|
Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 21, 2024 20:55:02 GMT -5
Don't get those posters who hate Jones, but do not want the Giants to draft a QB, but instead prefer a WR. That makes sense only if you think Jones is good which they do not. It’s not surprising such a simple business concept is way over your head and outside of your acumen. Even though I clearly laid out the logic in the first post, you still can’t grasp it. Once again you expose how little you know about the NFL and how much you struggle to assimilate information spoon fed to you. Sad.
|
|
|
Post by IrishMike on Mar 22, 2024 17:43:43 GMT -5
Right and there are tons of different ways to allocate those resources as we have seen from the different teams that have won the Super Bowl. Uh huh. And the better the resources are allocated, the better chance you have The better the chance you have to win games....
and now we have come full circle lol. Enjoy your weekend man.
|
|
|
Post by Danke Schoen on Apr 25, 2024 21:06:27 GMT -5
This isn't to say I think Jones is the answer at QB1, IMO he is not and never will be. But reference my post from the other day: Schoen is building the team like a modern franchise. Putting equity into the trenches: protect the QB and passing game. Generate a pass rush with the DL to stop the opposing passing game.
Then add talent at the play making positions.
Then plug the QB in so that they are set up for their best chance of success while playing on a rookie deal. Thus creating a five year window of opportunity.Today's NFL is a passing league. You need to have an offense that is very productive at it and a defense that shuts down the opposing passing attacks. With that comes the price tag for #1 WRs. They are highly coveted. And most successful teams have one great outside WR and one very good one. That said, look at the AAV of the top WRs. They are $27-30M per year. The market for #1 WRs has boomed in the past five years. So not only is WR1 a major need for the Giants it would also behoove us to have them on a rookie deal (plus 5th year option) for five years. Thus making it easier to plug in QB1 and supporting that window of opportunity. Apparently you don’t have to watch 32 hours of college games on TV every day in order to understand the NFL.
|
|
|
Post by PennState1 on Apr 25, 2024 23:34:23 GMT -5
They sucked for a decade because they had a bad front office and bad HC's. That supposedly changed in 2022. Going back beyond that is irrelevant. you said they have been going down hill since Schoen and Daboll were hired. They turned chicken shit into chicken sald in 2022 and back into chicken shit in 2023. Not sure what your point is about going down hill since they got here. Anyway....it really doesnt matter because they will be around for two more years at least. They gambled on Jones and lost. Oh well. I was convinced Jones was the guy after 2022. Thought he turned a corner. He didnt. He will be gone in 2025. They will be drafting a QB this season or next or both. the FA signings and draft are trying build the team form the inside out many factors contributing to the chicken shit no? We lose our LT after one game and sign a guy off the couch to play there. Neil was atrocious. Was he playing hurt or just sucks? We could talk about the guard position but why bother. Rookie Center learning. Wandel coming off an ACL. Highly anticipated free agent TE didn’t play most of the year. So perhaps jones does suck but man they had a host of other issues to contend with.
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Apr 26, 2024 5:19:39 GMT -5
you said they have been going down hill since Schoen and Daboll were hired. They turned chicken shit into chicken sald in 2022 and back into chicken shit in 2023. Not sure what your point is about going down hill since they got here. Anyway....it really doesnt matter because they will be around for two more years at least. They gambled on Jones and lost. Oh well. I was convinced Jones was the guy after 2022. Thought he turned a corner. He didnt. He will be gone in 2025. They will be drafting a QB this season or next or both. the FA signings and draft are trying build the team form the inside out many factors contributing to the chicken shit no? We lose our LT after one game and sign a guy off the couch to play there. Neil was atrocious. Was he playing hurt or just sucks? We could talk about the guard position but why bother. Rookie Center learning. Wandel coming off an ACL. Highly anticipated free agent TE didn’t play most of the year. So perhaps jones does suck but man they had a host of other issues to contend with. no question, There was a shit around Jones for sure. However Jones was a shit show on his own. I like Nabers for sure and they obviously didn't love an available or attainable QB this draft.
