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Post by vinnie on Oct 19, 2021 13:55:27 GMT -5
I think Jones will be here next year and possible a 5th year. He had a real bad game with an offensive line playing terrible and only one good receiver after the 1st series.. Don't know what people want as a starting QB moving forward but I think we are stuck with Jones for a couple of more years.. We can argue all the time if he's good enough but I just don't see any viable options at least for next year.. well at least we can go ahead and build up the O line for who the next qb will be if he isn't here beyond that. So might turn out fine in the end Build up the O line? Judge and Gettleman both said they were happy with who they had and we were told that new coaches would make all the difference in bringing out the best of the players which couldn’t be more obvious with how much Hernandez and Peart have improved. Once we get Gates and Lemieux back we’ll have top 10 O line! You know other teams would dread playing a line up of Thomas, Lemieux, Gates, Hernandez ad Peart. If that doesn’t strike fear in defenses, I don’t know what O line would.
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Post by myronguyton29 on Oct 19, 2021 14:26:29 GMT -5
well at least we can go ahead and build up the O line for who the next qb will be if he isn't here beyond that. So might turn out fine in the end Build up the O line? Judge and Gettleman both said they were happy with who they had and we were told that new coaches would make all the difference in bringing out the best of the players which couldn’t be more obvious with how much Hernandez and Peart have improved. Once we get Gates and Lemieux back we’ll have top 10 O line! You know other teams would dread playing a line up of Thomas, Lemieux, Gates, Hernandez ad Peart. If that doesn’t strike fear in defenses, I don’t know what O line would. lol so are you saying we don't need much O line help or we do? I think we definitely need at least 2 pieces minimum for sure. If we went ALL defense for the other 9 picks I wouldnt be mad lol. But I think the D with maybe 4 studs or 2-3 studs and one solid player would make a world of difference in addition to what we have. Not sure if Graham ****ed things all up and the players aren't actually that bad or what.
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Post by TCHOF on Oct 19, 2021 15:02:21 GMT -5
Not sure how it can be said that a QB who had 4 passing TD's going into game 6 was playing at a "high level". By comparison, Tom Brady has 18 TD's and Stafford has 16 TD's ... now that is playing at a high level. Jones has had to endure some difficulties for sure and I still am not sure how he is going to ultimately turn out. My only point is that the reports of Jones making some huge leap this year or establishing himself as a franchise QB were laughably premature/exaggerated. They were definitely premature and were simply guesses. It does not help Jones' case when you see other young quarterbacks play well and at a way more consistent rate. I've seen glimpses that Jones can play very well. He lit up a really good Saints defense. It just seems like for every game like that, he gives games like the ones against Denver, Atlanta, and Los Angeles. I wish that we could see more of what we saw against WFT and NO. The bottom line is that Jones deserves props when plays well and criticism when he doesn’t, no matter what. Enough excuses. We want and need consistent results. If fans want to wait until the wheels fall off the Jones bandwagon before jumping off, more power to them. I won't be one of those guys. I really want to fully buy into Jones, but I can't because he is way too inconsistent. Good post
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Post by jaymas on Oct 19, 2021 15:14:14 GMT -5
I don't think this is true. As rookie with far worse talent, the kid threw a lot of TDs and ran for some more. 4 games with 4 plus TDs (one of them 5), nothing to sniff at. His 16 game pace was around 30 TDs...would have been a record at the time. I blame this coaching staff and offensive design a lot. And right now, everyone that matters is hurt. Big games aren't going to come when every talented player is hurt for pretty much all QBs. But what Jones could do in that situation is not have a turnover filled mess when all his guys are out, do what you can, don't hero it. He still needs to learn a lot there. When Jones was a rookie, there was no play book ( information ) on his strengths and weakness.Teams now know how to defend and bait him. A top tier QB can overcome weak OL and injuries. Most teams have injuries and a weak OL. So now being an inexperienced rookie at the hardest position in sports is...an advantage? I've heard it all. I disagree that top tier QBs can survive having none of their good to great skill position players on offense. Will a top tier QB be smarter with the football than Jones was Sunday? Sure, I alluded to that. In a bad situation, can't play hero. But what top tier QB missing 3 of his 4 best receivers, his LT, down 4 to 5 starting guards/center and best olineman up to that point in Gates, and their most talented offensive player (Barkley)...has 300+ yard multi TD games? Doesn't happen, would be the exception if it did, not the rule. If you're expecting of Jones to protect the ball better down that much talent and not press, I agree. But expecting some sort of elite performance from anyone without those horses is ridiculous. To win a game that undermanned, you gotta have a great gameplan, play amazing on defense, force some turnovers of your own, and somehow eat the clock while being opportunistic on offense. Probably need to have a little throwback running success aka be able to run the ball without the threat of a passing game (pretty hard to do in today's nfl). Every successful QB in the NFL has talent around them, even the great ones. If they all of a sudden didn't have talent, they wouldn't be as effective. Also, I think our GM stinks and our coaching staff is having a really bad year...but what teams have the simultaneous thrashing of WR and OL the Giants have right now? Genuinely curious.
