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Post by Kase1 on Dec 17, 2020 15:40:32 GMT -5
That sounds good to me. Id be totally cool going with BPA in the 1st, if it happens to be a WR im cool with it. Hell even in the 2nd, id be cool with it depends on who drops. Im not familiar with Watkins at all, ill have to check my draft sites to see what they say. Are you a UAB fan? EDIT; 6'3, 205LBS PROS: Transferred to UAB from the JUCO ranks and became a big play threat. Averaged 19.2 yards per reception on 57 catches in 2019, showcasing his ability to get down the field and make plays on the football. Has excellent ball skills and he does well to track the football, adjust and position himself to win at the catch point. Highly successful in contested situations and he showcases terrific hands to pluck the football and hang on through contact. Concentration and body control are outstanding. True alpha when the ball is in the air and he attacks it with a “my ball” mentality. Fluid route runner that is smooth in and out of breaks. Has run detailed routes with multiple breaks which he executes with terrific timing and suddenness. Physical and decisive after the catch and he showcases plenty of shifty moves to create space for himself. Has appeal as a target at all levels of the field. CONS: While he made plenty of big plays down the field, a surprising amount of them were in contested situations. He runs routes with good pace and timing but his ability to create separation down the field is a question mark in terms of that vertical big play potential translating to the NFL. Gets to top speed quickly but does he have another gear very hard pass He would be a favorite on BBV though..slow and big Sounds like all he is good for is the jump ball I dont go on BBV, is that where the cavemen Giants fans congregate?? Reddit is usually my #2 option after here
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 17, 2020 15:45:03 GMT -5
very hard pass He would be a favorite on BBV though..slow and big Sounds like all he is good for is the jump ball I dont go on BBV, is that where the cavemen Giants fans congregate?? Reddit is usually my #2 option after here You mean tbe uppity old school fans that are still stuck in 1990.. Yep
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Post by jmike on Dec 17, 2020 15:46:21 GMT -5
very hard pass He would be a favorite on BBV though..slow and big Sounds like all he is good for is the jump ball I dont go on BBV, is that where the cavemen Giants fans congregate?? Reddit is usually my #2 option after here As a 6th round WR, you really aren't expecting to get a complete package but a WR with skills you can work with. Good size, good body control and ball skills are a good starting point for a productive receiver.
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Post by Kase1 on Dec 17, 2020 16:39:59 GMT -5
Sounds like all he is good for is the jump ball I dont go on BBV, is that where the cavemen Giants fans congregate?? Reddit is usually my #2 option after here As a 6th round WR, you really aren't expecting to get a complete package but a WR with skills you can work with. Good size, good body control and ball skills are a good starting point for a productive receiver. Those are nice assets but if you cant get any separation, whats the use?? Sounds like a 1 trick pony who will have the most value as strictly a red zone option, reminds me of Ramses Barden, LOL
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 18, 2020 0:00:46 GMT -5
As a 6th round WR, you really aren't expecting to get a complete package but a WR with skills you can work with. Good size, good body control and ball skills are a good starting point for a productive receiver. Those are nice assets but if you cant get any separation, whats the use?? Sounds like a 1 trick pony who will have the most value as strictly a red zone option, reminds me of Ramses Barden, LOL In this league a guy like this is useless We have a guy like this in Mack..we don't need another
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Post by fifthavephil on Dec 18, 2020 1:32:43 GMT -5
You asked if I was a UAB fan. Didn't think I needed to be more descriptive, sorry. Figured you would have some input after I posted his scouting report, guess not For what’s it worth. He is related to Sammy Watkins.
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Post by jmike on Dec 18, 2020 11:09:39 GMT -5
Those are nice assets but if you cant get any separation, whats the use?? Sounds like a 1 trick pony who will have the most value as strictly a red zone option, reminds me of Ramses Barden, LOL In this league a guy like this is useless We have a guy like this in Mack..we don't need another When talking about late round WRs here, incomplete players. What skills would you prioritize in a receiver late in the draft? For me, I like players there that have good ball skills primarily, but have other physical skills that compliment that like speed or size. Watkins caught my eye because he has good size and ball skills. Mack was a player I liked as a late round possibility in the last draft, funny that you mentioned him.
