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Post by Roswell on Aug 20, 2019 12:10:57 GMT -5
I understand Mike’s point. OU is a football factory and Mayfield was one of many terrific players to come thru there. He’s right about that.
What I don’t agree with is that Jones did more for Duke football than Mayfield did for OU football.
I just don’t think that, while he was there, Duke football became a topic of conversation anywhere. Even at Duke lol.
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Post by bluebuddha on Aug 20, 2019 12:25:52 GMT -5
Baker Mayfield trashed the Jones pick in a GQ article. He thinks a winning pedigree is they key, but Jones did win relative to Duke’s usual results in football. I would say Jones did more for Duke football than Baker did for Oklahoma football. I don't know about that. I certainly am not going to watch Duke football this year but I will still watch Oklahoma.
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Merc
Special Teams
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Post by Merc on Aug 20, 2019 12:34:32 GMT -5
Here's my question. We have 4 QBs on the roster, none of which is a bust. Do we keep 3, as Eli is approaching retirement, to have a decent backup for Jones and trade 1. If so, who do we keep?
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Shim
Special Teams
Adapt or die.
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Post by Shim on Aug 20, 2019 12:37:21 GMT -5
Here's my question. We have 4 QBs on the roster, none of which is a bust. Do we keep 3, as Eli is approaching retirement, to have a decent backup for Jones and trade 1. If so, who do we keep? As long as Eli is on this roster we will only carry 3 QBs. I'm not sure that changes when Daniel Jones takes the throne, either.
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Post by IrishMike on Aug 20, 2019 12:41:04 GMT -5
I understand Mike’s point. OU is a football factory and Mayfield was one of many terrific players to come thru there. He’s right about that. What I don’t agree with is that Jones did more for Duke football than Mayfield did for OU football. I just don’t think that, while he was there, Duke football became a topic of conversation anywhere. Even at Duke lol. Yes. It is not a knock on Mayfield, he was great at a football powerhouse.
Jones played for Duke. Before his arrival they won 4 bowl games (technically 3, but he was a redshirt for one so I don't credit him). Jones won 2 more bowl games in his 3 seasons there. 33% of their bowl wins came with Jones as the QB. Are they the talk of the town? No. But he took a team with a tradition of losing and won both of his final two seasons there.
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Post by bluebuddha on Aug 20, 2019 12:55:58 GMT -5
I understand Mike’s point. OU is a football factory and Mayfield was one of many terrific players to come thru there. He’s right about that. What I don’t agree with is that Jones did more for Duke football than Mayfield did for OU football. I just don’t think that, while he was there, Duke football became a topic of conversation anywhere. Even at Duke lol. Yes. It is not a knock on Mayfield, he was great at a football powerhouse.
Jones played for Duke. Before his arrival they won 4 bowl games (technically 3, but he was a redshirt for one so I don't credit him). Jones won 2 more bowl games in his 3 seasons there. 33% of their bowl wins came with Jones as the QB. Are they the talk of the town? No. But he took a team with a tradition of losing and won both of his final two seasons there.
If you want to count the Pinstripe and QickLane as legitimate bowls games then you have to acknowledge that those bowls were not around before 2010. Who knows if previous Duke teams could have made those bowls. There are a lot more bowl games now then there were in the past so the probability of reaching one is much higher.
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Post by trueblueatnyc on Aug 20, 2019 13:04:16 GMT -5
We wont really know if Jones is "the guy" until after at least his first full season and into the start of his second season starting.
There are quite a few examples of players starting out strong, but then flaming out after the league figures them out. RGIII and Kaepernick were two examples of that. Once teams sorta figured them out, they struggled with consistency.
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Post by Jomo on Aug 20, 2019 13:07:41 GMT -5
I understand Mike’s point. OU is a football factory and Mayfield was one of many terrific players to come thru there. He’s right about that. What I don’t agree with is that Jones did more for Duke football than Mayfield did for OU football. I just don’t think that, while he was there, Duke football became a topic of conversation anywhere. Even at Duke lol. LOL, I tend to believe in individuals rather than institutions.....and NOT just with football.
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Post by Jomo on Aug 20, 2019 13:11:25 GMT -5
We wont really know if Jones is "the guy" until after at least his first full season and into the start of his second season starting. There are quite a few examples of players starting out strong, but then flaming out after the league figures them out. RGIII and Kaepernick were two examples of that. Once teams sorta figured them out, they struggled with consistency. Those two might be a little different...and of course RG3's injury didn't help at all.
They were both built on run heavy skill sets which took a while for defenses to adjust. DJ is more classically constructed in his skills which are dominated by downfield passing.
It doesn't mean he won't disappoint just that he is a bit different than those two. Now defensive coordinators will show him a bunch of new looks. He'll have to adjust to succeed and that will take (as you say) more than a year as a starter.
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Post by Roswell on Aug 20, 2019 13:37:41 GMT -5
Yes. It is not a knock on Mayfield, he was great at a football powerhouse.
Jones played for Duke. Before his arrival they won 4 bowl games (technically 3, but he was a redshirt for one so I don't credit him). Jones won 2 more bowl games in his 3 seasons there. 33% of their bowl wins came with Jones as the QB. Are they the talk of the town? No. But he took a team with a tradition of losing and won both of his final two seasons there.
If you want to count the Pinstripe and QickLane as legitimate bowls games then you have to acknowledge that those bowls were not around before 2010. Who knows if previous Duke teams could have made those bowls. There are a lot more bowl games now then there were in the past so the probability of reaching one is much higher. Admittedly I’m not a college football follower so when Mike said he won 2 bowl games at Duke I didn’t realize he meant the Pinstripe and Quicklane Bowls. That changes everything for me. 😎 But at least he won them. So there’s that.
