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Post by Bigjeep on Sept 2, 2022 7:32:09 GMT -5
Given that Giants general manager Joe Schoen advertises himself as a culture and character guy, it is worth nothing that the quarterback he will watch Saturday night, C.J. Stroud, just handed out $500 gift cards to his Ohio State teammates so they can wear new suits into their home game against Notre Dame. In the Wild West era of Name, Image & Likeness, a star Division I player can cut a deal with a clothing company like Stroud’s with “Express” and make things happen just like that. On the other hand, young Mr. Stroud just did a pretty thoughtful thing for the rest of his locker room without any prodding from his head coach. Schoen should jot that down in his notebook before arriving in Columbus, Ohio, just in case Stroud’s name gets tossed around in the Giants’ draft room in their scramble for a new quarterback next spring. Up front, understand that Daniel Jones deserves his fair-and-square chance to persuade the rookie Schoen and his rookie coach, Brian Daboll, that he is worthy of being the Giants’ long-term franchise quarterback. “I think Daniel’s in a good place. I’m happy where he is,” Schoen said Thursday, while acknowledging that “everybody’s got to go perform on Sundays,” and that nothing else really counts. Jones might have the size, the arm and the athleticism to pull it off, even after Schoen declined to pick up his fifth-year option for $22 million-plus. If Jones proves he can stay healthy and throw more touchdowns and fewer interceptions than he’s thrown over his past 25 starts (21 TDs, 17 picks), maybe, just maybe, he can still be “the guy” during the next stage of the Giants’ never-ending rebuild. Giants general manager Joe Schoen will be scouting Ohio State quarterback C.J. Stroud (top left), if they decide to go in a different directions from Daniel Jones after this season. But chances are, that’s not going to happen. Even if Jones plays at a higher level in 2022, there’s a lot of incentive for Schoen and Daboll to identify and acquire their own quarterback in 2023. A fresh hopeful at that position buys the GM and head coach some extra time for their vision — a chance to convert Year 2 back into Year 1 — and gives the Giants a shot at a prospect at the kind of first-tier upside Jones doesn’t own. The kind of prospect Schoen’s Bills drafted in 2018, Josh Allen, with the seventh-overall pick, after Dave Gettleman’s Giants grabbed Saquon Barkley at No. 2. As much as Schoen contributed to the evaluation of Wyoming’s Allen as Buffalo’s assistant GM, he doesn’t get to claim that one. Brandon Beane is the executive who made the trades and acquired the draft capital to move up after the Giants and others whiffed on Allen, and Beane is the executive who deserves the credit. That’s the way it works. Before that fateful 2018 draft, one veteran NFL scout had actually sent word to a Gettleman lieutenant that the Giants and Browns would regret it if they kept Barkley and Baker Mayfield higher on their draft boards than Allen. Of course, had the Giants selected Allen four years ago, Gettleman would likely still be in power, and Schoen would be who-knows-where. Those are the breaks of the game. Now all that matters is Schoen’s ability, or lack thereof, to find a QB1 who will be the next Eli Manning and win the franchise’s fifth Super Bowl title. Not that any such search was a matter for public discussion Thursday when the GM sat before the news media ahead of the season opener in 10 days at Tennessee. Rather than go solo, Schoen was seated next to Daboll — who is available to reporters on a daily basis — in an apparent attempt to hammer home the message that theirs is a 24/7 partnership. Schoen praised Daboll’s talent for leading and motivating an entire team, rather than just the offensive unit he ran in Buffalo. Daboll praised Schoen’s communication skills and called him “a really good listener.” As a really good listener, Schoen has heard the fans’ pain after a brutal decade of football, and has smartly tried to manage expectations by refusing to set any. He needs to restructure some contracts and, ultimately, set up the Giants to have more flexibility next year. Schoen said he’s eager to find out how the Giants will respond to adversity and how they will handle success. The smart money says they will have more practice this year responding to adversity. Shoulder to shoulder, Schoen and Daboll seem to be preparing for tough seas ahead. Though harmony between the front office and head coach is never a bad thing, history shows it isn’t required. Giants GM George Young didn’t get along with Bill Parcells (or with defensive coordinator Bill Belichick), and yet they won two Super Bowls together. In New England, Belichick enjoyed no bro-mance with Robert Kraft, and together they maintained the greatest NFL dynasty of all. Like most of his peers, Joe Schoen talks about the importance of culture, and the kind of people you need to build the right one. You know who builds a culture in the NFL? A great quarterback. Maybe the Giants’ rookie GM will find one Saturday night on his trip to Ohio State. nypost.com/2022/09/01/joe-schoen-era-will-hinge-on-giants-having-a-top-quarterback/ |
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Post by JoeBigBlue on Sept 2, 2022 7:39:03 GMT -5
Is Davis Webb available?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2022 7:48:43 GMT -5
He's on some bad teams PS.. |
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Post by GameTime on Sept 2, 2022 8:02:52 GMT -5
what GMs era isnt?
