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Post by McCherry on Jul 29, 2021 9:51:57 GMT -5
Let me get this straight... They wanted him to lose 17 pounds in a month? Is that even possible, or even healthy? The Giants knew exactly what they were getting, they should’ve cut him then, or let him compete if he passed all the physicals. It sounds like the HC and GM were on a totally different page with this player. That's the first time I ever heard of a player being cut during practice. Sorry, but the whole thing sounds weird. In the last 2 seasons we’ve had the Baker, debacle, the Colombo debacle, the Toney debacles, now this... Can we get back to being a normal team and stop making headlines for all the wrong reasons? Math .. its not just for kids anymore..
Mini- camp was probably 2 months or so ago...so 14 lbs in 8 - 10 wks is not a hard ask
Minicamp was last month.
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Post by giants8493 on Jul 29, 2021 9:58:51 GMT -5
The more I read about this thing the crazier it gets. He says judge was ripping him for gaining weight then Benjamin says "so you want me to play tight end at a lower weight then when I played WR? Yeah that made judge real quiet" BRO judge was probably biting his tongue to keep himself from laughing his ass off. A 255 pound WR? No wonder he could not hang in the league. Dude is delusional
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Post by ratbastich on Jul 29, 2021 10:08:37 GMT -5
The more I read about this thing the crazier it gets. He says judge was ripping him for gaining weight then Benjamin says "so you want me to play tight end at a lower weight then when I played WR? Yeah that made judge real quiet" BRO judge was probably biting his tongue to keep himself from laughing his ass off. A 255 pound WR? No wonder he could not hang in the league. Dude is delusional The way this whole thing seems to be going, he may be beyond delusional and have some really deep deep issues other than being hungry. I think we should call this Sandwich Gate. They need to check his car, he probably has empty Big Gulp cups, candy bar wrappers, etc. Probably couldn't read the playbook because of pizza sauce stains...he was in the wrong place because he didn't realize a piece of pepperoni wasn't actually him on the play.
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Post by McCherry on Jul 29, 2021 10:16:24 GMT -5
No more pigskins for him unless he pays for them. He said that he is now officially done with football. I honestly wish the best for him going forward in his life. I also hope that he get his weight issues under control. The Giants decision to move on from him was strictly business and not personal. The Giants came to him. He was retired for 3 years, he had no obligations to stay in shape. They signed him after a tryout, and paid him almost $1M, which counts against the cap when they knew he was out of shape. Benjamin didn't live up to his obligations, but this was not a smart move by the Giants from the beginning. They could’ve used that money elsewhere, say an O-lineman.
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Post by Nite on Jul 29, 2021 10:17:26 GMT -5
Math .. its not just for kids anymore..
Mini- camp was probably 2 months or so ago...so 14 lbs in 8 - 10 wks is not a hard ask
Minicamp was last month. He was at the rookie mini camp and that was about 2 months ago
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Post by McCherry on Jul 29, 2021 10:25:10 GMT -5
He was at the rookie mini camp and that was about 2 months ago
That was his tryout in rookie minicamp. If you read the story, he said they told him to lose the weight after veteran minicamp in June.
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Post by repeatchamps on Jul 29, 2021 11:08:24 GMT -5
Hmmm hold on. Kelvin's side of the story concerns me a bit. Why did they want him to be smaller than he was when he was a WR? It's very simple. Engram is 6'3 240, Benjamin at one point in his career was 245 at 6'5. They asked for 251 which is a lot to ask in a short time but an ideal playing weight for someone his size who wants to go from WR to TE. He came in at 268. I mean at least come in at 255 - 260 and I think Judge/Gettleman would have worked with that. Honestly, I would have cut him right when he got off the scale.
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Post by TCHOF on Jul 29, 2021 11:24:02 GMT -5
Hmmm hold on. Kelvin's side of the story concerns me a bit. Why did they want him to be smaller than he was when he was a WR? It's very simple. Engram is 6'3 240, Benjamin at one point in his career was 245 at 6'5. They asked for 251 which is a lot to ask in a short time but an ideal playing weight for someone his size who wants to go from WR to TE. He came in at 268. I mean a least come in at 255 - 260 and I think Judge/Gettleman would have worked with that. Honestly, I would have cut him right when he got off the scale. Your boss tells you to lose 14 pounds and instead you gain 3 … and you don’t go seek him out with an explanation after you weigh in? Instead, you freak out and storm off the field when he raises the issue? So odd
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Post by repeatchamps on Jul 29, 2021 11:36:54 GMT -5
It's very simple. Engram is 6'3 240, Benjamin at one point in his career was 245 at 6'5. They asked for 251 which is a lot to ask in a short time but an ideal playing weight for someone his size who wants to go from WR to TE. He came in at 268. I mean a least come in at 255 - 260 and I think Judge/Gettleman would have worked with that. Honestly, I would have cut him right when he got off the scale. Your boss tells you to lose 14 pounds and instead you gain 3 … and you don’t go seek him out with an explanation after you weigh in? Instead, you freak out and storm off the field when he raises the issue? So odd Yeah. Like I said if he came in 255 or even 260 they'd probably work with that. Kelce is 6'5 and 260. Gronk is 6'5 and 265. It's also about body frame too. Benjamin is not as broad shouldered as a Gronk or even a Kelce.
