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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 2, 2020 12:55:14 GMT -5
did someone fart in here? Nah Just a moron with mouth flatulence that can't take a clue What is your opinion of Sewell from Oregon (or anyone else's take on him)? The Giants, even with the first or 2nd pick, could keep Jones and draft him so that the Giants could have two potentially great tackles on their oline. My mind is basically made up that I want Lawrence or Fields if we are picking in the top 2, but I am a person that always likes to hear other opinions on what we can do about this team. Hate to say it but a bit of a luxury pick considering all the draft recourses we have used on the line since 2018 early. There comes a point you have to just keep them on the field as a unit and let them gell,even Gates...I really thinl Hernandez's "slump " is because of not having the same C next to him 3 years in a row,also having to compensate for a bad year from Solder.. To me Sewell is the pick you make when you have a rare occurrence of having 90% of your roster set and somehow get a top 5 pick as well.. To me Lawrence is debatable...number 2 I'm trading back, I'm looking at guys at need positions like Chase or Surtain... |
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Post by jmike on Oct 2, 2020 13:04:02 GMT -5
What is your opinion of Sewell from Oregon (or anyone else's take on him)? The Giants, even with the first or 2nd pick, could keep Jones and draft him so that the Giants could have two potentially great tackles on their oline. My mind is basically made up that I want Lawrence or Fields if we are picking in the top 2, but I am a person that always likes to hear other opinions on what we can do about this team. Hate to say it but a bit of a luxury pick considering all the draft recourses we have used on the line since 2018 early. There comes a point you have to just keep them on the field as a unit and let them gell,even Gates...I really thinl Hernandez's "slump " is because of not having the same C next to him 3 years in a row,also having to compensate for a bad year from Solder.. To me Sewell is the pick you make when you have a rare occurrence of having 90% of your roster set and somehow get a top 5 pick as well.. To me Lawrence is debatable...number 2 I'm trading back, I'm looking at guys at need positions like Chase or Surtain... Can't argue with any of that. I just hope you are right with Gates; I'm not overly confident in that. Off the top of your head do you know which teams have 2 firsts this year? Would be nice if Jones shows he is the future and we can turn 1 high pick into 2 mid firsts. We could land 2 spots there in need of more talent. Like CB....geez, how many picks spent on DB the past couple of years and look at the state of that unit. Ugh. |
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mj312
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Post by mj312 on Oct 2, 2020 13:57:47 GMT -5
I think no matter what picking saquon was the right pick at the right time and it’s actually the only thing I will defend gettleman on.. at the time we knew we needed to invest in the offensive line but the line in 2017 could block better than our current line. He was an amazing talent that nobody could pass on . Let’s all be honest , the odds of gettleman doing something better with that pick was slim to none . Even if he traded back he would have just picked more average players .. SB, at the time of the draft was a generational talent who could have fetched a Herschel Walker-like bushel of players/picks to rebuild one of the worst rosters in the league. ++++++++++++++++++ In 1989, at the peak of his NFL career, the Cowboys sent Herschel Walker to the Vikings for five players and six draft picks. The players were LB Jesse Solomon, DB Isiac Holt, RB Darrin Nelson, LB David Howard, and DE Alex Stewart. The picks turned into players such as Emmitt Smith, Russell Maryland, Kevin Smith, and Darren Woodson.++++++++++++++++++ Not suggesting we are going to get that type of pay back but, IMHO, selecting SB was a huge opportunity missed for roster as pathetic as ours was/remains.. I completely understand your rationale but if gettleman did that and got 4 picks for barkley 3 of 4 would be horrible . I believe that 1 very talented player is better than 2-3 average players .. |
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mj312
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Post by mj312 on Oct 2, 2020 14:05:47 GMT -5
I think no matter what picking saquon was the right pick at the right time and it’s actually the only thing I will defend gettleman on.. at the time we knew we needed to invest in the offensive line but the line in 2017 could block better than our current line. He was an amazing talent that nobody could pass on . Let’s all be honest , the odds of gettleman doing something better with that pick was slim to none . Even if he traded back he would have just picked more average players .. I agree with this. I have no problem with them drafting Barkley at 2. He is a special talent and you don't pass up on special talent like his. I don't know why people keep reaching back for that scenario. IMO, this team would be where it is regardless because of who is running it. Prior to barkley we had bargain bin backs since Bradshaw . The year before Jennings and darkwa were able to get some runs but just weren’t good enough to break away .. barkley was the answer . Nobody could ever imagine that gettlemans hog mollies would be worst than what we had |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2020 14:12:44 GMT -5