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Post by Roswell on Aug 20, 2019 13:55:45 GMT -5
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Post by McCherry on Aug 20, 2019 13:58:49 GMT -5
The Donald Trump defense. Deny everything then blame it on the media....
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Post by Jomo on Aug 20, 2019 14:04:44 GMT -5
One man's clarification is another man's "walk back,"
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soflo
Special Teams
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Post by soflo on Aug 20, 2019 14:22:21 GMT -5
Davis Webb went 14-20 with a TD in preseason game 3 last year. The beat guys called him the best offensive player on the field. He was cut.... This stuff isn’t real football. It’s good he’s making throws, but who you are facing matters. Misinformation. Webb went 5-11 for 73 yards and 0 TDs in game 3 last year. He also went 9-22 with 0 TDs against the Browns in game 1. The 14-20 game you're thinking of was game 2 against Detroit. He didn't play in game 4 so he had 1 good game and 2 terrible games, and then he was cut.
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Post by shocknaweny on Aug 20, 2019 16:38:15 GMT -5
Akili Smith and Cade McNown both looked lights out in the pre-season and are historical busts for the Bengals and Bears respectively
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Post by Jomo on Aug 20, 2019 16:45:07 GMT -5
It will all be clear in due time....one way or the other.
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Post by bluebuddha on Aug 20, 2019 17:35:45 GMT -5
If you want to count the Pinstripe and QickLane as legitimate bowls games then you have to acknowledge that those bowls were not around before 2010. Who knows if previous Duke teams could have made those bowls. There are a lot more bowl games now then there were in the past so the probability of reaching one is much higher. Admittedly I’m not a college football follower so when Mike said he won 2 bowl games at Duke I didn’t realize he meant the Pinstripe and Quicklane Bowls. That changes everything for me. 😎 But at least he won them. So there’s that. Yes I am glad he won them but who did he really beat? I like DJ but not because of his records or what he did in college but more because he was prepared to play for the NFL rather than college. He didn't come from a system that makes "Qbs" look good. His humbleness really impresses me. Lastly the touch he has on his throws comes naturally. I see a NFL QB but I can't see something great yet. There hasn't been enough games or even throws to see anything other than a guys who looks the part of a NFL QB. I really need to see him when things go bad. When the team is down and needs a comeback. When things go wrong that is not in his control ( bad weather, bad defense, injuries, etc...). I have not seen that yet and it will probably be a while before I do see it. Hopefully my patience pays off. My current stance is he has the chops to be a NFL QB but not one that will successful without good players around him. The great part about it is he has one of the best offensive players in Saquon, other budding stars like Shep, Engram and Hernandez and a young team that will grow with him. I am excited about the future of this team.
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Post by Roswell on Aug 20, 2019 18:14:32 GMT -5
Admittedly I’m not a college football follower so when Mike said he won 2 bowl games at Duke I didn’t realize he meant the Pinstripe and Quicklane Bowls. That changes everything for me. 😎 But at least he won them. So there’s that. Yes I am glad he won them but who did he really beat? I like DJ but not because of his records or what he did in college but more because he was prepared to play for the NFL rather than college. He didn't come from a system that makes "Qbs" look good. His humbleness really impresses me. Lastly the touch he has on his throws comes naturally. I see a NFL QB but I can't see something great yet. There hasn't been enough games or even throws to see anything other than a guys who looks the part of a NFL QB. I really need to see him when things go bad. When the team is down and needs a comeback. When things go wrong that is not in his control ( bad weather, bad defense, injuries, etc...). I have not seen that yet and it will probably be a while before I do see it. Hopefully my patience pays off. My current stance is he has the chops to be a NFL QB but not one that will successful without good players around him. The great part about it is he has one of the best offensive players in Saquon, other budding stars like Shep, Engram and Hernandez and a young team that will grow with him. I am excited about the future of this team. 100% agree. Too early to evaluate the intangibles but so far he throws a nice ball to the right guy and says the right things. As far as Mayfield, he’s a player, his mouth might get him in trouble, but it’s hard to fault him with the success he had in college and the limited successq he’s had in the pros. He supposedly clarified his comments about Jones so it should be a non story. Unless, of course, Beckham weighs in. Then the whole thing will grow legs for weeks.
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yoho
Special Teams
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Post by yoho on Aug 21, 2019 9:03:05 GMT -5
So far Jones has looked good. He seems to make quick reads, knows where to go with the ball, and has good accuracy and touch, and ball placement. So far this has been all against number twos, but you can only beat the ones they put you up against, and he has done that. If he can keep his poise in real game situations, I think we’ll have something. Based on the college video I’ve seen from him, he has stood in there and made plays with a below average offense around him. That may have forged him for what is yet to come. I am optimistic as he appears to have the height, the arm, and the mental sharpness to be successful. Mostly he is quick to know where to go with the ball, and accurate. But I still expect some struggles until he gets comfortable, however having Barkley is a huge safety blanket when he finally gets his chance.
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Post by Jomo on Aug 21, 2019 19:18:59 GMT -5
is that QB hell or just team hell though? depends on who you ask here, but it's worth the question It's a good question, and honest question and the right question. Can we be honest? JR boxed us in with about 9 years of bad drafts. I can't tell you whether Eli is still capable but I can tell you that we don't really know at the moment. Two years into DG and a couple of strong draft years we will get a better read on Eli this year. We will get a final read on Eli this year. I am hopeful for Eli and really hopeful for DJ
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