rbe40
Special Teams
Posts: 800
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Post by rbe40 on Mar 4, 2020 11:37:46 GMT -5
in their entire team's history. This fact isn't being discussed enough. I've heard "Giants haven't had a Linebacker like Simmons since Carl Banks" as a reason to draft Simmons. Now replace the word "Linebacker" with "stud Left Tackle": The Giants have never had a stud Left Tackle since....EVER
Our last 5 Left Tackles:
- Nate Solder
- Ereck Flowers
- Will Beatty
- David Diehl
- Luke Pettigout
Look at the other 3 teams in the division. While the Giants have trotted out the above 5 JAGs at LT, the Cowboys trotted out Flozell Adams / Doug Free / Tyron Smith. The Redskins trotted out Trent Williams. The Eagles trotted out Tra Thomas / Jason Peters.
Stop thinking about Simmons. Simmons is a luxury pick given the current state of the roster.
Fix this glaring Left Tackle problem FIRST before even thinking about Off-Ball players. Team Building 101
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Post by hadenough on Mar 4, 2020 11:42:03 GMT -5
I agree. Thomas and Becton would be better than any LT they've had in decades. Go get them. They're good and they should play for a while.
This is still a 2-year process. Not every position will be addressed this offseason. It'll take next draft and free agency, too.
A LT should be there...go get them.
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Post by roundabout on Mar 4, 2020 11:45:55 GMT -5
in their entire team's history. This fact isn't being discussed enough. I've heard "Giants haven't had a Linebacker like Simmons since Carl Banks" as a reason to draft Simmons. Now replace the word "Linebacker" with "stud Left Tackle": The Giants have never had a stud Left Tackle since....EVER Our last 5 Left Tackles: - Nate Solder - Ereck Flowers - Will Beatty - David Diehl - Luke Pettigout Look at the other 3 teams in the division. While the Giants have trotted out the above 5 JAGs at LT, the Cowboys trotted out Flozell Adams / Doug Free / Tyron Smith. The Redskins trotted out Trent Williams. The Eagles trotted out Tra Thomas / Jason Peters. Stop thinking about Simmons. Simmons is a luxury pick given the current state of the roster. Fix this glaring Left Tackle problem FIRST before even thinking about Off-Ball players. Team Building 101 Jumbo Elliott |
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Post by giantlegacy on Mar 4, 2020 11:58:14 GMT -5
in their entire team's history. This fact isn't being discussed enough. I've heard "Giants haven't had a Linebacker like Simmons since Carl Banks" as a reason to draft Simmons. Now replace the word "Linebacker" with "stud Left Tackle": The Giants have never had a stud Left Tackle since....EVER Our last 5 Left Tackles: - Nate Solder - Ereck Flowers - Will Beatty - David Diehl - Luke Pettigout Look at the other 3 teams in the division. While the Giants have trotted out the above 5 JAGs at LT, the Cowboys trotted out Flozell Adams / Doug Free / Tyron Smith. The Redskins trotted out Trent Williams. The Eagles trotted out Tra Thomas / Jason Peters. Stop thinking about Simmons. Simmons is a luxury pick given the current state of the roster. Fix this glaring Left Tackle problem FIRST before even thinking about Off-Ball players. Team Building 101 Sshhhhhh.......... Logic like this isn't allowed on here these days,not when such an athletic messiah can fix the entire Giants defense all by himself has appeared. Nevermind the fact the team spent the last 2 1st round picks on a dynamic unicorn RB and a franchise QB,you can't half ass this rebuild now by not building the line in a year where the stars align in so many ways not only to complete the line but get the dynamic playmaker outside as well to compliment Slayton with such a deep draft there ... Great to see some common sense around here |
