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Post by Analyst on Mar 25, 2024 11:20:12 GMT -5
While it may save on some injuries, its going to be just another rule the refs can use to screw up games and for fans to yell at their TV that the games are rigged. Wonder if it is challengeable.
Another step closer to flag football.
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Post by vinnie on Mar 25, 2024 11:25:44 GMT -5
Shit like this is a large part of why I enjoy college football much more than the NFL but even that is going to shit with the transfer portal, players sitting out of bowl games, payments, etc. College is become the NFL minor league but at least there’s not as many bullshit rules and subjective penalties.
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Post by Analyst on Mar 25, 2024 11:35:35 GMT -5
Shit like this is a large part of why I enjoy college football much more than the NFL but even that is going to shit with the transfer portal, players sitting out of bowl games, payments, etc. College is become the NFL minor league but at least there’s not as many bullshit rules and subjective penalties. I cant wait to hear the first time this rule is applied on a game changing play. Its going to happen. Annoying, just like the QB protection rules that went overboard. Its going to be called sometimes and not sometimes, probably depending on the player/position its happening to. |
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 25, 2024 11:35:45 GMT -5
I hate all these added rules as much as the next guy and the refs will certainly **** up some how cause they can't seem to get out of the way. This will be very tough to define and get right. However with a little coaching emphasis this should be an "easy" fix for the players (easy isn't the right word, it'll take time to adjust to this rule). Drop your shoulder, wrap up their legs like you've been taught since pee wee.
I'm still against it but it's not as drastic as not being able to hit a QB too high, or too low, or too hard, or land on them or.....
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Post by Analyst on Mar 25, 2024 11:39:11 GMT -5
I hate all these added rules as much as the next guy and the refs will certainly **** up some how cause they can't seem to get out of the way. This will be very tough to define and get right. However with a little coaching emphasis this should be an easy fix for the players. Drop your shoulder, wrap up their legs like you've been taught since pee wee. I'm still against it but it's not as drastic as not being able to hit a QB too high, or too low, or too hard, or land on them or..... Just what players need, another thing to process and think about while playing a fast and violent game. All these rules make players more hesitant to do their job. Always brings me back to Kiwi and his Vince Young moment. What about if the guy you are trying to tackle moves out of the way and the only way the defender can tackle him is wrapping his arms around his waist? Flag now for 15 yards? So dumb... |
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 25, 2024 11:44:07 GMT -5
Just what players need, another thing to process and think about while playing a fast and violent game. All these rules make players more hesitant to do their job. Always brings me back to Kiwi and his Vince Young moment. What about if the guy you are trying to tackle moves out of the way and the only way the defender can tackle him is wrapping his arms around his waist? Flag now for 15 yards? So dumb... It is stupid. I also edited my post to make my point a little more clear. It'll take time but over time it'll be more natural. Kiwi did that the year they added that rule in if I remember. Haven't really seen that since. Same thing will happen here, players will think too much and mess up, but over time will be ok.
Remember this happens when the defender is behind the ball carrier. Instead of wrapping the hips and dropping your weight to the ground they will need to wrap the legs and take them down that way. It'll be harder no doubt and this rule sucks for sure. I just don't think it's as bad as other rules they've made in the past. If the NFLs data is true, then these tackles are 20 times more likely to cause injury. That's insane.
Also rugby is also banning this for what it's worth.
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nyg2
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Post by nyg2 on Mar 25, 2024 11:45:26 GMT -5
This is a terrible rule change, this essentially makes it so that the defender needs to be in front of the offensive player for them to initiate and try to make tackle. How would it be even possible for a defender who manages to chase down the ball carrier to tackle him from the back without them considering it “a hip drop tackle”? This is what they just banned:  |
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Post by Analyst on Mar 25, 2024 11:51:27 GMT -5
This is a terrible rule change, this essentially makes it so that the defender needs to be in front of the offensive player for them to initiate and try to make tackle. How would it be even possible for a defender who manages to chase down the ball carrier to tackle him from the back without them considering it “a hip drop tackle”? This is what they just banned: My guess is you will see chasing defenders go after the ankles and legs instead now. The shoulders are too high and you risk the horse collar tackle that way. So you have to go shoe string tackle. Which means, tackling RBs and receivers with good balance is going to be very difficult from behind. Lots more missed tackles. |
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Post by ocgiant on Mar 25, 2024 11:56:07 GMT -5
The controversy is how the Refs are going to call this new rule… is it intent?