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Post by Martin on Oct 19, 2021 15:27:51 GMT -5
The problem I have is that Jones is inconsistent but it makes it even worse that the entire offense is inconsistent including the coaching. Forget the D for the moment. I can't evaluate anything about Daniel Jones. It's a mess! I don't know who he really is except currently he is a very inconsistent QB. If it continues by the end of the season the Giants need to pick a 1st round QB in the draft. I will wait and see for now. Everything about this team is so frustrating!!
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 19, 2021 15:30:36 GMT -5
The problem I have is that Jones is inconsistent but it makes it even worse that the entire offense is inconsistent including the coaching. Forget the D for the moment. I can't evaluate anything about Daniel Jones. It's a mess! I don't know who he really is except currently he is a very inconsistent QB. If it continues by the end of the season the Giants need to pick a 1st round QB in the draft. I will wait and see for now. Everything about this team is so frustrating!! You can't pick a qb just because you have a 1st round pick early in a year where there isn't a legit upgrade coming out. That's how you make a bad situation much worse
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Post by vinnie on Oct 19, 2021 15:32:43 GMT -5
Build up the O line? Judge and Gettleman both said they were happy with who they had and we were told that new coaches would make all the difference in bringing out the best of the players which couldn’t be more obvious with how much Hernandez and Peart have improved. Once we get Gates and Lemieux back we’ll have top 10 O line! You know other teams would dread playing a line up of Thomas, Lemieux, Gates, Hernandez ad Peart. If that doesn’t strike fear in defenses, I don’t know what O line would. lol so are you saying we don't need much O line help or we do? I think we definitely need at least 2 pieces minimum for sure. If we went ALL defense for the other 9 picks I wouldnt be mad lol. But I think the D with maybe 4 studs or 2-3 studs and one solid player would make a world of difference in addition to what we have. Not sure if Graham ****ed things all up and the players aren't actually that bad or what. I was definitely being sarcastic. I don’t trust Lemieux as more than back up, Hernandez isn’t worth an extension and Peart sucks. That leaves us with needing two guards and a RT OR move Gates to his natural position at guard and then we need another guard, center and RT. I really don’t care if they address all of the O line next year because I think this team will be lucky to get to 8-8 but they can at least address 2 of the 3 positions. Edge is the other huge need, if not priority, in the next draft as well. We could even use two Edges or one Edge and a LB’er. Either way, the next GM needs to do what Gettleman said he would do but failed horribly at accomplishing which is build from the inside out.
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Post by myronguyton29 on Oct 19, 2021 15:37:08 GMT -5
The problem I have is that Jones is inconsistent but it makes it even worse that the entire offense is inconsistent including the coaching. Forget the D for the moment. I can't evaluate anything about Daniel Jones. It's a mess! I don't know who he really is except currently he is a very inconsistent QB. If it continues by the end of the season the Giants need to pick a 1st round QB in the draft. I will wait and see for now. Everything about this team is so frustrating!! that's why I think if they fix the line which they have the capital to do, then Jones might be ok. I'm kinda willing to take that chance and also if if if the recievers and Barkely can be on the damn field too!!!