SB, at the time of the draft was a generational talent who could have fetched a Herschel Walker-like bushel of players/picks to rebuild one of the worst rosters in the league. ++++++++++++++++++ In 1989, at the peak of his NFL career, the Cowboys sent Herschel Walker to the Vikings for five players and six draft picks. The players were LB Jesse Solomon, DB Isiac Holt, RB Darrin Nelson, LB David Howard, and DE Alex Stewart. The picks turned into players such as Emmitt Smith, Russell Maryland, Kevin Smith, and Darren Woodson.++++++++++++++++++ Not suggesting we are going to get that type of pay back but, IMHO, selecting SB was a huge opportunity missed for roster as pathetic as ours was/remains.. I completely understand your rationale but if gettleman did that and got 4 picks for barkley 3 of 4 would be horrible . I believe that 1 very talented player is better than 2-3 average players .. The Broncos were offering the 6th pick plus next years #1.. That looks like two excellent opportunities for one player who has now been hurt for more than half his short career.. |
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Post by jmike on Oct 2, 2020 14:42:46 GMT -5
I completely understand your rationale but if gettleman did that and got 4 picks for barkley 3 of 4 would be horrible . I believe that 1 very talented player is better than 2-3 average players .. The Broncos were offering the 6th pick plus next years #1.. That looks like two excellent opportunities for one player who has now been hurt for more than half his short career.. With hindsight, sure. Could have gotten Allen there and not need to trade up for Baker 2019...or take Jacobs if you still needed a RB. Though a #6 and a pick the next year is not much for #2 overall. I think they would have needed to get back 2 picks in 2018 plus the 1 in 2019 to make it worthwhile. GMs make mistakes with high picks, but eschewing that deal for a player regarded as well as Barkley was by everyone is hard to criticize. There were no tackles in that draft and with al the good guards, solid shot at getting one in the 2nd; so Nelson wasn't ideal. I think the pick came down to Barkley or one of the QBs and honestly none of the QB that year came without significant concerns. If I was there, no idea who I would have taken. I thought any of Darnold, Chubb or Barkley would have been a solid pick and none would still be there if they traded as far back as 5. Turns out Chubb was and Allen would have been better than Darnold. Didn't see Ward going ahead of Chubb. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2020 15:53:00 GMT -5
Saquon is a monster when he has even the slightest bit of blocking to support him. That’s a fact.
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Post by Morehead State on Oct 2, 2020 21:23:24 GMT -5
Saquon is a monster when he has even the slightest bit of blocking to support him. That’s a fact. So is Raheem Mostert. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2020 21:50:35 GMT -5
Saquon is a monster when he has even the slightest bit of blocking to support him. That’s a fact. So is Raheem Mostert. I think you’re mistaken, slightest bit of blocking & great blocking are two different things |
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Post by Morehead State on Oct 2, 2020 21:59:32 GMT -5
I think you’re mistaken, slightest bit of blocking & great blocking are two different things Well here's my point.
Saquan is a great talent....but he's not a grinder. He's a guy who doesn't get those extra yards after being hit. He doesn't turn 2 yard gains into 4 yard gains. He doesn't move the pile. He's a hit or miss RB. He likes to try to bounce it outside. He's not a guy to feed and win you a football game.
His breakout plays are epic. But they can't be counted on. Defenses can also take away his impact in the passing game. We've seen that. We have also seen that he can be taken away in the running game. I just don't think he has great impact on our ability to win games.
As talented as he is.....he was the wrong guy for our team with the 2nd pick in the draft. That was a huge amount of draft capital...and it was used poorly for a team that had SO many needs.
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Post by Jomo on Oct 2, 2020 22:40:30 GMT -5
I think you’re mistaken, slightest bit of blocking & great blocking are two different things Well here's my point.
Saquan is a great talent....but he's not a grinder. He's a guy who doesn't get those extra yards after being hit. He doesn't turn 2 yard gains into 4 yard gains. He doesn't move the pile. He's a hit or miss RB. He likes to try to bounce it outside. He's not a guy to feed and win you a football game.
His breakout plays are epic. But they can't be counted on. Defenses can also take away his impact in the passing game. We've seen that. We have also seen that he can be taken away in the running game. I just don't think he has great impact on our ability to win games.
