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Post by Kase1 on Nov 13, 2023 18:05:20 GMT -5
See and I don't consider that cockiness, I consider that not being the most cerebral QB. I thought maybe he said something off putting, maybe came off like a douche in an interview or something that would be attributed to cockiness. Learning when to throw it away and when to extend the play is a trait some pro qbs still don't have. You make a good point about Penix, his team is MUCH more talented than USC, I'll give ya that. ...Still don't have a favorite qb in the draft and at this point would be happy with CW, Maye, or Penix Same although I wouldn't be mad with the Combination of Marvin Harrison Jr and Bo Nix/ Jayden Daniels ( if he comes out). Both are guys that can compensate for a bad oline and create thier own offense. It might provide some cheap production on offense while the oline is worked on. Can't say I'd be upset if we got Harrison 2.0 and a 2nd tier QB like Nix, Daniels, or even Penix if he somehow falls to the 2nd |
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Post by jb456 on Nov 13, 2023 18:15:26 GMT -5
They are not a QB away from contention, so I would like it if they traded down and beefed up the roster. No, that doesn't matter. What matter's is if they think they can get a superstar QB, they take him. Do you understand how much draft capital it takes trading to the fist or 2nd pick, even if you are sitting at 5? |
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Post by jb456 on Nov 13, 2023 18:17:31 GMT -5
In terms of talent to succeed in the NFL I give Williams a 9. In terms of intangibles to succeed in the NFL I give him a 2. You think Caleb Williams is Zach Wilson? |
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Post by Kase1 on Nov 13, 2023 18:22:03 GMT -5
If AZ is up for trading Kyler Murray, would you do it?
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Post by McCherry on Nov 13, 2023 18:41:28 GMT -5
In terms of talent to succeed in the NFL I give Williams a 9. In terms of intangibles to succeed in the NFL I give him a 2. You think Caleb Williams is Zach Wilson? Only in the potential to be a highly drafted bust. |
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Post by myronguyton29 on Nov 13, 2023 19:38:36 GMT -5
You think Caleb Williams is Zach Wilson? Only in the potential to be a highly drafted bust. I agree................... |
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miggs
Starter
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Post by miggs on Nov 14, 2023 5:28:55 GMT -5
The Giants need to consider signing some quality free agents and trade back. Maybe a few times.
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Post by Analyst on Nov 14, 2023 6:04:49 GMT -5
If AZ is up for trading Kyler Murray, would you do it? Maybe as a backup QB if DJ retires. Would rather Mayfield if we are trying failed #1 QB picks. |
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Post by jmike on Nov 14, 2023 9:02:22 GMT -5
See and I don't consider that cockiness, I consider that not being the most cerebral QB. I thought maybe he said something off putting, maybe came off like a douche in an interview or something that would be attributed to cockiness. Learning when to throw it away and when to extend the play is a trait some pro qbs still don't have. You make a good point about Penix, his team is MUCH more talented than USC, I'll give ya that. ...Still don't have a favorite qb in the draft and at this point would be happy with CW, Maye, or Penix Same although I wouldn't be mad with the Combination of Marvin Harrison Jr and Bo Nix/ Jayden Daniels ( if he comes out). Both are guys that can compensate for a bad oline and create thier own offense. It might provide some cheap production on offense while the oline is worked on. Jayden Daniels is unlikely to get out of the top 10 picks once the draft rolls around. |
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Post by jmike on Nov 14, 2023 9:18:13 GMT -5
Same although I wouldn't be mad with the Combination of Marvin Harrison Jr and Bo Nix/ Jayden Daniels ( if he comes out). Both are guys that can compensate for a bad oline and create thier own offense. It might provide some cheap production on offense while the oline is worked on. Can't say I'd be upset if we got Harrison 2.0 and a 2nd tier QB like Nix, Daniels, or even Penix if he somehow falls to the 2nd If Penix makes it there, it will likely be due serious concerns about injury. Bo Nix might make it there, depending on the QB needs in the mid to late first round. Daniels will be QB3 and a top 10 pick by the draft. I think you can count on Ewers being there in the 2nd and not a terrible choice. He needs some work but has all the arm talent you need from your QB. I would say they go off the board in this order: 1/2-Williams/Maye 3-Daniels 4/5/6-Penix/McCarthy/Nix 7/8-Ewers/Leonard Due purely by numbers, a unexpected one could very likely still be there at the top of the 2nd. Probably would trade up into the end of the first to get him to secure the 5th yr option. Other QBs that might make a push to group with the tail end of that list by draft day include Jordan Travis, KJ Jefferson, Cameron Ward, Tyler Van Dyke, Joe Milton & Sam Hartman. You'll find draft gurus out there pounding the table for one of these guys, but ultimately I don't think any of them will land in the 1st or 2nd rounds. If Travis or Ward are sitting there for their third and the Giants for some reason haven't drafted a QB yet, I'd nab one of those two there. |