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Post by giantlegacy on Mar 4, 2020 11:59:09 GMT -5
in their entire team's history. This fact isn't being discussed enough. I've heard "Giants haven't had a Linebacker like Simmons since Carl Banks" as a reason to draft Simmons. Now replace the word "Linebacker" with "stud Left Tackle": The Giants have never had a stud Left Tackle since....EVER Our last 5 Left Tackles: - Nate Solder - Ereck Flowers - Will Beatty - David Diehl - Luke Pettigout Look at the other 3 teams in the division. While the Giants have trotted out the above 5 JAGs at LT, the Cowboys trotted out Flozell Adams / Doug Free / Tyron Smith. The Redskins trotted out Trent Williams. The Eagles trotted out Tra Thomas / Jason Peters. Stop thinking about Simmons. Simmons is a luxury pick given the current state of the roster. Fix this glaring Left Tackle problem FIRST before even thinking about Off-Ball players. Team Building 101 Jumbo Elliott I think he meant post Cap era... |
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Post by roundabout on Mar 4, 2020 12:04:43 GMT -5
I think he meant post Cap era... I thought he said never |
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Post by Morehead State on Mar 4, 2020 12:07:26 GMT -5
in their entire team's history. This fact isn't being discussed enough. I've heard "Giants haven't had a Linebacker like Simmons since Carl Banks" as a reason to draft Simmons. Now replace the word "Linebacker" with "stud Left Tackle": The Giants have never had a stud Left Tackle since....EVER Our last 5 Left Tackles: - Nate Solder - Ereck Flowers - Will Beatty - David Diehl - Luke Pettigout Look at the other 3 teams in the division. While the Giants have trotted out the above 5 JAGs at LT, the Cowboys trotted out Flozell Adams / Doug Free / Tyron Smith. The Redskins trotted out Trent Williams. The Eagles trotted out Tra Thomas / Jason Peters. Stop thinking about Simmons. Simmons is a luxury pick given the current state of the roster. Fix this glaring Left Tackle problem FIRST before even thinking about Off-Ball players. Team Building 101 Jumbo Elliott These kids today.
Jumbo was a GREAT football player.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2020 12:17:43 GMT -5
Interesting way to look at the last few years.
The other thing to compare with these other teams is that the Giants put out a HoF QB while the other three teams didn't..
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Post by Kruunch on Mar 4, 2020 12:18:04 GMT -5
As you can see with those 5 players the Giants have tried to get an establish left tackle, they just haven’t found one. Petitgout and Flowers are 1st round picks, Beatty was a 2nd round pick. Diehl was a 5th round pick and if you ask me a steal. And Solder was a high priced free agent.
The Giants just haven’t had the luck like the other teams when it comes to the position. Call it better scouting, luck, whatever. Like the OP said the Eagles signed Jason Peters at 27 years old. He’s going into the HOF. The Cowboys drafted Smith, another future HOF, and the Redskins drafted Trent Williams a 7x pro bowler. Those 3 teams found gold as the Giants found lead.
As history tells us the Giants have swung and missed when it came to the position in recent years. Hopefully, this time they hit a homerun.