Agreed playing at real time speed for a defender to be able leverage and take down a ball carrier, what are they going to do, not tackle?
Maybe now teams are policed to see if the hip drop tackle is taught as a tackling method? Which I doubt.
15 yards and a first down, yeah some games going to be lost or won with that call by the refs.
Another rule layered on top of refs having now to look at this tackle in real time speed and make that call.
Trying subdue a physical game at some point takes the game itself away.
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Post by Analyst on Mar 25, 2024 11:57:03 GMT -5
Just what players need, another thing to process and think about while playing a fast and violent game. All these rules make players more hesitant to do their job. Always brings me back to Kiwi and his Vince Young moment. What about if the guy you are trying to tackle moves out of the way and the only way the defender can tackle him is wrapping his arms around his waist? Flag now for 15 yards? So dumb... It is stupid. I also edited my post to make my point a little more clear. It'll take time but over time it'll be more natural. Kiwi did that the year they added that rule in if I remember. Haven't really seen that since. Same thing will happen here, players will think too much and mess up, but over time will be ok.
Remember this happens when the defender is behind the ball carrier. Instead of wrapping the hips and dropping your weight to the ground they will need to wrap the legs and take them down that way. It'll be harder no doubt and this rule sucks for sure. I just don't think it's as bad as other rules they've made in the past. If the NFLs data is true, then these tackles are 20 times more likely to cause injury. That's insane.
Also rugby is also banning this for what it's worth.
Sure, they will adjust, and offenses will keep scoring more and more points. This once again is a rule that helps the offense. I guess thats the point. That and avoiding injuries. |
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Post by Roosevelt on Mar 25, 2024 12:02:21 GMT -5
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 25, 2024 12:02:54 GMT -5
Just about to post this.
Even more reason to invest in the offense. It’s eventually going to be impossible to legally tackle in the NFL.
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Post by Analyst on Mar 25, 2024 12:10:25 GMT -5
How can you tackle a player and not use your weight to stop or tackle him? Thats the main force in getting the player to the ground. Using gravity. So they just have to hug them then and stand up? Now they need to go after the knees themselves which will most likely cause more ACL injuries that way. And then they make a rule you cant tackle at the knees either. I just dont know what they want anymore. Flags are coming. |
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Post by Roosevelt on Mar 25, 2024 12:18:50 GMT -5
How can you tackle a player and not use your weight to stop or tackle him? Thats the main force in getting the player to the ground. Using gravity. So they just have to hug them then and stand up? Now they need to go after the knees themselves which will most likely cause more ACL injuries that way. And then they make a rule you cant tackle at the knees either. I just dont know what they want anymore. Flags are coming.
The way this reads, you can unweight yourself as long as you don't swivel or drop your hips.
I'd love to see demonstrations of what they can or should do when catching a player from the back.
The bottom line is that the refs cannot call a lot rules with high degree of consistency. My guess is they'll struggle with this one too.
