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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 12, 2021 13:27:38 GMT -5
Thats a good point, and I certainly considered it. Of course Gregory Rousseau is exactly who I had in mind. Im not really even suggesting dont take Smith if he's available. He probably won't be, but of course I'd be more than fine with it if that's who we ended up with. Im really just suggesting itd be wise to not lock into having to go wr with the first pick just because its the most obvious need. But to reiterate my general point...while I certainly acknowledge Smith is more of a sure thing than Rousseau, if you could tell me that Rousseau will be 80-85% as good at being an nfl edge rusher as we think Smith will be at wr, I'd rather have Rousseau. Yep A good edge rusher is more important than a dynamic WR for sure, however none of the edge rushers are are worth a pick at 11.. Its a huge reach we can't do that esp when the offense is starved for weapons. I don't think we'll even have a chance at Smith and if the Giants address WR in FA chances are we aren't going to draft a WR with that pick unless for whatever miracle Smith or Chase drop. This is the kind of draft where if you need a WR you draft a WR and get your edge guy in round two. I know it sounds crazy, bc its usually the opposite, but that has more to do with not how bad we need a WR but how lackluster these edge guys are this year. The good news is there's going to be plenty of avenues the Giants can go with their first pick.. they just cna't reach... FA is going to tell us alot about where the giants are thinking of going draft wise. Seems like the Gettleman method is to flood positions of need in both FA and the draft If history here is any indication he gets a bargain type guy that is starting level (Watkins?) or a decent rotation stop gap player (Flemming)so we aren't shopping completely starving come draft time then hit the position hard.. Also his history in Carolina is that he likes to keep his trenches long term,both sides of the ball with 2nd contracts (he resigned both DTs he drafted in Carolina and resigned one of his guards ,forget his name ) So if that is any indication I have a feeling he could go not prime playmaker in FA..(even though we have future cap space to do so) Also We have seen recievers we didn't expect traded lately...so maybe we get a guy via trade |
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southerner
Starter
Bearer of Bad News
Posts: 4,226
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Post by southerner on Jan 12, 2021 14:26:59 GMT -5
The Giants were never going to take a WR at No. 11...this isn’t Reese drafting for the Giants. Now that Joe Judge is firmly in charge, they will probably trade down, just like the Patriots do. This is something Gettleman doesn’t normally do, but Judge will certainly be more persuasive in the draft room this year than he was last year. |
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Post by BlueReign on Jan 12, 2021 15:15:53 GMT -5
Yeah, Smith will be lone gone before 11.
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Post by lt56 on Jan 12, 2021 15:36:02 GMT -5
Smith is an amazing Route Runner, one of the best Route Runners I've ever seen in Collage Football. Skinny Guy, will have to Bulk Up for the NFL but that Route Running is incredible!
Yeah he will be long gone by the 11th Pick and so will Ja'Marr Chase and maybe even Jaylen Waddle (especially after he runs the 40 at the Combine)
I think...HOPE we go Free Agent route for Receiver and land Golladay or Allen Robinson but if one of these young Receivers fall then yeah of course you grab one of them. The impact Stephon Diggs has had in Buffalo and how he has had a major impact on Allen Development as a QB and helping make his job easier is huge. I think we also should grab that Veteran like a Golladay or Robinson for Jones and to help with his Development and make his job easier
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Post by FundamentallySoundJones on Jan 12, 2021 16:24:43 GMT -5
So maybe we trade up and get him.
