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Post by McCherry on Apr 11, 2021 20:21:38 GMT -5
"We already have a great RB - Paul Perkins" and "Dalvin Tomlinson is more important to re-sign than Leonard Wiliams" are 2 of your gems. Where did the Giants rank in scoring defense in 2020? Who was their #1 "edge" rusher? Kyler Fackrell? Yeah, exactly. The job of OLBs in this scheme is to CONTAIN, not get up the field to chase sacks. The Giants are about to field a Top 5 Defense in 2021 with Ryan Anderson as their #1 "edge rusher". OLB is the least important position on this defense and it isn't even remotely close. The opposing QB’s the Giants faced were pathetic last. Over half were backups. The Giants faced 10 starting QB's in 2020, not counting Washington only because who is their starter? and Dak Prescott who was hurt in the 3rd quarter of week 5. Either way, you're not right.
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Post by Kruunch on Apr 11, 2021 20:54:23 GMT -5
The opposing QB’s the Giants faced were pathetic last. Over half were backups. The Giants faced 10 starting QB's in 2020, not counting Washington only because who is their starter? and Dak Prescott who was hurt in the 3rd quarter of week 5. Either way, you're not right. The only good/great quarterback we beat last year was Russell Wilson. Other than him we beat the likes of Andy Dalton, Carson Wentz, whomever was playing for Washington, and the extremely talented Brandon Allen.
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Post by McCherry on Apr 11, 2021 20:56:32 GMT -5
The Giants faced 10 starting QB's in 2020, not counting Washington only because who is their starter? and Dak Prescott who was hurt in the 3rd quarter of week 5. Either way, you're not right. The only good/great quarterback we beat last year was Russell Wilson. Other than him we beat the likes of Andy Dalton, Carson Wentz, whomever was playing for Washington, and the extremely talented Brandon Allen. Should've beaten Brady. The majority of this forum cried that the refs beat us. They were probably right, we certainly outplayed those bums.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2021 7:01:26 GMT -5
The Giants faced 10 starting QB's in 2020, not counting Washington only because who is their starter? and Dak Prescott who was hurt in the 3rd quarter of week 5. Either way, you're not right. The only good/great quarterback we beat last year was Russell Wilson. Other than him we beat the likes of Andy Dalton, Carson Wentz, whomever was playing for Washington, and the extremely talented Brandon Allen. Giants need more help than some of these fans think and they better start beating some of the better teams next year!!
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 12, 2021 7:58:35 GMT -5
It really doesn't matter most teams do both and in the end it is still football same principals, I think a base 3-4 gives you more opportunity to be versatile. If the decision makers coaches GM and director of scouting are on the same page getting smart versatile players I think you can squeeze more different body types into the base 3-4. Just my humble opinion. also once you have this smart versatile players in all different shapes and sizes you can play football using both odd and even fronts.
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Post by bizcliz on Apr 12, 2021 8:02:14 GMT -5
I think Graham does a really good job calling plays and using coverage variations. I'm not sure the front 7 matters as much. I do like that running a 3-4 lends itself to being more multiple in terms of what you do up front, but that's more based on the talent we have up there.
Doesn't matter, working well, I enjoy the creativity.
Plus the AMOEBA defense looks pretty cool
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 12, 2021 8:06:24 GMT -5
The Giants faced 10 starting QB's in 2020, not counting Washington only because who is their starter? and Dak Prescott who was hurt in the 3rd quarter of week 5. Either way, you're not right. The only good/great quarterback we beat last year was Russell Wilson. Other than him we beat the likes of Andy Dalton, Carson Wentz, whomever was playing for Washington, and the extremely talented Brandon Allen. Our defense kept most teams down our problem was our offense score points catch balls and the wins might out number the losses. This is a thread with the subject being defense only reason I bring this up. It's never simple if the defense takes a step back and offense takes a step forward we can very well be in the same position this year playing close high scoring games where last team with the ball wins. Hopefully not we did that song and dance for a couple of years near the end of TCs tenure.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 12, 2021 8:13:56 GMT -5
Luxury, not a necessity. Luxury, not a necessity. Luxury, not a necessity. Luxury, not a necessity. Luxury, not a necessity. I guess I have to keep repeating myself for you to get it. your view has its merits but its certainly not the "be all end all" in a defensive roster for a 3-4. i like the Idea of waves of guys like we had with Osi Tuck Stra. I have accepted that Judges Philosophy might be more inline with what BB does he survives with good pass rushers when he had a top tear guy in Jones he traded him before he had to pay him. If you have 2 or 3 good versatile guys who can get to the QB and a top tear secondary your gonna win more then you lose on defense.