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Post by jmike on Mar 25, 2024 12:20:46 GMT -5
This is a terrible rule change, this essentially makes it so that the defender needs to be in front of the offensive player for them to initiate and try to make tackle. How would it be even possible for a defender who manages to chase down the ball carrier to tackle him from the back without them considering it “a hip drop tackle”? This is what they just banned: My guess is you will see chasing defenders go after the ankles and legs instead now. The shoulders are too high and you risk the horse collar tackle that way. So you have to go shoe string tackle. Which means, tackling RBs and receivers with good balance is going to be very difficult from behind. Lots more missed tackles. No, just a lot of shots at the knees. Then they will change the rule again. Put handles on the uniforms and you can only tackle people by the handles. Then someone will injure themselves on the handle. So why do these handles need to be attached, they should just need to pull the handles off. Then they will find just running around, players can get torn ligaments and pulled muscles. So they will only be allowed to speed walk around the field. Then someone trips over another players foot and injures themselves. So why do we need players on the field, we can create a full simulation in VR. Before you know it your football stars will include people like Chuck a bald 400lb 65 year old who hasn't left his home in 20 years and is a star in the new virtual NFL. Whoo--hoo....but you can still gamble on it. The future of the NFL. |
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Post by Analyst on Mar 25, 2024 12:29:43 GMT -5
My guess is you will see chasing defenders go after the ankles and legs instead now. The shoulders are too high and you risk the horse collar tackle that way. So you have to go shoe string tackle. Which means, tackling RBs and receivers with good balance is going to be very difficult from behind. Lots more missed tackles. No, just a lot of shots at the knees. Then they will change the rule again. Put handles on the uniforms and you can only tackle people by the handles. Then someone will injure themselves on the handle. So why do these handles need to be attached, they should just need to pull the handles off. Then they will find just running around, players can get torn ligaments and pulled muscles. So they will only be allowed to speed walk around the field. Then someone trips over another players foot and injures themselves. So why do we need players on the field, we can create a full simulation in VR. Before you know it your football stars will include people like Chuck a bald 400lb 65 year old who hasn't left his home in 20 years and is a star in the new virtual NFL. Whoo--hoo....but you can still gamble on it. The future of the NFL. Maybe they can incorporate water balloons into the tackle. Instead of putting your hands on the offensive player, throw a water balloon at him. If you hit him and the balloon bursts, he is down. Then we can all scrutinize the PFF scores of water ballooning. |
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Post by Roosevelt on Mar 25, 2024 12:35:11 GMT -5
This is a terrible rule change, this essentially makes it so that the defender needs to be in front of the offensive player for them to initiate and try to make tackle. How would it be even possible for a defender who manages to chase down the ball carrier to tackle him from the back without them considering it “a hip drop tackle”? This is what they just banned: I'm wondering if offenses will teach their ball carriers to influence this type of call from the refs to get the extra 15. Don't get me wrong. I'm not suggesting anyone would try to get themselves injured. But if the ball carrier intentionally goes down on his side, it seems like he could possibly create the illusion of this tackle. |
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 25, 2024 12:39:06 GMT -5
How can you tackle a player and not use your weight to stop or tackle him? Thats the main force in getting the player to the ground. Using gravity. So they just have to hug them then and stand up? Now they need to go after the knees themselves which will most likely cause more ACL injuries that way. And then they make a rule you cant tackle at the knees either. I just dont know what they want anymore. Flags are coming. You just have to shove them out of bounds. |
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Post by bluebuddha on Mar 25, 2024 12:43:50 GMT -5
How can you tackle a player and not use your weight to stop or tackle him? Thats the main force in getting the player to the ground. Using gravity. So they just have to hug them then and stand up? Now they need to go after the knees themselves which will most likely cause more ACL injuries that way. And then they make a rule you cant tackle at the knees either. I just dont know what they want anymore. Flags are coming. You just have to shove them out of bounds. what happens if they are in the middle of the field? |
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Post by Analyst on Mar 25, 2024 12:46:12 GMT -5
From last year. So many of these tackles are legit tackles. How else do you drop Mark Andrews there to tackle him? Dive at the back of his knees?
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Post by Nick6475 on Mar 25, 2024 12:50:54 GMT -5
This will not significantly change behavior for many years. Players aren't intentionally tackling like this (at least I don't think they are), it's just a freak occurrence. This isn't like hitting the QB in the head, you can control that to a certain extent.
If I am a coach, I would still tell my players to tackle the guy any way possible. 15 yards is better than giving up a TD.
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Post by DJones19 on Mar 25, 2024 13:03:37 GMT -5
I don't mind the rule change.