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Post by OrangeGiant on Jul 29, 2021 12:43:55 GMT -5
What this clown just doesn't get is that your potential future HC asked you to do something. You have been out of the league for 3 years. It probably wasn't even so much the weight as it was JJ checking to see just how motivated he was. If you are really motivated to get back in the league, you will do what the HC asks, whether it's lose weight, gain weight, whatever.
It was a motivation test...he failed, and he's surprised?
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katcavage75
Special Teams
Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence.- Vince Lombardi
Posts: 360
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Post by katcavage75 on Jul 29, 2021 13:16:14 GMT -5
Was told to be at 251 on Day 1 of practice. Reported at 268. +17 Buhbye.
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Post by jimmieray on Jul 29, 2021 14:39:37 GMT -5
Not for nothing, a WR transitioning to TE isnt likely going to be used for his blocking ability. The skill you have as a WR, they want you to be a weapon. For him to say "I put on muscle" when he was told to lose the weight means he failed the test. If it were somebody who really wanted to be in the league, they would have made more of an effort to lose the weight. Clearly not Kelvin. But if he did stick, he would have to block at times. They can't just put him in formations where you aren't expecting to block, there's no element of surprise then - and they knew he wouldn't have WR speed, regardless of what weight he came in as. Was he really any "fatter" than what we expect to see in Rudolf, once he's ready?
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robl
Special Teams
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Post by robl on Jul 29, 2021 15:17:54 GMT -5
So the other option would be to tell him to come back 20 pounds heavier and have him play guard in place of Lemieux.
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Post by snyder55 on Jul 29, 2021 15:40:23 GMT -5
It is very easy to rag on the player in situations like this. However, it is totally warranted this time around. Benjamin did not handle his side of their agreement and the Giants acted accordingly. Nothing more or less. this whole story shows me how badly he didn't want it..
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Post by snyder55 on Jul 29, 2021 15:46:54 GMT -5
He said that he is now officially done with football. I honestly wish the best for him going forward in his life. I also hope that he get his weight issues under control. The Giants decision to move on from him was strictly business and not personal. The Giants came to him. He was retired for 3 years, he had no obligations to stay in shape. They signed him after a tryout, and paid him almost $1M, which counts against the cap when they knew he was out of shape. Benjamin didn't live up to his obligations, but this was not a smart move by the Giants from the beginning. They could’ve used that money elsewhere, say an O-lineman. somebody in the Giants organization who interviewed Benjamin had to have seen he was out of shape and they should have told him to be at a certain weight when he showed up or the deal was off, the Giants made a very dumb move, there are a lot of poor people struggling to survive these days who could have put that kind of money to far better use but instead the Giants just threw away this money for nothing....whatever happened to the value of a million dollars
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Post by Kruunch on Jul 29, 2021 16:37:23 GMT -5
Not for nothing, a WR transitioning to TE isnt likely going to be used for his blocking ability. The skill you have as a WR, they want you to be a weapon. For him to say "I put on muscle" when he was told to lose the weight means he failed the test. If it were somebody who really wanted to be in the league, they would have made more of an effort to lose the weight. Clearly not Kelvin. But if he did stick, he would have to block at times. They can't just put him in formations where you aren't expecting to block, there's no element of surprise then - and they knew he wouldn't have WR speed, regardless of what weight he came in as. Was he really any "fatter" than what we expect to see in Rudolf, once he's ready? He was released before he broke a sweat. The Giants never had intentions on keeping him. It was an experiment, and now it’s a distant memory.
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Post by jb456 on Jul 29, 2021 17:06:21 GMT -5
He said that he is now officially done with football. I honestly wish the best for him going forward in his life. I also hope that he get his weight issues under control. The Giants decision to move on from him was strictly business and not personal. The Giants came to him. He was retired for 3 years, he had no obligations to stay in shape. They signed him after a tryout, and paid him almost $1M, which counts against the cap when they knew he was out of shape. Benjamin didn't live up to his obligations, but this was not a smart move by the Giants from the beginning. They could’ve used that money elsewhere, say an O-lineman. I doubt he was given a $1M guaranteed salary. I don't even see him on spotrac. Also, a NFL cap guy could find $1M if he he drank an entire bottle of tequila...
