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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2021 18:16:21 GMT -5
That's really the only 1st round situation I see. Anything else will force me to reexamine who DG is.
Pick Smith in our spot or trade down in the 1st for Bateman.
This is a hill I built on my own and I'm willing to die on it...
PS - Bookmark this post
PS #2 - I still feel a way about McKinney over Denzel Mims in round 2. Ok I'm done now.
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Post by Kase1 on Feb 24, 2021 18:42:07 GMT -5
Well it all depends who is left on the board when we pick at 11 and depends what we get back for our trade down
Give me more hypothetical details and I'll give you an opinion
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Post by thetruth on Feb 24, 2021 18:44:37 GMT -5
That's really the only 1st round situation I see. Anything else will force me to reexamine who DG is. Pick Smith in our spot or trade down in the 1st for Bateman. This is a hill I built on my own and I'm willing to die on it... PS - Bookmark this post PS #2 - I still feel a way about McKinney over Denzel Mims in round 2. Ok I'm done now. I may be a minority on this but taking Bateman at #11 is not a reach for me Unlike Smith, I haven't seen Bateman getting mauled as an X, so theres that.
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Post by McCherry on Feb 24, 2021 18:47:30 GMT -5
There's the top 3 then there's round 2. Bateman isn't in this conversation.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2021 18:51:46 GMT -5
There's the top 3 then there's round 2. Bateman isn't in this conversation. Time will tell. I see Bateman as the J. Jefferson, and Smith as the C.D. Lamb of this draft, imo of course. Both will be great.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2021 18:53:14 GMT -5
That's really the only 1st round situation I see. Anything else will force me to reexamine who DG is. Pick Smith in our spot or trade down in the 1st for Bateman. This is a hill I built on my own and I'm willing to die on it... PS - Bookmark this post PS #2 - I still feel a way about McKinney over Denzel Mims in round 2. Ok I'm done now. I may be a minority on this but taking Bateman at #11 is not a reach for me Unlike Smith, I haven't seen Bateman getting mauled as an X, so theres that. Bateman only makes sense if we trade down.
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Post by thetruth on Feb 24, 2021 18:54:05 GMT -5
Excellent podcast with two people that know what they're talking about when it comes to scouting. Listen to their take on the WRs
Ignore the gross logo. Greg Cosell is the best in the business. Bateman talk @~15 mins in. Compares him to Micheal Thomas and Allen Robinson
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Post by thetruth on Feb 24, 2021 18:57:45 GMT -5
I may be a minority on this but taking Bateman at #11 is not a reach for me Unlike Smith, I haven't seen Bateman getting mauled as an X, so theres that. Bateman only makes sense if we trade down. Him and Chase are the only WR that dont struggle press, we dont have an X right now. The Alabama kids are playing Z or slot.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2021 18:57:54 GMT -5
Excellent podcast with two people that know what they're talking about when it comes to scouting. Listen to their take on the WRs Ignore the gross logo. Greg Cosell is the best in the business Listening now.
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Post by McCherry on Feb 24, 2021 19:00:43 GMT -5
There's the top 3 then there's round 2. Bateman isn't in this conversation. Time will tell. I see Bateman as the J. Jefferson, and Smith as the C.D. Lamb of this draft, imo of course. Both will be great. Bateman is bigger with fans than the scouts. He isn't even the 4th best receiver on a lot of big boards. I've seen Toney and Stevenson rated higher. Personally I prefer Marshall and Collins in RD 2 and taking the BPA at 11.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2021 19:07:48 GMT -5
Time will tell. I see Bateman as the J. Jefferson, and Smith as the C.D. Lamb of this draft, imo of course. Both will be great. Bateman is bigger with fans than the scouts. He isn't even the 4th best receiver on a lot of big boards. I've seen Toney and Stevenson rated higher. Personally I prefer Marshall and Collins in RD 2 and taking the BPA at 11. Every board is different and I have Bateman @ WR #4 for whatever thats worth.
