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Post by McCherry on Aug 12, 2023 15:29:28 GMT -5
So far so good for our Center for the next decade I've been saying he's going to be an upgrade from week 1.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Aug 12, 2023 15:43:45 GMT -5
So far so good for our Center for the next decade I've been saying he's going to be an upgrade from week 1. Yea he looked good in command sure he has some work to do and DCs once the regular season comes around will be throwing the kitchen sink at him. Really couldn't ask for a better start for the kid.
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Post by Nite on Aug 12, 2023 15:46:44 GMT -5
Btw we suck Can't believe it lost a game in pre-season...Man if Steinbrenner owned this team heads would be rolling by now...... I don’t think these preseason meetings deserve to be called games since winning’s not the primary objective. Its a pre-curser to the regular season. Does not look good....What happens in preseason also happens in season Ghost of the fudge still hovering over the team (and the big Fudge Mara and his 'Family')
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Post by McCherry on Aug 12, 2023 15:50:43 GMT -5
I don’t think these preseason meetings deserve to be called games since winning’s not the primary objective. Its a pre-curser to the regular season. Does not look good.... What happens in preseason also happens in seasonGhost of the fudge still hovering over the team (and the big Fudge Mara and his 'Family') Not unless 95% of the starting lineup goes down.
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Post by Nite on Aug 12, 2023 15:53:16 GMT -5
Its a pre-curser to the regular season. Does not look good.... What happens in preseason also happens in seasonGhost of the fudge still hovering over the team (and the big Fudge Mara and his 'Family') Not unless 95% of the starting lineup goes down. The infection is still in the system affecting performance.. Schoen has to chelate Mara to achieve optimum results
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Post by vinnie on Aug 12, 2023 15:55:25 GMT -5
I think you have to throw out the Judge, Garrett, Graham years. The entire team was a mess. Proof, Garrett wasn’t an offensive coordinator for almost 10 years prior to the Giants giving him the job. Also, with almost the exact same roster, Martindale made the Giants a top 10 defensive vs. a bottom 5. Even in 2021, Jones didn't play poorly. Very similar numbers to 2022. The only time Jones was flat out bad was the first half of 2020. Considering how bad that coaching was and how bad they were without him, it's nothing short of miraculous. Mike, you can look at the Jones glass half full, half empty or both. I’m going with both. Even last season he had some nice stats, like turnovers and completion percentage, but he also wasn’t asked to do much. I can show you stats right now that show he has regressed on shorter pass completions compared to his rookie season. Shurmur, like Dabs, boosted his completion stats by giving him high completion percentage short yard passes. It’s no coincidence he has such a high completion percentage but had the 29th ranked throws in depth in the league. Blame it on the WR’s, blame it on the O line but that doesn’t take away from why his completion percentage was so high and turnover rate so low. That hardly tells the whole story though. Can he put it all together this year? Perhaps, but when you take everything into account I don’t see how anyone can say their sold on him being a franchise QB. Again, not saying he can’t be, but I personally haven’t seen enough to say he’s without a doubt the answer. I can point out how last year he played against the bottom 10 pass defenses in the league or how he had a horrible O line but also had more time to throw than most QB’s due to his legs. There’s a lot of different ways to look at what he’s done. Some of you prefer to only focus on the positive without taking into consideration context, like the examples I gave, whereas I like to look at both sides of the story which is considered negative by most because it’s not all “rah, rah, rah…let’s look at what DJ did” through clouded, blue shaded glasses.
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Post by Rangers13 on Aug 12, 2023 16:23:44 GMT -5
Mets play preseason footballl?
Seems the lost 21-3
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Post by vinnie on Aug 12, 2023 16:24:40 GMT -5
So far so good for our Center for the next decade I've been saying he's going to be an upgrade from week 1. Debbie Downer here. JMS was my favorite pick of the draft, I wouldn’t have been mad if they took him in the first and I have high hopes BUT…let’s not put the cart before the horse. He held his own against back ups. Let’s see how he does against starters. Speaking of which, I haven’t heard much about him vs Sexy? Anyone hear any reports? It won’t get much tougher than that.
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miggs
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Post by miggs on Aug 12, 2023 16:27:03 GMT -5
I was hoping he'd help on ST's, but Crowder has not been impressive in camp and I've at least one beat reporter say he's on the outs. That could change over the next couple weeks. Absent some injuries creating a spot for him, I don’t see a path to him making the team Crowder will be gone only If the Giants don't want knd of its most talented receivers. SW tgat last night.