|
|
mendy
Starter
Posts: 3,891
|
Post by mendy on Apr 26, 2024 5:52:28 GMT -5
many factors contributing to the chicken shit no? We lose our LT after one game and sign a guy off the couch to play there. Neil was atrocious. Was he playing hurt or just sucks? We could talk about the guard position but why bother. Rookie Center learning. Wandel coming off an ACL. Highly anticipated free agent TE didn’t play most of the year. So perhaps jones does suck but man they had a host of other issues to contend with. no question, There was a shit around Jones for sure. However Jones was a shit show on his own. I like Nabers for sure and they obviously didn't love an available or attainable QB this draft. I believe in cause and effect , cause the O line and others around Jones were so bad the effect was Jones himself being bad. Look the whole team sucked in 2023 they all need to get better but you can't ignore 2022 either. This pick proves that the whole team is behind Jones , fans have to accept that.
|
|
|
Post by Danke Schoen on Apr 26, 2024 6:26:08 GMT -5
This pick proves that the whole team is behind Jones , fans have to accept that. Tell me you have an agenda without telling me. This pick doesn’t say that at all. Try learning about the NFL and stop idolizing a 20-something.
|
|
|
Post by christian on Apr 26, 2024 6:52:02 GMT -5
This is my feeling, we have too much invested financially in Jones this year to make a move for one of the top QBs in the first round. Seems to make the most sense to go for a top end WR which seems to be right there on big boards everywhere for the 6th pick. If jones plays bad like he did for most of the 5 games he played last year.. then we'll have a top draft pick next year if there is a good QB we like. If he plays well.. then we can re-evaluate. Continue building a supporting cast though for jones and most likely a rookie QB in the near future. They were close to pulling the deal for Maye - I guess they felt JJ wasn't worth the 6th pick but were hoping for a trade back into the first rd to get him at a much lower cost
|
|
|
Post by Danke Schoen on Apr 26, 2024 6:53:11 GMT -5
This is my feeling, we have too much invested financially in Jones this year to make a move for one of the top QBs in the first round. Seems to make the most sense to go for a top end WR which seems to be right there on big boards everywhere for the 6th pick. If jones plays bad like he did for most of the 5 games he played last year.. then we'll have a top draft pick next year if there is a good QB we like. If he plays well.. then we can re-evaluate. Continue building a supporting cast though for jones and most likely a rookie QB in the near future. They were close to pulling the deal for Maye - I guess they felt JJ wasn't worth the 6th pick but were hoping for a trade back into the first rd to get him at a much lower cost Link to the Giants “being close to pulling the deal for Maye.”
|
|
|
Post by idkaname on Apr 26, 2024 7:25:10 GMT -5
This isn't to say I think Jones is the answer at QB1, IMO he is not and never will be. But reference my post from the other day: Schoen is building the team like a modern franchise. Putting equity into the trenches: protect the QB and passing game. Generate a pass rush with the DL to stop the opposing passing game.
Then add talent at the play making positions.
Then plug the QB in so that they are set up for their best chance of success while playing on a rookie deal. Thus creating a five year window of opportunity.Today's NFL is a passing league. You need to have an offense that is very productive at it and a defense that shuts down the opposing passing attacks. With that comes the price tag for #1 WRs. They are highly coveted. And most successful teams have one great outside WR and one very good one. That said, look at the AAV of the top WRs. They are $27-30M per year. The market for #1 WRs has boomed in the past five years. So not only is WR1 a major need for the Giants it would also behoove us to have them on a rookie deal (plus 5th year option) for five years. Thus making it easier to plug in QB1 and supporting that window of opportunity. Apparently you don’t have to watch 32 hours of college games on TV every day in order to understand the NFL. Congrats you predicted what every common-knowledge football fan in America knew.