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 18, 2020 11:31:27 GMT -5
In this league a guy like this is useless We have a guy like this in Mack..we don't need another When talking about late round WRs here, incomplete players. What skills would you prioritize in a receiver late in the draft? For me, I like players there that have good ball skills primarily, but have other physical skills that compliment that like speed or size. Watkins caught my eye because he has good size and ball skills. Mack was a player I liked as a late round possibility in the last draft, funny that you mentioned him. Speed
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Post by jmike on Dec 18, 2020 11:43:17 GMT -5
When talking about late round WRs here, incomplete players. What skills would you prioritize in a receiver late in the draft? For me, I like players there that have good ball skills primarily, but have other physical skills that compliment that like speed or size. Watkins caught my eye because he has good size and ball skills. Mack was a player I liked as a late round possibility in the last draft, funny that you mentioned him. Speed That's it? Well, since everyone is looking for speed you have a problem there in the late rounds. A player with speed that can also catch the ball will not be there, they will be gone by the 4th at the latest. So I suggest adding a bit more useful criteria there since a WR that can't catch is actually useless.
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Post by Kase1 on Dec 18, 2020 13:42:53 GMT -5
In this league a guy like this is useless We have a guy like this in Mack..we don't need another When talking about late round WRs here, incomplete players. What skills would you prioritize in a receiver late in the draft? For me, I like players there that have good ball skills primarily, but have other physical skills that compliment that like speed or size. Watkins caught my eye because he has good size and ball skills. Mack was a player I liked as a late round possibility in the last draft, funny that you mentioned him. I like size, and I like ball skills, but it sounds like if he gets jammed at the line its over. I guess I want someone with speed, you cant teach that. Its not like he's a great route runner or a technician, sounds like all he has is size and ball skills and thats a good start, but I guess give me more. Give me a good blocker, or a good route runner, or something, just more than size
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Post by Kase1 on Dec 18, 2020 13:44:26 GMT -5
That's it? Well, since everyone is looking for speed you have a problem there in the late rounds. A player with speed that can also catch the ball will not be there, they will be gone by the 4th at the latest. So I suggest adding a bit more useful criteria there since a WR that can't catch is actually useless. You make a good point, a WR that cant catch IS useless. I guess id rather take a speedy or quick guy that has blocking or catching issues because that is easier to teach than speed
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Post by jmike on Dec 18, 2020 15:46:36 GMT -5
That's it? Well, since everyone is looking for speed you have a problem there in the late rounds. A player with speed that can also catch the ball will not be there, they will be gone by the 4th at the latest. So I suggest adding a bit more useful criteria there since a WR that can't catch is actually useless. You make a good point, a WR that cant catch IS useless. I guess id rather take a speedy or quick guy that has blocking or catching issues because that is easier to teach than speed Fair enough. My starting point with any receiver in any round is his ability to catch the ball. Slayton for example was labelled as having bad hands because of the drops. Not what I saw though. He had inconsistent hands. Drops were hand placement and concentration related. So we have a 5th round kid, with good speed, inconsistent hands(not bad hands) but struggles with getting jammed. OK, good skills to start with for a late rounder. He has turned out pretty good, but still struggles getting clean break off the line. I've only watched a bit of Watkins, I have not seen him struggle to release in that sample size. He doesn't get separation down the field in a traditional sense, but has good body control and frame and he uses his body to create separation at the catch point. Shown reliable hands. Weak route runner and only good enough speed. If you are looking at him for #1 WR potential, no, not there. But useful piece to a WR corps with the ability to improve, he may just be. Not every guy is going to be a #1 WR possibility and swinging for the fences on speed or workout numbers alone leaves you with a lot of late round guys who aren't on the team anymore. I was hoping someone here had seen more of him playing than I have as he intrigues me, but I just don't have the time to watch enough of him playing to get the whole picture on him.
