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Post by knixknation on Apr 18, 2024 9:42:27 GMT -5
has he been beat up so much over the course of his career that he is now "gun shy"? I know I may be in the very small minority here, but if the above is not the case, he's given receiving weapons, and more than 1.5 seconds when he drops back...I still feel he can be a very good QB. I've watched his films from college and it was almost comical the receivers had to work with. He was throwing dimes (no pun) and his Wr's were Featherstone from the movie Necessary Roughness. Just criminal. We've seen that he can make all the NFL-required passes near and far. He's is one of the best running qb's in the league (when the turf monster doesn't get him). He's improved on his turnovers every year. I feel like its just become almost en vogue to s--t on him. I would not be surprised if he serves up some humble pie to many folks this year. Whether I'm right or wrong...I'm now on record .
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Post by Danke Schoen on Apr 18, 2024 9:47:47 GMT -5
If he’s “gun shy” then he’s not mentally fit to thrive in the NFL.
And “1.5 seconds to throw” is not factual.
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Post by straightrazorman on Apr 18, 2024 9:48:35 GMT -5
has he been beat up so much over the course of his career that he is now "gun shy"? I know I may be in the very small minority here, but if the above is not the case, he's given receiving weapons, and more than 1.5 seconds when he drops back...I still feel he can be a very good QB. I've watched his films from college and it was almost comical the receivers had to work with. He was throwing dimes (no pun) and his Wr's were Featherstone from the movie Necessary Roughness. Just criminal. We've seen that he can make all the NFL-required passes near and far. He's is one of the best running qb's in the league (when the turf monster doesn't get him). He's improved on his turnovers every year. I feel like its just become almost en vogue to s--t on him. I would not be surprised if he serves up some humble pie to many folks this year. Whether I'm right or wrong...I'm now on record . Whooee! Stand by for the pounding!
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Post by Zimonami on Apr 18, 2024 9:49:38 GMT -5
has he been beat up so much over the course of his career that he is now "gun shy"? I know I may be in the very small minority here, but if the above is not the case, he's given receiving weapons, and more than 1.5 seconds when he drops back...I still feel he can be a very good QB. I've watched his films from college and it was almost comical the receivers had to work with. He was throwing dimes (no pun) and his Wr's were Featherstone from the movie Necessary Roughness. Just criminal. We've seen that he can make all the NFL-required passes near and far. He's is one of the best running qb's in the league (when the turf monster doesn't get him). He's improved on his turnovers every year. I feel like its just become almost en vogue to s--t on him. I would not be surprised if he serves up some humble pie to many folks this year. Whether I'm right or wrong...I'm now on record . lol... you're in for some heavy kickback here, but I'm in your corner. With the below average receivers and horribly offensive lines he's had to work with he has still completed 64% in his 5 years. He needs to get comfortable and confidant in the pocket again. Trust. He can do the job with the right tools. He has devolved into making decisions too quickly and eschewing his progressions. He can do the job, but only if he can regain trust in his support.... not an easy task.
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Post by inthezone on Apr 18, 2024 9:53:08 GMT -5
The biggest issues with Jones have been his inability to understand where the blitz is coming which does make it seem like he doesn't understand what the defense is doing. I don't even know if he changes the plays to match up with what the defense is showing but without that the offense isn't putting the players in the best position to succeed and the results are what we've witnessed these past few years. Basically I don't think it matters how good his physical skills are if he can't understand what the defenses are throwing at him meaning he can be shut down which we have also seen makes it easy to defend even by rookie CBs.
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Post by cdngfan on Apr 18, 2024 9:55:32 GMT -5
For years there have been reasons why DJ hasn’t performed to draft expectations. I think a lot of those reasons have been valid. I’ve always rooted for DJ and have wanted him to have the opportunities to be what he was suppose to be.
But it’s 2024 and we’re now at the point that the team needs to move on from DJ regardless of whether he’s been given a fair situation to perform in or not.
I supported JS and Dabs basically operating as if DJ’s first two years with them were the only two years that mattered.
But in 2024 he’s a scary injury risk. He can’t claim unfamiliarity with the playbook or an offence ill designed for his skill set, you reach a point that the reasons why no longer matter.