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Post by myronguyton29 on Oct 19, 2021 15:42:31 GMT -5
lol so are you saying we don't need much O line help or we do? I think we definitely need at least 2 pieces minimum for sure. If we went ALL defense for the other 9 picks I wouldnt be mad lol. But I think the D with maybe 4 studs or 2-3 studs and one solid player would make a world of difference in addition to what we have. Not sure if Graham ****ed things all up and the players aren't actually that bad or what. I was definitely being sarcastic. I don’t trust Lemieux as more than back up, Hernandez isn’t worth an extension and Peart sucks. That leaves us with needing two guards and a RT OR move Gates to his natural position at guard and then we need another guard, center and RT. I really don’t care if they address all of the O line next year because I think this team will be lucky to get to 8-8 but they can at least address 2 of the 3 positions. Edge is the other huge need, if not priority, in the next draft as well. We could even use two Edges or one Edge and a LB’er. Either way, the next GM needs to do what Gettleman said he would do but failed horribly at accomplishing which is build from the inside out. I wholeheartedly agree edge , OL, LB and pretty much BPA in the first 4 picks even if it's 2 of one position out of the first 4. But yeah 2 of the 3 should be able to be fixed or 80-90 % fixed and light years above what we've had the past 4 yrs ish...................
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Post by TheAussieGiant on Oct 19, 2021 15:59:39 GMT -5
I think DJ looks like and NFL QB this year. Looks like a guy that could win a Super Bowl if he had a great defence and OL around him.
I still don’t think he’s a guy that elevates the players around him. He’s never going to be an MVP type QB.
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 19, 2021 16:34:39 GMT -5
I think DJ looks like and NFL QB this year. Looks like a guy that could win a Super Bowl if he had a great defence and OL around him. I still don’t think he’s a guy that elevates the players around him. He’s never going to be an MVP type QB. How do you know this ? I hate this kind of think. Again Nevermind
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Post by TheAussieGiant on Oct 19, 2021 20:22:39 GMT -5
I think DJ looks like and NFL QB this year. Looks like a guy that could win a Super Bowl if he had a great defence and OL around him. I still don’t think he’s a guy that elevates the players around him. He’s never going to be an MVP type QB. How do you know this ? I hate this kind of think. Again Nevermind I don't know this, thats why I used the word think. Nothing other than what I feel and see watching him play. It all really boils down to how everyone responds to DJ. You have someone like Rodgers, Brady, Murray, Mahomes on your roster and straight away everyone else in your team is more likely to buy in. Because they know they have a guy that can take them to the superbowl. DJ might be this guy, his players around him might already think about him like this. I don't think he is that guy though.
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 19, 2021 20:52:29 GMT -5
How do you know this ? I hate this kind of think. Again Nevermind I don't know this, thats why I used the word think. Nothing other than what I feel and see watching him play. It all really boils down to how everyone responds to DJ. You have someone like Rodgers, Brady, Murray, Mahomes on your roster and straight away everyone else in your team is more likely to buy in. Because they know they have a guy that can take them to the superbowl. DJ might be this guy, his players around him might already think about him like this. I don't think he is that guy though. There is no evidence to suggest he isn't the guy,unfortunately with this team the way it has been built around him and what has happened so far its impossible to say that he is either,which really makes all of this ****ed up What he did in the game against the Saints showed me enough to possibly think he CAN be the guy more than what he did after he lost Toney and Thomas not being the guy.. Fans are looking for a unicorn to save a radioactive dumpster fire of a team are going to be disappointed as no qb can save what Jones is going to be dealing with till the bye week
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Post by Martin on Oct 19, 2021 22:45:59 GMT -5
The problem I have is that Jones is inconsistent but it makes it even worse that the entire offense is inconsistent including the coaching. Forget the D for the moment. I can't evaluate anything about Daniel Jones. It's a mess! I don't know who he really is except currently he is a very inconsistent QB. If it continues by the end of the season the Giants need to pick a 1st round QB in the draft. I will wait and see for now. Everything about this team is so frustrating!! You can't pick a qb just because you have a 1st round pick early in a year where there isn't a legit upgrade coming out. That's how you make a bad situation much worse I have no idea about the QB's in the draft coming up at the moment. We all saw what happened with Lamar Jackson. You can never tell about QB's in the draft. But the Giants need to consider this possibility at the end of this season and I think you should as well.
