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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2018 9:15:16 GMT -5
Baker has a guaranteed 5 years in the NFL, several of them as a starter. He also has he guarantee of a huge contract and many people supporting him. Webb could be selling used cars by this time next year. Mayfiled has an entire franchise and city on his shoulders. Webb is happy to be in the league.
And BTW...what's wrong with selling cars? My job isn't much more glamorous than that and I've had a very happy and meaningful life.
Nothing wrong and I don’t have a much better line of work either. It was a choice between used car salesman and insurance salesman and since I’m in the insurance industry I chose to risk offending the car salesmen. Sorry if you took offence. But I stand by my point. The people who drafted Webb are gone. A player was drafted by the new regime to compete with him. The window of opportunity is opening as Eli winds down his career so there is a very real but also very limited opportunity for Webb to position himself to get an actual starting gig and all the good things that come from that. If not, he will be on the journeyman plan to keep himself relevant and in the league. Baker and everyone in Cleveland is highly invested in his success and will be reluctant to pull the plug. Personally I see him succeeding but the “city on his shoulders” stuff to me is limited to the football universe and isn’t in the same ballpark as what udfas, and the guys bouncing around the league have to face. Moving cities, lower salaries, having to fight like a dog every training camp, practice, rep. Real life pressure has a way of throwing everything else off kilter.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 13, 2018 9:23:59 GMT -5
Mayfiled has an entire franchise and city on his shoulders. Webb is happy to be in the league.
And BTW...what's wrong with selling cars? My job isn't much more glamorous than that and I've had a very happy and meaningful life.
Nothing wrong and I don’t have a much better line of work either. It was a choice between used car salesman and insurance salesman and since I’m in the insurance industry I chose to risk offending the car salesmen. Sorry if you took offence. But I stand by my point. The people who drafted Webb are gone. A player was drafted by the new regime to compete with him. The window of opportunity is opening as Eli winds down his career so there is a very real but also very limited opportunity for Webb to position himself to get an actual starting gig and all the good things that come from that. If not, he will be on the journeyman plan to keep himself relevant and in the league. Baker and everyone in Cleveland is highly invested in his success and will be reluctant to pull the plug. Personally I see him succeeding but the “city on his shoulders” stuff to me is limited to the football universe and isn’t in the same ballpark as what udfas, and the guys bouncing around the league have to face. Moving cities, lower salaries, having to fight like a dog every training camp, practice, rep. Real life pressure has a way of throwing everything else off kilter. It's a matter of expectations. Mayfield's expectations are to be a great NFL QB. And to suggest that a kid's first preseason game isn't a hug spot in his mind is kind of silly.
Webb is just trying to stay in the league. I would suggest his expecations are to be a good backup QB and stay in the league. I'm sure his hopes of course are much higher.
Mayfield has always struck me as a guy who loves the spotlight. To me, he seems like the kind of guy who will rise to the occasion....because he always has.
He has attitude. And maybe he's a dickhead. But attitude like that is exactly what I want. There is reason the two biggest jaggoffs are the two best QB's in the league....Rodgers and Brady.
Give me a leader with an FU attitude any day.
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Post by Parademon1 on Aug 13, 2018 10:51:55 GMT -5
When you can go 1-31 & still have a job in the NFL as a HC, when in NY, if you go 3-13, you get canned, you have no pressure in Cleveland. Mayfield can go 4-12 these next 3yrs & still be the starter for the Browns. Webb is under way more pressure because if he stinks it up in the pre-season, the Giants are gonna sign a vet backup QB & Have Lauletta as the 3rd QB. No way they would go into the season with Webb #2 if he underperforms in the pre-season.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 13, 2018 11:37:12 GMT -5
When you can go 1-31 & still have a job in the NFL as a HC, when in NY, if you go 3-13, you get canned, you have no pressure in Cleveland. Mayfield can go 4-12 these next 3yrs & still be the starter for the Browns. Webb is under way more pressure because if he stinks it up in the pre-season, the Giants are gonna sign a vet backup QB & Have Lauletta as the 3rd QB. No way they would go into the season with Webb #2 if he underperforms in the pre-season. "Who is under more pressure?...Davis Webb or Baker Mayfield?"....May be the single dumbest argument we've all ever had.
Not sure what the point is. Every NFL player who is trying to earn a job is playing under pressure. Every player trying to KEEP their job is under pressure.