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 12, 2021 16:29:12 GMT -5
So maybe we trade up and get him. No no no no Unless its a qb or maybe an elite pass rusher you NEVER trade up like this for anyone We probably would have to trade up in front of Miami ...11-3 That is at least 2 extra 1st round picks including 11 plus a day 2 pick this year |
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Post by Kase1 on Jan 12, 2021 16:33:02 GMT -5
I think he is being sarcastic....and I have my doubts with Gettleman understanding how to get modern playmakers myself Hopefully one of them drops and we get one Hopefully the computer folks point him in the right direction.  Are they talking about us???? |
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Post by Kase1 on Jan 12, 2021 16:35:08 GMT -5
The guy is a great receiver, but acquiring him is not going to make or break the future of this team. History would suggest that, much like rbs, an elite top 5 type wr is not essential in building a championship roster. The Giants certainly need to make upgrading the wr position a priority, but this doesn't need to be done in the 1st round of the draft. I'd much prefer it if the Giants were able to acquire an elite level edge rusher with their first pick. I think that would have a much bigger impact on future overall success than a wr. The Giants have more than one hole, but the defense is the unit that could perceivably make the transformation to being great with a good offseason in 2021. Furthermore, its a pretty strong wr class from what I understand. My guess is that the Giants will look to target a wr in rd 2 and also sign a wr in fa to address the problem, and I hope I'm right. the problem is an "elite" edge rusher just doesn't really exist at 11.. it would be a reach. This draft if underwelming with pass rushers and Gregory Rousseau is one year removed from playing football. ...And only had 1 year of production |
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Post by Kase1 on Jan 12, 2021 16:40:13 GMT -5
I think he is being sarcastic....and I have my doubts with Gettleman understanding how to get modern playmakers myself Hopefully one of them drops and we get one You mentioned several times that this is a deep draft for WR. If my memory serves me correct (it might not), I believe you mentioned that this years WR class was as good or better than last years class. Do the Giants need to invest their #1 pick at WR to find a #1 or will there be some be available in the 2nd round? The draft class IS deep with good talent in the 1st few rounds. Thats doesnt mean I dont want Smith or Chase at 11, if either falls im all about it. What me and im sure GL will say is that there is some good talent after them, not as good as Chase or Smith but still good. Chris Olave 2 Rashod Bateman 2 Terry Marshall 2 Nico Collins 2-3 Dazz Newsome 3 Seth Williams 4 Sage Surratt 3 DaMonte Coxie 3-4 are a few names of guys we've been discussing in the draft section of the gmb |
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Jan 12, 2021 16:44:29 GMT -5
Ha - you’re either tongue in cheek or you’ve bumped your head.
if Smith is there at 11 - he’ll be a Giant unless we are already ready to move on from DJ. Then possibly Mac Jones.
I think he is being sarcastic....and I have my doubts with Gettleman understanding how to get modern playmakers myself Hopefully one of them drops and we get one The better question is what will Joe Judge want if it's Parsons then it will be Parsons if it's a WR then it will be a WR. I think in a perfect world for Gettlemen his coach  a playmaker because DG is tied to Jones no playmaker his QB is gonna struggle. |
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Jan 12, 2021 16:49:21 GMT -5
I’m sure Dave Gettleman will figure something out. Probably draft a receiver that has hog mollie characteristics. A big bodied slug that can't get seperation but is a top blocker in the run game in the 6th round Remember He spend a 2nd on Devin Funchess...a large tweener that didn't even have the production Engram has He drafted Benjamin also he was big as hell and started off pretty good but one knee injury he was done didn't have a step tp lose I will pass. He did draft Curtis Samuel more in the mold of todays WRs maybe he learned if they are big and can't run it ain't gonna last. |
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Post by Kase1 on Jan 12, 2021 16:53:18 GMT -5
Thats a good point, and I certainly considered it. Of course Gregory Rousseau is exactly who I had in mind. Im not really even suggesting dont take Smith if he's available. He probably won't be, but of course I'd be more than fine with it if that's who we ended up with. Im really just suggesting itd be wise to not lock into having to go wr with the first pick just because its the most obvious need. But to reiterate my general point...while I certainly acknowledge Smith is more of a sure thing than Rousseau, if you could tell me that Rousseau will be 80-85% as good at being an nfl edge rusher as we think Smith will be at wr, I'd rather have Rousseau. I don't trust any of these edge rushers at 11 honestly Rousseau has a horrifically low floor to even be considered...we lucked out with JPP having a similar boom or bust feel but at least you could see 3 years of steady improvement and he wasn't immediately thrust into being a savior his rookie year with the depth they had on that d line (at DE with Tuck,Osi and Kiwi ) Paye is the other guy many think will go early