|
|
|
Post by GameTime on Apr 26, 2024 7:26:31 GMT -5
no question, There was a shit around Jones for sure. However Jones was a shit show on his own. I like Nabers for sure and they obviously didn't love an available or attainable QB this draft. I believe in cause and effect , cause the O line and others around Jones were so bad the effect was Jones himself being bad. Look the whole team sucked in 2023 they all need to get better but you can't ignore 2022 either. This pick proves that the whole team is behind Jones , fans have to accept that. the OL sucked in 2022 as well. I like Jones but confidence in him has ebbed and flowed. Right now its on the ebbtide. The pick proves they couldn't make the right the right trade up deal. Jones not only played poorly but he got hurt again. He has a great attitude and will always give his 100%. However his 100% may not be good enough.
|
|
|
Post by Analyst on Apr 26, 2024 7:31:47 GMT -5
I like the pick.
Now lets get Nabers a QB somehow so he doesnt turn into a bust.
Really, Robinson, Hyatt are WRs that should be putting up numbers too. The fact that Hyatt didnt score a TD last year is embarrassing. Robinson appears to be a playmaker. Now adding Nabers, we should be set. Plenty of talent in that WR room.
Lets start looking at the QBs in 2025s draft lol. Because in 2025, we could lose Jones, Lock and DeVito.
|
|
|
Post by Danke Schoen on Apr 26, 2024 7:50:56 GMT -5
Apparently you don’t have to watch 32 hours of college games on TV every day in order to understand the NFL. Congrats you predicted what every common-knowledge football fan in America knew. lol, sorry if ruining your “I’m a college game film guru” image jams sand in your crack.
|
|
|
Post by idkaname on Apr 26, 2024 8:03:49 GMT -5
Congrats you predicted what every common-knowledge football fan in America knew. lol, sorry if ruining your “I’m a college game film guru” image jams sand in your crack. thats whats even more funny. I don't watch college football and I knew the pick based on need, not talent, L
|
|
|
Post by Danke Schoen on Apr 26, 2024 8:07:52 GMT -5
lol, sorry if ruining your “I’m a college game film guru” image jams sand in your crack. thats whats even more funny. I don't watch college football and I knew the pick based on need, not talent, L Stick to Goodell and the refs rigging every game against the Giants. That’s more your speed.
|
|
|
Post by idkaname on Apr 26, 2024 8:10:03 GMT -5
thats whats even more funny. I don't watch college football and I knew the pick based on need, not talent, L Stick to Goodell and the refs rigging every game against the Giants. That’s more your speed. and what about your conspiracy that the Giants are "done" with Jones ?
|
|
|
Post by PennState1 on Apr 26, 2024 8:17:48 GMT -5
This is my feeling, we have too much invested financially in Jones this year to make a move for one of the top QBs in the first round. Seems to make the most sense to go for a top end WR which seems to be right there on big boards everywhere for the 6th pick. If jones plays bad like he did for most of the 5 games he played last year.. then we'll have a top draft pick next year if there is a good QB we like. If he plays well.. then we can re-evaluate. Continue building a supporting cast though for jones and most likely a rookie QB in the near future. They were close to pulling the deal for Maye - I guess they felt JJ wasn't worth the 6th pick but were hoping for a trade back into the first rd to get him at a much lower cost We know that or just another media-led rumor?
|
|
te88
Special Teams
Posts: 1,964
|
Post by te88 on Apr 26, 2024 9:06:48 GMT -5
They were close to pulling the deal for Maye - I guess they felt JJ wasn't worth the 6th pick but were hoping for a trade back into the first rd to get him at a much lower cost We know that or just another media-led rumor? Seems like rumour nonsense to me. There was zero reason for the Patriots to trade that pick.
|
|
|
Post by PennState1 on Apr 26, 2024 9:58:41 GMT -5
We know that or just another media-led rumor? Seems like rumour nonsense to me. There was zero reason for the Patriots to trade that pick. If they were willing to trade out what does that say about the player?