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Post by McCherry on Feb 24, 2021 19:11:34 GMT -5
Bateman is bigger with fans than the scouts. He isn't even the 4th best receiver on a lot of big boards. I've seen Toney and Stevenson rated higher. Personally I prefer Marshall and Collins in RD 2 and taking the BPA at 11. Every board is different and I have Bateman @ WR #4 for whatever thats worth. It’s worth very little... Not that I don't respect your opinion
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Post by thetruth on Feb 24, 2021 19:12:49 GMT -5
Bateman is bigger with fans than the scouts. He isn't even the 4th best receiver on a lot of big boards. I've seen Toney and Stevenson rated higher. Personally I prefer Marshall and Collins in RD 2 and taking the BPA at 11. Every board is different and I have Bateman @ WR #4 for whatever thats worth. Me too, but none of these boards matter come April. Thats all these big boards scramble to change when the NFL starts giving hints to their big boards. Jefferson was taken #4 last year but easily should have gone #1. Hope we can avoid that issue and take one of the best prospects at their position, Gettlemen has a habit of taking the 4th best prospect above his peers.
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Post by piddy283 on Feb 24, 2021 19:16:11 GMT -5
Seems like an odd hill to die on. Of the big 4, Smith and Waddle actually scare me the most. Bateman isn't even on my radar, although I've started to hear his name from other posters more and more recently. I'll need to brush up.
Trading down hasn't been discussed much, but it's not completely out of the question. There are a few players I'd have a hard time passing up, but all things being equal I'm all for trading down.
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Post by fifthavephil on Feb 24, 2021 19:36:02 GMT -5
I have liked Bateman for two years. Catches with his hands and has size and is physical . He knows how to get open. Though, Giants can trade down ( in teens ] and get Bateman . Take ( hopefully ) second round pick acquired in trade. Trade up to late first round to get K. Toney ( Florida ). Toney has acceleration equal ( or better ) then Waddle or Smith Toney is 5ft 11.5 inch.
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Post by giantlegacy on Feb 24, 2021 19:37:45 GMT -5
Excellent podcast with two people that know what they're talking about when it comes to scouting. Listen to their take on the WRs Ignore the gross logo. Greg Cosell is the best in the business. Bateman talk @~15 mins in. Compares him to Micheal Thomas and Allen Robinson He has something Robinson and Thomas doesn't have Post catch ability and deep speed To me he looks like Justin Jefferson
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2021 20:09:01 GMT -5
Excellent podcast with two people that know what they're talking about when it comes to scouting. Listen to their take on the WRs Ignore the gross logo. Greg Cosell is the best in the business. Bateman talk @~15 mins in. Compares him to Micheal Thomas and Allen Robinson He has something Robinson and Thomas doesn't have Post catch ability and deep speed To me he looks like Justin Jefferson Respectfully, Robinson & Thomas are elite for a reason. They have major skills you only see vs. NFL talent. I'd never say a college player has abilities that an NFL doesn't have until I see him week 1 in the NFL. Thomas and Robinson are two of the most gifted WRs in the league right now.
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Post by giantlegacy on Feb 24, 2021 20:19:20 GMT -5
He has something Robinson and Thomas doesn't have Post catch ability and deep speed To me he looks like Justin Jefferson Respectfully, Robinson & Thomas are elite for a reason. They have major skills you only see vs. NFL talent. I'd never say a college player has abilities that an NFL doesn't have until I see him week 1 in the NFL. Thomas and Robinson are two of the most gifted WRs in the league right now. If you like possession recievers that don't force defenses to have to defend the entire field sure..
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Feb 24, 2021 21:04:23 GMT -5
Well it all depends who is left on the board when we pick at 11 and depends what we get back for our trade down Give me more hypothetical details and I'll give you an opinion If Parsons or fro some freak reason Sewell fell they can stay put draft one of them and still get value in round 2 from what I'm reading Bateman might make it down there.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2021 21:12:09 GMT -5
Respectfully, Robinson & Thomas are elite for a reason. They have major skills you only see vs. NFL talent. I'd never say a college player has abilities that an NFL doesn't have until I see him week 1 in the NFL. Thomas and Robinson are two of the most gifted WRs in the league right now. If you like possession recievers that don't force defenses to have to defend the entire field sure.. Great possesion receivers force you to have a skilled corner that can cover. Its not always about the entire field... ... and if you're in our division with a weak secondary the scheme will exploit that twice a year. ie Plax, Nicks, Cruz, Smith Jr. Side note.. we need Allen Robinson in blue at whatever cost.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 24, 2021 21:25:11 GMT -5
Well it all depends who is left on the board when we pick at 11 and depends what we get back for our trade down Give me more hypothetical details and I'll give you an opinion If Parsons or fro some freak reason Sewell fell they can stay put draft one of them and still get value in round 2 from what I'm reading Bateman might make it down there. This take is the equivalent of the Knicks not trading up above Golden State for Curry because they felt comfortable 'seeing what happens' in the draft. Na, get the guy you want, by any means necessary.