Jones needs to emerge as the franchise or they move on.
not news.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2022 8:03:44 GMT -5
A top scout told Gettleman, Josh Allen….over Mayfield and obviously a running back.
Well the Josh Allen over Barkley and a running back was as obvious as Rosen or Darnold over a running back in 2018.
Another poster suggested Daniel Jones has a long leash and years and I disagreed ….for exactly this reason. They get their guy and that allows them to not only get another year, but it’s THEIR guy, and for THEIR system. This is a potential QB draft if many of this Junior signal callers excel as expected on Saturdays …. as long as the Giants have patience, these are the right people to have in charge.
This year is a dead one, let’s all not go all crayon eating jarhead … and let’s just get the right QB next year, a QB with more talent than even Webb.
Then watch as the right pieces are put in that match the system, and culture.
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Post by GameTime on Sept 2, 2022 8:09:32 GMT -5
A top scout told Gettleman, Josh Allen….over Mayfield and obviously a running back. Well the Josh Allen over Barkley and a running back was as obvious as Rosen or Darnold over a running back in 2018. Another poster suggested Daniel Jones has a long leash and years and I disagreed ….for exactly this reason. They get their guy and that allows them to not only get another year, but it’s THEIR guy, and for THEIR system. This is a potential QB draft if many of this Junior signal callers excel as expected on Saturdays …. as long as the Giants have patience, these are the right people to have in charge. This year is a dead one, let’s all not go all crayon eating jarhead … and let’s just get the right QB next year, a QB with more talent than even Webb. Then watch as the right pieces are put in that match the system, and culture. my guess is that the NYGs, if they didnt pick Barkely would have taken Rosen or Darnold. I also feel that Schoen and Daboll are not totally hung up on getting "their" guy. If they can turn Jones they will have a hit home run and wont care at all abotu drafting"their" guy because Jones will become their guy. I agree with you that Jones does not have a long leash or years. He has this season to prove it or he's done here. With that said I think he plays well enough to stay the starter all season except for injury. I dont see him crashing and burning at all. |
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Post by TEM on Sept 2, 2022 8:14:02 GMT -5
IMO: His career will hinge on breaking the 6 win stagnation by the end of next season.
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Post by Tyrell on Sept 2, 2022 8:20:25 GMT -5
IMO: His career will hinge on breaking the 6 win stagnation by the end of next season. basically, yep. and i love that schoen seems like the nicest ruthless guy ever lol. dude is very friendly in demeanor while being pretty laser focused at building this teamand making moves. at least thats my early impression. |
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Post by Nite on Sept 2, 2022 8:34:20 GMT -5
A top scout told Gettleman, Josh Allen….over Mayfield and obviously a running back. Well the Josh Allen over Barkley and a running back was as obvious as Rosen or Darnold over a running back in 2018. Another poster suggested Daniel Jones has a long leash and years and I disagreed ….for exactly this reason. They get their guy and that allows them to not only get another year, but it’s THEIR guy, and for THEIR system. This is a potential QB draft if many of this Junior signal callers excel as expected on Saturdays …. as long as the Giants have patience, these are the right people to have in charge. This year is a dead one, let’s all not go all crayon eating jarhead … and let’s just get the right QB next year, a QB with more talent than even Webb. Then watch as the right pieces are put in that match the system, and culture. Is that even possible? A Webb of intrigue has (will?) be woven... All kidding aside I was very pleasantly surprised on how well he performed this preseason and I'm glad he is on the ps. He will be the 'break glass in case of emergency' qb. It goes to show that coaching is as important as talent. Four years ago he was a throwaway scrub type pick. Now he has some utility.... |
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Post by ratbastich on Sept 2, 2022 8:53:09 GMT -5
Ouch! I like the red ones they taste like Mad Dog 20/20 |
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Post by miggs on Sept 2, 2022 8:55:53 GMT -5
Jones' excellent performance is no surprise. As good players play well in good systems and not well in bad systems. He previously played in bad systems.
Bad offensive systems combined with bad offensive lines leads to both QB fumbles and interceptions.