Horrible fit at 275 lbs...he is a 4/3 guy that had a bad year.. All things being equal We get one of the 3 (who knows who flies up the boards at WR ,I think Olave could,remember Odell was a day 2 prospect until the combine)Wrs early Day 2 has some interesting edge guys like Jones,Weaver,eft The corners will be taken ahead of us,Surtain just made himself possibly a top 7 pick last night... Only guy on defense I consider is Parsons if he falls and that will be because Chase and Smith are gone and they are iffy about Waddle.. Rousseau scares the crap out of me, between sitting out 2020 and only really having 1 year of production, thats not worth a 1st or even 2nd round pick to me. Maybe im not a big risk taker but that scares me, just like Jaylen Waddle scares me, for some reason Chase doesnt scare me AS MUCH but im still iffy on Chase. Paye is not a good fit for us for the exact reasons you mentioned, yet people think he's a great choice for us. Sadly I can see DG loving both of these guys. If we dont get Chase or Smith, Im cool with Surtain, Parsons, Farley or God Willing Sewell [now THAT boy is touched by the hand of God, LOL] |
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Post by repeatchamps on Jan 12, 2021 16:55:12 GMT -5
Hopefully the computer folks point him in the right direction. Are they talking about us???? Classic! Timothy Busfield as Point Dexter, legendary! Best scene in that movie by far is Busfield, Carradine and Edwards running out arm in arm of the Pi sorority house after infiltrating it, lol. Goes down as one of those classic 80's comedy movie moments. Right up there with some of the famous scenes in Animal House, Porky's, Caddyshack and on and on.   Here it is: |
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Jan 12, 2021 16:56:57 GMT -5
Don’t forget Kelvin Benjamin. The guy ate himself out of the league. Go to BBV.... That place is still stuck in prehistoric times and there are morons that hope we get a guy like him hE iS a PeRfEcT bIg bOdiEd ReCiEvEr We NeEd,MuCh bEtTeR tHaN tHaT sMuRf DaVoNtA SmItH Its a miracle I haven't been tossed yet trolling those idiots LOL those days are over even the big guys today have to be able to run and jump at least the ones that are any good. Agree no room for guys who if they lose a step they are over with. |
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Jan 12, 2021 17:00:07 GMT -5
I just don't see what value Pitts gives Dallas. They have 3 (maybe 2 if Gallup leaves) WRs are are all number 1s and a TE who is high quality. They just hired a defensive coordinator who is going to want to instill his legion of boom style defense. The are going CB is my bet. Because Jerruh Jones He wants a team to win being an entertaining super high octane Harlem globetrotters style team (this is where he had his rift with Jimmy Johnson..who understood that at that time while the game was starting to change that while having a good offense was good that back in the 90s having a good defense and that o line and running it was the winning way..Jerruh wanted the flashy stars... That team could have 4peated or more if Johnson won) They ruined tbe team last year letting Jones go and signing Cooper (ask yourself..is he that difference maker that takes over games singlehandedly that is worth 100 million,a cautionary tale for those that want to give a not as good version of him yhe same kind of deal to Robinson)then passing on McKinney for Lamb.. Quin may want...Quin will be lucky if any decent assets are given to him(not for nothing but he wanted that kind of defense in Atlanta and his entire time their they failed. Which tells me Pete Carrol had much more to do with that defense in Seattle being put together) But yeah The same thing is they need an all defense draft,even linebackers as Vander Esch is now officially an injury liability witb hks neck issue they ignored before drafting him They always have Jarwin and Schultz at TE And really how many more years does Smith have on that Knee it was destroyed . |
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Jan 12, 2021 17:04:18 GMT -5
So maybe we trade up and get him. No no no no Unless its a qb or maybe an elite pass rusher you NEVER trade up like this for anyone We probably would have to trade up in front of Miami ...11-3 That is at least 2 extra 1st round picks including 11 plus a day 2 pick this year Legacy you know better them me there are some pretty good options possibly in round 2 if thats the route we have to go. |
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 12, 2021 17:06:06 GMT -5
You mentioned several times that this is a deep draft for WR. If my memory serves me correct (it might not), I believe you mentioned that this years WR class was as good or better than last years class. Do the Giants need to invest their #1 pick at WR to find a #1 or will there be some be available in the 2nd round? The draft class IS deep with good talent in the 1st few rounds. Thats doesnt mean I dont want Smith or Chase at 11, if either falls im all about it. What me and im sure GL will say is that there is some good talent after them, not as good as Chase or Smith but still good. Chris Olave 2 Rashod Bateman 2 Terry Marshall 2 Nico Collins 2-3 Dazz Newsome 3 Seth Williams 4 Sage Surratt 3 DaMonte Coxie 3-4 are a few names of guys we've been discussing in the draft section of the gmb I actually think Olave can be as good as the 1st tier and quickly |
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Post by Kase1 on Jan 12, 2021 17:07:04 GMT -5
