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Post by Rangers13 on Oct 18, 2021 10:16:55 GMT -5
i am thinking about it and don’t see the connection. He inherited a poorly constructed roster and it’s still poorly constructed. - Golladay is out - Barkley is out - Jones is coming off a concussion- the medicore/poor OL added nothing and lost some - Engram is still overrated - He has zero pass rush - Lost his only LB to injury - Lost Tomlinson which broke up the only stable position on the team Blame the coach b/c he’s like Gettleman? How???? Obviously some of you think this roster is good. Otherwise, why blame he coach? By all means, share which coach you want. Guaranteed that coach will fail too with this roster. Until then, every coach will be the modern day scapegoat. So why is he in the game down 38-3 in the 4th quarter? Or are you going to blame the GM for that too? The point of this thread is to question Joe Judge's judgement. Or lack thereof. Yes. he has had more than a normal amount of injuries to key players. But how is him playing his QB in a 38-3 game, that was just in concussion protocol, a wise move? There's plenty of deserved blame for the GM. Time Judge takes his fair share for not improving anything other than pressers. cherry pick often. Any comment about the rest? As far as Jones, we don’t even know if he is an NFL QB. Maybe he shouldn’t have been playing at all. Did he contribute to that 38-3 score? Fine, get rid of Judge to feel better. Now what? It will be no different than the past three coaches. Heck, if Belichick was here the same fans would be posting about how the game past bye like Coughlin.
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Post by Rangers13 on Oct 18, 2021 10:17:20 GMT -5
oh of course, it’s his roster. And he created these injuries, poor blocking, no pass rush and inaccurate QB by himself. technically, yes. It’s his job to teach players/assistants to improve on those areas… lol, ok Billie
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Post by Roswell on Oct 18, 2021 10:19:18 GMT -5
So why is he in the game down 38-3 in the 4th quarter? Or are you going to blame the GM for that too? The point of this thread is to question Joe Judge's judgement. Or lack thereof. Yes. he has had more than a normal amount of injuries to key players. But how is him playing his QB in a 38-3 game, that was just in concussion protocol, a wise move? There's plenty of deserved blame for the GM. Time Judge takes his fair share for not improving anything other than pressers. cherry pick often. Any comment about the rest? As far as Jones, we don’t even know if he is an NFL QB. Maybe he shouldn’t have been playing at all. Did he contribute to that 38-3 score? Fine, get rid of Judge to feel better. Now what? It will be no different than the past three coaches. Heck, if Belichick was here the same fans would be posting about how the game past bye like Coughlin. Cherry pick? That's the theme of the thread. His lack of judgement with respect to his handling of the QB.
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Post by TheAnalyst on Oct 18, 2021 10:19:51 GMT -5
Maybe you forgot "What Im about, ok, is an old school physical mentality. Ok. We are going to put a product on the field, that the people of this city and region are going to be proud of, because this team will represent this area. We will play fast we will play downhill we will play aggressive. We will punch you in the nose for 60 minutes and play every play like it has a history and life of its own with a relentless competitive attitude. We will play fundamentally sound and will will not beat ourselves."blame the coach if it makes you feel better. Obviously you believe this roster is good and with a different coach they would be winning. Great pivot. Im calling out both for talking out one side of their mouth and the results being the exact opposite. Both of them.
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Post by DandyDon on Oct 18, 2021 10:19:57 GMT -5
What talk? Gettleman spoke about kicking @ss and contradicted himself continually. Never heard Judge do that. Maybe you forgot "What Im about, ok, is an old school physical mentality. Ok. We are going to put a product on the field, that the people of this city and region are going to be proud of, because this team will represent this area. We will play fast we will play downhill we will play aggressive. We will punch you in the nose for 60 minutes and play every play like it has a history and life of its own with a relentless competitive attitude. We will play fundamentally sound and will will not beat ourselves.""We will play fundamentally sound and will will not beat ourselves." When does that start happening exactly? Year 3?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2021 10:21:31 GMT -5
I think Judge is desperate now and hes desperately trying not to show that hes desperate and as a result the noose is tightening. I think his jones decision was out of desperation to try and stay tough and maybe win a game. I think if he just became more transparent and came clean in his pressers, acknowledged that hey we suck, and be a bit mad and show frustration, he'd alleviate a lot of his own stress.
