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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Mar 16, 2020 9:09:50 GMT -5
Yeah. I think he is worth $15m for this year unless we could find another pass rusher in free agency. This is a very weak free agent pass rush class and the draft class does not look good either. We need to improve our pass rush and I don't think removing our #2 man in QB pressures is a good plan in a year it's hard to find pass rushers. What is this about Jacksonville trading away Calais Campbell, supposedly for just a kicker and a 5th round pick? Am I missing something? No he is 34 and looking for a new deal.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Mar 16, 2020 9:12:36 GMT -5
Yeah. I think he is worth $15m for this year unless we could find another pass rusher in free agency. This is a very weak free agent pass rush class and the draft class does not look good either. We need to improve our pass rush and I don't think removing our #2 man in QB pressures is a good plan in a year it's hard to find pass rushers. Are you paying Williams 15M as a pass rusher? Williams will get what ever he gets because he can play every position in either front never come off the field and he is a second tier type DT.
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Post by jimmieray on Mar 16, 2020 9:23:42 GMT -5
What is this about Jacksonville trading away Calais Campbell, supposedly for just a kicker and a 5th round pick? Am I missing something? No he is 34 and looking for a new deal. 2 years, 27 million from the Ravens. Still feared around the league.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Mar 16, 2020 10:08:16 GMT -5
No he is 34 and looking for a new deal. 2 years, 27 million from the Ravens. Still feared around the league. match made team in the top 6 or 7 guy at the end of his career 34 little old for a team trying to build.
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Post by Fletch842 on Mar 16, 2020 13:21:20 GMT -5
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Post by bringsimmsback on Mar 16, 2020 15:18:31 GMT -5
Isn't Armstead more definitively an edge player than Williams? Regardless, I would put him slightly behind.
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Post by IrishMike on Mar 16, 2020 15:38:57 GMT -5
Are you paying Williams 15M as a pass rusher? No, $15m is the tag number for a DT. Pass rusher is not a position in football.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Mar 16, 2020 21:54:03 GMT -5
His and Armsteads Career were very similar till Armstead broke out this year adding Bosa helped I believe.
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Mar 16, 2020 21:55:51 GMT -5
Isn't Armstead more definitively an edge player than Williams? Regardless, I would put him slightly behind. He is a 3-4 DE 4-3 3tech DT they are similar.
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Post by Sarcasman on Mar 16, 2020 21:59:02 GMT -5
For the record, this thread about a DT is nearly 25 pages and 700 posts long.
I worry about you people.
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Post by Sarcasman on Mar 18, 2020 22:17:26 GMT -5
Yeah. I think he is worth $15m for this year unless we could find another pass rusher in free agency. This is a very weak free agent pass rush class and the draft class does not look good either. We need to improve our pass rush and I don't think removing our #2 man in QB pressures is a good plan in a year it's hard to find pass rushers. I'm torn on that concept. I very, very much don't want to set our D back a a single step, and I also don't want to over commit funds.The Tag does seem like a way to work right down the middle of that. I like him at 3 years for $40M with about $25M guaranteed.
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Post by TEM on Mar 19, 2020 7:01:52 GMT -5
I'm torn on that concept. I very, very much don't want to set our D back a a single step, and I also don't want to over commit funds.The Tag does seem like a way to work right down the middle of that. I like him at 3 years for $40M with about $25M guaranteed. I think that is doable without being a bank breaker . 8.33 a year in singing bonus . 4.7 spread across base pay , roster and workout. bonuses.
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Post by GameTime on Mar 19, 2020 7:06:31 GMT -5
I like him at 3 years for $40M with about $25M guaranteed. I think that is doable without being a bank breaker . 8.33 a year in singing bonus . 4.7 spread across base pay , roster and workout. bonuses. to make the best out of a scenario that was bad to begin with they need to make his deal as team friendly as possible. As a player I like the guy but of course the way he was acquired was/is the problem
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Post by TEM on Mar 19, 2020 7:14:02 GMT -5
I think that is doable without being a bank breaker . 8.33 a year in singing bonus . 4.7 spread across base pay , roster and workout. bonuses. to make the best out of a scenario that was bad to begin with they need to make his deal as team friendly as possible. As a player I like the guy but of course the way he was acquired was/is the problem I am more in the camp , How the journey leads to the destination. The journey is not over yet with LW. I do not see how it could be a bad or good decision . If it has not played out.