The draft class IS deep with good talent in the 1st few rounds. Thats doesnt mean I dont want Smith or Chase at 11, if either falls im all about it. What me and im sure GL will say is that there is some good talent after them, not as good as Chase or Smith but still good. Chris Olave 2 Rashod Bateman 2 Terry Marshall 2 Nico Collins 2-3 Dazz Newsome 3 Seth Williams 4 Sage Surratt 3 DaMonte Coxie 3-4 are a few names of guys we've been discussing in the draft section of the gmb I actually think Olave can be as good as the 1st tier and quickly He actually reminds me of Smith |
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Post by giantlegacy on Jan 12, 2021 17:08:03 GMT -5
I don't trust any of these edge rushers at 11 honestly Rousseau has a horrifically low floor to even be considered...we lucked out with JPP having a similar boom or bust feel but at least you could see 3 years of steady improvement and he wasn't immediately thrust into being a savior his rookie year with the depth they had on that d line (at DE with Tuck,Osi and Kiwi ) Paye is the other guy many think will go early Horrible fit at 275 lbs...he is a 4/3 guy that had a bad year.. All things being equal We get one of the 3 (who knows who flies up the boards at WR ,I think Olave could,remember Odell was a day 2 prospect until the combine)Wrs early Day 2 has some interesting edge guys like Jones,Weaver,eft The corners will be taken ahead of us,Surtain just made himself possibly a top 7 pick last night... Only guy on defense I consider is Parsons if he falls and that will be because Chase and Smith are gone and they are iffy about Waddle.. Rousseau scares the crap out of me, between sitting out 2020 and only really having 1 year of production, thats not worth a 1st or even 2nd round pick to me. Maybe im not a big risk taker but that scares me, just like Jaylen Waddle scares me, for some reason Chase doesnt scare me AS MUCH but im still iffy on Chase. Paye is not a good fit for us for the exact reasons you mentioned, yet people think he's a great choice for us. Sadly I can see DG loving both of these guys. If we dont get Chase or Smith, Im cool with Surtain, Parsons, Farley or God Willing Sewell [now THAT boy is touched by the hand of God, LOL] Sewell doesn't get past the Bengals |
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Post by Kase1 on Jan 12, 2021 17:19:09 GMT -5
Rousseau scares the crap out of me, between sitting out 2020 and only really having 1 year of production, thats not worth a 1st or even 2nd round pick to me. Maybe im not a big risk taker but that scares me, just like Jaylen Waddle scares me, for some reason Chase doesnt scare me AS MUCH but im still iffy on Chase. Paye is not a good fit for us for the exact reasons you mentioned, yet people think he's a great choice for us. Sadly I can see DG loving both of these guys. If we dont get Chase or Smith, Im cool with Surtain, Parsons, Farley or God Willing Sewell [now THAT boy is touched by the hand of God, LOL] Sewell doesn't get past the Bengals I could only dream..... |
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Post by GameTime on Jan 12, 2021 17:50:34 GMT -5
Tyreek Hill 5-10 185 missed only 5 games in 5 seasons. Hill is only one example but Smith's size wont dictate his success or failure in the NFL. The kid has big skills. Big receivers can get hurt too. You never know who is tough and who isn't. Smith's size wouldn't keep me from drafting him. getting injured or not in the NFL is not about being tough....... but I agree about Smith's size. He will be drafted very early and if he drops to the NYGs that would be cool too |
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Post by GameTime on Jan 12, 2021 17:54:16 GMT -5
Tyreek Hill 5-10 185 missed only 5 games in 5 seasons. Hill is only one example but Smith's size wont dictate his success or failure in the NFL. The kid has big skills. Man, I get the numbers are the same but if you look at both players they look completely different. Hill is stacked. He's like Steve Smith.....thick like a bulldog. Smith is skinny skinny. His legs literally have no definition, they're bean poles. #DoesHeEvenLiftBro  bottom line is some of the biggest and most ripped guys in the league get injured every week. Saquon "Quads" Barkley for example |
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Jan 12, 2021 21:25:37 GMT -5
The guy is a great receiver, but acquiring him is not going to make or break the future of this team. History would suggest that, much like rbs, an elite top 5 type wr is not essential in building a championship roster. The Giants certainly need to make upgrading the wr position a priority, but this doesn't need to be done in the 1st round of the draft. I'd much prefer it if the Giants were able to acquire an elite level edge rusher with their first pick. I think that would have a much bigger impact on future overall success than a wr. The Giants have more than one hole, but the defense is the unit that could perceivably make the transformation to being great with a good offseason in 2021. Furthermore, its a pretty strong wr class from what I understand. My guess is that the Giants will look to target a wr in rd 2 and also sign a wr in fa to address the problem, and I hope I'm right. If Chase and Smith are already gone at #11 then of course we go edge rusher but Rousseau might be gone already also. Then I would think we go CB cause at least 1 of the top 3 will be there, imo.
Don't worry they never listen to me.