As talented as he is.....he was the wrong guy for our team with the 2nd pick in the draft. That was a huge amount of draft capital...and it was used poorly for a team that had SO many needs.
In a word, yes. |
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Post by titowooten on Oct 3, 2020 0:34:18 GMT -5
If he plays so bad this season that the Giants decide to move on already; you'd be lucky to get a 5th and a bag of peanuts for him. I think that Jones will be a good professional QB in due time, even if he plays bad the rest of this season. Finishing where the Giants are going to finish (2-14 at best IMO) takes a team effort. Even the Cardinals got a 2nd for Josh Rosen when it became clear that they were getting Murray. It really depends on who else was scouting him when he was at Duke. I see people in this thread sniping at Jones because they want Lawrence or Fields. I'm not going to do that. I like Jones. I just think that both of those guys will be better than Jones. The reason the cardinals got a #2 for Rosen was because he was still more of an unknown quantity. He had only started like 13 or 14 games on a mediocre team with a terrible offensive line. The main reason they moved on from him was because they hired a coach who utilized an air raid system that Murray was perfect for and he was also a dynamic athlete. If the Giants end up with the #1 pick and Jones turns the ball over 25+ times again this season nobody is going to give us anywhere near a 2nd or 3rd round pick for him. If a QB is turning the ball over that much 2 years into the league then it's probably going to be a career long problem not something a new team and a coach can just fix and that it's worth giving up a high draft pick to find out. The Rosen trade didn't work out too well either so teams will be even more leery about making a trade like that. |
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Post by thetruth on Oct 3, 2020 4:31:12 GMT -5
Saquon is a monster when he has even the slightest bit of blocking to support him. That’s a fact. Nick Chubb is a monster regardless of blocking. Same draft, but second round, not second pick. Having vision helps. |
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Post by moecoastie on Oct 3, 2020 4:43:09 GMT -5
Saquon is a monster when he has even the slightest bit of blocking to support him. That’s a fact. Nick Chubb is a monster regardless of blocking. Same draft, but second round, not second pick. Having vision helps. nick chubb may have gotten drafted way higher had he not had a horrific knee injury in college. |
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southerner
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Post by southerner on Oct 3, 2020 5:58:05 GMT -5
The Giants are facing a new rebuild effort with a new coach, GM, and QB and Saquon will be long past his prime when that is complete. I would bring him back next season and hopes he crushes early, and then trade him before the trade deadline passes. Saquon would be very appreciative to finally get on an NFL team with real playoff and super bowl aspirations.
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Post by DandyDon on Oct 3, 2020 10:09:59 GMT -5
The Giants are facing a new rebuild effort with a new coach, GM, and QB and Saquon will be long past his prime when that is complete. I would bring him back next season and hopes he crushes early, and then trade him before the trade deadline passes. Saquon would be very appreciative to finally get on an NFL team with real playoff and super bowl aspirations. Well, hes under contract and injured. Bringing him back next season isnt an option. |
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Post by TEM on Oct 3, 2020 11:32:58 GMT -5
I completely understand your rationale but if gettleman did that and got 4 picks for barkley 3 of 4 would be horrible . I believe that 1 very talented player is better than 2-3 average players .. That looks like two excellent opportunities for one player who has now been hurt for more than half his short career.. That is nothing more than a never confirmed rumor. Elway never said they called the Giants FO about the pick. If Denver wanted the pick. What was Elway doing for the 100 days between the Super bowl and the time the Giants were on the clock? Understand Elway has never been hush hush. This is Elway's own words about the 2019 draft. ( quoted) 247sports.com/nfl/new-york-giants/Article/Giants-Draft-2019-trade-Broncos-Josh-Allen-131635977/"Broncos general manager John Elway told him that the Giants were one of three teams in trade talks with the Broncos for the No. 10 overall pick before they eventually decided to deal the draft spot to the Pittsburgh Steelers.
"Denver had the Giants and Falcons on the phone during the trade with Pittsburgh," King said. "The Giants made a competitive offer, Elway said, but not as good at Pittsburgh’s."
It's unclear who the Giants were targeting at No. 10 overall if they were able to complete the trade with the Broncos. Shortly after the Giants selected Jones at No. 6,"Now if he was so candid with the #10 pick in the 2019 draft as it pretains to the Giants. If the rumor was true about Denver wanting the #2 pick in the 2018 draft . Why not come out and say it after the draft? Because it is complete BS. |
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Post by Jomo on Oct 3, 2020 11:38:11 GMT -5
It was a mistake by our GM, poor strategic timing to select any running back with this team.