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Post by Kruunch on Apr 12, 2021 8:27:35 GMT -5
The only good/great quarterback we beat last year was Russell Wilson. Other than him we beat the likes of Andy Dalton, Carson Wentz, whomever was playing for Washington, and the extremely talented Brandon Allen. Our defense kept most teams down our problem was our offense score points catch balls and the wins might out number the losses. This is a thread with the subject being defense only reason I bring this up. It's never simple if the defense takes a step back and offense takes a step forward we can very well be in the same position this year playing close high scoring games where last team with the ball wins. Hopefully not we did that song and dance for a couple of years near the end of TCs tenure. We all know our offense was pathetic last season. Point was, we didn’t beat a single good quarterback not named Russell Wilson last year. Look over the past few seasons, beating Wilson’s Seahawks was our super bowl.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 12, 2021 8:28:18 GMT -5
The opposing QB’s the Giants faced were pathetic last. Over half were backups. The Giants faced 10 starting QB's in 2020, not counting Washington only because who is their starter? and Dak Prescott who was hurt in the 3rd quarter of week 5. Either way, you're not right. Mike - take a break
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 12, 2021 8:43:24 GMT -5
Our defense kept most teams down our problem was our offense score points catch balls and the wins might out number the losses. This is a thread with the subject being defense only reason I bring this up. It's never simple if the defense takes a step back and offense takes a step forward we can very well be in the same position this year playing close high scoring games where last team with the ball wins. Hopefully not we did that song and dance for a couple of years near the end of TCs tenure. We all know our offense was pathetic last season. Point was, we didn’t beat a single good quarterback not named Russell Wilson last year. Look over the past few seasons, beating Wilson’s Seahawks was our super bowl. I agree but as i said I think had more to do with the team not being able to score being this is a defense subject I thought the defense kept us in against almost every QB we faced Jacksons legs killed Thats all I'm saying. The Giants have been the heavy bag for the league since mid 2012 during that time some was putrid offense some was putrid defense last year just happened to be putrid offense. Gotta be tough to be a Giants fan over the last 8 to 9 years they have lost in every way possible and mostly ugly either getting blown out when it is the defense or playing last one with the ball wins and for the Giants back then it was don't leave more then 20 seconds on the clock or you will lose.
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Post by TheAnalyst on Apr 12, 2021 8:55:50 GMT -5
your view has its merits but its certainly not the "be all end all" in a defensive roster for a 3-4. i like the Idea of waves of guys like we had with Osi Tuck Stra. I have accepted that Judges Philosophy might be more inline with what BB does he survives with good pass rushers when he had a top tear guy in Jones he traded him before he had to pay him. If you have 2 or 3 good versatile guys who can get to the QB and a top tear secondary your gonna win more then you lose on defense. Im fine with a rotation of pass rushers getting to the QB. Our rotation of edge rushers is pretty weak. The issue I am taking up is the false claim that the edge pass rush is unimportant on our defense. It is important. It is very helpful. Getting a great one (or several very god ones) would boost this teams defense tremendously. One pass rusher on the outside who can consistently get to the QB would not only help out the middle DT/DEs pushing, but also the secondary. Big time. In the 4-3 or the 3-4 or a mix. Its honestly sad this needs to be explained to Giants fans.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 12, 2021 9:13:50 GMT -5
i like the Idea of waves of guys like we had with Osi Tuck Stra. I have accepted that Judges Philosophy might be more inline with what BB does he survives with good pass rushers when he had a top tear guy in Jones he traded him before he had to pay him. If you have 2 or 3 good versatile guys who can get to the QB and a top tear secondary your gonna win more then you lose on defense. Im fine with a rotation of pass rushers getting to the QB. Our rotation of edge rushers is pretty weak. The issue I am taking up is the false claim that the edge pass rush is unimportant on our defense. It is important. It is very helpful. Getting a great one (or several very god ones) would boost this teams defense tremendously. One pass rusher on the outside who can consistently get to the QB would not only help out the middle DT/DEs pushing, but also the secondary. Big time. In the 4-3 or the 3-4 or a mix. Its honestly sad this needs to be explained to Giants fans. lol - it actually doesn't need to be explained to Giants/Football fans.