|
|
mendy
Starter
Posts: 3,891
|
Post by mendy on Apr 26, 2024 11:02:31 GMT -5
Of course it was rumor BS three QB's were still on the Board after the Giants pick , according to the arm chair GM's here they all had more talent then Jones , why not draft one of them? The Giants believe in Jones is why.
|
|
|
Post by Morehead State on Apr 26, 2024 11:06:38 GMT -5
Of course it was rumor BS three QB's were still on the Board after the Giants pick , according to the arm chair GM's here they all had more talent then Jones , why not draft one of them? The Giants believe in Jones is why. Because it would have been poor value at that pick. The best value by far at #6 was either Odunze or Nabers. You can't "shop hungry" as David Shaw said yesterday. They are most certainly looking to move on from Daniel Jones after 2024....probably before. But they just weren't in a good position to draft one of those three top QB prospects.
|
|
te88
Special Teams
Posts: 1,964
|
Post by te88 on Apr 26, 2024 11:28:06 GMT -5
Of course it was rumor BS three QB's were still on the Board after the Giants pick , according to the arm chair GM's here they all had more talent then Jones , why not draft one of them? The Giants believe in Jones is why. Because it would have been poor value at that pick. The best value by far at #6 was either Odunze or Nabers. You can't "shop hungry" as David Shaw said yesterday. They are most certainly looking to move on from Daniel Jones after 2024....probably before. But they just weren't in a good position to draft one of those three top QB prospects. It’s as simple as that.
|
|
|
Post by inconvenientruth on Apr 26, 2024 11:31:41 GMT -5
Of course it was rumor BS three QB's were still on the Board after the Giants pick , according to the arm chair GM's here they all had more talent then Jones , why not draft one of them? The Giants believe in Jones is why. Because it would have been poor value at that pick. The best value by far at #6 was either Odunze or Nabers. You can't "shop hungry" as David Shaw said yesterday. They are most certainly looking to move on from Daniel Jones after 2024....probably before. But they just weren't in a good position to draft one of those three top QB prospects.they could have gave what the Pats wanted to get Maye. Franchise guys are invaluable. Unless your "process" tells you that Maye is not a franchise guy, then i get why you couldn't commit. The again, this is the same "process" that told Schoen/Daboll that Daniel Jones was their franchise guy but a calendar year ago. How valid is this process? Im curious to see what this roster, in the vision of Schoen does over the next two years. Playoffs are the expectation. I want to see how this "team first" approach works in practice, and not in theory.
|
|
te88
Special Teams
Posts: 1,964
|
Post by te88 on Apr 26, 2024 11:33:46 GMT -5
Because it would have been poor value at that pick. The best value by far at #6 was either Odunze or Nabers. You can't "shop hungry" as David Shaw said yesterday. They are most certainly looking to move on from Daniel Jones after 2024....probably before. But they just weren't in a good position to draft one of those three top QB prospects.they could have gave what the Pats wanted to get Maye. Franchise guys are invaluable. Unless your process tells you that Maye is not a franchise guy. The again, this is the same process that told Schoen/Daboll that Daniel Jones was their franchise guy but a calendar year ago. Lets see how it goes. There is no actual evidence to support the Pats were seriously open to trading that pick. Ask yourself - if you were the Patriots, given their situation, why the hell would you trade that pick?