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Apr 18, 2024 10:35:52 GMT -5
has he been beat up so much over the course of his career that he is now "gun shy"? I know I may be in the very small minority here, but if the above is not the case, he's given receiving weapons, and more than 1.5 seconds when he drops back...I still feel he can be a very good QB. I've watched his films from college and it was almost comical the receivers had to work with. He was throwing dimes (no pun) and his Wr's were Featherstone from the movie Necessary Roughness. Just criminal. We've seen that he can make all the NFL-required passes near and far. He's is one of the best running qb's in the league (when the turf monster doesn't get him). He's improved on his turnovers every year. I feel like its just become almost en vogue to s--t on him. I would not be surprised if he serves up some humble pie to many folks this year. Whether I'm right or wrong...I'm now on record . lol... you're in for some heavy kickback here, but I'm in your corner. With the below average receivers and horribly offensive lines he's had to work with he has still completed 64% in his 5 years. He needs to get comfortable and confidant in the pocket again. Trust. He can do the job with the right tools. He has devolved into making decisions too quickly and eschewing his progressions. He can do the job, but only if he can regain trust in his support.... not an easy task. Everyone of course is entitled to their opinions we have seen DJ have maybe 2 good seasons his rookie year and 2022. Good being relative. That 64 % completions mentioned is mainly dump offs and quick routes. Yes many because of the OL breakdowns yet Tyrod and Cutlets were able to throw long every game they started. DJ is definitely gun shy imo, nobody is going to miss Barkley more than DJ. He ran off of defenses keying on Saquon. Plus between his 2 neck injuries and coming off an ACL doubt if he will hold up. His running will be limited. He doesn't even average 1 TD pass per game. I didn't like the DJ pick from jump street but that's not his fault. I don't think he's a starting NFL QB. A fine backup. He's not the answer, I don't think he is a winner. I was actually excited to see anybody else at QB. TT was so much more successful with the offense.
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Post by SG88 on Apr 18, 2024 10:37:03 GMT -5
If he’s “gun shy” then he’s not mentally fit to thrive in the NFL. And “1.5 seconds to throw” is not factual. I'm personally done talking about 8 until after the draft is done and over with. These fans and employees of the team who continue pounding the table for him must know something that literally everyone outside of this fan base or NYG payroll not named Mel Kiper doesn't know.
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Post by GameTime on Apr 18, 2024 10:40:46 GMT -5
He has the tools. He just doesn't have the ability to use them consistently enough.
He has had a shit show around him most of the time but thats the NFL.
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Post by OrangeGiant on Apr 18, 2024 10:44:29 GMT -5
Well, probably to the chagrin of most of us, he is probably going to get one last chance at least at the start of this season to prove himself, as long as he is healthy and makes it through camp unscathed.
Now I suppose its possible that Lock could beat him out for the job, but "they" say that DJ is their guy when healthy so we will see.
With what appears to be an improved OL, hopefully a true #1 receiver like MHJr, Nabers or Odunze, and a solid back like Singletary who can run and catch out of the backfield (and who MAY end up being better for this offense), this is it for him, sink or swim Danny.
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Post by Kruunch on Apr 18, 2024 11:07:15 GMT -5
What a load of shit.. Didn’t affect Randall Cunningham one bit when he ate more dirt than a backhoe.. Need stats? Three out of the first four seasons he got sacked more than anyone in the sport. Not enough? He also came up when Lawrence Taylor was in his prime.. So besides being mistaken for the old veterans stadium turf.
He was being chased down by a mad dog in blue. Instead of succumbing to the pressure and becoming a basket case. He took all the shots the sport had to offer.. and delivered when he got the chance. There’s no I in Jones.. But there is plenty of no in it. If last season proved anything to the stragglers still on the fence. Tyrod Taylor and Tommy DeVito pushed them the hell off..
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Post by DandyDon on Apr 18, 2024 11:10:40 GMT -5
has he been beat up so much over the course of his career that he is now "gun shy"? I know I may be in the very small minority here, but if the above is not the case, he's given receiving weapons, and more than 1.5 seconds when he drops back...I still feel he can be a very good QB. I've watched his films from college and it was almost comical the receivers had to work with. He was throwing dimes (no pun) and his Wr's were Featherstone from the movie Necessary Roughness. Just criminal. We've seen that he can make all the NFL-required passes near and far. He's is one of the best running qb's in the league (when the turf monster doesn't get him). He's improved on his turnovers every year. I feel like its just become almost en vogue to s--t on him. I would not be surprised if he serves up some humble pie to many folks this year. Whether I'm right or wrong...I'm now on record . I don't know. But even Mara has said that they might have ruined him. This will probably be the last year for him to prove everybody wrong.
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Post by hadenough on Apr 18, 2024 11:13:51 GMT -5
I think everything you said IS the problem with Daniel Jones. He’s not a play maker. He doesn’t seem to elevate the play of his teammates. He doesn’t have pocket awareness. It’s too hard to work with a QB that needs perfection around him. There’s just no spark with him. DeVito and Taylor are lesser talented QBs than Jones…but they provide a spark that Jones doesn’t.