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Post by McCherry on Apr 12, 2021 9:27:54 GMT -5
The Giants faced 10 starting QB's in 2020, not counting Washington only because who is their starter? and Dak Prescott who was hurt in the 3rd quarter of week 5. Either way, you're not right. Mike - take a break The truth shall set you free.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 12, 2021 9:46:40 GMT -5
The truth shall set you free. So does stepping out and away from the internet to see the sky once a month. Ben - first game in over a year. Torched defense 2nd half Trubinsky is backup who happened to start Mullens is 3rd string Goff - they traded him he was so inconsistent Dallas twice - Dak went down after leading he Boys to 24 points Washington twice lol Philly twice - they traded Wentz they were so disgusted Tampa - Brady on a new team which pulled it together in Dec Cincy - backup Seattle - an actual win against a good QB +1 Az - torched by a smurf Browns - Baker with no issues Baltimore - smoked Whew - 6 wins vs those Gunslingers.
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Post by TheAnalyst on Apr 12, 2021 9:56:18 GMT -5
Im fine with a rotation of pass rushers getting to the QB. Our rotation of edge rushers is pretty weak. The issue I am taking up is the false claim that the edge pass rush is unimportant on our defense. It is important. It is very helpful. Getting a great one (or several very god ones) would boost this teams defense tremendously. One pass rusher on the outside who can consistently get to the QB would not only help out the middle DT/DEs pushing, but also the secondary. Big time. In the 4-3 or the 3-4 or a mix. Its honestly sad this needs to be explained to Giants fans. lol - it actually doesn't need to be explained to Giants/Football fans. It appears to have to be explained for some.
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Post by McCherry on Apr 12, 2021 10:09:07 GMT -5
The truth shall set you free. So does stepping out and away from the internet to see the sky once a month. Ben - first game in over a year. Torched defense 2nd half Trubinsky is backup who happened to start Mullens is 3rd string Goff - they traded him he was so inconsistent Dallas twice - Dak went down after leading he Boys to 24 points Washington twice lol Philly twice - they traded Wentz they were so disgusted Tampa - Brady on a new team which pulled it together in Dec Cincy - backup Seattle - an actual win against a good QB +1 Az - torched by a smurf Browns - Baker with no issues Baltimore - smoked Whew - 6 wins vs those Gunslingers.
I agree. I'm not arguing the talent level of the QB's we faced, just the number of starters. You could look at any teams schedule and see that no one faces 16 All Pro QB's every year. You play the schedule you're given, next year we play even a lesser talented group of QB's. It won't take away from anything we accomplish. In our division we face one good QB, it is what it is.
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Post by Blue Hulk on Apr 12, 2021 11:39:42 GMT -5
We dont have the right LBs yet for the 3-4 IMO. Who will be our guy off the edge and can drop back? We need one of those good players. 4-3 we had Strahan, Osi, Tuck, JPP, Kiwi... 3-4 we have Lorenzo Carter, Ximines, Carter Coughlin, Cam Brown... I like some of these guys but none are anywhere near the level of play the guys in the 4-3 days were on the edge. We have the perfect LB's for 3-4... Lorenzo Carter is athletic enough to drop into coverage and so it Tae Crowder. Our LB's are the most athletic group we've had in a long time...and u still don't see it?
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Post by TheAnalyst on Apr 12, 2021 11:47:38 GMT -5
We dont have the right LBs yet for the 3-4 IMO. Who will be our guy off the edge and can drop back? We need one of those good players. 4-3 we had Strahan, Osi, Tuck, JPP, Kiwi... 3-4 we have Lorenzo Carter, Ximines, Carter Coughlin, Cam Brown... I like some of these guys but none are anywhere near the level of play the guys in the 4-3 days were on the edge. We have the perfect LB's for 3-4... Lorenzo Carter is athletic enough to drop into coverage and so it Tae Crowder. Our LB's are the most athletic group we've had in a long time...and u still don't see it? Im losing faith in Carter the past year or 2. This is year 4. Sure, he is athletic, but he isnt doing much with it. Same with Ximines. I like Tae Crowder in the middle. I like Carter Coughlin on the edge. I like these guys. They are athletic. But we don't have greatness on the edge is what I was saying. I want that one guy teams need to prepare for. Thats what I meant by saying we dont have the right LBs yet. No household names.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Apr 12, 2021 11:54:28 GMT -5