|
|
|
Post by inconvenientruth on Apr 26, 2024 11:35:30 GMT -5
they could have gave what the Pats wanted to get Maye. Franchise guys are invaluable. Unless your process tells you that Maye is not a franchise guy. The again, this is the same process that told Schoen/Daboll that Daniel Jones was their franchise guy but a calendar year ago. Lets see how it goes. There is no actual evidence to support the Pats were seriously open to trading that pick. Ask yourself - if you were the Patriots, given their situation, why the hell would you trade that pick? The Giants/Pats were chatting all day yesterday, not according to one source, but literally, all of them. As for why they would trade the pick? im not sure, but it takes two to tango in any and all negotiations. Pats were seriously discussing a trade down and wouldn't budge on their price. Neither would Joe. The fact that they were even discussing it means they weren't completely sold. But Joe wears the responsibility of this roster. He's the professional, im ready to see what kind of record we have with the plan they've chosen. Year 3 means results are expected.
|
|
|
Post by McCherry on Apr 26, 2024 11:38:17 GMT -5
they could have gave what the Pats wanted to get Maye. Franchise guys are invaluable. Unless your process tells you that Maye is not a franchise guy. The again, this is the same process that told Schoen/Daboll that Daniel Jones was their franchise guy but a calendar year ago. Lets see how it goes. There is no actual evidence to support the Pats were seriously open to trading that pick. Ask yourself - if you were the Patriots, given their situation, why the hell would you trade that pick? The fact there was there was that much trade discussion says they were open to trading the pick.
|
|
te88
Special Teams
Posts: 1,964
|
Post by te88 on Apr 26, 2024 11:39:11 GMT -5
There is no actual evidence to support the Pats were seriously open to trading that pick. Ask yourself - if you were the Patriots, given their situation, why the hell would you trade that pick? The Giants/Pats were chatting all day yesterday, not according to one source, but literally, all of them. As for why they would trade the pick? im not sure, but it takes two to tango in any and all negotiations. Pats were seriously discussing a trade down and wouldn't budge on their price. Neither would Joe. There isn’t really any legitimate evidence that those talks progressed to any meaningful stage. I don’t think it was very serious. They needed a QB and the guy they wanted was available to them. Patriots would have been morons to trade. If you wanted the Giants to take a QB, Drake Maye was as available to them as Caleb Williams. The choices were McCarthy, Penix and Nix. I’m glad they passed.
|
|
|
Post by inconvenientruth on Apr 26, 2024 11:40:05 GMT -5
The Giants/Pats were chatting all day yesterday, not according to one source, but literally, all of them. As for why they would trade the pick? im not sure, but it takes two to tango in any and all negotiations. Pats were seriously discussing a trade down and wouldn't budge on their price. Neither would Joe. There isn’t really any legitimate evidence that those talks progressed to any meaningful stage. I don’t think it was very serious. They needed a QB and the guy they wanted was available to them. Patriots would have been morons to trade. If you wanted the Giants to take a QB, Drake Maye was as available to them as Caleb Williams. The choices were McCarthy, Penix and Nix. I’m glad they passed. It was as serious as the Giants were going to make it. The Giants made a choice, thats they're right. Lets see how it goes. I assume McCarthy, Penix and Nix are not franchise material QBs.
|
|
te88
Special Teams
Posts: 1,964
|
Post by te88 on Apr 26, 2024 11:40:38 GMT -5
There is no actual evidence to support the Pats were seriously open to trading that pick. Ask yourself - if you were the Patriots, given their situation, why the hell would you trade that pick? The fact there was there was that much trade discussion says they were open to trading the pick. I didn’t see anything legitimate from any reporter who actually is trustworthy. Just nonsense. Im sure they took calls (they’re not Gettleman), but I highly doubt there was any real way forward to get them to pass on Maye.
|
|
|
Post by inconvenientruth on Apr 26, 2024 11:41:57 GMT -5
The fact there was there was that much trade discussion says they were open to trading the pick. I didn’t see anything legitimate from any reporter who actually is trustworthy. Just nonsense. Im sure they took calls (they’re not Gettleman), but I highly doubt there was any real way forward to get them to pass on Maye. which reporters do you find "actually trustworthy"? Schefter, Breer, all had us in deep conversations most of the day. Ranaan, Stapleton, etc, all out to lunch?
|
|