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Post by giantlegacy on Feb 24, 2021 21:29:34 GMT -5
If you like possession recievers that don't force defenses to have to defend the entire field sure.. Great possesion receivers force you to have a skilled corner that can cover. Its not always about the entire field... ... and if you're in our division with a weak secondary the scheme will exploit that twice a year. ie Plax, Nicks, Cruz, Smith Jr. Side note.. we need Allen Robinson in blue at whatever cost. Modern NFL requires you to have playmakers to force the defense to have to defend the entire field,which opens up the underneath to tbe run If this does not happen teams can sit in a shallow zone and run blitz all day And no I do not want to pay 18 million a year for an overglorified possession reciever that is going to be 28 and start to slow down. Nicks and Cruz were dynamic playmakers that threatened the entire field...if we had even am average O line Bradshaw would have added 1200 yards on the ground to the nearly 5K in the air
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Feb 24, 2021 21:53:06 GMT -5
If Parsons or fro some freak reason Sewell fell they can stay put draft one of them and still get value in round 2 from what I'm reading Bateman might make it down there. This take is the equivalent of the Knicks not trading up above Golden State for Curry because they felt comfortable 'seeing what happens' in the draft. Na, get the guy you want, by any means necessary. I would say right now if you can get the best at any position to come out in the last 10 15 years which Sewell is for his position you get that card up there with in 5 seconds. Parsons can be the a lot like Devon white. If Smith or Chase Waddle Pittman are there you go with need and value but can't pass on a guy like Sewell. In reality most likely Sewell Smith Pittman and chase possibly will be gone and maybe even Waddle.
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Post by McCherry on Feb 24, 2021 21:55:43 GMT -5
Great possesion receivers force you to have a skilled corner that can cover. Its not always about the entire field... ... and if you're in our division with a weak secondary the scheme will exploit that twice a year. ie Plax, Nicks, Cruz, Smith Jr. Side note.. we need Allen Robinson in blue at whatever cost. Modern NFL requires you to have playmakers to force the defense to have to defend the entire field,which opens up the underneath to tbe run If this does not happen teams can sit in a shallow zone and run blitz all day And no I do not want to pay 18 million a year for an overglorified possession reciever that is going to be 28 and start to slow down. Nicks and Cruz were dynamic playmakers that threatened the entire field...if we had even am average O line Bradshaw would have added 1200 yards on the ground to the nearly 5K in the air In the last 2 seasons Robinson has 200 receptions, 2400 yards, 13 TD’s at over 12 yards per catch. That’s as dominant as anyone who’s played the position. Label him what you want, he doesn’t stretch the field, he tears it a new ass.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 1:19:04 GMT -5
Great possesion receivers force you to have a skilled corner that can cover. Its not always about the entire field... ... and if you're in our division with a weak secondary the scheme will exploit that twice a year. ie Plax, Nicks, Cruz, Smith Jr. Side note.. we need Allen Robinson in blue at whatever cost. Modern NFL requires you to have playmakers to force the defense to have to defend the entire field,which opens up the underneath to tbe run If this does not happen teams can sit in a shallow zone and run blitz all day And no I do not want to pay 18 million a year for an overglorified possession reciever that is going to be 28 and start to slow down. Nicks and Cruz were dynamic playmakers that threatened the entire field...if we had even am average O line Bradshaw would have added 1200 yards on the ground to the nearly 5K in the air You can have both, or multiples of the same. Toomer, Plax, Smith Jr.. (all possession guys)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 1:20:56 GMT -5