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Post by jimmieray on Jul 29, 2021 17:08:05 GMT -5
But if he did stick, he would have to block at times. They can't just put him in formations where you aren't expecting to block, there's no element of surprise then - and they knew he wouldn't have WR speed, regardless of what weight he came in as. Was he really any "fatter" than what we expect to see in Rudolf, once he's ready? He was released before he broke a sweat. The Giants never had intentions on keeping him. It was an experiment, and now it’s a distant memory. I'd normally let this go, and enjoy a few jokes at his expense. But TE is still unnecessarily a question mark, with the current group. This was an ill conceived experiment - but if the guy really did come in with more muscle weight, than at least see what he can do blocking with it.
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Post by Kruunch on Jul 29, 2021 17:44:02 GMT -5
He was released before he broke a sweat. The Giants never had intentions on keeping him. It was an experiment, and now it’s a distant memory. I'd normally let this go, and enjoy a few jokes at his expense. But TE is still unnecessarily a question mark, with the current group. This was an ill conceived experiment - but if the guy really did come in with more muscle weight, than at least see what he can do blocking with it. Unless the English language is not Benjamin’s strong points. You do not report to camp over weight. The muscle mass excuse doesn’t work. A player who’s hanging by a thread to make the team, needs to be more proactive with his weight. If he can’t take that serious enough. Who cares to see how he blocks..
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Post by McCherry on Jul 29, 2021 18:27:19 GMT -5
The Giants came to him. He was retired for 3 years, he had no obligations to stay in shape. They signed him after a tryout, and paid him almost $1M, which counts against the cap when they knew he was out of shape. Benjamin didn't live up to his obligations, but this was not a smart move by the Giants from the beginning. They could’ve used that money elsewhere, say an O-lineman. I doubt he was given a $1M guaranteed salary. I don't even see him on spotrac. Also, a NFL cap guy could find $1M if he he drank an entire bottle of tequila... I'm sure it wasn't, but that's money against the cap that could've been spent on another player, like a Guard, which we may need.
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Post by jb456 on Jul 29, 2021 18:35:04 GMT -5
I doubt he was given a $1M guaranteed salary. I don't even see him on spotrac. Also, a NFL cap guy could find $1M if he he drank an entire bottle of tequila... I'm sure it wasn't, but that's money against the cap that could've been spent on another player, like a Guard, which we may need. Yeah, I don't think anyone would disagree you there. One of the weakest position group just got weaker....
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te88
Special Teams
Posts: 1,998
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Post by te88 on Jul 29, 2021 19:16:54 GMT -5
It's very simple. Engram is 6'3 240, Benjamin at one point in his career was 245 at 6'5. They asked for 251 which is a lot to ask in a short time but an ideal playing weight for someone his size who wants to go from WR to TE. He came in at 268. I mean a least come in at 255 - 260 and I think Judge/Gettleman would have worked with that. Honestly, I would have cut him right when he got off the scale. Your boss tells you to lose 14 pounds and instead you gain 3 … and you don’t go seek him out with an explanation after you weigh in? Instead, you freak out and storm off the field when he raises the issue? So odd Benjamin just doesn’t get that he is too fat. Never has understood and never will evidently. It is not even about what he is capable of doing and what he isn’t at the weight. It is about being a lazy ass who doesn’t take direction. It’s pretty obvious why Judge didn’t give him the time of day. I’m sure that was an “I told you so.” from Judge to Gettleman afterwards.
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Post by trueblueatnyc on Jul 29, 2021 21:21:21 GMT -5
Outside of the weirdness of it all, this was the likely end result of this experiment to begin with.
A few things though don't add up with Benjamin's story. If the team told him back in May that they wanted him to play at 250, and he thought he should play at 268, then why wouldn't he bring that up back in May? Why just show up at that weight and then try to make the case of what his playing weight should be? He says it should be a collaboration, but he didn't seem to do too much collaboration of his own in communicating with the team about his playing weight. More likely, he just ignored what the team told him to do.
Also, he may have passed the conditioning test, but maybe he just barely passed it?
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Post by jb456 on Jul 30, 2021 7:51:35 GMT -5
It is very easy to rag on the player in situations like this. However, it is totally warranted this time around. Benjamin did not handle his side of their agreement and the Giants acted accordingly. Nothing more or less. this whole story shows me how badly he didn't want it.. He absolutely didn't want it. You know how I know he didn't want it, from his own words. Benjamin said the experience with the Giants soured his feelings about the NFL. He doesn’t intend to pursue any more opportunities in the league. He plans to move back to Florida and “try and relax and just get back to living life. Does that sound like a player who wanted it? This sounds like a person who felt guilty of being lazy when his wife or parents asked him what he was going to do with the rest of his life now that he was retired at 30.