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Post by Kruunch on Mar 4, 2020 12:21:38 GMT -5
Interesting way to look at the last few years. The other thing to compare with these other teams is that the Giants put out a HoF QB while the other three teams didn't.. True, big reason why we have two championships to the other teams 1 in the last 20 years. |
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Post by DandyDon on Mar 4, 2020 12:29:15 GMT -5
in their entire team's history. This fact isn't being discussed enough. I've heard "Giants haven't had a Linebacker like Simmons since Carl Banks" as a reason to draft Simmons. Now replace the word "Linebacker" with "stud Left Tackle": The Giants have never had a stud Left Tackle since....EVER Our last 5 Left Tackles: - Nate Solder - Ereck Flowers - Will Beatty - David Diehl - Luke Pettigout Look at the other 3 teams in the division. While the Giants have trotted out the above 5 JAGs at LT, the Cowboys trotted out Flozell Adams / Doug Free / Tyron Smith. The Redskins trotted out Trent Williams. The Eagles trotted out Tra Thomas / Jason Peters. Stop thinking about Simmons. Simmons is a luxury pick given the current state of the roster. Fix this glaring Left Tackle problem FIRST before even thinking about Off-Ball players. Team Building 101 And while the other 3 teams in the division were trotting them out, Beatty and Diehl won rings. |
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Post by Dogecoin on Mar 4, 2020 12:34:53 GMT -5
Jumbo Elliott for sure
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Post by GameTime on Mar 4, 2020 12:36:00 GMT -5
in their entire team's history. This fact isn't being discussed enough. I've heard "Giants haven't had a Linebacker like Simmons since Carl Banks" as a reason to draft Simmons. Now replace the word "Linebacker" with "stud Left Tackle": The Giants have never had a stud Left Tackle since....EVER Our last 5 Left Tackles: - Nate Solder - Ereck Flowers - Will Beatty - David Diehl - Luke Pettigout Look at the other 3 teams in the division. While the Giants have trotted out the above 5 JAGs at LT, the Cowboys trotted out Flozell Adams / Doug Free / Tyron Smith. The Redskins trotted out Trent Williams. The Eagles trotted out Tra Thomas / Jason Peters. Stop thinking about Simmons. Simmons is a luxury pick given the current state of the roster. Fix this glaring Left Tackle problem FIRST before even thinking about Off-Ball players. Team Building 101 Jumbo Elliott played only 6 or 7 season with the NYGs. Not a franchise in that regard |
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Post by TCHOF on Mar 4, 2020 12:41:32 GMT -5
in their entire team's history. This fact isn't being discussed enough. I've heard "Giants haven't had a Linebacker like Simmons since Carl Banks" as a reason to draft Simmons. Now replace the word "Linebacker" with "stud Left Tackle": The Giants have never had a stud Left Tackle since....EVER Our last 5 Left Tackles: - Nate Solder - Ereck Flowers - Will Beatty - David Diehl - Luke Pettigout Look at the other 3 teams in the division. While the Giants have trotted out the above 5 JAGs at LT, the Cowboys trotted out Flozell Adams / Doug Free / Tyron Smith. The Redskins trotted out Trent Williams. The Eagles trotted out Tra Thomas / Jason Peters. Stop thinking about Simmons. Simmons is a luxury pick given the current state of the roster. Fix this glaring Left Tackle problem FIRST before even thinking about Off-Ball players. Team Building 101 Jumbo Elliott Beat me to it |
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Post by TCHOF on Mar 4, 2020 12:45:50 GMT -5
These kids today.
Jumbo was a GREAT football player.
Loved Jumbo ... He was a second round pick. |
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Post by TCHOF on Mar 4, 2020 12:46:47 GMT -5
in their entire team's history. This fact isn't being discussed enough. I've heard "Giants haven't had a Linebacker like Simmons since Carl Banks" as a reason to draft Simmons. Now replace the word "Linebacker" with "stud Left Tackle": The Giants have never had a stud Left Tackle since....EVER Our last 5 Left Tackles: - Nate Solder - Ereck Flowers - Will Beatty - David Diehl - Luke Pettigout Look at the other 3 teams in the division. While the Giants have trotted out the above 5 JAGs at LT, the Cowboys trotted out Flozell Adams / Doug Free / Tyron Smith. The Redskins trotted out Trent Williams. The Eagles trotted out Tra Thomas / Jason Peters. Stop thinking about Simmons. Simmons is a luxury pick given the current state of the roster. Fix this glaring Left Tackle problem FIRST before even thinking about Off-Ball players. Team Building 101 Hard to argue with this rationale |
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Post by bavarobeast on Mar 4, 2020 13:08:56 GMT -5
Wrong - Jumbo Elliot was a stud LT and Brad Benson wasn’t too shabby.
Never say never. You set yourself up for failure.
We haven’t had a true left tackle in recent years.
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Post by Roswell on Mar 4, 2020 14:59:52 GMT -5
Was Roosevelt Brown an LT or a RT because he was great and certainly fits the whole franchise criteria?