I was never taught to tackle like that and I'd only see a couple tackles like that per game at most.
It's main use to to bring defenders down faster when chasing from behind.
I heard the Isaiah Simmons tackle and injury of Geno Smith when he used the technique for no reason on a sideline tackle was a main cause for Pete Carroll to lobby for this rule. Simmons may have fallen like that accidentally but it can be used to intentionally injure a player. There was no reason or benefit to use that tackle technique on a sideline tackle...Geno was pissed.
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Post by Fletch842 on Mar 25, 2024 13:05:12 GMT -5
No, just a lot of shots at the knees. Then they will change the rule again. Put handles on the uniforms and you can only tackle people by the handles. Then someone will injure themselves on the handle. So why do these handles need to be attached, they should just need to pull the handles off. Then they will find just running around, players can get torn ligaments and pulled muscles. So they will only be allowed to speed walk around the field. Then someone trips over another players foot and injures themselves. So why do we need players on the field, we can create a full simulation in VR. Before you know it your football stars will include people like Chuck a bald 400lb 65 year old who hasn't left his home in 20 years and is a star in the new virtual NFL. Whoo--hoo....but you can still gamble on it. The future of the NFL. Maybe they can incorporate water balloons into the tackle. Instead of putting your hands on the offensive player, throw a water balloon at him. If you hit him and the balloon bursts, he is down. Then we can all scrutinize the PFF scores of water ballooning. I'm thinking something more like the NFFL (national flag football league....) Make Betsy Ross proud!!! |
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Post by DJones19 on Mar 25, 2024 13:06:10 GMT -5
This is a terrible rule change, this essentially makes it so that the defender needs to be in front of the offensive player for them to initiate and try to make tackle. How would it be even possible for a defender who manages to chase down the ball carrier to tackle him from the back without them considering it “a hip drop tackle”? This is what they just banned: Isn't that how LT broke Thesimann's leg in half putting him in the hospital for 10+ days? Don't think it's good for the sport to have a lot of star players hurt by the end of the year due to a normally bad tackling technique. |
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Post by Rangers13 on Mar 25, 2024 13:11:20 GMT -5
This is a terrible rule change, this essentially makes it so that the defender needs to be in front of the offensive player for them to initiate and try to make tackle. How would it be even possible for a defender who manages to chase down the ball carrier to tackle him from the back without them considering it “a hip drop tackle”? This is what they just banned: Isn't that how LT broke Thesimann's leg in half putting him in the hospital for 10+ days? Don't think it's good for the sport to have a lot of star players hurt by the end of the year due to a normally bad tackling technique. NO - how can you be a Giants fan and ask that? |
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mendy
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Post by mendy on Mar 25, 2024 13:16:44 GMT -5
**** it, just make it flag football and get it over with.
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Post by DJones19 on Mar 25, 2024 13:16:44 GMT -5
Isn't that how LT broke Thesimann's leg in half putting him in the hospital for 10+ days? Don't think it's good for the sport to have a lot of star players hurt by the end of the year due to a normally bad tackling technique. NO - how can you be a Giants fan and ask that?  Looks like a hip drop tackle to me. |
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 25, 2024 13:17:54 GMT -5
You just have to shove them out of bounds. what happens if they are in the middle of the field? You have to shove them out of bounds. But only maintaining their forum momentum because if forward progress is stopped you’ll get flagged for a late hit. |
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Post by Danke Schoen on Mar 25, 2024 13:18:36 GMT -5
Isn't that how LT broke Thesimann's leg in half putting him in the hospital for 10+ days? Don't think it's good for the sport to have a lot of star players hurt by the end of the year due to a normally bad tackling technique. NO - how can you be a Giants fan and ask that? It’s literally exactly how he broke Theisman leg. |
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Post by cdngfan on Mar 25, 2024 13:20:44 GMT -5
So being a finance/legal geek, This seems to be designed to prevent all of the tacklers weight landing on knees ankles. The language is specific. Hip tackle, un weighing, so dragging down from behind, and weight landing on knees ankles. |
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