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Post by idkaname on Apr 18, 2024 11:14:43 GMT -5
If he’s “gun shy” then he’s not mentally fit to thrive in the NFL. And “1.5 seconds to throw” is not factual. I still don't believe he is, it's Daboll. That's why we've seen the arguments / verbal beatdowns with Jones, Tyrod, and Devito. He asks QB to play "safe" and gets angry when they don't take the available chances, problem is he will take the other side too if you do the opposite. Daboll still has soul-searching to do to become a more successful coach imo (ie coughlin)
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Post by bavarobeast on Apr 18, 2024 11:18:45 GMT -5
I admire your positive mindset. You could be correct.
Personally I’ve seen enough of him. Has he been surrounded by top flight talent? Nope! Does that justify his pitiful play? Nope!
I think if we get him some weapon upgrades and better protection he will exhibit better performance. Does that mean he will lead us to a championship level team? IMO nope.
We need an upgrade at the position to lead us to a championship. DJ in now in his 6th season. 5 years of excuses doesn’t erase his underwhelming performances. It’s not like he always looks great when he has time to throw.
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Post by vinnie on Apr 18, 2024 11:25:37 GMT -5
5 f’in years. What other QB during the salary cap era has had this long with the same team that drafted him and as poor or poorer cumulative stats than Jones has had? Honest question.
And I don’t want to hear the O line bullshit or WR bullshit. Yeah, there are some valid points but the back ups proved they could do more than Jones under the same and/or similar circumstances.
Anyone?
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Post by inthezone on Apr 18, 2024 11:26:47 GMT -5
If he’s “gun shy” then he’s not mentally fit to thrive in the NFL. And “1.5 seconds to throw” is not factual. I still don't believe he is, it's Daboll. That's why we've seen the arguments / verbal beatdowns with Jones, Tyrod, and Devito. He asks QB to play "safe" and gets angry when they don't take the available chances, problem is he will take the other side too if you do the opposite. Daboll still has soul-searching to do to become a more successful coach imo (ie coughlin) The times I saw Dabs get angry were about the decisions that Jones made throwing it to a covered player while there were other WRs open for an easy catches. It has been explained and shown by ex QBs when they break down the plays.
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Post by inthezone on Apr 18, 2024 11:28:12 GMT -5
5 f’in years. What other QB during the salary cap era has had this long with the same team that drafted him and as poor or poorer cumulative stats than Jones has had? Honest question. And I don’t want to hear the O line bullshit or WR bullshit. Yeah, there are some valid points but the back ups proved they could do more than Jones under the same and/or similar circumstances. Anyone? You haven't read todays excuse that it's Dabs who forcing him to play it safe or be ready for a shout down?
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Post by myronguyton29 on Apr 18, 2024 11:37:10 GMT -5
What a load of shit.. Didn’t affect Randall Cunningham one bit when he ate more dirt than a backhoe.. Need stats? Three out of the first four seasons he got sacked more than anyone in the sport. Not enough? He also came up when Lawrence Taylor was in his prime.. So besides being mistaken for the old veterans stadium turf. He was being chased down by a mad dog in blue. Instead of succumbing to the pressure and becoming a basket case. He took all the shots the sport had to offer.. and delivered when he got the chance. There’s no I in Jones.. But there is plenty of no in it. If last season proved anything to the stragglers still on the fence. Tyrod Taylor and Tommy DeVito pushed them the hell off.. and chased down by the GREAT LT twice a year at that lol........................
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Post by dream8 on Apr 18, 2024 11:49:01 GMT -5
I often hear how Jones "has all the tools" and I never understand it. Purely physical tools, maybe - His arm talent is around league average and he runs well (however he now has the tread of an ACL tear on his tires).
But "all the tools" also includes: Pre and post snap processing, pocket presence/manipulation, throwing with anticipation.
Jones is well below average at every single one of these. We just saw Tyrod this past year outdo Jones at every one of these. I can't get on board with thinking this guy is our Franchise QB when a journeyman backup came in and clearly outplayed him. And this is on top of his concerning injury history.
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Post by McCherry on Apr 18, 2024 12:17:17 GMT -5
Good athlete, hard worker, great person. I like Jones and will continue to root for him. The vitriolic hate makes no sense to me.
I'm willing to give him a chance if he gets the start. Even if he gets back to his 2022, we can win games and even beat good teams. My concern about his health outweighs my concern about his ability. Not interested in reviving any debates about that, but if the coach and GM still have faith in Jones, it says something and that's all that matters right now.
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te88
Special Teams
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Post by te88 on Apr 18, 2024 12:33:14 GMT -5
Tyrod Taylor performed better in the same circumstances.
Jones production is at the level of Tommy DeVito.
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mendy
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Post by mendy on Apr 18, 2024 12:40:17 GMT -5
Tyrod Taylor performed better in the same circumstances. Jones production is at the level of Tommy DeVito. None of that is true.
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thrax
Special Teams
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Post by thrax on Apr 18, 2024 12:47:42 GMT -5
I'm with ya man.Still working on caffeine intake but I'm with ya.