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Post by lt56 on Mar 4, 2020 15:02:18 GMT -5
Yeah Jumbo Elliot was VERY GOOD but no he wasn't a "Franchise Left Tackle
Franchise Left Tackles are extremely RARE through out the history of the NFL. Even Currently looking around the league it is not many True Franchise Left Tackles other than WHO right now? Tyron Smith for the Cowboys, Taylor Lewan for the Titans, David Bakhtiari for the Packers (was a 4th Round Pick), Terron Armstead (3rd Round Pick) after that the rest are just Good Enough but not many are great and Future Hall of Famers in This ERA or anything like that
You kinda have to just get LUCKY when it comes to Franchise Left Tackles. Taking one high in the Draft doesn't Guarantee anything so it is no exact Science into finding one. You can also find guys like David Bakhtiari in the 4th Round and Develop a player like that into probably the best Tackle in the NFL at the moment. In that draft when Bakhtiari went 4th Round and Terron Armstead in the 3rd Round, Giants drafted Pugh in the 1st Round with the 19th Pick so yeah THAT FAILED and further proof that Drafting a guy high based on "NEED" guarantees nothing
Also we won 2 Super Bowls with David Diehl as our Left Tackle, Chiefs just won a Super Bowl with Eric Fisher as their Left Tackle so you don't NEED a Franchise Left Tackle to win
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Post by Kase1 on Mar 4, 2020 15:21:52 GMT -5
in their entire team's history. This fact isn't being discussed enough. I've heard "Giants haven't had a Linebacker like Simmons since Carl Banks" as a reason to draft Simmons. Now replace the word "Linebacker" with "stud Left Tackle": The Giants have never had a stud Left Tackle since....EVER Our last 5 Left Tackles: - Nate Solder - Ereck Flowers - Will Beatty - David Diehl - Luke Pettigout Look at the other 3 teams in the division. While the Giants have trotted out the above 5 JAGs at LT, the Cowboys trotted out Flozell Adams / Doug Free / Tyron Smith. The Redskins trotted out Trent Williams. The Eagles trotted out Tra Thomas / Jason Peters. Stop thinking about Simmons. Simmons is a luxury pick given the current state of the roster. Fix this glaring Left Tackle problem FIRST before even thinking about Off-Ball players. Team Building 101 Jumbo Elliott You mean Ronkonkoma, Long Island's OWN, Jumbo Elliott, LOL |
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Post by Kase1 on Mar 4, 2020 15:29:12 GMT -5
How DARE you inject some common sense and knowledge into these boards!!!!!
Simmons is a flashy, luxury asset. I WISH he was the most sensible pick for us, but then again drafting top 5, youre usually not 1 defensive player away from a fix.
I have been REALLY wanting a LT for a good while, except for last year, I LOOOOVED Josh Allen. At this point with 1st rd picks being spent on a RB and QB the last 2 seasons, a LT only makes the most rational sense. All 3 can grow and flourish together for years to come forming a devastating offensive core
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Post by ThatGuyRich on Mar 4, 2020 15:52:53 GMT -5
Was Roosevelt Brown an LT or a RT because he was great and certainly fits the whole franchise criteria? Roosevelt Brown #79 was the LT in the 50's and possibly even early 60's. Jack Stroud #66 was the RT. Rosey is in the HOF, Brown was the first athletic OL that could run downfield and throw a 2nd block. Frank Gifford has said that Rosey is the reason he's in the HOF. All Time great LT. The best LT we've ever had.
I know when people say in our history they usually mean since they've been around but the league and the Giants have been around for 100 years.
And as a lot of you guys have already pointed out Jumbo Elliot was really good. Guess he could qualify for a franchise LT. In todays football definitely.
But it has seemed like forever since we've had a franchise LT on our team. This year in the draft hopefully we can end that streak.
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Post by Blue Hulk on Mar 4, 2020 16:29:10 GMT -5
which one of those teams won anything? The one hit wonder eagles?