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Post by McCherry on Oct 3, 2020 11:42:32 GMT -5
Saquon is a monster when he has even the slightest bit of blocking to support him. That’s a fact. But he's not very durable, and we don't know how this injury will affect his speed and quickness. |
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Post by tuckrule on Oct 3, 2020 11:46:54 GMT -5
The Giants are facing a new rebuild effort with a new coach, GM, and QB and Saquon will be long past his prime when that is complete. I would bring him back next season and hopes he crushes early, and then trade him before the trade deadline passes. Saquon would be very appreciative to finally get on an NFL team with real playoff and super bowl aspirations. Where in the world do you come up with this crap. A totally "NEW REBUILD" WOW you are either a Genius or extremely Delusional. I will go with the latter. I have heard some outlandish stuff in the past but this one take them all. Now let me tell you, we are not in a totally new rebuild, we are still in the original rebuild. Barkley isn't getting traded now or later on in the next season. There as of this time isn't and New Coach coming we have a New Coach in Judge, nothing has been said about Gettleman getting fired as of today, and We have our QB His name is Daniel Jones, and rumors have it that the Giants FO really like him alot. They arent happy with the Turnovers and have said they will get that straightened out So please explain to me where in the world you get this stuff from. Or is it you have an inside track to the NY Giants FO and have all this information from them. If you do in fact have this inside tract to the Giants, your not long for this job. Joe Judge has stated that Leaks from anyone in the Organization will not be tolerated. So please explain your position |
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Post by TheAnalyst on Oct 3, 2020 12:01:30 GMT -5
It was a mistake by our GM, poor strategic timing to select any running back with this team. I would have been ok with a RB in the 2nd round. |
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Post by Kruunch on Oct 3, 2020 12:06:54 GMT -5
With Barkley we bought a Ferrari when our house needed a complete renovation. So now, we have the best car on the block, but we’re living in our brothers guest room.
Gettleman fell in love with Barkley, it was Barkley or bust with him. Once the Browns selected Mayfield, the Giants would have broke the sound barrier with how fast they ran to the podium.
I don’t need to tell you how great he is, that seems to be the standard requirement when speaking about Barkley. Since we drafted him, we continue to lose. Blame the offensive line, the GM, the head coach. Doesn’t matter, our record is an abominable 9-26 since he landed in our laps. And now he’s injured, talk about getting kicked in the balls not once but twice.
At some point the Giants have to make some tough decisions. Are we willing to pay a kings ransom to retain Barkley? Or do we cut our losses and trade him? Either way, we end up with the shit end of the stick. Memo to the future GM of the Giants. (Kevin Abrams) build your team around your QB, build the trenches on both sides of the ball. And invest heavily on edge rushers and receivers. This is a passing league, only way to combat that is to attack the QB and have play maker receivers of your own.
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Post by McCherry on Oct 3, 2020 13:05:02 GMT -5
With Barkley we bought a Ferrari when our house needed a complete renovation. So now, we have the best car on the block, but we’re living in our brothers guest room. Gettleman fell in love with Barkley, it was Barkley or bust with him. Once the Browns selected Mayfield, the Giants would have broke the sound barrier with how fast they ran to the podium. I don’t need to tell you how great he is, that seems to be the standard requirement when speaking about Barkley. Since we drafted him, we continue to lose. Blame the offensive line, the GM, the head coach. Doesn’t matter, our record is an abominable 9-26 since he landed in our laps. And now he’s injured, talk about getting kicked in the balls not once but twice. At some point the Giants have to make some tough decisions. Are we willing to pay a kings ransom to retain Barkley? Or do we cut our losses and trade him? Either way, we end up with the shit end of the stick. Memo to the future GM of the Giants. (Kevin Abrams) build your team around your QB, build the trenches on both sides of the ball. And invest heavily on edge rushers and receivers. This is a passing league, only way to combat that is to attack the QB and have play maker receivers of your own. Contract extensions, trades... You guys are discussing Barkley's future when he hasn't even had surgery yet. How about we see what kind of player he is if he returns? |
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Post by Kruunch on Oct 3, 2020 13:11:52 GMT -5