I was a HUGE judge fan year one despite his already obvious shortcomings, and Im still rooting for him, but just like a rookie qb, he has to evolve, he has to look himself in the mirror and learn from his experience, and shift his demeanor.
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Post by Rangers13 on Oct 18, 2021 10:23:41 GMT -5
cherry pick often. Any comment about the rest? As far as Jones, we don’t even know if he is an NFL QB. Maybe he shouldn’t have been playing at all. Did he contribute to that 38-3 score? Fine, get rid of Judge to feel better. Now what? It will be no different than the past three coaches. Heck, if Belichick was here the same fans would be posting about how the game past bye like Coughlin. Cherry pick? That's the theme of the thread. His lack of judgement with respect to his handling of the QB. maybe the theme should be why is Gettleman still here since his roster aided in falling behind 38-3 along with his 17-38 record. If it would have made you feel better had Jones sat after being down 38-3, fine. Guaranteed some would feel he gave up on Jones. The roster stinks is the bottom line with the annual roasting of the coach in full swing.
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Post by Rangers13 on Oct 18, 2021 10:25:00 GMT -5
blame the coach if it makes you feel better. Obviously you believe this roster is good and with a different coach they would be winning. Great pivot. Im calling out both for talking out one side of their mouth and the results being the exact opposite. Both of them. Pivot lol - you hate the coach and want him gone. That’s what you want to hear. Great. Until the next coach. You’re four deep with no end in site.
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Post by Nite on Oct 18, 2021 10:28:54 GMT -5
Verdict: Guilty!
Of impersonating a head coach
Penalty: Options: (1) Drawn and quartered (2) Date with Madame guillotine (3) Seppuku (my favorite)
Or:
A tearful apology to the fanbase and the Mara family as he leaves his job and slowly rides out of town in shame..Only to be picked up by Billy B and he helps them to a 11 game winning streak and a playoff berth..
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Post by jaymas on Oct 18, 2021 10:29:59 GMT -5
I like Joe Judge's message and philosophy, but other than his ability to articulate his message/philosophy (which his team has certainly not lived up to), what has he shown to indicate that he can be a good coach in this league? Hitting your talking points is fine, but eventually that has to be backed up by team performance or else you're doing nothing but blowing hot air. Well said, aligns with how I feel too. I'm even on board with his "results are often overrated and sometimes misleading " thought process he talked about a few weeks ago. Not that they don't matter and certainly are the end KPI, but they are often born of a sound process/path to get there and that's what needs careful attention in order to even have consistent results. The issue is, regardless of him being a quality thinker and seemingly getting guys to believe in him, the performance isn't supporting the fact the process has been fixed. At some point the result does have to dictate the assessment of the process. On a more simple note, our current injury situation and schedule really emphasizes how blowing the Washington and Falcons game may be the most unacceptable part of the year for me. No foundation to deal with losses like we've had the last two weeks. Much easier at 3-3 to rally back from injury gate and an embarrassment against the rams.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2021 10:30:54 GMT -5
one other thought - NOONE on this roster makes plays. I watch a lot of games and guys are making plays, breaking tackles, avoiding defenders, getitng significant yards, other games are so much more up tempo from us. toney started to show us a little of what this is like, but man, our team is just dead in the water compared to most others
as much as we hold the higher ups and coaches accountable for this wreck, I think our roster is just really weak with no depth, and the giants way over value what we have.
when the whole team was almost healthy for the saints game, we saw a glimmer of a real team. take away the frontline guys, and we just totally crumble.
thats a weak roster.
our receivers mostly suck we have NOTHING at tight end, they factor to nothing in our games (i think smith is good but they never play him) we have NO beasts at linebacker, no tucks, osi's, strahans, etc, nothing even close. our oline is still struggling, solder should NOT be on an nfl field.
this roster sucks overall
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Post by TheAnalyst on Oct 18, 2021 10:32:41 GMT -5
Great pivot. Im calling out both for talking out one side of their mouth and the results being the exact opposite. Both of them. Pivot lol - you hate the coach and want him gone. That’s what you want to hear. Great. Until the next coach. You’re four deep with no end in site. Yes, it was a pivot. The GM, yes, he has ruined the franchise for 4 years now. His resume is garbage. Judge, he wont and shouldn't get canned as of right now, but it doesn't look good at all. All that beating his chest and tough guy talk that you said he didn't do, when I just provided you the proof, is backfiring on him.