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Post by Roswell on Aug 13, 2018 11:40:59 GMT -5
Impossible to quantify pressure. Certainly expectations are higher for Mayfield but stakes are higher for Webb.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 13, 2018 11:43:02 GMT -5
Impossible to quantify pressure. Certainly expectations are higher for Mayfield but stakes are higher for Webb. Bottom line is that Mayfield showed up big time in his first NFL action and our guy had the "jitters" and stunk it up.
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Post by Roswell on Aug 13, 2018 11:44:22 GMT -5
Impossible to quantify pressure. Certainly expectations are higher for Mayfield but stakes are higher for Webb. Bottom line is that Mayfield showed up big time in his first NFL action and our guy had the "jitters" and stunk it up. One game. One game. One game.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 13, 2018 12:15:32 GMT -5
Bottom line is that Mayfield showed up big time in his first NFL action and our guy had the "jitters" and stunk it up. One game. One game. One game. Except the rap on Webb was his lack of poise in the pocket and the history of Mayfield is that he's a playmaker and a very accurate passer.
So both reps, that came from their history of play in college are consistent with what we saw on Thursday.
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Post by Parademon1 on Aug 13, 2018 12:18:08 GMT -5
I wanna see how Mayfield does when he's down 21-0 to Pittsburgh on the rd, then we'll see what he's made of. When the D is up 21 & makes you 1 dimensional because now you have to throw just bout every down to get back in the game, then we'll see how good he truly is. The great ones have overcome those type of deficits to win the game.
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Post by Sarcasman on Aug 13, 2018 12:27:39 GMT -5
When you can go 1-31 & still have a job in the NFL as a HC, when in NY, if you go 3-13, you get canned, you have no pressure in Cleveland. Mayfield can go 4-12 these next 3yrs & still be the starter for the Browns. Webb is under way more pressure because if he stinks it up in the pre-season, the Giants are gonna sign a vet backup QB & Have Lauletta as the 3rd QB. No way they would go into the season with Webb #2 if he underperforms in the pre-season. That doesn't really change by team with the exception of one or two. To hear the media and other vacuous pundits speak, there's tons of franchise QBs in the league today. Not that all of these QBs have actually won anything of consequence, in fact most haven't, but that's the bar now. Mayfield - and any/every one of the other QBs drafted - will likely be considered successful if he's the QB for the next ten years, makes the playoffs occasionally, never wins a championship, and has some overall decent stats. I've said it before, I'm calling the franchise QB bubble. That market is due for a correction.
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Post by Parademon1 on Aug 13, 2018 12:43:09 GMT -5
Marino comes to mind when I think of franchise QBs. Outstanding QB, tough SOB who hated losing, quickest release since Namath. But had an 8-10 playoff record & lost the only SB he played in during a 17yr career. Would you Mayfield lovers be content with a 17yr career, 8-10 playoff record & 1 SB loss? Too much of an emphasis is placed on locking up a QB for a dozen yrs or more, for what? So they can lose more playoff games than they win & get us to just 1 SB that we lose? I'd rather see SB play 8-10 yrs & help us win 2-3 SBs than a QB put up Marino's stats for 17 yrs & we have 0 SB wins to show for it.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 13, 2018 12:47:00 GMT -5
I wanna see how Mayfield does when he's down 21-0 to Pittsburgh on the rd, then we'll see what he's made of. When the D is up 21 & makes you 1 dimensional because now you have to throw just bout every down to get back in the game, then we'll see how good he truly is. The great ones have overcome those type of deficits to win the game. I would have no idea. he's a rookie QB and needs to develop. Which generally takes time. Let's not forget how awful Eli was his first half dozen games or so. My point is that Mayfiled has the ability, the attitude and the stomach to play QB in the NFL....at least in my opinion.
Anyway it looks like Tyrod Taylor will be starting the season at least for the Browns.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 13, 2018 12:48:42 GMT -5
Marino comes to mind when I think of franchise QBs. Outstanding QB, tough SOB who hated losing, quickest release since Namath. But had an 8-10 playoff record & lost the only SB he played in during a 17yr career. Would you Mayfield lovers be content with a 17yr career, 8-10 playoff record & 1 SB loss? Too much of an emphasis is placed on locking up a QB for a dozen yrs or more, for what? So they can lose more playoff games than they win & get us to just 1 SB that we lose? I'd rather see SB play 8-10 yrs & help us win 2-3 SBs than a QB put up Marino's stats for 17 yrs & we have 0 SB wins to show for it. "Mayfield lover"?. What does that even mean?