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 19, 2021 23:11:18 GMT -5
You can't pick a qb just because you have a 1st round pick early in a year where there isn't a legit upgrade coming out. That's how you make a bad situation much worse I have no idea about the QB's in the draft coming up at the moment. We all saw what happened with Lamar Jackson. You can never tell about QB's in the draft. But the Giants need to consider this possibility at the end of this season and I think you should as well. I'm watching theee guys There is no qb as of now that would be an upgrade in this draft,the one that was supposed to be the top guy just got benched (Ratler) To the point you will not see a qb possibly taken in the top 10 this year It's that bleak
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Post by cdngfan on Oct 20, 2021 0:46:36 GMT -5
Is it me or is the "jump" taken by Daniel Jones this season non-existent, or at the least very exaggerated? Through 6 games: 4 Passing TD's, 4 INT's, 5 fumbles Sam Darnold is a lesson to be learned IMO. I think it’s a complete waste to spend another draft pick on another QB until we have two lines that are above average. Once we blow this up again amd get rid of those disaster “save my job” FA contracts we signed this off-season, I’d be happy with a vet until we find the guy we can’t pass up on. Watching Darnold and Tannenhil and Bridgewater and Fitzpatrick all win more than we do leads me to believe we’ll ruin a good QB before one helps us win. I cant think of the last amazing rookie QB who helped a team win with a horrible one dimensional offense and useless defence. Andrew Luck? And before him?
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Eazy E
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Post by Eazy E on Oct 20, 2021 1:31:24 GMT -5
Trubisky gets ragged on all the time but his winning% is 56% in the NFL with 29 career victories. Blake Bortles is a punching bag but even he won 36% of his games with 23 career victories. Whats that say about Daniel Jones, his career record is 9-24 with a winning% of 28%. Thats actually really really bad compared to other 20+ game starters. Will he ever be a .500% QB? Who knows. Seems like he has a lot more losses to add to that record this season.
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Post by TCHOF on Oct 20, 2021 4:30:11 GMT -5
I don't know this, thats why I used the word think. Nothing other than what I feel and see watching him play. It all really boils down to how everyone responds to DJ. You have someone like Rodgers, Brady, Murray, Mahomes on your roster and straight away everyone else in your team is more likely to buy in. Because they know they have a guy that can take them to the superbowl. DJ might be this guy, his players around him might already think about him like this. I don't think he is that guy though. There is no evidence to suggest he isn't the guy,unfortunately with this team the way it has been built around him and what has happened so far its impossible to say that he is either,which really makes all of this ****ed up What he did in the game against the Saints showed me enough to possibly think he CAN be the guy more than what he did after he lost Toney and Thomas not being the guy.. Fans are looking for a unicorn to save a radioactive dumpster fire of a team are going to be disappointed as no qb can save what Jones is going to be dealing with till the bye week There is plenty of evidence to suggest that he isn’t the guy. There is also evidence to suggest that he is the guy. That’s the problem in year 3
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Post by Roswell on Oct 20, 2021 6:24:55 GMT -5
Those stats look bad, but mostly because of one awful game. He has been playing his best ball this year. [br The bad game makes it look like bad optics The #notmyqb people conveniently have picked this week to come out of hiding but the facts are that actually up until Thomas went down he looked the part Hell,2nd drive he was moving around the pocket,eyes downfield feeling the pressure on a play and hit Shepard for a 1st down.... Rest of the game was a perfect storm of bad. No qb can function like that.. For those that say he sucks because he needs everything perfect? When has it been perfect this year? When has he had all his playmakers,running game and a healthy O line this year. When has he had someone who knew how to call plays inside tbe 10 that would allow for success? He carried the team on his back against New Orleans minus 2 good recievers Up until the 2nd quarter this past weekend he was playing at a high level with much lower than perfect around him . I agree with all of this. He has played well until last Sunday and he was in concussion protocol that week. He probably shouldn’t have been cleared. He is not the problem. Oline injuries, WR injuries, OC ineptitude, an underachieving D with horrendous game planning and an HC that makes very poor in game decisions are the problems.