He now has command of a good system. Will get even better with each passing day.
The Giants offensive schemes get receivers open in space, making it easier for him to make good decisions.
He appears to be relaxed enough to throw passes at different speeds depending on what is required.
Do think his stats will match-up well to other good QBs at the end of the season.
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Post by ratbastich on Sept 2, 2022 8:56:27 GMT -5
IMO: His career will hinge on breaking the 6 win stagnation by the end of next season. basically, yep. and i love that schoen seems like the nicest ruthless guy ever lol. dude is very friendly in demeanor while being pretty laser focused at building this teamand making moves. at least thats my early impression. You have to believe the amount of prestige he would gain if he could get the Giants, a storied franchise, back on track would be tremendous. |
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Post by ratbastich on Sept 2, 2022 8:57:36 GMT -5
let’s just get the right QB next year, a QB with more talent than even Webb. Impossible. Webb is the new Seawright and the Chuck Norris of the New York Giants |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2022 9:16:06 GMT -5
Ouch! I like the red ones they taste like Mad Dog 20/20 Hahaha….squid vs jarhead…you’re the sane one, and thankfully not retired Chair Force. |
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Post by cdngfan on Sept 2, 2022 9:18:17 GMT -5
No it won’t.
The Vrabel era is not defined by having a top flight QB.
“Joe Schoen talks about the importance of culture, and the kind of people you need to build the right one. You know who builds a culture in the NFL? A great quarterback.”
What a f’ing moronic statement.
Not dissing BigJeep, he didn’t write it, but I’m dumber for having read this.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2022 9:21:41 GMT -5
A top scout told Gettleman, Josh Allen….over Mayfield and obviously a running back. Well the Josh Allen over Barkley and a running back was as obvious as Rosen or Darnold over a running back in 2018. Another poster suggested Daniel Jones has a long leash and years and I disagreed ….for exactly this reason. They get their guy and that allows them to not only get another year, but it’s THEIR guy, and for THEIR system. This is a potential QB draft if many of this Junior signal callers excel as expected on Saturdays …. as long as the Giants have patience, these are the right people to have in charge. This year is a dead one, let’s all not go all crayon eating jarhead … and let’s just get the right QB next year, a QB with more talent than even Webb. Then watch as the right pieces are put in that match the system, and culture.
I also feel that Schoen and Daboll are not totally hung up on getting "their" guy. If they can turn Jones they will have a hit home run and wont care at all abotu drafting"their" guy because Jones will become their guy. I agree with you that Jones does not have a long leash or years. He has this season to prove it or he's done here. With that said I think he plays well enough to stay the starter all season except for injury. I dont see him crashing and burning at all. Then Gettlemagic is perhaps more of an idiot than previously measured on the idiocy meter. If you were even remotely thinking of QB va RB, and you did not trade down and took a running back…wow. |
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Post by GameTime on Sept 2, 2022 9:39:26 GMT -5
my guess is that the NYGs, if they didnt pick Barkely would have taken Rosen or Darnold.
I also feel that Schoen and Daboll are not totally hung up on getting "their" guy. If they can turn Jones they will have a hit home run and wont care at all abotu drafting"their" guy because Jones will become their guy. I agree with you that Jones does not have a long leash or years. He has this season to prove it or he's done here. With that said I think he plays well enough to stay the starter all season except for injury. I dont see him crashing and burning at all. Then Gettlemagic is perhaps more of an idiot than previously measured on the idiocy meter. If you were even remotely thinking of QB va RB, and you did not trade down and took a running back…wow. well....I am prbably wrong because he thought Eli till had gas left in the tank and that, to me, is why he really picked Barkley. Just saying if was going to draft a QB that year I am thinking Darnold and not Allen. In retrospect many GMs would have. |
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Post by cdngfan on Sept 2, 2022 9:43:09 GMT -5
IMO: His career will hinge on breaking the 6 win stagnation by the end of next season. Sanity. Thank you. |
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DJones19
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Post by DJones19 on Sept 2, 2022 9:46:52 GMT -5
No it won’t. The Vrabel era is not defined by having a top flight QB. “Joe Schoen talks about the importance of culture, and the kind of people you need to build the right one. You know who builds a culture in the NFL? A great quarterback.” What a f’ing moronic statement. Not dissing BigJeep, he didn’t write it, but I’m dumber for having read this. I love this author - he hated Belichick when he was a coach with the Jets and now writes books about how great Belichick is for $$$... I know old topic...but too hard to pass up bringing it up. I wonder if all of those talking culture are advocating for Jimmy G who is openly disliked by teammates and doesn't answer texts or calls from coaches for months at a time. |