I don't even know why this story is getting so much traction and interest on this board. Benjamin had a vet min deal with no guaranteed money. He did the opposite of what the coaches asked him to do by GAINING weight when they asked him to lose it and then starts playing the victim. If I was giving a last chance to rejuvenate my career and was told I needed to do something by my employer, I would do it. I'm sorry fellas, anyone defending this guy is completely out of touch with reality....
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Post by IrishMike on Jul 30, 2021 10:44:07 GMT -5
If you read the full stories and reports now coming out it wasn't just about the weight. Judge said something to him on the practice field and Benjamin had words for Joe Judge and DG had to get in the middle of them. I see a pattern here. Do what the F Judge tells you to or you're gone. Coach, player...does not matter. You argue with the HC and you're gone. Makes sense to me.
Reminds me of a guy I knew in the military. He was at the 16 year mark, four left before he could retire. He failed a PT test for being fat. 6months later fails again, then again 6 months later, then again. He ended up having 2 years to lose weight and simply didn't. Got kicked out at the 18 year mark cause he didn't want to work for it. See ya.
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Post by Kruunch on Jul 30, 2021 18:04:28 GMT -5
If you read the full stories and reports now coming out it wasn't just about the weight. Judge said something to him on the practice field and Benjamin had words for Joe Judge and DG had to get in the middle of them. I see a pattern here. Do what the F Judge tells you to or you're gone. Coach, player...does not matter. You argue with the HC and you're gone. Makes sense to me.
Reminds me of a guy I knew in the military. He was at the 16 year mark, four left before he could retire. He failed a PT test for being fat. 6months later fails again, then again 6 months later, then again. He ended up having 2 years to lose weight and simply didn't. Got kicked out at the 18 year mark cause he didn't want to work for it. See ya.
Two years to lose weight and he still couldn’t do it? Here’s an idea, sew your mouth shut..
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Post by McCherry on Jul 30, 2021 18:26:16 GMT -5
If you read the full stories and reports now coming out it wasn't just about the weight. Judge said something to him on the practice field and Benjamin had words for Joe Judge and DG had to get in the middle of them. I see a pattern here. Do what the F Judge tells you to or you're gone. Coach, player...does not matter. You argue with the HC and you're gone. Makes sense to me.
Reminds me of a guy I knew in the military. He was at the 16 year mark, four left before he could retire. He failed a PT test for being fat. 6months later fails again, then again 6 months later, then again. He ended up having 2 years to lose weight and simply didn't. Got kicked out at the 18 year mark cause he didn't want to work for it. See ya.
Two years to lose weight and he still couldn’t do it? Here’s an idea, sew your mouth shut.. He had no intention of returning to football. The Giants came to him, nobody forced them to give a contract to a player who they felt was badly out of shape. He took their money with barely breaking a sweat. Smart move by him, the Giants not so much. I’d really like to know what the cap hit and guaranteed pay was.
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Post by Kruunch on Jul 30, 2021 18:29:51 GMT -5
Two years to lose weight and he still couldn’t do it? Here’s an idea, sew your mouth shut.. He had no intention of returning to football. The Giants came to him, nobody forced them to give a contract to a player who they felt was badly out of shape. He took their money with barely breaking a sweat. Smart move by him, the Giants not so much. I’d really like to know what the cap hit and guaranteed pay was. When you say “Giants” you mean Gettleman. He drafted Benjamin, and most likely vouched for him. The cap hit was probably $20 dollars.
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Post by GameTime on Jul 30, 2021 18:31:35 GMT -5
Two years to lose weight and he still couldn’t do it? Here’s an idea, sew your mouth shut.. He had no intention of returning to football. The Giants came to him, nobody forced them to give a contract to a player who they felt was badly out of shape. He took their money with barely breaking a sweat. Smart move by him, the Giants not so much. I’d really like to know what the cap hit and guaranteed pay was. not sure if this is accurate or they just dont have the data overthecap.com/player/kelvin-benjamin/2967/
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Post by Kruunch on Jul 30, 2021 18:36:19 GMT -5
He had no intention of returning to football. The Giants came to him, nobody forced them to give a contract to a player who they felt was badly out of shape. He took their money with barely breaking a sweat. Smart move by him, the Giants not so much. I’d really like to know what the cap hit and guaranteed pay was. not sure if this is accurate or they just dont have the data overthecap.com/player/kelvin-benjamin/2967/He made $990 grand without lifting a finger. He should win an Oscar.
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