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Post by vinnie on Oct 18, 2021 10:37:42 GMT -5
I like Joe Judge's message and philosophy, but other than his ability to articulate his message/philosophy (which his team has certainly not lived up to), what has he shown to indicate that he can be a good coach in this league? Hitting your talking points is fine, but eventually that has to be backed up by team performance or else you're doing nothing but blowing hot air. Agreed no wonder Judge and Gettleman get along so well (and Mara thinks that’s a good thing) because they both talk a good game but can’t deliver. Judge’s philosophy may be good, just like Gettleman’s philosophy of building from the inside out, but both have failed miserably at accomplishing what they said they’ll do. IMOF, both have accomplished the exact opposite of what they said they’ll do. Good times.
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Post by Roswell on Oct 18, 2021 10:40:31 GMT -5
Cherry pick? That's the theme of the thread. His lack of judgement with respect to his handling of the QB. maybe the theme should be why is Gettleman still here since his roster aided in falling behind 38-3 along with his 17-38 record. If it would have made you feel better had Jones sat after being down 38-3, fine. Guaranteed some would feel he gave up on Jones. The roster stinks is the bottom line with the annual roasting of the coach in full swing. No. That could be yet the 1000th thread about that subject. This thread is about the obvious lack of judgement that Joe Judge exhibited yesterday by playing his QB when the game was already decided.
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Post by TCHOF on Oct 18, 2021 10:42:06 GMT -5
I will ask again ... Can you name one good thing that the coach has done since he has come here other than talking? he’s held the lockeroom from falling apart like Mac. Again, you must believe this is a good roster and think yet another coach would be winning with this roster. You are making assumptions about what I believe. It doesn't give you pause that the only good thing that you can point out about Judge's tenure to date is that as far as we know, he hasn't lost the locker room (yet)?
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Post by Roswell on Oct 18, 2021 10:47:03 GMT -5
Cherry pick? That's the theme of the thread. His lack of judgement with respect to his handling of the QB. maybe the theme should be why is Gettleman still here since his roster aided in falling behind 38-3 along with his 17-38 record. If it would have made you feel better had Jones sat after being down 38-3, fine. Guaranteed some would feel he gave up on Jones. The roster stinks is the bottom line with the annual roasting of the coach in full swing. Truth is, like you, I like the coach. I want to believe he's going to turn this thing around. He seems really organized. He talks the talk. Time to walk the walk.
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Post by jaymas on Oct 18, 2021 10:49:49 GMT -5
one other thought - NOONE on this roster makes plays. I watch a lot of games and guys are making plays, breaking tackles, avoiding defenders, getitng significant yards, other games are so much more up tempo from us. toney started to show us a little of what this is like, but man, our team is just dead in the water compared to most others as much as we hold the higher ups and coaches accountable for this wreck, I think our roster is just really weak with no depth, and the giants way over value what we have. when the whole team was almost healthy for the saints game, we saw a glimmer of a real team. take away the frontline guys, and we just totally crumble. thats a weak roster. our receivers mostly suck we have NOTHING at tight end, they factor to nothing in our games (i think smith is good but they never play him) we have NO beasts at linebacker, no tucks, osi's, strahans, etc, nothing even close. our oline is still struggling, solder should NOT be on an nfl field. this roster sucks overall Everyone on offense who makes plays and has proven they make plays is hurt. I'm much more disappointed in the defense from an on paper to on field standpoint. I genuinely believe the offense is down too many guys to have an impact. Doesn't mean DJ needs to turn the ball over that much against the rams, but I just can't fault them for sucking nearly as much as the D. The other thing is the two blown games. Would be much easier to lick wounds and try to bounce back mentally if the team were 3-3 right now.
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Post by nycisgreat on Oct 18, 2021 10:57:04 GMT -5
His performance cries new head coach. I still believe that Joe Judge is in over his head with this big market team job. I think the front office did him a disservice by making him he could be a head coach in this league this early in his career. I am sure one day he will be good, but I can see how that will be in this team. This team need a veteran head coach who can manage all aspect of the game wisely. Yesterday the team made many mistakes on special teams and he is supposed to be good at it. Just makes me wonder what is really going on with this team and his managerial style.