i like the Idea of waves of guys like we had with Osi Tuck Stra. I have accepted that Judges Philosophy might be more inline with what BB does he survives with good pass rushers when he had a top tear guy in Jones he traded him before he had to pay him. If you have 2 or 3 good versatile guys who can get to the QB and a top tear secondary your gonna win more then you lose on defense. Im fine with a rotation of pass rushers getting to the QB. Our rotation of edge rushers is pretty weak. The issue I am taking up is the false claim that the edge pass rush is unimportant on our defense. It is important. It is very helpful. Getting a great one (or several very god ones) would boost this teams defense tremendously. One pass rusher on the outside who can consistently get to the QB would not only help out the middle DT/DEs pushing, but also the secondary. Big time. In the 4-3 or the 3-4 or a mix. Its honestly sad this needs to be explained to Giants fans. Absolutely can't go in the with pack of slugs it's to bad Carter had the Akilies injury he was starting to come along nicely last year playing all over the formation. they can get value from the second round through the 3rd top of the fourth in this draft.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2021 11:54:45 GMT -5
We dont have the right LBs yet for the 3-4 IMO. Who will be our guy off the edge and can drop back? We need one of those good players. 4-3 we had Strahan, Osi, Tuck, JPP, Kiwi... 3-4 we have Lorenzo Carter, Ximines, Carter Coughlin, Cam Brown... I like some of these guys but none are anywhere near the level of play the guys in the 4-3 days were on the edge. We have the perfect LB's for 3-4... Lorenzo Carter is athletic enough to drop into coverage and so it Tae Crowder. Our LB's are the most athletic group we've had in a long time...and u still don't see it? So fans are still holding out hope that the Carter pick wasn't a waste even after this injury.. I don't think he's the answer and wouldn't be surprised if he's cut like Connelly was..
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2021 11:56:51 GMT -5
Im fine with a rotation of pass rushers getting to the QB. Our rotation of edge rushers is pretty weak. The issue I am taking up is the false claim that the edge pass rush is unimportant on our defense. It is important. It is very helpful. Getting a great one (or several very god ones) would boost this teams defense tremendously. One pass rusher on the outside who can consistently get to the QB would not only help out the middle DT/DEs pushing, but also the secondary. Big time. In the 4-3 or the 3-4 or a mix. Its honestly sad this needs to be explained to Giants fans. Absolutely can't go in the with pack of slugs it's to bad Carter had the Akilies injury he was starting to come along nicely last year playing all over the formation. they can get value from the second round through the 3rd top of the fourth in this draft. That's a career ending injury whatever it may be..
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Post by TheAnalyst on Apr 12, 2021 12:00:14 GMT -5
Absolutely can't go in the with pack of slugs it's to bad Carter had the Akilies injury he was starting to come along nicely last year playing all over the formation. they can get value from the second round through the 3rd top of the fourth in this draft. That's a career ending injury whatever it may be.. Named after Akili Smith.
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Post by giantlegacy on Apr 12, 2021 12:12:59 GMT -5
That's a career ending injury whatever it may be.. Named after Akili Smith. Kind of like how the Liz Frank injury was named after he sister Anne
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Post by Blue Hulk on Apr 12, 2021 16:01:52 GMT -5
Who was Tommy John surgery named after? And Lou Gherigs disease?
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Post by Fletch842 on Apr 12, 2021 16:37:24 GMT -5
Who was Tommy John surgery named after? And Lou Gherigs disease? John Wayne of course!!
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Post by IrishMike on Apr 12, 2021 17:16:12 GMT -5
Do we really run a 3-4? Seems like lines are super blurred in the NFL now.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 12, 2021 17:39:47 GMT -5
Do we really run a 3-4? Seems like lines are super blurred in the NFL now. why blurred? Look if the center(0/1 tech) has a player over him.
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Post by IrishMike on Apr 12, 2021 18:56:48 GMT -5
Do we really run a 3-4? Seems like lines are super blurred in the NFL now. why blurred? Look if the center(0/1 tech) has a player over him. Because our defensive coordinator literally said "they all kind of blend together in my mind" when asked about our alignment. Now you might be way smarter than me when it comes to football but I'll take Graham over you any day.
If they blend together in his mind they sure as hell blend together in mine as well. "So you say 4-3, 3-4, 2-4, 3-3-5, whatever you want to say, I’ll say yes". Maybe someone should our DC to just look at the center lol.
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Post by Rangers13 on Apr 12, 2021 19:05:45 GMT -5
why blurred? Look if the center(0/1 tech) has a player over him. Because our defensive coordinator literally said "they all kind of blend together in my mind" when asked about our alignment. Now you might be way smarter than me when it comes to football but I'll take Graham over you any day.
If they blend together in his mind they sure as hell blend together in mine as well. "So you say 4-3, 3-4, 2-4, 3-3-5, whatever you want to say, I’ll say yes". Maybe someone should our DC to just look at the center lol.
You really don’t understand football at all.
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