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Post by Deleted on Sept 2, 2022 9:50:03 GMT -5
Then Gettlemagic is perhaps more of an idiot than previously measured on the idiocy meter. If you were even remotely thinking of QB va RB, and you did not trade down and took a running back…wow. well....I am prbably wrong because he thought Eli till had gas left in the tank and that, to me, is why he really picked Barkley. Just saying if was going to draft a QB that year I am thinking Darnold and not Allen. In retrospect many GMs would have. Yeah, because I can accept they thought none of the QB’s were franchise, although that in itself was idiocy of the Mara clan….but to suggest if not Barkley…then maybe a QB…well, that’s borderline insane football management. In all honesty, any QB taken under that regime would of fizzled….from Allen to Darnold. That’s why I am sure we are now going to get a QB in a deep QB (possibly is the juniors ball out) class…we have the groomers of a wild rocket armed cowboy, and it would be insanity to not believe if Jones is not their guy as I don’t believe he is, they would not whisper into a rookie QB next year. This management team is NOT going veteran QB…or stop gaps. Not this year…if or course Jones does Jones again…IOW, Jones has got to be able to extend plays and launch long passes with high velocity into tight windows vs lock onto a first read and fumble a ball off his knee. Game managers is not what we want …. |
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Post by cdngfan on Sept 2, 2022 9:50:51 GMT -5
No it won’t. The Vrabel era is not defined by having a top flight QB. “Joe Schoen talks about the importance of culture, and the kind of people you need to build the right one. You know who builds a culture in the NFL? A great quarterback.” What a f’ing moronic statement. Not dissing BigJeep, he didn’t write it, but I’m dumber for having read this. I love this author - he hated Belichick when he was a coach with the Jets and now writes books about how great Belichick is for $$$... I know old topic...but too hard to pass up bringing it up. I wonder if all of those talking culture are advocating for Jimmy G who is openly disliked by teammates and doesn't answer texts or calls from coaches for months at a time. I’ll bet a crisp $50 Canadian bill ($25 American) that he just grazes message boards and call-in shows and writes an article based on fan opinion, which we’re all learning (Martinez, Slayton, Webb) is uninformed and dumb. |
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Post by cdngfan on Sept 2, 2022 9:53:27 GMT -5
Then Gettlemagic is perhaps more of an idiot than previously measured on the idiocy meter. If you were even remotely thinking of QB va RB, and you did not trade down and took a running back…wow. well....I am prbably wrong because he thought Eli till had gas left in the tank and that, to me, is why he really picked Barkley. Just saying if was going to draft a QB that year I am thinking Darnold and not Allen. In retrospect many GMs would have. I never believed Getty when he said Eli had gas in the tank. I always thought his hog mollie comments and Barkley draft mean he was going to try and turn the giants into a running team and Eli into a game manager. He couldn’t say “Eli can’t lead a team with his arm anymore”. Outdated football strategy. |
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Post by GameTime on Sept 2, 2022 9:57:23 GMT -5
well....I am prbably wrong because he thought Eli till had gas left in the tank and that, to me, is why he really picked Barkley. Just saying if was going to draft a QB that year I am thinking Darnold and not Allen. In retrospect many GMs would have. Yeah, because I can accept they thought none of the QB’s were franchise, although that in itself was idiocy of the Mara clan….but to suggest if not Barkley…then maybe a QB…well, that’s borderline insane football management. In all honesty, any QB taken under that regime would of fizzled….from Allen to Darnold. That’s why I am sure we are now going to get a QB in a deep QB (possibly is the juniors ball out) class…we have the groomers of a wild rocket armed cowboy, and it would be insanity to not believe if Jones is not their guy as I don’t believe he is, they would not whisper into a rookie QB next year. This management team is NOT going veteran QB…or stop gaps. Not this year…if or course Jones does Jones again…IOW, Jones has got to be able to extend plays and launch long passes with high velocity into tight windows vs lock onto a first read and fumble a ball off his knee. Game managers is not what we want …. agreed... If Jones fails or succeeds the last he will be is a game manager. At least that my take. |
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Post by GameTime on Sept 2, 2022 10:00:35 GMT -5