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Post by idkaname on Nov 14, 2023 9:23:16 GMT -5
If AZ is up for trading Kyler Murray, would you do it? 1. at what cost? 2. I've always been against QBs that run...for the situation they all end up in...injured. I guess in short, no. We need to get back to a field general, pocket passing. Don't care what's "modern"...imo a running QB is to mask a bad Oline and if you have a good Oline, they'll hold you back somewhat (Hurts....the name fits well) |
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Post by jmike on Nov 14, 2023 9:27:02 GMT -5
If AZ is up for trading Kyler Murray, would you do it? 1. at what cost? Daniel Jones |
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Post by shocknaweny on Nov 14, 2023 9:29:14 GMT -5
If AZ is up for trading Kyler Murray, would you do it? |
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Post by jaymas on Nov 14, 2023 9:29:17 GMT -5
If AZ is up for trading Kyler Murray, would you do it? 1. at what cost? 2. I've always been against QBs that run...for the situation they all end up in...injured. I guess in short, no. We need to get back to a field general, pocket passing. Don't care what's "modern"...imo a running QB is to mask a bad Oline and if you have a good Oline, they'll hold you back somewhat (Hurts....the name fits well) Jalen Hurts is "holding back" the Eagles? |
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Post by Danke Schoen on Nov 14, 2023 9:44:45 GMT -5
If the Giants pick #1 I believe the pick is Williams. He has everything you want. Elite arm, elite ball placement, elite arm talent. He has things that need work, but massive upside, and already a much better baseline than any QB we have on the roster. Him and Maye are both upper tier prospects that teams will trade up for, and my guess for #1 and #2 regardless which teams slot there I don’t think Williams translates well to the pros. I’m not pretending to be a scout or claiming to be an arm chair GM “I just watched 30 hours of tape yesterday” - there’s just a feeling I have that I don’t like. |
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Post by jmike on Nov 14, 2023 9:50:41 GMT -5
If the Giants pick #1 I believe the pick is Williams. He has everything you want. Elite arm, elite ball placement, elite arm talent. He has things that need work, but massive upside, and already a much better baseline than any QB we have on the roster. Him and Maye are both upper tier prospects that teams will trade up for, and my guess for #1 and #2 regardless which teams slot there I don’t think Williams translates well to the pros. I’m not pretending to be a scout or claiming to be an arm chair GM “I just watched 30 hours of tape yesterday” - there’s just a feeling I have that I don’t like. I think it has to do with a player being touted as the best since high school. Consistent praise and adulation does not prepare you for adversity when it strikes and it will strike in the NFL for any player. The big question is how will he handle it when it does? Will he look for mommy's lap again? IDK, but it has me concerned about him. |
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Post by idkaname on Nov 14, 2023 9:57:51 GMT -5
1. at what cost? 2. I've always been against QBs that run...for the situation they all end up in...injured. I guess in short, no. We need to get back to a field general, pocket passing. Don't care what's "modern"...imo a running QB is to mask a bad Oline and if you have a good Oline, they'll hold you back somewhat (Hurts....the name fits well) Jalen Hurts is "holding back" the Eagles? yep, injured again and his luck with dropped INTs is ceasing...pretty much experiencing the same regression as Geno (turnover luck last year, dropped picks etc) It's only a matter of time before Hurts takes more damage an is A) missing games B) playing even worse because he can't run the ball I'm assuming you never actually watch Jalen Hurts play, he's basically a Jones clone. Look at first read - throw or tuck and run. When he's forced to stay in the pocket, he looks so lost. I challenge you to find 3 plays (his whole career) of him looking through his progressions. |
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Post by Danke Schoen on Nov 14, 2023 10:03:23 GMT -5