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Post by Roswell on Oct 20, 2021 6:29:04 GMT -5
[br The bad game makes it look like bad optics The #notmyqb people conveniently have picked this week to come out of hiding but the facts are that actually up until Thomas went down he looked the part Hell,2nd drive he was moving around the pocket,eyes downfield feeling the pressure on a play and hit Shepard for a 1st down.... Rest of the game was a perfect storm of bad. No qb can function like that.. For those that say he sucks because he needs everything perfect? When has it been perfect this year? When has he had all his playmakers,running game and a healthy O line this year. When has he had someone who knew how to call plays inside tbe 10 that would allow for success? He carried the team on his back against New Orleans minus 2 good recievers Up until the 2nd quarter this past weekend he was playing at a high level with much lower than perfect around him . Not sure how it can be said that a QB who had 4 passing TD's going into game 6 was playing at a "high level". By comparison, Tom Brady has 18 TD's and Stafford has 16 TD's ... now that is playing at a high level. Jones has had to endure some difficulties for sure and I still am not sure how he is going to ultimately turn out. My only point is that the reports of Jones making some huge leap this year or establishing himself as a franchise QB were laughably premature/exaggerated. Do you think that Brady, Stafford and Jones all play under the same circumstances? There’s a difference between “enduring some difficulties” and playing with his 6th left guard, without his improving left tackle, having Solder on the field, losing all of your WRs and having Garrett as your OC.
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Post by TCHOF on Oct 20, 2021 6:35:45 GMT -5
Not sure how it can be said that a QB who had 4 passing TD's going into game 6 was playing at a "high level". By comparison, Tom Brady has 18 TD's and Stafford has 16 TD's ... now that is playing at a high level. Jones has had to endure some difficulties for sure and I still am not sure how he is going to ultimately turn out. My only point is that the reports of Jones making some huge leap this year or establishing himself as a franchise QB were laughably premature/exaggerated. Do you think that Brady, Stafford and Jones all play under the same circumstances? There’s a difference between “enduring some difficulties” and playing with his 6th left guard, without his improving left tackle, having Solder on the field, losing all of your WRs and having Garrett as your OC. I don’t disagree with any of that, but just don’t tell me that the guy has made some big “jump” this year. He just hasn’t. Much of it may be result of the poor team around him (thanks Getty!), but the fact of the matter is we still don’t know what this guy is almost 2 1/2 seasons in ….
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2021 6:36:15 GMT -5
There is no evidence to suggest he isn't the guy,unfortunately with this team the way it has been built around him and what has happened so far its impossible to say that he is either,which really makes all of this ****ed up What he did in the game against the Saints showed me enough to possibly think he CAN be the guy more than what he did after he lost Toney and Thomas not being the guy.. Fans are looking for a unicorn to save a radioactive dumpster fire of a team are going to be disappointed as no qb can save what Jones is going to be dealing with till the bye week There is plenty of evidence to suggest that he isn’t the guy. There is also evidence to suggest that he is the guy. That’s the problem in year 3 So true still too many questions without much of a chance to get the answers now..
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Post by TCHOF on Oct 20, 2021 6:37:36 GMT -5
There is plenty of evidence to suggest that he isn’t the guy. There is also evidence to suggest that he is the guy. That’s the problem in year 3 So true still too many questions without much of a chance to get the answers now.. Can say the same thing about Judge … very frustrating
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2021 6:41:00 GMT -5
So true still too many questions without much of a chance to get the answers now.. Can say the same thing about Judge … very frustrating It's been frustrating since they hired Getty so he has brought some consistency..