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Post by myronguyton29 on Oct 18, 2021 10:59:30 GMT -5
He's the biggest fraud on the team. Mara fell for his slick talking used car salesman act. lol lol don't this joka talk a DAMN GOOD GAME.................
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Post by myronguyton29 on Oct 18, 2021 11:00:47 GMT -5
I like Joe Judge's message and philosophy, but other than his ability to articulate his message/philosophy (which his team has certainly not lived up to), what has he shown to indicate that he can be a good coach in this league? Hitting your talking points is fine, but eventually that has to be backed up by team performance or else you're doing nothing but blowing hot air. about as point blank as it can be put!!!!!!
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Post by OrangeGiant on Oct 18, 2021 11:05:27 GMT -5
I think most reasonable thinkers here are not saying JJ should be fired. I'm not by any means at this point.
But does anyone think it was actually a good idea for DJ to still be on the field yesterday down 38-3 coming off a concussion?
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Post by McCherry on Oct 18, 2021 11:09:38 GMT -5
he’s held the lockeroom from falling apart like Mac. Again, you must believe this is a good roster and think yet another coach would be winning with this roster. You are making assumptions about what I believe. It doesn't give you pause that the only good thing that you can point out about Judge's tenure to date is that as far as we know, he hasn't lost the locker room (yet)? The team quit in the second half. That's not my emotional reaction, that's a fact being reported by analysts today who are confirming that the defense was jogging during Kupp's last big run down the sidelines. I haven't heard one analyst today say the team doesn't have the players to win. They're all saying Judge is doing a bad job and his message isn't being heard.
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Post by Parademon1 on Oct 18, 2021 11:17:16 GMT -5
DJ was in there at the end because he's paid to be the starting QB of this team & until benched or out due to injury, which is a thing with him, he will play all 4 QTs regardless of the score. I see zero issues with Judge keeping him in the game, the league babies these QBs way too much as it is already, now you want the HC to baby him as well? As far as the HC is concerned, I give him 3 yrs total, if next yr this team isn't at least playing meaningful football into Dec, & is once again an after thought by Halloween, he's got to go. As for DJ, he is always playing without a fully healthy offense, last yr he lost SB in week 2, this yr, already he has lost his starting LT , RB, 3WRs in the 1st 6 games. I would really like to see how he does in a game where all those players are healthy & starting. If he stinks it up then, he is also shown the door after this season.
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Post by Rangers13 on Oct 18, 2021 11:32:01 GMT -5
Pivot lol - you hate the coach and want him gone. That’s what you want to hear. Great. Until the next coach. You’re four deep with no end in site. Yes, it was a pivot. The GM, yes, he has ruined the franchise for 4 years now. His resume is garbage. Judge, he wont and shouldn't get canned as of right now, but it doesn't look good at all. All that beating his chest and tough guy talk that you said he didn't do, when I just provided you the proof, is backfiring on him. should he have said we’re going to play slow and soft? - If your OL can’t run block they can’t run block - if your receivers can’t stay on the field they can’t catch - if you have zero pass rushers how do you create a pass rush? You guys have unrealistically expectations as even Vegas had the healthy version of the team at 7 wins.
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Post by Rangers13 on Oct 18, 2021 11:33:31 GMT -5
maybe the theme should be why is Gettleman still here since his roster aided in falling behind 38-3 along with his 17-38 record. If it would have made you feel better had Jones sat after being down 38-3, fine. Guaranteed some would feel he gave up on Jones. The roster stinks is the bottom line with the annual roasting of the coach in full swing. No. That could be yet the 1000th thread about that subject. This thread is about the obvious lack of judgement that Joe Judge exhibited yesterday by playing his QB when the game was already decided. lol - yeah ok. He should have benched the QB after trailing by 35. Who cares?