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 18, 2020 16:38:01 GMT -5
That's it? Well, since everyone is looking for speed you have a problem there in the late rounds. A player with speed that can also catch the ball will not be there, they will be gone by the 4th at the latest. So I suggest adding a bit more useful criteria there since a WR that can't catch is actually useless. You make a good point, a WR that cant catch IS useless. I guess id rather take a speedy or quick guy that has blocking or catching issues because that is easier to teach than speed Also A speed guy can be highly useful as a return specialist/get the ball in space kind of guy Devin Hester didn't have a position..he had 4.28 speed .. Best returner in history and made a few plays in space on offense Ponderous Paul is useless
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Post by JoeyCush on Dec 19, 2020 9:59:06 GMT -5
Apparently Jaylen Waddle is out of his cast and is already running on treadmill. I would love to see him run at the combine and see his progression.
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 19, 2020 11:49:42 GMT -5
Apparently Jaylen Waddle is out of his cast and is already running on treadmill. I would love to see him run at the combine and see his progression. Apparently his injury was more compared to T.0s than Odell's Would put another top dynamic name in the mix that we desperately need
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Post by Kase1 on Dec 20, 2020 13:49:28 GMT -5
You make a good point, a WR that cant catch IS useless. I guess id rather take a speedy or quick guy that has blocking or catching issues because that is easier to teach than speed Fair enough. My starting point with any receiver in any round is his ability to catch the ball. Slayton for example was labelled as having bad hands because of the drops. Not what I saw though. He had inconsistent hands. Drops were hand placement and concentration related. So we have a 5th round kid, with good speed, inconsistent hands(not bad hands) but struggles with getting jammed. OK, good skills to start with for a late rounder. He has turned out pretty good, but still struggles getting clean break off the line. I've only watched a bit of Watkins, I have not seen him struggle to release in that sample size. He doesn't get separation down the field in a traditional sense, but has good body control and frame and he uses his body to create separation at the catch point. Shown reliable hands. Weak route runner and only good enough speed. If you are looking at him for #1 WR potential, no, not there. But useful piece to a WR corps with the ability to improve, he may just be. Not every guy is going to be a #1 WR possibility and swinging for the fences on speed or workout numbers alone leaves you with a lot of late round guys who aren't on the team anymore. I was hoping someone here had seen more of him playing than I have as he intrigues me, but I just don't have the time to watch enough of him playing to get the whole picture on him. Usually when someone is labeled as having "bad hands" its because of drops or inconsistencies, i don't know what else would warrant someone being labeled as having "bad hands" If you look for a #1 in the mid to late rounds, you're just kidding yourself, kind of like how alot of people on here expected Slayton to immediately be a #1 wr after being drafted in the 5th or 6th round. There is usually a good reason why a player falls so far in the draft.
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Post by Kase1 on Dec 21, 2020 9:53:17 GMT -5
So it looks to me that having at least 1 competent WR is going to be on our agenda this offseason, so who do you guys like most between
Tier 1:(Round 1) Jamar Chase Jaylen Waddle DeVonta Smith
Tier 2: (Round 2) Rashod Bateman Chris Olave Terrance Marshall
Tier 3: (Middle of Round 2-4) Amon St Brown Rondale Moore Seth Williams Kadarius Toney Dazz Newsome Sage Surratt
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 21, 2020 10:04:27 GMT -5
So it looks to me that having at least 1 competent WR is going to be on our agenda this offseason, so who do you guys like most between Tier 1:(Round 1) Jamar Chase Jaylen Waddle DeVonta Smith Tier 2: (Round 2) Rashod Bateman Chris Olave Terrance Marshall Tier 3: (Middle of Round 2-4) Amon St Brown Rondale Moore Seth Williams Kadarius Toney Dazz Newsome Sage Surratt Left out Coxie (tweener tier 2 and 3) That is a nice list for sure Chase won't be there... So give me Smith and Coxie.