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Post by knixknation on Apr 18, 2024 12:51:11 GMT -5
If he’s “gun shy” then he’s not mentally fit to thrive in the NFL. And “1.5 seconds to throw” is not factual. Exactly...IF he is gun shy. We don't know yet, but he has every reason to be. Yes, 1.5 seconds to throw is hyperbole...but you get my drift.
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Post by vinnie on Apr 18, 2024 12:54:04 GMT -5
Good athlete, hard worker, great person. I like Jones and will continue to root for him. The vitriolic hate makes no sense to me. I'm willing to give him a chance if he gets the start. Even if he gets back to his 2022, we can win games and even beat good teams. My concern about his health outweighs my concern about his ability. Not interested in reviving any debates about that, but if the coach and GM still have faith in Jones, it says something and that's all that matters right now. Mike, ya know I love ya buddy, but don’t you think “vitriolic hate” is a complete exaggeration? If not, please quote me ANYONE who has said they HATE Daniel Jones or has even implied it. Yeah, there are several of us that don’t think he should be the starting QB of the NY Giants but I’m almost 100% sure we have all said we like him as a person, hard worker, etc but HATE him? C’mon, you sound like the media just trying to stir shit up. and my lord, “back to his ‘22”? Lol, is the bar that low that ‘22 was considered some sort of franchise QB year? Everyone outside of DJ homers looks at what he did that season as a complete joke, which it was, but he has sucked so bad that they consider that worthy of mentioning as an accolade of sorts.
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Post by Nick6475 on Apr 18, 2024 13:00:17 GMT -5
Good athlete, hard worker, great person. I like Jones and will continue to root for him. The vitriolic hate makes no sense to me. I'm willing to give him a chance if he gets the start. Even if he gets back to his 2022, we can win games and even beat good teams. My concern about his health outweighs my concern about his ability. Not interested in reviving any debates about that, but if the coach and GM still have faith in Jones, it says something and that's all that matters right now. Mike, ya know I love ya buddy, but don’t you think “vitriolic hate” is a complete exaggeration? If not, please quote me ANYONE who has said they HATE Daniel Jones or has even implied it. Yeah, there are several of us that don’t think he should be the starting QB of the NY Giants but I’m almost 100% sure we have all said we like him as a person, hard worker, etc but HATE him? C’mon, you sound like the media just trying to stir shit up. I think any hate is more towards the fans who keep bringing up how good Jones is and how lucky the Giants are to have him.
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Aris
Special Teams
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Post by Aris on Apr 18, 2024 13:01:16 GMT -5
has he been beat up so much over the course of his career that he is now "gun shy"? I know I may be in the very small minority here, but if the above is not the case, he's given receiving weapons, and more than 1.5 seconds when he drops back...I still feel he can be a very good QB. I've watched his films from college and it was almost comical the receivers had to work with. He was throwing dimes (no pun) and his Wr's were Featherstone from the movie Necessary Roughness. Just criminal. We've seen that he can make all the NFL-required passes near and far. He's is one of the best running qb's in the league (when the turf monster doesn't get him). He's improved on his turnovers every year. I feel like its just become almost en vogue to s--t on him. I would not be surprised if he serves up some humble pie to many folks this year. Whether I'm right or wrong...I'm now on record .
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Post by vinnie on Apr 18, 2024 13:07:19 GMT -5
Mike, ya know I love ya buddy, but don’t you think “vitriolic hate” is a complete exaggeration? If not, please quote me ANYONE who has said they HATE Daniel Jones or has even implied it. Yeah, there are several of us that don’t think he should be the starting QB of the NY Giants but I’m almost 100% sure we have all said we like him as a person, hard worker, etc but HATE him? C’mon, you sound like the media just trying to stir shit up. I think any hate is more towards the fans who keep bringing up how good Jones is and how lucky the Giants are to have him. You’re right about that, it’s maddening. 3 HC’s, 2 have been fired for lackluster results and the only constant is the same quarterback who John Mara and a small group of supporters keep insisting isn’t a large part of the problem. In the meantime, they’re paying a 6 year veteran backup QB, near starter money. Talk about banging your head against the wall. The next excuse will be “he’s been in the league 10 years, what do you expect”?
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Post by Fletch842 on Apr 18, 2024 13:50:04 GMT -5
I think any hate is more towards the fans who keep bringing up how good Jones is and how lucky the Giants are to have him. You’re right about that, it’s maddening. 3 HC’s, 2 have been fired for lackluster results and the only constant is the same quarterback who John Mara and a small group of supporters keep insisting isn’t a large part of the problem. In the meantime, they’re paying a 6 year veteran backup QB, near starter money. Talk about banging your head against the wall. The next excuse will be “he’s been in the league 10 years, what do you expect”? this coming season is one of recovery for him. I fully expect him to blossom in year 7...
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