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Post by McCherry on Aug 12, 2023 16:27:17 GMT -5
Even in 2021, Jones didn't play poorly. Very similar numbers to 2022. The only time Jones was flat out bad was the first half of 2020. Considering how bad that coaching was and how bad they were without him, it's nothing short of miraculous. Mike, you can look at the Jones glass half full, half empty or both. I’m going with both. Even last season he had some nice stats, like turnovers and completion percentage, but he also wasn’t asked to do much. I can show you stats right now that show he has regressed on shorter pass completions compared to his rookie season. Shurmur, like Dabs, boosted his completion stats by giving him high completion percentage short yard passes. It’s no coincidence he has such a high completion percentage but had the 29th ranked throws in depth in the league. Blame it on the WR’s, blame it on the O line but that doesn’t take away from why his completion percentage was so high and turnover rate so low. That hardly tells the whole story though. Can he put it all together this year? Perhaps, but when you take everything into account I don’t see how anyone can say their sold on him being a franchise QB. Again, not saying he can’t be, but I personally haven’t seen enough to say he’s without a doubt the answer. I can point out how last year he played against the bottom 10 pass defenses in the league or how he had a horrible O line but also had more time to throw than most QB’s due to his legs. There’s a lot of different ways to look at what he’s done. Some of you prefer to only focus on the positive without taking into consideration context, like the examples I gave, whereas I like to look at both sides of the story which is considered negative by most because it’s not all “rah, rah, rah…let’s look at what DJ did” through clouded, blue shaded glasses. I'm not sure what you're referring to here. Jones deep passing efficiency rating of 119.4 was 3rd overall last year. I'm not someone who tears apart the stats based on the competition. You play who you play. QB's like Mahomes, Allen, Burrow get a good percentage of their overall stats by padding their numbers vs. bad competition, weak defenses, garbage time. You don't throw 30 TD's 4k yards without exploiting the bad teams on your schedule. You're looking for chinks in Jones armor, that's fine. I'm looking at the results. He's an extremely efficient passer through his career. Doesn't turn the ball over. I don't look for reasons to dismiss that. I'm not saying you don't bring up concerns or reasons to be skeptical here, we just look at it from different angles. I guess we'll find out for real this season.
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Post by TCHOF on Aug 12, 2023 16:32:50 GMT -5
I got nothing out of this game. Detroit is a good measuring stick for us their a better team and a possible playoff team. We were the 2nd best team out there last night. We'll be better after our initial time under fire. We certainly need help with depth on this team but were still trying to find starters. I would like our starting OL to get a series or 2 under their belts with contact in the next 2 pre season games. But I understand holding the OT's out because of injury concerns. I have no idea what or who our starters are going to be, but we have 3 weeks and 2 games to work it out. Hope they got a look at the players they wanted to see. I think the current depth charts out there are pretty much cut and dried. Maybe a question between Ezeudu/Glowibnski, but I see Ezeudu winning that spot. I mostly wonder about some backup positions. I don’t see Ezeudu winning that spot to start the season
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miggs
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Post by miggs on Aug 12, 2023 16:36:15 GMT -5
Even in 2021, Jones didn't play poorly. Very similar numbers to 2022. The only time Jones was flat out bad was the first half of 2020. Considering how bad that coaching was and how bad they were without him, it's nothing short of miraculous. Mike, you can look at the Jones glass half full, half empty or both. I’m going with both. Even last season he had some nice stats, like turnovers and completion percentage, but he also wasn’t asked to do much. I can show you stats right now that show he has regressed on shorter pass completions compared to his rookie season. Shurmur, like Dabs, boosted his completion stats by giving him high completion percentage short yard passes. It’s no coincidence he has such a high completion percentage but had the 29th ranked throws in depth in the league. Blame it on the WR’s, blame it on the O line but that doesn’t take away from why his completion percentage was so high and turnover rate so low. That hardly tells the whole story though. Can he put it all together this year? Perhaps, but when you take everything into account I don’t see how anyone can say their sold on him being a franchise QB. Again, not saying he can’t be, but I personally haven’t seen enough to say he’s without a doubt the answer. I can point out how last year he played against the bottom 10 pass defenses in the league or how he had a horrible O line but also had more time to throw than most QB’s due to his legs. There’s a lot of different ways to look at what he’s done. Some of you prefer to only focus on the positive without taking into consideration context, like the examples I gave, whereas I like to look at both sides of the story which is considered negative by most because it’s not all “rah, rah, rah…let’s look at what DJ did” through clouded, blue shaded glasses. I know you think you're saying something above, but you're not. You should be able to see just by his completion rate, accurate arm, low interception rate, and his outstanding running that he's a helluva QB, but you don't. Hoe you don't change your mind after this season as it will really cause those of us who love Jones to question ourselves.