well....I am prbably wrong because he thought Eli till had gas left in the tank and that, to me, is why he really picked Barkley. Just saying if was going to draft a QB that year I am thinking Darnold and not Allen. In retrospect many GMs would have. I never believed Getty when he said Eli had gas in the tank. I always thought his hog mollie comments and Barkley draft mean he was going to try and turn the giants into a running team and Eli into a game manager. He couldn’t say “Eli can’t lead a team with his arm anymore”. Outdated football strategy. I was part o the camp that Eli had one more run in him. I was painfully wrong 100%. I truly believe DG thought Barkley could be a great outlet option for Eli on the way to the playoffs. As it turns out Barkley was a great outlet for Eli. Barkley had a monster rookie season!! But the rest of the offense was not up to the task. |
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Post by Nite on Sept 2, 2022 10:08:53 GMT -5
I never believed Getty when he said Eli had gas in the tank. I always thought his hog mollie comments and Barkley draft mean he was going to try and turn the giants into a running team and Eli into a game manager. He couldn’t say “Eli can’t lead a team with his arm anymore”. Outdated football strategy. I was part o the camp that Eli had one more run in him. I was painfully wrong 100%. I truly believe DG thought Barkley could be a great outlet option for Eli on the way to the playoffs. As it turns out Barkley was a great outlet for Eli. Barkley had a monster rookie season!! But the rest of the offense was not up to the task. Barkely would be a good pick for a team that was missing that ONE particular piece. Obviously that wasn't us...and a RB at No. 2??? unless he is Walter Payton or Jim Brown jeez |
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Post by GameTime on Sept 2, 2022 10:10:26 GMT -5
I was part o the camp that Eli had one more run in him. I was painfully wrong 100%. I truly believe DG thought Barkley could be a great outlet option for Eli on the way to the playoffs. As it turns out Barkley was a great outlet for Eli. Barkley had a monster rookie season!! But the rest of the offense was not up to the task. Barkely would be a good pick for a team that was missing that ONE particular piece. Obviously that wasn't us...and a RB at No. 2??? unless he is Walter Payton or Jim Brown jeez agreed....and that took me a while to see that. But as I said I thought Eli had another good year in him. So I was just as piss poor of a judge as DG was. |
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Post by Jomo on Sept 2, 2022 10:11:14 GMT -5
It is an interesting article which could leave fans misaligned with Schoen.
If DJ has a strong year, Schoen still might choose NOT to re-sign him.
Why?
Schoen will have to pay more for Jones than he would for a first round QB pick thus squeezing his options in FA next year.
He also gets another year's pass in rebuilding the team because, after all, we've got a rookie QB.
Schoen is probably too smart to get caught in this trap, but it is a plausible scenario especially if DJ turns out to be a tweener.
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Post by GameTime on Sept 2, 2022 10:14:14 GMT -5
It is an interesting article which could leave fans misaligned with Schoen. If DJ has a strong year, Schoen still might choose NOT to re-sign him. Why? Schoen will have to pay more for Jones than he would for a first round QB pick thus squeezing his options in FA next year. He also gets another year's pass in rebuilding the team because, after all, we've got a rookie QB. Schoen is probably too smart to get caught in this trap, but it is a plausible scenario especially if DJ turns out to be a tweener. I can agree with only if DJ has a good year and the still dont think he can be a franchise QB. if they are convinced he can be a franchise QB they will not toss him aside because of money. Its so hard to get/develop a franchise QB. |
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Post by ratbastich on Sept 2, 2022 10:14:44 GMT -5
Ouch! I like the red ones they taste like Mad Dog 20/20 Hahaha….squid vs jarhead…you’re the sane one, and thankfully not retired Chair Force. Thanks! I changed a lot after I got out and started believing the whole MacGregor X Y Theory. Saves on blood pressure meds. |
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Post by Roswell on Sept 2, 2022 10:30:36 GMT -5
I was part o the camp that Eli had one more run in him. I was painfully wrong 100%. I truly believe DG thought Barkley could be a great outlet option for Eli on the way to the playoffs. As it turns out Barkley was a great outlet for Eli. Barkley had a monster rookie season!! But the rest of the offense was not up to the task. Barkely would be a good pick for a team that was missing that ONE particular piece. Obviously that wasn't us...and a RB at No. 2??? unless he is Walter Payton or Jim Brown jeezI think that's what the Giants saw him as. The second coming of Payton, Brown, Peterson, etc. And in his rookie year, he was. Problem was that the rest of the team was horrible and if they had traded back they could've had a king's ransom. We keep assuming DG made this pick on an island but I think the owners incorrectly wanted to wring more years out of Eli and had a hand in Barkley's selection. But it doesn't matter now. Gettlemen made tons of blunders and he deserves some of the blame for this one as well. |
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