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Post by Kase1 on Dec 21, 2020 13:57:22 GMT -5
So it looks to me that having at least 1 competent WR is going to be on our agenda this offseason, so who do you guys like most between Tier 1:(Round 1) Jamar Chase Jaylen Waddle DeVonta Smith Tier 2: (Round 2) Rashod Bateman Chris Olave Terrance Marshall Tier 3: (Middle of Round 2-4) Amon St Brown Rondale Moore Seth Williams Kadarius Toney Dazz Newsome Sage Surratt Left out Coxie (tweener tier 2 and 3) That is a nice list for sure Chase won't be there... So give me Smith and Coxie. Oh yea, totally forgot about Coxie, id put him in Tier 3. Im torn between a Smith/Williams or Surratt combo or go defense in the 1st and a Bateman/Williams, Surratt or Newsome combo. Either way I want at least 1 WR in the 1st 3 rounds. How do you feel about the TE class, I know you're a big fan of the multiple TE sets
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Post by DJones19 on Dec 21, 2020 15:06:29 GMT -5
Watched a little bit of Smith...his route running looks absurdly good. His ball control and hands are great too. I'll have to watch more of Chase and Waddle. Waddle looked fast but like a Tavon Austin type...wasn't really blown away by his highlights.
...after taking a deeper look it looks like Smith has shot up draft boards and some have him higher than Chase now. I like him the most.
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Post by jimmieray on Dec 23, 2020 20:29:46 GMT -5
Fair enough. My starting point with any receiver in any round is his ability to catch the ball. Slayton for example was labelled as having bad hands because of the drops. Not what I saw though. He had inconsistent hands. Drops were hand placement and concentration related. So we have a 5th round kid, with good speed, inconsistent hands(not bad hands) but struggles with getting jammed. OK, good skills to start with for a late rounder. He has turned out pretty good, but still struggles getting clean break off the line. I've only watched a bit of Watkins, I have not seen him struggle to release in that sample size. He doesn't get separation down the field in a traditional sense, but has good body control and frame and he uses his body to create separation at the catch point. Shown reliable hands. Weak route runner and only good enough speed. If you are looking at him for #1 WR potential, no, not there. But useful piece to a WR corps with the ability to improve, he may just be. Not every guy is going to be a #1 WR possibility and swinging for the fences on speed or workout numbers alone leaves you with a lot of late round guys who aren't on the team anymore. I was hoping someone here had seen more of him playing than I have as he intrigues me, but I just don't have the time to watch enough of him playing to get the whole picture on him. Usually when someone is labeled as having "bad hands" its because of drops or inconsistencies, i don't know what else would warrant someone being labeled as having "bad hands" I think Jenn is referring to "bad hands" as something not correctable, like speed or twitch ability. "Inconsistent hands", as she said, could be about technique and concentration, which are correctable. Slayton was dropping everything in the early camp, looked like a poor pick at first. Obviously the coaching worked on that, he wound up having a decent season.
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 23, 2020 22:30:44 GMT -5
Usually when someone is labeled as having "bad hands" its because of drops or inconsistencies, i don't know what else would warrant someone being labeled as having "bad hands" I think Jenn is referring to "bad hands" as something not correctable, like speed or twitch ability. "Inconsistent hands", as she said, could be about technique and concentration, which are correctable. Slayton was dropping everything in the early camp, looked like a poor pick at first. Obviously the coaching worked on that, he wound up having a decent season. Got his eyes checked and got contacts right after his rookie minicamp Night and day ... One of those great Charger recievers (I think Joiner)had an issue like that until he got his eyes checked (wore huge goggles) Same thing with Billy White Shoes Johnson(got contacts once he was traded to Atlanta )
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Post by jimmieray on Dec 24, 2020 8:38:28 GMT -5
I think Jenn is referring to "bad hands" as something not correctable, like speed or twitch ability. "Inconsistent hands", as she said, could be about technique and concentration, which are correctable. Slayton was dropping everything in the early camp, looked like a poor pick at first. Obviously the coaching worked on that, he wound up having a decent season. Got his eyes checked and got contacts right after his rookie minicamp Night and day ... One of those great Charger recievers (I think Joiner)had an issue like that until he got his eyes checked (wore huge goggles) Same thing with Billy White Shoes Johnson(got contacts once he was traded to Atlanta ) I hadn't seen that discussed here, unbelievable. When he was having those early issues, the number of drops being reported was alarming. I wondered if he would even make the roster, or wind up just being a deep decoy to loosen things up at the line. There's been some disagreement as to whether he's fighting through injuries now - I believe he is, but being in each game would seem to indicate he just needs to off season to heal up.