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Post by vinnie on Aug 12, 2023 16:40:20 GMT -5
Mike, you can look at the Jones glass half full, half empty or both. I’m going with both. Even last season he had some nice stats, like turnovers and completion percentage, but he also wasn’t asked to do much. I can show you stats right now that show he has regressed on shorter pass completions compared to his rookie season. Shurmur, like Dabs, boosted his completion stats by giving him high completion percentage short yard passes. It’s no coincidence he has such a high completion percentage but had the 29th ranked throws in depth in the league. Blame it on the WR’s, blame it on the O line but that doesn’t take away from why his completion percentage was so high and turnover rate so low. That hardly tells the whole story though. Can he put it all together this year? Perhaps, but when you take everything into account I don’t see how anyone can say their sold on him being a franchise QB. Again, not saying he can’t be, but I personally haven’t seen enough to say he’s without a doubt the answer. I can point out how last year he played against the bottom 10 pass defenses in the league or how he had a horrible O line but also had more time to throw than most QB’s due to his legs. There’s a lot of different ways to look at what he’s done. Some of you prefer to only focus on the positive without taking into consideration context, like the examples I gave, whereas I like to look at both sides of the story which is considered negative by most because it’s not all “rah, rah, rah…let’s look at what DJ did” through clouded, blue shaded glasses. I'm not sure what you're referring to here. Jones deep passing efficiency rating of 119.4 was 3rd overall last year. I'm not someone who tears apart the stats based on the competition. You play who you play. QB's like Mahomes, Allen, Burrow get a good percentage of their overall stats by padding their numbers vs. bad competition, weak defenses, garbage time. You don't throw 30 TD's 4k yards without exploiting the bad teams on your schedule. You're looking for chinks in Jones armor, that's fine. I'm looking at the results. He's an extremely efficient passer through his career. Doesn't turn the ball over. I don't look for reasons to dismiss that. I'm not saying you don't bring up concerns or reasons to be skeptical here, we just look at it from different angles. I guess we'll find out for real this season. Again, context Mike. He was 3rd and what were his attempts compared to other QB’s? Nice reply, you bring up fair points, which I honestly appreciate because sometimes I don’t think of those. The only thing I’ll counter with is Mahomes may pad his stats by exploiting weaker teams and that’s something I’ve been saying this team/Jones should be doing if they’re true playoff contenders. The only team they exploited last year were the Colts who were in full on tank mode and then they barely beat the 2nd worst defense in the league for their big playoff win. You’re 100% right, we’ll find out for real this season. We’ve all been saying “the excuses are over” for Jones for the past 3 years but he keeps getting them, some justified, some not so much but I agree this season is when we’ll have our answer, I don’t give a shit if it’s the worst O line in the league.
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Post by TEM on Aug 12, 2023 16:46:49 GMT -5
I'm not sure what you're referring to here. Jones deep passing efficiency rating of 119.4 was 3rd overall last year. I'm not someone who tears apart the stats based on the competition. You play who you play. QB's like Mahomes, Allen, Burrow get a good percentage of their overall stats by padding their numbers vs. bad competition, weak defenses, garbage time. You don't throw 30 TD's 4k yards without exploiting the bad teams on your schedule. You're looking for chinks in Jones armor, that's fine. I'm looking at the results. He's an extremely efficient passer through his career. Doesn't turn the ball over. I don't look for reasons to dismiss that. I'm not saying you don't bring up concerns or reasons to be skeptical here, we just look at it from different angles. I guess we'll find out for real this season. Again, context Mike. He was 3rd and what were his attempts compared to other QB’s?Nice reply, you bring up fair points, which I honestly appreciate because sometimes I don’t think of those. The only thing I’ll counter with is Mahomes may pad his stats by exploiting weaker teams and that’s something I’ve been saying this team/Jones should be doing if they’re true playoff contenders. The only team they exploited last year were the Colts who were in full on tank mode and then they barely beat the 2nd worst defense in the league for their big playoff win. You’re 100% right, we’ll find out for real this season. We’ve all been saying “the excuses are over” for Jones for the past 3 years but he keeps getting them, some justified, some not so much but I agree this season is when we’ll have our answer, I don’t give a shit if it’s the worst O line in the league. . Jones was 14th in attempts 6th in completion % 11th in completions 15th in total passing yards
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Post by McCherry on Aug 12, 2023 16:49:14 GMT -5
I think the current depth charts out there are pretty much cut and dried. Maybe a question between Ezeudu/Glowibnski, but I see Ezeudu winning that spot. I mostly wonder about some backup positions. I don’t see Ezeudu winning that spot to start the season If it weren't the Cowboys week 1, I might have to disagree.. But it's clear the Giants are giving Ezeudu every opportunity to put Glow on the bench. Looking at the last couple weeks of camp, they like the combo of Bredeson/Ezeudu at G.