OP....Here is the issue. teams would go QB's don't have cap space for OL....Thos teams drafted those players, but come re-sign time...
Cap hell
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Post by shocknaweny on Mar 4, 2020 17:00:41 GMT -5
Jumbo Elliot was the MAN !!!
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Post by giantlegacy on Mar 4, 2020 17:34:50 GMT -5
which one of those teams won anything? The one hit wonder eagles? OP....Here is the issue. teams would go QB's don't have cap space for OL....Thos teams drafted those players, but come re-sign time... Cap hell Maybe if teams get smart and stop paying 95 million to the recievers because we are seeing these guy are replaceable with how many good ones hit the draft ready to contribute week one,especially on a good team with a very good line and qb.. |
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 4, 2020 18:08:14 GMT -5
So you point out that a team with 4 Super Bowls built on DEFENSE and never having a great OT should pass on building their DEFENSE in order to sign a OT?
I fail to see your logic.
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Post by shocknaweny on Mar 4, 2020 18:12:44 GMT -5
Yeah Jumbo Elliot was VERY GOOD but no he wasn't a "Franchise Left Tackle Also we won 2 Super Bowls with David Diehl as our Left Tackle, Chiefs just won a Super Bowl with Eric Fisher as their Left Tackle so you don't NEED a Franchise Left Tackle to win Wasnt Eric Fischer a 1 overall draft pick |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2020 18:14:27 GMT -5
in their entire team's history. This fact isn't being discussed enough. I've heard "Giants haven't had a Linebacker like Simmons since Carl Banks" as a reason to draft Simmons. Now replace the word "Linebacker" with "stud Left Tackle": The Giants have never had a stud Left Tackle since....EVER Our last 5 Left Tackles: - Nate Solder - Ereck Flowers - Will Beatty - David Diehl - Luke Pettigout Look at the other 3 teams in the division. While the Giants have trotted out the above 5 JAGs at LT, the Cowboys trotted out Flozell Adams / Doug Free / Tyron Smith. The Redskins trotted out Trent Williams. The Eagles trotted out Tra Thomas / Jason Peters. Stop thinking about Simmons. Simmons is a luxury pick given the current state of the roster. Fix this glaring Left Tackle problem FIRST before even thinking about Off-Ball players. Team Building 101 Dude, how old are you? Don’t you remember Elliot? |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2020 18:18:16 GMT -5
Yeah Jumbo Elliot was VERY GOOD but no he wasn't a "Franchise Left Tackle Franchise Left Tackles are extremely RARE through out the history of the NFL. Even Currently looking around the league it is not many True Franchise Left Tackles other than WHO right now? Tyron Smith for the Cowboys, Taylor Lewan for the Titans, David Bakhtiari for the Packers (was a 4th Round Pick), Terron Armstead (3rd Round Pick) after that the rest are just Good Enough but not many are great and Future Hall of Famers in This ERA or anything like that You kinda have to just get LUCKY when it comes to Franchise Left Tackles. Taking one high in the Draft doesn't Guarantee anything so it is no exact Science into finding one. You can also find guys like David Bakhtiari in the 4th Round and Develop a player like that into probably the best Tackle in the NFL at the moment. In that draft when Bakhtiari went 4th Round and Terron Armstead in the 3rd Round, Giants drafted Pugh in the 1st Round with the 19th Pick so yeah THAT FAILED and further proof that Drafting a guy high based on "NEED" guarantees nothing Also we won 2 Super Bowls with David Diehl as our Left Tackle, Chiefs just won a Super Bowl with Eric Fisher as their Left Tackle so you don't NEED a Franchise Left Tackle to win He’s as close to franchise as you can get without being franchise in my opinion. And him not being franchised make you say he should have been. |
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Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2020 18:20:38 GMT -5
played only 6 or 7 season with the NYGs. Not a franchise in that regard He probably should have been. Wonder why they didn’t. I remember it not being as big an issue then as it is now. |
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