I don’t think Williams translates well to the pros. I’m not pretending to be a scout or claiming to be an arm chair GM “I just watched 30 hours of tape yesterday” - there’s just a feeling I have that I don’t like. I think it has to do with a player being touted as the best since high school. Consistent praise and adulation does not prepare you for adversity when it strikes and it will strike in the NFL for any player. The big question is how will he handle it when it does? Will he look for mommy's lap again? IDK, but it has me concerned about him. The mom thing is completely irrelevant to me. Such a lame attack by media and fans. At least it shows he’s passionate and cares. I honestly don’t like any of these QBs coming out. But if we are to take one the two most important attributes are arm and brain. Jones has tools but he clearly doesn’t have the brain (processing, football IQ) to take his NFL game to the next level. |
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Post by jaymas on Nov 14, 2023 10:08:41 GMT -5
Jalen Hurts is "holding back" the Eagles? yep, injured again and his luck with dropped INTs is ceasing...pretty much experiencing the same regression as Geno (turnover luck last year, dropped picks etc) It's only a matter of time before Hurts takes more damage an is A) missing games B) playing even worse because he can't run the ball I'm assuming you never actually watch Jalen Hurts play, he's basically a Jones clone. Look at first read - throw or tuck and run. When he's forced to stay in the pocket, he looks so lost. I challenge you to find 3 plays (his whole career) of him looking through his progressions. You are hilariously sanctimonious for being wrong so often. All of my closest friends are Eagles fans, I watch the Eagles every week unless the game conflicts with the Giants. Live about an hour north of Philly. If there is a team I know the 2nd most about in the NFL, it's the Eagles. On Hurts it's wild how incorrect you are. 1. He doesn't miss games. And even when he plays a little banged up, it doesn't affect his performance that much, if at all. 2. Jones and Hurts could not be more different. The dude is on time with throws, often throws with great anticipation and his ball placement is elite tier. He actually throws guys open. It has certainly helped him to be able to develop with such elite skills talent, but those traits are clear as day. You describing Jalen Hurts as a one read and run QB is like you only watched him in 2021. The quality gap between DJ and Hurts is very large. 3. Basic stats perspective, he's going to throw for over 30 TDs and over 4500 yards if he doesn't sit a game or two at the end of the year and is leading one of the best offenses in the league. He regressed to the mean somewhat on ints, but he's also going to throw 10 or more passing TDs while potentially eclipsing his rushing TD total from last year. I genuinely don't think it's possible for you to be more wrong about Jalen Hurts. At the most basic level, imagine saying a guy is holding a team back that just made the SB, was one bounce away from winning it and the dude you're criticizing played well...and then is leading one of the best teams in the league the following year. |
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Post by jaymas on Nov 14, 2023 10:11:42 GMT -5
I think it has to do with a player being touted as the best since high school. Consistent praise and adulation does not prepare you for adversity when it strikes and it will strike in the NFL for any player. The big question is how will he handle it when it does? Will he look for mommy's lap again? IDK, but it has me concerned about him. The mom thing is completely irrelevant to me. Such a lame attack by media and fans. At least it shows he’s passionate and cares. I honestly don’t like any of these QBs coming out. But if we are to take one the two most important attributes are arm and brain. Jones has tools but he clearly doesn’t have the brain (processing, football IQ) to take his NFL game to the next level. 100%. Though I like these QB prospects. Real weird to come at a 21 year old kid for having a connection with a parent. |
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Post by McCherry on Nov 14, 2023 10:13:30 GMT -5
I don’t think Williams translates well to the pros. I’m not pretending to be a scout or claiming to be an arm chair GM “I just watched 30 hours of tape yesterday” - there’s just a feeling I have that I don’t like. I think it has to do with a player being touted as the best since high school. Consistent praise and adulation does not prepare you for adversity when it strikes and it will strike in the NFL for any player. The big question is how will he handle it when it does? Will he look for mommy's lap again? IDK, but it has me concerned about him. He's not cut out for NY. I can see him succeeding in a small market, but he could be a disaster in NY. |
