toney and Shep are more short/intermediate guys. How will the OL hold up? How will Barkley effect things? Bottom line is we look like a team that can threaten people deep but until we prove it on the field it doesn't matter. True enough. But Jones is very athletic and should be able to scramble. He has shown he can run, now time to develop the scrambling skills to buy time, ala Rogers, Big Ben, Wilson, etc.
|
|
te88
Special Teams
Posts: 1,963
|
Post by te88 on May 28, 2021 8:41:20 GMT -5
Too bad our OL could be a short to intermediate unit. They need to hold up. My real hope is that they do well enough in the run game to make Barkley a real threat and that sucks up the D for the play action. IMO that is how our deep game would be most effective. Sure John Ross can run past any defender in the league, but if the Safety is 20 yards down the field already it doesn't matter. You don’t need a running game to use play action. Debunked is recent years. Everybody should be using play action on a regular basis no matter what your running game is. It actually works best the opposite way where PA and the passing attack opens things up for the run
|
|
|
Post by nick030567 on May 28, 2021 8:57:35 GMT -5
Definitely could be if Slayton establishes himself as a high end complimentary piece opposite Golladay.... And Toney can go deep as well ... This could he a very fun explosive offense And we all know how good the defense was last year. With less time on the field and better personnel, they should only get better.
|
|
|
Post by TEM on May 28, 2021 9:29:38 GMT -5
Too bad our OL could be a short to intermediate unit. They need to hold up. My real hope is that they do well enough in the run game to make Barkley a real threat and that sucks up the D for the play action. IMO that is how our deep game would be most effective. Sure John Ross can run past any defender in the league, but if the Safety is 20 yards down the field already it doesn't matter.If our line can open holes and DC does that . We will run the ball down their throat
|
|
|
Post by giantlegacy on May 28, 2021 9:54:05 GMT -5
As long as the OL can hold the line consistently, there's no reason why we shouldn't be a deep threat team. I'm not too sure about the article claiming DJ is the best deep throwing QB, but hey.....I'll run with it. Slayton, Engram, KT, Pettis, and Ross are all players who can take the top off of any defense. KG is a deep threat in his own right, along with Barkley coming out of the backfield. Our offense is in good shape. If the oline is even functional (which..let's be honest..the 2011 line was functional at best pass blocking)and can be above average run blocking this is a top 10 lethal offense (as long as Jones doesn't go Blane Gabbert on us)
|
|
|
Post by giantlegacy on May 28, 2021 9:57:37 GMT -5
My real hope is that they do well enough in the run game to make Barkley a real threat and that sucks up the D for the play action. IMO that is how our deep game would be most effective. Sure John Ross can run past any defender in the league, but if the Safety is 20 yards down the field already it doesn't matter. You don’t need a running game to use play action. Debunked is recent years. Everybody should be using play action on a regular basis no matter what your running game is. It actually works best the opposite way where PA and the passing attack opens things up for the run Modern NFL actually uses play action most plays...RPO is the new play action and really forces the 2nd level to have to freeze to think who has the balk,QB,RB or is it a pase.... It's why most teams use shotgun/pistol as their base offense these days. So also debunked the past 5 years are that QBs have to learn how to play under center and in a huddle as many teams (including us as Garret loves up tempo when he gets a match up on field he likes..he did it a bit in Dallas as well)
|
|
|
Post by giantlegacy on May 28, 2021 10:04:34 GMT -5
Also I really think all these weapons makes Engram very expendable..
If it turns out our WR group is all that we could be a better 11 team than 12..meaning I would rather have Rudolph out there full time..and he would have a ton of green all by himself to be a chain moving machine (like Brate and Hronk were in the Super Bowl when the Chiefs were in a very deep zone all game )
And in a 12 I think Smitb is much more dependable than Engram and also a better blocker.... Golliday/Slayton or Toney outside with Smitb/Rudolph...this is what devastated KC all superbowl ..
I'd rather tbe TEs be dependable chain movers/red zone targets and help our blocking in the run game with 2 dynamic threats outside than what amounts to an unreliable gadget toy ...I mean it's cool if your TE can run jet sweeps and missle screens but when we have the perceived weaponry we have do we really need this from our TE?
Hell.....depending where we pick with our 2nd pick get Bavaro 2.0(that kid from Notre Dame )next year as a luxury toy BPA if we want a gimmick TE
|
|
nyg2
Starter
Posts: 4,554
|
Post by nyg2 on May 28, 2021 10:16:36 GMT -5
I like how the minimum you came up with is one attempt more than Jones' total as if the one extra attempt would now make him relevant. That’s the point.. It’s ridiculous.. I think the point that he was trying to make was that you choose a number based on Daniel Jones' stats that would allow you to only disqualify and criticize him. An if that's the main critique, then let's make it 50 deep pass attempts we know that 8 QBs on that top-10 list have a minimum of 50 deep pass attempts, that way there's no rational argument that can be made that the number that was chosen was based on any particular player, but on the minimum threshold that a majority on that top-10 list were able to clear. When comparing Daniel Jones stats to Aaron Rodgers for example who's ranked #4, no one can honestly by looking at just the stats not next gen analytics, make an argument that he's a better deep passer than Aaron Rodgers. Daniel Jones Aaron RodgersDeep Completions: 19 31 Deep Attempts: 39 74 Yards: 636 1,219
TD: 5 12 INT: 0 0
|
|
|
Post by Kruunch on May 28, 2021 10:39:59 GMT -5
That’s the point.. It’s ridiculous.. I think the point that he was trying to make was that you choose a number based on Daniel Jones' stats that would allow you to only disqualify and criticize him. An if that's the main critique, then let's make it 50 deep pass attempts we know that 8 QBs on that top-10 list have a minimum of 50 deep pass attempts, that way there's no rational argument that can be made that the number that was chosen was based on any particular player, but on the minimum threshold that a majority on that top-10 list were able to clear. When comparing Daniel Jones stats to Aaron Rodgers for example who's ranked #4, no one can honestly by looking at just the stats not next gen analytics, make an argument that he's a better deep passer than Aaron Rodgers. Daniel Jones Aaron RodgersDeep Completions: 19 31 Deep Attempts: 39 74 Yards: 636 1,219
TD: 5 12 INT: 0 0 That’s the thing.. I’m ridiculing the whole thing. Daniel Jones just happens to have the least amount of pass attempts to the rest of his peers. To make it a fair debate, you have to give it a number of pass attempts that compares to the rest of the league. It’s like saying Odell Beckham has the all time quarterback rating in league history.
|
|