This take is the equivalent of the Knicks not trading up above Golden State for Curry because they felt comfortable 'seeing what happens' in the draft. Na, get the guy you want, by any means necessary. I would say right now if you can get the best at any position to come out in the last 10 15 years which Sewell is for his position you get that card up there with in 5 seconds. Parsons can be the a lot like Devon white. If Smith or Chase Waddle Pittman are there you go with need and value but can't pass on a guy like Sewell. In reality most likely Sewell Smith Pittman and chase possibly will be gone and maybe even Waddle. Problem is, we need WRs more than we need LBs. 5 years ago, sure, let's get Parsons. Not in 2021 though.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 25, 2021 1:27:58 GMT -5
Modern NFL requires you to have playmakers to force the defense to have to defend the entire field,which opens up the underneath to tbe run If this does not happen teams can sit in a shallow zone and run blitz all day And no I do not want to pay 18 million a year for an overglorified possession reciever that is going to be 28 and start to slow down. Nicks and Cruz were dynamic playmakers that threatened the entire field...if we had even am average O line Bradshaw would have added 1200 yards on the ground to the nearly 5K in the air In the last 2 seasons Robinson has 200 receptions, 2400 yards, 13 TD’s at over 12 yards per catch. That’s as dominant as anyone who’s played the position. Label him what you want, he doesn’t stretch the field, he tears it a new ass. This post is like replacing the moon with the sun. Shine light on what really matters! Regardless of your "feelings". Robinson is a 💎 and if that doesn't make sense to you... my condolences.
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Post by giantlegacy on Feb 25, 2021 4:39:40 GMT -5
Modern NFL requires you to have playmakers to force the defense to have to defend the entire field,which opens up the underneath to tbe run If this does not happen teams can sit in a shallow zone and run blitz all day And no I do not want to pay 18 million a year for an overglorified possession reciever that is going to be 28 and start to slow down. Nicks and Cruz were dynamic playmakers that threatened the entire field...if we had even am average O line Bradshaw would have added 1200 yards on the ground to the nearly 5K in the air You can have both, or multiples of the same. Toomer, Plax, Smith Jr.. (all possession guys) That was also 14 years ago and Plax was a deep threat that threatened all areas of the field Look how our offense took off to the next level once we got actual.dynamic threats I'm 2009 with Nicks and Manningham and then with Cruz It's a different game now ,all your good offenses have multiple players that can threaten the entire field to force defenses to have to defend them,even Tennessee (which is why Henry had so much room tbis year),which is why if anyone if rather cave Corey Davis and maybe Elkridge day 2 if we can't get one of the big 4. A possession reciever as a starter makes tbe entire offense easier to defend
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Post by giantlegacy on Feb 25, 2021 4:40:10 GMT -5
In the last 2 seasons Robinson has 200 receptions, 2400 yards, 13 TD’s at over 12 yards per catch. That’s as dominant as anyone who’s played the position. Label him what you want, he doesn’t stretch the field, he tears it a new ass. This post is like replacing the moon with the sun. Shine light on what really matters! Regardless of your "feelings". Robinson is a 💎 and if that doesn't make sense to you... my condolences. I respect your opinion
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Post by giantlegacy on Feb 25, 2021 4:44:14 GMT -5
Modern NFL requires you to have playmakers to force the defense to have to defend the entire field,which opens up the underneath to tbe run If this does not happen teams can sit in a shallow zone and run blitz all day And no I do not want to pay 18 million a year for an overglorified possession reciever that is going to be 28 and start to slow down. Nicks and Cruz were dynamic playmakers that threatened the entire field...if we had even am average O line Bradshaw would have added 1200 yards on the ground to the nearly 5K in the air In the last 2 seasons Robinson has 200 receptions, 2400 yards, 13 TD’s at over 12 yards per catch. That’s as dominant as anyone who’s played the position. Label him what you want, he doesn’t stretch the field, he tears it a new ass. And? Those numbers were inflated because he was their only target He never takes over games to the point of the defense having to sell out to stop him He is a notch below Amari Cooper if that and wants to be paid like him(who is also horribly overpaid for his production) Let some other team make this terrible mistake
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