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giantsalmon
Starter
Came over from a defunct board. Formerly LakeO Giant fan
Posts: 3,904
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Post by giantsalmon on Jan 12, 2021 21:26:43 GMT -5
A big bodied slug that can't get seperation but is a top blocker in the run game in the 6th round Remember He spend a 2nd on Devin Funchess...a large tweener that didn't even have the production Engram has He drafted Benjamin also he was big as hell and started off pretty good but one knee injury he was done didn't have a step tp lose I will pass. He did draft Curtis Samuel more in the mold of todays WRs maybe he learned if they are big and can't run it ain't gonna last. What is extra scary is how did they miss the character flaws with Benjamin? Bills gave him another shot and he quickly proved not to be their cup of tea in the effort department. Constant let downs with tardiness and lack of dedication. |
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Jan 12, 2021 21:37:18 GMT -5
So maybe we trade up and get him. No no no no Unless its a qb or maybe an elite pass rusher you NEVER trade up like this for anyone We probably would have to trade up in front of Miami ...11-3 That is at least 2 extra 1st round picks including 11 plus a day 2 pick this year Correct ! GL beat me to it. Were going to need everyone of those top draft picks this year. |
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Post by TCHOF on Jan 12, 2021 21:47:40 GMT -5
Wouldn’t be surprised if Slaton is the pick
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Post by piddy283 on Jan 12, 2021 21:53:05 GMT -5
You mentioned several times that this is a deep draft for WR. If my memory serves me correct (it might not), I believe you mentioned that this years WR class was as good or better than last years class. Do the Giants need to invest their #1 pick at WR to find a #1 or will there be some be available in the 2nd round? The draft class IS deep with good talent in the 1st few rounds. Thats doesnt mean I dont want Smith or Chase at 11, if either falls im all about it. What me and im sure GL will say is that there is some good talent after them, not as good as Chase or Smith but still good. Chris Olave 2 Rashod Bateman 2 Terry Marshall 2 Nico Collins 2-3 Dazz Newsome 3 Seth Williams 4 Sage Surratt 3 DaMonte Coxie 3-4 are a few names of guys we've been discussing in the draft section of the gmb I just started poking around on a couple sites to read up on WR's outside the top-3, and the first name that stood out to me was Nico Collins. Huge frame with speed. May drop a bit in the draft due to Michigan's passing game as a whole being lackluster. |
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Jan 12, 2021 22:47:03 GMT -5
He drafted Benjamin also he was big as hell and started off pretty good but one knee injury he was done didn't have a step tp lose I will pass. He did draft Curtis Samuel more in the mold of todays WRs maybe he learned if they are big and can't run it ain't gonna last. What is extra scary is how did they miss the character flaws with Benjamin? Bills gave him another shot and he quickly proved not to be their cup of tea in the effort department. Constant let downs with tardiness and lack of dedication. I think by the time he hit the Bills he was done he was a TE playing WR. Didn't know he had those issues there do know he had a fall from grace tho he started off dominating that rookie year, remember him tearing the ACL and never being the same. |
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Post by McCherry on Jan 12, 2021 23:46:56 GMT -5
You mentioned several times that this is a deep draft for WR. If my memory serves me correct (it might not), I believe you mentioned that this years WR class was as good or better than last years class. Do the Giants need to invest their #1 pick at WR to find a #1 or will there be some be available in the 2nd round? The draft class IS deep with good talent in the 1st few rounds. Thats doesnt mean I dont want Smith or Chase at 11, if either falls im all about it. What me and im sure GL will say is that there is some good talent after them, not as good as Chase or Smith but still good. Chris Olave 2 Rashod Bateman 2 Terry Marshall 2 Nico Collins 2-3 Dazz Newsome 3 Seth Williams 4 Sage Surratt 3 DaMonte Coxie 3-4 are a few names of guys we've been discussing in the draft section of the gmb Terrace Marshall Jr. in round 2. Take the best player available with the 11th pick at any position but RB or Safety. And imagine Pitts and Marshall 1 and 2? |
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Post by krappdetector on Jan 12, 2021 23:47:16 GMT -5
You mentioned several times that this is a deep draft for WR. If my memory serves me correct (it might not), I believe you mentioned that this years WR class was as good or better than last years class. Do the Giants need to invest their #1 pick at WR to find a #1 or will there be some be available in the 2nd round? There "should be" some good talent when we go again in the 2nd I'm partial to Bateman,Olave,Marshall here ....but if God forbid there is an unforseen run on WRs before our pick in the 2nd we could be in the hopes and prayers situation we have been in the past 2 years hoping a guy with warts (Coxie is falling a bit but I think he is legit)develops later...which probably means a slowpoke that doesn't do anything but catches 7 yard passes for 7 yards or a speedburner that has butterfingers or has no idea where he is going (or an asshole witn major red flags ) I think both the edge rushers and wide receivers will get lots of action (after QBs) but the WRs are harder to evaluate, so I think the edges will get vaporized first. Plenty of top notch receivers have come after the first round, so I am for Rouseau or Paye @#11, otherwise Pitts or WR. |
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a playmaker because DG is tied to Jones no playmaker his QB is gonna struggle.