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Post by vinnie on Aug 12, 2023 16:58:20 GMT -5
Again, context Mike. He was 3rd and what were his attempts compared to other QB’s?Nice reply, you bring up fair points, which I honestly appreciate because sometimes I don’t think of those. The only thing I’ll counter with is Mahomes may pad his stats by exploiting weaker teams and that’s something I’ve been saying this team/Jones should be doing if they’re true playoff contenders. The only team they exploited last year were the Colts who were in full on tank mode and then they barely beat the 2nd worst defense in the league for their big playoff win. You’re 100% right, we’ll find out for real this season. We’ve all been saying “the excuses are over” for Jones for the past 3 years but he keeps getting them, some justified, some not so much but I agree this season is when we’ll have our answer, I don’t give a shit if it’s the worst O line in the league. . Jones was 14th in attempts 6th in completion % 11th in completions 15th in total passing yards As always, appreciate the stats TEM but I’m confused. Are these stats his deep ball stats or overall? Completion % is greatly skewed when comparing air yards per pass and attempts. Passing yards I’ve never been a fan of and I won’t use them for or against Jones, I feel the same way for TD’s for RB’s but for a different reason, it’s a horribly misleading stats. With relation to passing yards though, I can throw a 2 yard screen to Barkley who runs it for 80 yards and I get credit for 85 passing yards? Not to mention if I do it over and over again my completion % should be absurdly high.
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Post by McCherry on Aug 12, 2023 17:04:24 GMT -5
I'm not sure what you're referring to here. Jones deep passing efficiency rating of 119.4 was 3rd overall last year. I'm not someone who tears apart the stats based on the competition. You play who you play. QB's like Mahomes, Allen, Burrow get a good percentage of their overall stats by padding their numbers vs. bad competition, weak defenses, garbage time. You don't throw 30 TD's 4k yards without exploiting the bad teams on your schedule. You're looking for chinks in Jones armor, that's fine. I'm looking at the results. He's an extremely efficient passer through his career. Doesn't turn the ball over. I don't look for reasons to dismiss that. I'm not saying you don't bring up concerns or reasons to be skeptical here, we just look at it from different angles. I guess we'll find out for real this season. Again, context Mike. He was 3rd and what were his attempts compared to other QB’s?
Nice reply, you bring up fair points, which I honestly appreciate because sometimes I don’t think of those. The only thing I’ll counter with is Mahomes may pad his stats by exploiting weaker teams and that’s something I’ve been saying this team/Jones should be doing if they’re true playoff contenders. The only team they exploited last year were the Colts who were in full on tank mode and then they barely beat the 2nd worst defense in the league for their big playoff win. You’re 100% right, we’ll find out for real this season. We’ve all been saying “the excuses are over” for Jones for the past 3 years but he keeps getting them, some justified, some not so much but I agree this season is when we’ll have our answer, I don’t give a shit if it’s the worst O line in the league. How often was he being asked to throw deep? We know Daboll/Kafka did not install a deep passing attack in 2022 due to protection concerns and lack of of speed at outside WR. Jones can only be graded on the deep throws he was asked to make. If you told me he was 30th in attempts and efficiency, then we have a problem. i think he will be asked to do it more this year. Jones success on deep throws is more important to me than the number of throws. Again, we will see!