I have a high opinion of his game. i don't have love, hate, or anything in between for Baker Mayfield.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2018 12:50:58 GMT -5
I agree that 90% of a QB is from the neck up, and our guy just wet himself during a preseason game. The other guy worked his way up from a college walk-on to Heisman trophy winner and number 1 overall pick in the draft. I think he will be fine from the neck up. Every single QB wets themselves at some point in some game for some period of time. Yeah, but most of them do it in their rookie season. Nobody blinks an eye when a 3 year-old wets himself. But when a 10 year-old does...
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2018 12:55:38 GMT -5
What is the basis for comparing Mayfield to Jeff George? Just because they were both number one picks? George was a DB who was despised by his teammates. Mayfield was adored by his teammates and is a great leader. Just don’t get the comparison at all They both do not have command of their emotional response. Until he proves otherwise . That is my opinion of him . He did the same thing against Georgia. Fromm outplayed him . What was his response. Cut his head off . When thing go against the way he thinks they should go, He becomes a whiny little bitch and resorts to childish jesters to prove his worth. Only thing he proves is, he can be gotten to. Do you know who else had difficulty with his emotions? This guy...
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 13, 2018 12:58:01 GMT -5
Mayfiled has an entire franchise and city on his shoulders. Webb is happy to be in the league.
And BTW...what's wrong with selling cars? My job isn't much more glamorous than that and I've had a very happy and meaningful life.
Nothing wrong and I don’t have a much better line of work either. It was a choice between used car salesman and insurance salesman and since I’m in the insurance industry I chose to risk offending the car salesmen. Sorry if you took offence. But I stand by my point. The people who drafted Webb are gone. A player was drafted by the new regime to compete with him. The window of opportunity is opening as Eli winds down his career so there is a very real but also very limited opportunity for Webb to position himself to get an actual starting gig and all the good things that come from that. If not, he will be on the journeyman plan to keep himself relevant and in the league. Baker and everyone in Cleveland is highly invested in his success and will be reluctant to pull the plug. Personally I see him succeeding but the “city on his shoulders” stuff to me is limited to the football universe and isn’t in the same ballpark as what udfas, and the guys bouncing around the league have to face. Moving cities, lower salaries, having to fight like a dog every training camp, practice, rep. Real life pressure has a way of throwing everything else off kilter. Haha. No...I didn't take offense. it's just the notion that if you can't play football for a living your life is crap seems a stretch.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2018 13:55:27 GMT -5
When you can go 1-31 & still have a job in the NFL as a HC, when in NY, if you go 3-13, you get canned, you have no pressure in Cleveland. Mayfield can go 4-12 these next 3yrs & still be the starter for the Browns. Webb is under way more pressure because if he stinks it up in the pre-season, the Giants are gonna sign a vet backup QB & Have Lauletta as the 3rd QB. No way they would go into the season with Webb #2 if he underperforms in the pre-season. That doesn't really change by team with the exception of one or two. To hear the media and other vacuous pundits speak, there's tons of franchise QBs in the league today. Not that all of these QBs have actually won anything of consequence, in fact most haven't, but that's the bar now. Mayfield - and any/every one of the other QBs drafted - will likely be considered successful if he's the QB for the next ten years, makes the playoffs occasionally, never wins a championship, and has some overall decent stats. I've said it before, I'm calling the franchise QB bubble. That market is due for a correction. I am with you on that call.
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Post by TEM on Aug 13, 2018 15:30:54 GMT -5
Are you saying he was not up to the challenge. What is he going to do with the Steelers Defense., The Ravens Defense, NE's Defense. The Chiefs' Defense. Are you saying he can't beat a good Defense. In that game if the receiver was not wide open he could not thread the needle. That does not bode well in the NFL. He became disheveled and had to make a childish jester on national TV. I am not making this stuff up that is what he did. You are going off the rails here. Who said that he can’t beat a good defense? You are comparing the play of two QB’s in a single game, where the only difference in stats was that Mayfield threw a pick and Fromm did not. You don’t think that it is relevant to your comparison that one QB was playing against a good defense and one QB was playing against a bad defense? I do not see it that way. Oklahoma scored 48 points . Are you saying Georgia's Defence dominated? I do not see it that way . Fromm played better. I don't see that logic of the good D point to make a argument why Fromm out played Mayfield. As far as going off the rails . I received a credit Card/Debit card in the mail today. That I did not inisheat the order for the card. Apparently as a member of United Airlines mileage program. They felt it was appropriate to give my PI including my ss# to this scam CC company . That set me off the rails instantly. If any of you have an old Continental or United Mileage account expect the same. It is complete BS . I will be contacting the Federal trade commission and Visa to file a formal complaint against United Airlines and The Credit card company Republic Bank and Trust.