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Post by Rangers13 on Oct 18, 2021 11:35:08 GMT -5
he’s held the lockeroom from falling apart like Mac. Again, you must believe this is a good roster and think yet another coach would be winning with this roster. You are making assumptions about what I believe. It doesn't give you pause that the only good thing that you can point out about Judge's tenure to date is that as far as we know, he hasn't lost the locker room (yet)? Keep asking for the coaches head if it makes you feel better. If somebody feels the coach is a scapegoat, it is what it is. I don’t blame the coach at all.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 18, 2021 11:37:34 GMT -5
Yes, it was a pivot. The GM, yes, he has ruined the franchise for 4 years now. His resume is garbage. Judge, he wont and shouldn't get canned as of right now, but it doesn't look good at all. All that beating his chest and tough guy talk that you said he didn't do, when I just provided you the proof, is backfiring on him. should he have said we’re going to play slow and soft? - If your OL can’t run block they can’t run block - if your receivers can’t stay on the field they can’t catch - if you have zero pass rushers how do you create a pass rush? You guys have unrealistically expectations as even Vegas had the healthy version of the team at 7 wins. What does vegas know did they ever have pads on?I don't recall the final outcome of the wins and losses thread but I thought many were in the under .500 bracket.. Maybe those fans thought the team would have more wins with the weak ass schedule at the start..
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Post by Rangers13 on Oct 18, 2021 11:42:20 GMT -5
should he have said we’re going to play slow and soft? - If your OL can’t run block they can’t run block - if your receivers can’t stay on the field they can’t catch - if you have zero pass rushers how do you create a pass rush? You guys have unrealistically expectations as even Vegas had the healthy version of the team at 7 wins. What does vegas know did they ever have pads on?I don't recall the final outcome of the wins and losses thread but I thought many were in the under .500 bracket.. Maybe those fans thought the team would have more wins with the weak ass schedule at the start.. Yeah, Vegas doesn’t wear pads yet somehow pad a line of risk they never seem to lose at. Good news though, the 7 win over/under shrunk to 4. Hmm, should i bet the over or under?
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Post by TCHOF on Oct 18, 2021 11:46:41 GMT -5
You are making assumptions about what I believe. It doesn't give you pause that the only good thing that you can point out about Judge's tenure to date is that as far as we know, he hasn't lost the locker room (yet)? Keep asking for the coaches head if it makes you feel better. If somebody feels the coach is a scapegoat, it is what it is. I don’t blame the coach at all. I haven't asked for the coach's head. I simply posed a question that no one (including you) has been able to answer about what Judge has done well from a coaching perspective to date. I like Judge's philosophies and think that he is a decent well-intentioned guy. But if I'm being honest, I haven't seen much more than that to date to give me the confidence that he is the right guy moving forward. I don't know that he isn't the right guy either, but I will tell you that I felt much better about the possibility of him being the right guy last season than I do this season.
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Post by TheAnalyst on Oct 18, 2021 11:52:13 GMT -5
Yes, it was a pivot. The GM, yes, he has ruined the franchise for 4 years now. His resume is garbage. Judge, he wont and shouldn't get canned as of right now, but it doesn't look good at all. All that beating his chest and tough guy talk that you said he didn't do, when I just provided you the proof, is backfiring on him. should he have said we’re going to play slow and soft? - If your OL can’t run block they can’t run block - if your receivers can’t stay on the field they can’t catch - if you have zero pass rushers how do you create a pass rush? You guys have unrealistically expectations as even Vegas had the healthy version of the team at 7 wins. You are bouncing all over the place. I don't care about who is not doing what for the team. My comment, which you first responded to, of comparing DG and Judge is factual. I showed you the proof. DG and JJ both are talking a tough game, neither backing it up so far. Does this team seem fundamentally sound to you? Not losing us games? Of course this team wasn't going to do much this year. I picked them 6-7 wins at best, which obviously seems like an overestimate as of now. When Coughlin was a militant type coach here, he had a resume to back him up. He won 11 games in year 2. He didn't have a losing season here for 8 straight years, 2005 - 2012. Judge is trying to build a resume, but its failing. I do blame DG and have been consistent there, but Judge isnt making me feel all warm and comfy with his abilities yet. It looks over his head at times. I said from the beginning with his style, that if he doesn't win early, its not going to work out for him, fair or unfair. I still think he should be here in 2022 regardless how the season turns out. He had zero experience as a HC on any level. Not even high school. The Giants signed up for it knowing this. 3-4 years minimal. Growing pains. Ect.
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