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Post by TEM on Aug 12, 2023 17:05:59 GMT -5
. Jones was 14th in attempts 6th in completion % 11th in completions 15th in total passing yards As always, appreciate the stats TEM but I’m confused. Are these stats his deep ball stats or overall? Completion % is greatly skewed when comparing air yards per pass and attempts. Passing yards I’ve never been a fan of and I won’t use them for or against Jones, I feel the same way for TD’s for RB’s but for a different reason, it’s a horribly misleading stats. With relation to passing yards though, I can throw a 2 yard screen to Barkley who runs it for 80 yards and I get credit for 85 passing yards? Not to mention if I do it over and over again my completion % should be absurdly high. passing stats. All QBs have the same stats. I had to do some digging. Jones was 11th in 20 yards + completions.
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mendy
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Post by mendy on Aug 12, 2023 17:10:53 GMT -5
I hear he has a hot cousin................. His last name is Devito. Lol I know ,some posters were calling him Vito, it was a vail attempt at levity.
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Post by vinnie on Aug 12, 2023 17:13:22 GMT -5
As always, appreciate the stats TEM but I’m confused. Are these stats his deep ball stats or overall? Completion % is greatly skewed when comparing air yards per pass and attempts. Passing yards I’ve never been a fan of and I won’t use them for or against Jones, I feel the same way for TD’s for RB’s but for a different reason, it’s a horribly misleading stats. With relation to passing yards though, I can throw a 2 yard screen to Barkley who runs it for 80 yards and I get credit for 85 passing yards? Not to mention if I do it over and over again my completion % should be absurdly high. passing stats. All QBs have the same stats. Ok. Can you break down the completion percentage vs air yards? Also, please show the stats for every QB vs the overall ranking of passing defenses they played.
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Post by jb456 on Aug 12, 2023 17:18:19 GMT -5
I think you have to throw out the Judge, Garrett, Graham years. The entire team was a mess. Proof, Garrett wasn’t an offensive coordinator for almost 10 years prior to the Giants giving him the job. Also, with almost the exact same roster, Martindale made the Giants a top 10 defensive vs. a bottom 5. I’ve said more then multiple times, yeah more then multiple, that I understand the shitty positions Jones was put in for various reasons but one decent season doesn’t erase those memories. Not everything was the coaches or O lines or WR’s fault, which is why I remain skeptical but neutral about him. There’s some things to like about him but there’s still reason for concern. Excuse me? Martindale made what defensive unit top 10 with the same roster? Yeah, pretty much the same roster. They had a buck 25 to spend in free agency last year and let’s be real, Thibs was far from dominant last year.
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Post by vinnie on Aug 12, 2023 17:22:21 GMT -5
I’ve said more then multiple times, yeah more then multiple, that I understand the shitty positions Jones was put in for various reasons but one decent season doesn’t erase those memories. Not everything was the coaches or O lines or WR’s fault, which is why I remain skeptical but neutral about him. There’s some things to like about him but there’s still reason for concern. Excuse me? Martindale made what defensive unit top 10 with the same roster? Yeah, pretty much the same roster. They had a buck 25 to spend in free agency last year and let’s be real, Thibs was far from dominant last year. Sorry if I wasn’t specific, I think I understand what you’re trying to say but I hope I’m wrong. Are you saying last years Giants defense was top 10?
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Post by TEM on Aug 12, 2023 17:22:22 GMT -5
passing stats. All QBs have the same stats. Ok. Can you break down the completion percentage vs air yards? Also, please show the stats for every QB vs the overall ranking of passing defenses they played. How is that relevant? The NFL sets the schedule. Here is why it is unbiased; every team is on an equal playing field. All get to draft, trade, bid for FAs. spend their cap as they see fit. Hire their own coaches and FO staff. If anything, football the fairest sport to its fan base in regard to talent dispersal.
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Post by GameTime on Aug 12, 2023 17:24:26 GMT -5
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Post by vinnie on Aug 12, 2023 17:30:25 GMT -5
Ok. Can you break down the completion percentage vs air yards? Also, please show the stats for every QB vs the overall ranking of passing defenses they played. How is that relevant? the NFL sets the schedule. Here is why it is unbiased; every team is on an equal playing field. All get to draft, trade, bid for FAs. spend their cap as they see fit. Hire their own coaches and FO staff. You don’t think it’s relevant whether a QB has better stats against a worse passing defense than a better passing defense?! I don’t give a shit what the schedule is. You can’t tell me Jones (or any QB) wouldn’t have an easier time playing in the NFCS vs the NFCE. Of course all teams are on an equal playing field but that doesn’t mean all teams are equal. I usually think pretty highly of your opinion TEM but you’re starting to scare me here. So if you can provide those stats I’d appreciate it. I know you can TEM and I honestly don’t know the exact answer but am curious because it’s something that should be considered.