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Post by TEM on Aug 13, 2018 15:32:47 GMT -5
Stats? He through a pick. The freshmen did not. I know when facts are used to they suck. I watched the same game . The freshmen beat him and out played him. You can spin it anyway you want. In the end the 19 year old Fromm beat him. I guess your whole "the QB loses" only applies to the Giants QB and not to head cases Again..the Geogia QB has nothing to do with Baker Mayfield. The Georgia kid played a great game. When he comes up for the draft then we can talk. Until then we are talking about Baker Mayfield, who played a great game against Georgia....against a top defense. Mayfield was the most accurate passer coming out in this past draft. He is also the best playmaker...which is why he was drafted 1st overall.
I said from the start that I wanted Mayfield. That I thought he was the best QB in last year's draft. What I saw against us last Thursday was exactly what I was talking about. He threw into tight windows and made plays. Great job of eluding the pass rush as well.
I think the kid is going to be a star in this league. You are free to disagree. We will find out together.
He did I can not argue that . It does not change the fact the freshmen out played him.
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Post by Roswell on Aug 13, 2018 16:26:14 GMT -5
Again..the Geogia QB has nothing to do with Baker Mayfield. The Georgia kid played a great game. When he comes up for the draft then we can talk. Until then we are talking about Baker Mayfield, who played a great game against Georgia....against a top defense. Mayfield was the most accurate passer coming out in this past draft. He is also the best playmaker...which is why he was drafted 1st overall.
I said from the start that I wanted Mayfield. That I thought he was the best QB in last year's draft. What I saw against us last Thursday was exactly what I was talking about. He threw into tight windows and made plays. Great job of eluding the pass rush as well.
I think the kid is going to be a star in this league. You are free to disagree. We will find out together.
He did I can not argue that . It does not change the fact the freshmen out played him. In basketball you can outplay someone. In the batters box a pitcher can strike you out. In golf you can be outplayed. These are one on one sports matchups. Football does not logically lend itself to such comparisons. It is a team game in every sense of the word. There are too many other mitigating factors to blanketly state that one player outplayed the other when neither are on the field at the same time.
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Post by Parademon1 on Aug 13, 2018 19:41:40 GMT -5
Football is the ultimate "team" sport.
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Post by Eazy E on Aug 13, 2018 19:55:13 GMT -5
Davis who? I can almost guarantee that aside from the NYG boards and maybe Metlife, nobody gives a rats ass about Webb. Its hilarious to even think that. This sounds almost like it should be on the Cgirls threads. I agree everybody is fighting for a job, heck even the wiley Vet rb Stewart is probably questioning if he is going to get cut. Mayfield has the most pressure for a draft pick in a very long time. I bet half the league fans want to see him fail because of his past.
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Post by GameTime on Aug 14, 2018 7:35:11 GMT -5
Davis who? I can almost guarantee that aside from the NYG boards and maybe Metlife, nobody gives a rats ass about Webb. Its hilarious to even think that. This sounds almost like it should be on the Cgirls threads. I agree everybody is fighting for a job, heck even the wiley Vet rb Stewart is probably questioning if he is going to get cut. Mayfield has the most pressure for a draft pick in a very long time. I bet half the league fans want to see him fail because of his past. its about personal pressure.....not outside pressure. Webb is fighting for his job/career. He cares a lot about that I bet. Hey....maybe he cant hack it. So be it. Mayfield is guaranteed to be in the NFL for 4/5 years. His real pressure starts when he is named the starter for the Browns.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 14, 2018 7:38:22 GMT -5
Davis who? I can almost guarantee that aside from the NYG boards and maybe Metlife, nobody gives a rats ass about Webb. Its hilarious to even think that. This sounds almost like it should be on the Cgirls threads. I agree everybody is fighting for a job, heck even the wiley Vet rb Stewart is probably questioning if he is going to get cut. Mayfield has the most pressure for a draft pick in a very long time. I bet half the league fans want to see him fail because of his past. its about personal pressure.....not outside pressure. Webb is fighting for his job/career. He cares a lot about that I bet. Hey....maybe he cant hack it. So be it. Mayfield is guaranteed to be in the NFL for 4/5 years. His real pressure starts when he is named the starter for the Browns. Davis Webb is probably going to be a back up QB in this league. It's possible that he could be a starter but that is a long shot.