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Post by SG88 on Nov 14, 2023 10:16:25 GMT -5
I think it has to do with a player being touted as the best since high school. Consistent praise and adulation does not prepare you for adversity when it strikes and it will strike in the NFL for any player. The big question is how will he handle it when it does? Will he look for mommy's lap again? IDK, but it has me concerned about him. He's not cut out for NY. I can see him succeeding in a small market, but he would be a disaster in NY. He plays college football in Los Angeles for a team that is more popular there than both NFL teams combined. When did LA become a small market? There are definitely some arguments for not wanting him here. This is not one of them. |
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Post by Danke Schoen on Nov 14, 2023 10:20:58 GMT -5
yep, injured again and his luck with dropped INTs is ceasing...pretty much experiencing the same regression as Geno (turnover luck last year, dropped picks etc) It's only a matter of time before Hurts takes more damage an is A) missing games B) playing even worse because he can't run the ball I'm assuming you never actually watch Jalen Hurts play, he's basically a Jones clone. Look at first read - throw or tuck and run. When he's forced to stay in the pocket, he looks so lost. I challenge you to find 3 plays (his whole career) of him looking through his progressions. You are hilariously sanctimonious for being wrong so often. All of my closest friends are Eagles fans, I watch the Eagles every week unless the game conflicts with the Giants. Live about an hour north of Philly. If there is a team I know the 2nd most about in the NFL, it's the Eagles. On Hurts it's wild how incorrect you are. 1. He doesn't miss games. And even when he plays a little banged up, it doesn't affect his performance that much, if at all. 2. Jones and Hurts could not be more different. The dude is on time with throws, often throws with great anticipation and his ball placement is elite tier. He actually throws guys open. It has certainly helped him to be able to develop with such elite skills talent, but those traits are clear as day. You describing Jalen Hurts as a one read and run QB is like you only watched him in 2021. The quality gap between DJ and Hurts is very large. 3. Basic stats perspective, he's going to throw for over 30 TDs and over 4500 yards if he doesn't sit a game or two at the end of the year and is leading one of the best offenses in the league. He regressed to the mean somewhat on ints, but he's also going to throw 10 or more passing TDs while potentially eclipsing his rushing TD total from last year. I genuinely don't think it's possible for you to be more wrong about Jalen Hurts. At the most basic level, imagine saying a guy is holding a team back that just made the SB, was one bounce away from winning it and the dude you're criticizing played well...and then is leading one of the best teams in the league the following year. Way too many words returned to a guy who literally spent a lot of time claiming Jones is a top QB talent and, now, Hurts is holding the Eagles back. |
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Post by Danke Schoen on Nov 14, 2023 10:23:32 GMT -5
I think it has to do with a player being touted as the best since high school. Consistent praise and adulation does not prepare you for adversity when it strikes and it will strike in the NFL for any player. The big question is how will he handle it when it does? Will he look for mommy's lap again? IDK, but it has me concerned about him. He's not cut out for NY. I can see him succeeding in a small market, but he would be a disaster in NY. Why? Because of one clip of him in the stands with his mom? Prior to that you had no opinion of this guy’s “mental toughness.” |
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Post by jaymas on Nov 14, 2023 10:25:39 GMT -5
You are hilariously sanctimonious for being wrong so often. All of my closest friends are Eagles fans, I watch the Eagles every week unless the game conflicts with the Giants. Live about an hour north of Philly. If there is a team I know the 2nd most about in the NFL, it's the Eagles. On Hurts it's wild how incorrect you are. 1. He doesn't miss games. And even when he plays a little banged up, it doesn't affect his performance that much, if at all. 2. Jones and Hurts could not be more different. The dude is on time with throws, often throws with great anticipation and his ball placement is elite tier. He actually throws guys open. It has certainly helped him to be able to develop with such elite skills talent, but those traits are clear as day. You describing Jalen Hurts as a one read and run QB is like you only watched him in 2021. The quality gap between DJ and Hurts is very large. 