With Barkley we bought a Ferrari when our house needed a complete renovation. So now, we have the best car on the block, but we’re living in our brothers guest room. Gettleman fell in love with Barkley, it was Barkley or bust with him. Once the Browns selected Mayfield, the Giants would have broke the sound barrier with how fast they ran to the podium. I don’t need to tell you how great he is, that seems to be the standard requirement when speaking about Barkley. Since we drafted him, we continue to lose. Blame the offensive line, the GM, the head coach. Doesn’t matter, our record is an abominable 9-26 since he landed in our laps. And now he’s injured, talk about getting kicked in the balls not once but twice. At some point the Giants have to make some tough decisions. Are we willing to pay a kings ransom to retain Barkley? Or do we cut our losses and trade him? Either way, we end up with the shit end of the stick. Memo to the future GM of the Giants. (Kevin Abrams) build your team around your QB, build the trenches on both sides of the ball. And invest heavily on edge rushers and receivers. This is a passing league, only way to combat that is to attack the QB and have play maker receivers of your own. Contract extensions, trades... You guys are discussing Barkley's future when he hasn't even had surgery yet. How about we see what kind of player he is if he returns? You guys? Who are these “guys” you speak of? I’m speaking of that the Giants have to make some decisions sooner than later. Or would you rather speak about the stinkier he had against the Steelers? Right now, he’s injured. Again. We constantly lose with him, it’s a fair discussion right now. The only ones who disagree are the fans who have their collective heads up his ass. |
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Post by McCherry on Oct 3, 2020 13:29:10 GMT -5
Contract extensions, trades... You guys are discussing Barkley's future when he hasn't even had surgery yet. How about we see what kind of player he is if he returns? You guys? Who are these “guys” you speak of? I’m speaking of that the Giants have to make some decisions sooner than later. Or would you rather speak about the stinkier he had against the Steelers? Right now, he’s injured. Again. We constantly lose with him, it’s a fair discussion right now. The only ones who disagree are the fans who have their collective heads up his ass. They don't have to make any decisions about Barkley's future for a long time. Right now he's irrelevant to this team. |
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Post by Kruunch on Oct 3, 2020 13:43:48 GMT -5
You guys? Who are these “guys” you speak of? I’m speaking of that the Giants have to make some decisions sooner than later. Or would you rather speak about the stinkier he had against the Steelers? Right now, he’s injured. Again. We constantly lose with him, it’s a fair discussion right now. The only ones who disagree are the fans who have their collective heads up his ass. They don't have to make any decisions about Barkley's future for a long time. Right now he's irrelevant to this team. He’s been irrelevant for two years now. If the season goes as bad as it’s going, every player on the team will be evaluated. |
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Post by TheAnalyst on Oct 3, 2020 14:05:45 GMT -5
They don't have to make any decisions about Barkley's future for a long time. Right now he's irrelevant to this team. He’s been irrelevant for two years now. If the season goes as bad as it’s going, every player on the team will be evaluated. They should be. I think I'd only keep about 5. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 3, 2020 15:00:07 GMT -5
I wish the Giants had blocked for him. I sincerely think hes shellshocked, tentative, and thus hesitant on the line of scrimmage.
I cringed last year when right after his injury shurmur sent him barreling straight into the pile with noone clearing a path, over and over again. Its little talked about but he got absolutely leveled last year, took some really hard hits.
This year I saw much the same, give him the ball and by himself against the whole line.
I agree with much of the assessment about him many are saying here but we certainly have not helped the situation with playcalling.
If this team ever gets it together, perhaps we try him more as a sitiational back, find a real beast to carry the heavier load through the pile
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Post by giantlegacy on Oct 3, 2020 15:05:51 GMT -5
I wish the Giants had blocked for him. I sincerely think hes shellshocked, tentative, and thus hesitant on the line of scrimmage. I cringed last year when right after his injury shurmur sent him barreling straight into the pile with noone clearing a path, over and over again. Its little talked about but he got absolutely leveled last year, took some really hard hits. This year I saw much the same, give him the ball and by himself against the whole line. I agree with much of the assessment about him many are saying here but we certainly have not helped the situation with playcalling. If this team ever gets it together, perhaps we try him more as a sitiational back, find a real beast to carry the heavier load through the pile Barkley is 230 lbs he more can carry the load (same size and almost same body type as Earl Campbell) |
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Post by Jomo on Oct 3, 2020 17:05:29 GMT -5
It was a mistake by our GM, poor strategic timing to select any running back with this team. I would have been ok with a RB in the 2nd round. I am good with that. |
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