I'm sure he has hopes to be a starter but it's probably not happening.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 14, 2018 7:47:35 GMT -5
Sorry ,I am just not putting any thought into the first preseason game ,good or bad. Like someone else said the Browns "game planed" for this game it is widely known we did not .I will tell you I like that . People relax it's pre season. That's what we were told last year....Unfortunately our poor play in preseason continued into the regular season.
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Post by GameTime on Aug 14, 2018 7:57:37 GMT -5
its about personal pressure.....not outside pressure. Webb is fighting for his job/career. He cares a lot about that I bet. Hey....maybe he cant hack it. So be it. Mayfield is guaranteed to be in the NFL for 4/5 years. His real pressure starts when he is named the starter for the Browns. Davis Webb is probably going to be a back up QB in this league. It's possible that he could be a starter but that is a long shot.
I'm sure he has hopes to be a starter but it's probably not happening.
I fully agree but I like most he wants to be a starter and probably thinks he can be.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 14, 2018 8:00:48 GMT -5
That's what we were told last year....Unfortunately our poor play in preseason continued into the regular season. You are very good at ignoring the obvious when it comes to the team last year. Just like people gave to much credit for the 11-5 season the year before. In the last 6 years, our first teamers have stunk in the preseason. In 5 of those 6 years, we have had losing seasons.
I'm not ignoring anything. I understand that preseason doesn't count and what happens then needs to be taken with a grain of salt. I truly do. But give me a string of winning seasons and then we can discount preseason in the way you seem to be suggesting. In recent history, our play in preseason has been matching our regular season play pretty closely.
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Post by Fletch842 on Aug 14, 2018 8:04:31 GMT -5
Sorry ,I am just not putting any thought into the first preseason game ,good or bad. Like someone else said the Browns "game planed" for this game it is widely known we did not .I will tell you I like that . People relax it's pre season. That's what we were told last year....Unfortunately our poor play in preseason continued into the regular season. If the poor execution continues through the pre-season, I will be very worried. I want to see improvement in each of the remaining 3 games to allay my concerns.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 14, 2018 18:57:51 GMT -5
This is a one sided story . There are two . I question if this is fact or Mayfield hot headed drama playing. If anything it makes him look like he has an inferiority complex. If he did not, he would not have needed to bring that up. Is he saying he needs to be disrespected to inspire self confidence ? DC's love this kind of information delving into a QB's psyche. If he had any confidence at all he would have retrieved towels and still took his job. This guy will prove to be another Jeff George before his time is done. Anyone who disrespects his frail self-assurance gets under his skin in a way he can not let go of it. Crotch grab in Kansas because he felt emotional picked on. Now he claims Davis bullied him. This is stuff that most would just blow off. This guy is a QB. What is going to do when things are going wrong in a game. Is it going to get to him.? If he holds on to stuff this petty. How is going to concentrate when everyone is disrespecting him to get him unravel . What is he going to do when the media starts to make comments that disturb him? . 90% of a QB is from the neck up. He would have been better off keeping this stuff to himself. Jut my 2 cents. we saw it in the national championship game he kind of disappeared for parts of the game and couldn't get out of the way of the pressure they brought, he looked discombobulated. That was pure football, not some cryptic mental game.
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Post by Morehead State on Aug 14, 2018 21:01:54 GMT -5
In the last 6 years, our first teamers have stunk in the preseason. In 5 of those 6 years, we have had losing seasons.
I'm not ignoring anything. I understand that preseason doesn't count and what happens then needs to be taken with a grain of salt. I truly do. But give me a string of winning seasons and then we can discount preseason in the way you seem to be suggesting. In recent history, our play in preseason has been matching our regular season play pretty closely.
Still don't buy it. Cleveland 4-0 last preseason and is 1 and 31 in regular season games over the last two years. Add in that in this season there has been a complete sweep in coach's and GM with the Giants ,that has not been the case in your last 5 year scenario. You are confusing wins and losses in the preseason, which means nothing...with the quality of the play of the starters.
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