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Post by Roswell on Oct 20, 2021 6:46:42 GMT -5
Do you think that Brady, Stafford and Jones all play under the same circumstances? There’s a difference between “enduring some difficulties” and playing with his 6th left guard, without his improving left tackle, having Solder on the field, losing all of your WRs and having Garrett as your OC. I don’t disagree with any of that, but just don’t tell me that the guy has made some big “jump” this year. He just hasn’t. Much of it may be result of the poor team around him (thanks Getty!), but the fact of the matter is we still don’t know what this guy is almost 2 1/2 seasons in …. He hasn’t made a big jump. That’s for sure. But I’d give him an Incomplete. Let’s see him with, maybe, half his receivers and half his Oline. Like he had in NO. Right now he has 10% of those components. I think he’s got the goods to be a very good starter in the NFL. He needs more around him than he currently has. Im not sure anyone could thrive with the supporting cast that he has right now.
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Post by myronguyton29 on Oct 20, 2021 6:56:26 GMT -5
Trubisky gets ragged on all the time but his winning% is 56% in the NFL with 29 career victories. Blake Bortles is a punching bag but even he won 36% of his games with 23 career victories. Whats that say about Daniel Jones, his career record is 9-24 with a winning% of 28%. Thats actually really really bad compared to other 20+ game starters. Will he ever be a .500% QB? Who knows. Seems like he has a lot more losses to add to that record this season. Sad to say but even the Bears and Jags might have been better than we have been overall with DJ as a team. Yeah on paper it screams we SHOULD be better than they were SMDH which might be the saddest part of it all!!!!!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2021 7:28:07 GMT -5
I don’t disagree with any of that, but just don’t tell me that the guy has made some big “jump” this year. He just hasn’t. Much of it may be result of the poor team around him (thanks Getty!), but the fact of the matter is we still don’t know what this guy is almost 2 1/2 seasons in …. He hasn’t made a big jump. That’s for sure. But I’d give him an Incomplete. Let’s see him with, maybe, half his receivers and half his Oline. Like he had in NO. Right now he has 10% of those components. I think he’s got the goods to be a very good starter in the NFL. He needs more around him than he currently has. Im not sure anyone could thrive with the supporting cast that he has right now. For some reason I thought of Steve Young and how bad he was at Tampa his 1st couple of years.. Give him a great coach and receivers and his career became HoF worthy..
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 20, 2021 7:38:49 GMT -5
He hasn’t made a big jump. That’s for sure. But I’d give him an Incomplete. Let’s see him with, maybe, half his receivers and half his Oline. Like he had in NO. Right now he has 10% of those components. I think he’s got the goods to be a very good starter in the NFL. He needs more around him than he currently has. Im not sure anyone could thrive with the supporting cast that he has right now. For some reason I thought of Steve Young and how bad he was at Tampa his 1st couple of years.. Give him a great coach and receivers and his career became HoF worthy.. Not a bad comparison at all,especially being a running type qb. I also think of Drew Brees in San Diego.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2021 7:54:07 GMT -5
I dunno man, this team is broken. Our wide receivers are garbage. Golladay will never be healthy, and toney might be half the time. beyond that we have a scrap pile, even shep, who I like as a dude, though he sometimes makes simple plays within 5 yards, dude never busts out and makes a big gain. everyone else drops the damn ball all the time. and we have no tight ends, they dont exist in this dojo, theyre never used, and the one the giants worship has the worst butter fingers ive ever seen kaden smith, the only one worth a damn is NEVER played the cards are stacked against dj
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3days
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Post by 3days on Oct 20, 2021 8:38:05 GMT -5
From what I see Jones was progressing very well and was even carrying this team. Once he lost all of his weapons he started to struggle. Remember when Plax shot himself. Eli looked pretty ordinary with no one to throw to.
One last point, many of you were pointing out early this season how no one was getting separation, yet he had no Int’s and was moving the ball. IMO he is the answer. Our current staff on the other hand most likely is not.
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