3. Basic stats perspective, he's going to throw for over 30 TDs and over 4500 yards if he doesn't sit a game or two at the end of the year and is leading one of the best offenses in the league. He regressed to the mean somewhat on ints, but he's also going to throw 10 or more passing TDs while potentially eclipsing his rushing TD total from last year. I genuinely don't think it's possible for you to be more wrong about Jalen Hurts. At the most basic level, imagine saying a guy is holding a team back that just made the SB, was one bounce away from winning it and the dude you're criticizing played well...and then is leading one of the best teams in the league the following year. Way too many words returned to a guy who literally spent a lot of time claiming Jones is a top QB talent and, now, Hurts is holding the Eagles back. You're not wrong about that 😂. Couldn't help myself on that one, I guess. |
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Post by McCherry on Nov 14, 2023 10:25:58 GMT -5
He's not cut out for NY. I can see him succeeding in a small market, but he would be a disaster in NY. He plays college football in Los Angeles for a team that is more popular there than both NFL teams combined. When did LA become a small market? There are definitely some arguments for not wanting him here. This is not one of them. In terms of sports, Southern California is a zero market. It's a bit different comparing that to a professional athlete in NY. Especially one carrying the burden of being the saviour of the NY Giants. |
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Post by McCherry on Nov 14, 2023 10:30:19 GMT -5
He's not cut out for NY. I can see him succeeding in a small market, but he would be a disaster in NY. Why? Because of one clip of him in the stands with his mom? Prior to that you had no opinion of this guy’s “mental toughness.” I've had an opinion since he first emerged as the top QB candidate. It has little to do with the crying scene and it's based on the total package. It's just an opinion. I'm not a college expert but I prefer Maye. |
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Post by bluebuddha on Nov 14, 2023 10:33:46 GMT -5
Same although I wouldn't be mad with the Combination of Marvin Harrison Jr and Bo Nix/ Jayden Daniels ( if he comes out). Both are guys that can compensate for a bad oline and create thier own offense. It might provide some cheap production on offense while the oline is worked on. Jayden Daniels is unlikely to get out of the top 10 picks once the draft rolls around. Idk. If enough talking heads talk about him he will be pushed up the public draft boards. He looks thin almost a wr body.I read that Bryce Young weighs more than him so he needs to pack on some weight before the combine. He is still a bit of a project but I can see why he might be considered top 10. All it takes if for one team to like him. Hopefully it does happen and better prospects gets pushed down for our next pick. |
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Post by jmike on Nov 14, 2023 10:51:11 GMT -5
I think it has to do with a player being touted as the best since high school. Consistent praise and adulation does not prepare you for adversity when it strikes and it will strike in the NFL for any player. The big question is how will he handle it when it does? Will he look for mommy's lap again? IDK, but it has me concerned about him. The mom thing is completely irrelevant to me. Such a lame attack by media and fans. At least it shows he’s passionate and cares. I honestly don’t like any of these QBs coming out. But if we are to take one the two most important attributes are arm and brain. Jones has tools but he clearly doesn’t have the brain (processing, football IQ) to take his NFL game to the next level. OK, I disagree. It shows a weak person. Or at least a moment of weakness at minimum. Most players who compete at a high level are passionate and care, they wouldn't be competing at a high level if they didn't. So why don't we see players cuddling in their mom's lap and crying after losses every single week? If it is just a sign of passion and caring? So my hope if the Giants do take him is it was a moment of weakness. It happens, and this one was public, but if you see that have to question his mental toughness. I am not close enough to him to know, which is why I said concerned. |
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Post by jmike on Nov 14, 2023 10:53:18 GMT -5
I think it has to do with a player being touted as the best since high school. Consistent praise and adulation does not prepare you for adversity when it strikes and it will strike in the NFL for any player. The big question is how will he handle it when it does? Will he look for mommy's lap again? IDK, but it has me concerned about him. He's not cut out for NY. I can see him succeeding in a small market, but he would be a disaster in NY. I wouldn't go that far. But it is concerning and needs to be looked into. |
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