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Post by SG88 on Dec 29, 2020 21:01:07 GMT -5
Devonta Smith was just awarded the AP college player of the year award. I think it is safe to say that his stock is increasing on a daily basis. Please put this young man in Giants blue
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Post by jmike on Dec 30, 2020 10:05:58 GMT -5
Thanks for your thoughts on Watkins. Have a few other WRs here that have caught my eye and was curious as to the thoughts of others on them as prospects and potential picks for the Giants:
>Dazz Newsome, North Carolina 5'11" 190 >Sage Surratt, Wake Forest 6'2" 215 >Seth Williams, Auburn 6'2" 224 >Anthony Schwartz, Auburn 6'0" 179
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 30, 2020 11:07:54 GMT -5
Thanks for your thoughts on Watkins. Have a few other WRs here that have caught my eye and was curious as to the thoughts of others on them as prospects and potential picks for the Giants: >Dazz Newsome, North Carolina 5'11" 190 >Sage Surratt, Wake Forest 6'2" 215 >Seth Williams, Auburn 6'2" 224 >Anthony Schwartz, Auburn 6'0" 179 Suratt= slow poke that will have trouble winning at the next level Love Daz and Sxhwartz
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Post by Kase1 on Dec 30, 2020 15:43:13 GMT -5
Got his eyes checked and got contacts right after his rookie minicamp Night and day ... One of those great Charger recievers (I think Joiner)had an issue like that until he got his eyes checked (wore huge goggles) Same thing with Billy White Shoes Johnson(got contacts once he was traded to Atlanta ) I hadn't seen that discussed here, unbelievable. When he was having those early issues, the number of drops being reported was alarming. I wondered if he would even make the roster, or wind up just being a deep decoy to loosen things up at the line. There's been some disagreement as to whether he's fighting through injuries now - I believe he is, but being in each game would seem to indicate he just needs to off season to heal up. I keep seeing people saying that Slayton is playing hurt, when did he get dinged up??? I sure hope that his hands are a correctable issue, its weird, last season it wasnt an issue at all. Maybe he over achieved due to lack of pro film on him, I have no idea, but he looks like a shell of the player we saw last season
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Post by giantlegacy on Dec 30, 2020 16:05:16 GMT -5
I hadn't seen that discussed here, unbelievable. When he was having those early issues, the number of drops being reported was alarming. I wondered if he would even make the roster, or wind up just being a deep decoy to loosen things up at the line. There's been some disagreement as to whether he's fighting through injuries now - I believe he is, but being in each game would seem to indicate he just needs to off season to heal up. I keep seeing people saying that Slayton is playing hurt, when did he get dinged up??? I sure hope that his hands are a correctable issue, its weird, last season it wasnt an issue at all. Maybe he over achieved due to lack of pro film on him, I have no idea, but he looks like a shell of the player we saw last season Look at how explosive he was week one Look at him now He got injured sometime week 5/6
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Post by Kase1 on Dec 30, 2020 16:44:45 GMT -5
I keep seeing people saying that Slayton is playing hurt, when did he get dinged up??? I sure hope that his hands are a correctable issue, its weird, last season it wasnt an issue at all. Maybe he over achieved due to lack of pro film on him, I have no idea, but he looks like a shell of the player we saw last season Look at how explosive he was week one Look at him now He got injured sometime week 5/6 Hand injury?? Upper Body injury?? A lower body injury wouldn't explain his dropsies this year
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3days
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Posts: 4,025
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Post by 3days on Dec 30, 2020 16:50:24 GMT -5
Look at how explosive he was week one Look at him now He got injured sometime week 5/6 Hand injury?? Upper Body injury?? A lower body injury wouldn't explain his dropsies this year I think it is a lower body injury preventing him from getting separation. Because of that more of his catches are contested, hence the drops.
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