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Post by vinnie on Aug 12, 2023 17:33:28 GMT -5
As always, appreciate the stats TEM but I’m confused. Are these stats his deep ball stats or overall? Completion % is greatly skewed when comparing air yards per pass and attempts. Passing yards I’ve never been a fan of and I won’t use them for or against Jones, I feel the same way for TD’s for RB’s but for a different reason, it’s a horribly misleading stats. With relation to passing yards though, I can throw a 2 yard screen to Barkley who runs it for 80 yards and I get credit for 85 passing yards? Not to mention if I do it over and over again my completion % should be absurdly high. passing stats. All QBs have the same stats. I had to do some digging. Jones was 11th in 20 yards + completions. Ok, that’s much more believable than 3rd and it still doesn’t take into account the passing defenses he played against.
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Post by TEM on Aug 12, 2023 17:34:18 GMT -5
How is that relevant? the NFL sets the schedule. Here is why it is unbiased; every team is on an equal playing field. All get to draft, trade, bid for FAs. spend their cap as they see fit. Hire their own coaches and FO staff. You don’t think it’s relevant whether a QB has better stats against a worse passing defense than a better passing defense?! I don’t give a shit what the schedule is. You can’t tell me Jones (or any QB) wouldn’t have an easier time playing in the NFCS vs the NFCE. Of course all teams are on an equal playing field but that doesn’t mean all teams are equal. I usually think pretty highly of your opinion TEM but you’re starting to scare me here. So if you can provide those stats I’d appreciate it. I know you can TEM and I honestly don’t know the exact answer but am curious because it’s something that should be considered. Yeah because it all evens out. All offenses play good and bad defenses. All defenses play good and bad offenses.
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Post by vinnie on Aug 12, 2023 17:46:01 GMT -5
You don’t think it’s relevant whether a QB has better stats against a worse passing defense than a better passing defense?! I don’t give a shit what the schedule is. You can’t tell me Jones (or any QB) wouldn’t have an easier time playing in the NFCS vs the NFCE. Of course all teams are on an equal playing field but that doesn’t mean all teams are equal. I usually think pretty highly of your opinion TEM but you’re starting to scare me here. So if you can provide those stats I’d appreciate it. I know you can TEM and I honestly don’t know the exact answer but am curious because it’s something that should be considered. Yeah because it all evens out. All offenses play good and bad defenses. All defenses play good and bad offenses. Ok, we had to play the #2 and #3 overall defenses two times last year and the #12 overall defense 2 times last year. If it all evens out, what other teams does that even out with? *just waiting for someone to bring up a “perceived” contradiction
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Post by TEM on Aug 12, 2023 17:51:54 GMT -5
Washington was rankled 10th Dallas was ranked 11th Eagles were ranked 15th Colts were ranked 8th Bears were ranked 2nd Packers were ranked 21st Jaguars were ranked 18th Titans were ranked 31st Vikings were ranked 32nd Texans were ranked 30th Ravens were ranked 26th Panthers were ranked 22nd seahawks were ranked 28th Lions were ranked 20th
With an average of 18 Defensive rankling (17 games) Within the statistical mean of 16 + or - 2 Exactly where it should be (parody)
As I said it averages out,
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Post by vinnie on Aug 12, 2023 18:25:57 GMT -5
Washington was rankled 10th Dallas was ranked 11th Eagles were ranked 15th Colts were ranked 8th Bears were ranked 2nd Packers were ranked 21st Jaguars were ranked 18th Titans were ranked 31st Vikings were ranked 32nd Texans were ranked 30th Ravens were ranked 26th Panthers were ranked 22nd seahawks were ranked 28th Lions were ranked 20th With an average of 18 Defensive rankling (17 games) Within the statistical mean of 16 + or - 2 Exactly where it should be (parody) As I said it averages out, What stats are you looking at? There is a huge difference between whatever you’re looking at vs these. Eagles 15th?! Odd though, Vikings and Cows are close. Washingtons seems off though. www.espn.com/nfl/stats/team/_/view/defense
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