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Post by GameTime on Mar 19, 2020 7:18:43 GMT -5
to make the best out of a scenario that was bad to begin with they need to make his deal as team friendly as possible. As a player I like the guy but of course the way he was acquired was/is the problem I am more in the camp , How the journey leads to the destination. The journey is not over yet with LW. I do not see how it could be a bad or good decision . If it has not played out. Yeah I get that.... I guess I am falling into the public outcry of what the Giants gave up to get him was a "dumb" idea. I agree that if he winds up playing great for the NYGs for the next 5 years or so then yeah its ultimately a very good move
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Post by jimmieray on Mar 19, 2020 8:05:05 GMT -5
I am more in the camp , How the journey leads to the destination. The journey is not over yet with LW. I do not see how it could be a bad or good decision . If it has not played out. Yeah I get that.... I guess I am falling into the public outcry of what the Giants gave up to get him was a "dumb" idea. I agree that if he winds up playing great for the NYGs for the next 5 years or so then yeah its ultimately a very good move There's a bunch of somewhat recent personnel decisions that could be considered dumb, with some ultimately turning out to be beneficial. Beckham and Engram are still two big ones, the jury is still out on. I'll throw Jones in there too, at the risk of being chastised.
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Post by Delicreep on Mar 19, 2020 8:17:28 GMT -5
Yeah I get that.... I guess I am falling into the public outcry of what the Giants gave up to get him was a "dumb" idea. I agree that if he winds up playing great for the NYGs for the next 5 years or so then yeah its ultimately a very good move There's a bunch of somewhat recent personnel decisions that could be considered dumb, with some ultimately turning out to be beneficial. Beckham and Engram are still two big ones, the jury is still out on. I'll throw Jones in there too, at the risk of being chastised. The history of QB's suggest that everyone should question Jones...and hope for the best!
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Post by GameTime on Mar 19, 2020 8:17:48 GMT -5
Yeah I get that.... I guess I am falling into the public outcry of what the Giants gave up to get him was a "dumb" idea. I agree that if he winds up playing great for the NYGs for the next 5 years or so then yeah its ultimately a very good move There's a bunch of somewhat recent personnel decisions that could be considered dumb, with some ultimately turning out to be beneficial. Beckham and Engram are still two big ones, the jury is still out on. I'll throw Jones in there too, at the risk of being chastised. well all high draft pics, especially QBs, are a 3 to 5 year profile. Jones has started out very good. At least year one is positive. As far as OBJ.....they weren't winning with him and with his "brand" being more important than his game that decision in my mind is a great one and done deal. Unless his attitude changes he will bounce around he NFL making a handful of great plays here and there and never realize his what he could have been Engram.....nice player but not a game changer overall. AS far a LW or players in the same situation if they play really well then all else is "whatever"....
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Post by FundamentallySoundJones on Mar 19, 2020 14:16:19 GMT -5
There's a bunch of somewhat recent personnel decisions that could be considered dumb, with some ultimately turning out to be beneficial. Beckham and Engram are still two big ones, the jury is still out on. I'll throw Jones in there too, at the risk of being chastised. The history of QB's suggest that everyone should question Jones...and hope for the best! I have seen enough from him to not question him. He has it . now can we win a sb with him idk. but to me he is a starting qb. multiple 4 td games says he can throw and find the endzone. curb his turnovers a bit and we with a good D we will win quite a few games.
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Post by Morehead State on Mar 19, 2020 14:36:36 GMT -5
There's a bunch of somewhat recent personnel decisions that could be considered dumb, with some ultimately turning out to be beneficial. Beckham and Engram are still two big ones, the jury is still out on. I'll throw Jones in there too, at the risk of being chastised. The history of QB's suggest that everyone should question Jones...and hope for the best! The jury is still out on the kid but I like where he is. But really, Minchew was better last year than Jones and he was a late round pick.
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Post by Delicreep on Mar 19, 2020 15:33:08 GMT -5
The history of QB's suggest that everyone should question Jones...and hope for the best! The jury is still out on the kid but I like where he is. But really, Minchew was better last year than Jones and he was a late round pick. Oh, I am all about the draft experts being right about absolutely nothing....Gardner looked solid* to me, Haskins much less so. Happy with Jones so far - excited to see what he does this year! *Rookie solid; graded on a curve
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Post by Delicreep on Mar 19, 2020 15:33:51 GMT -5
The history of QB's suggest that everyone should question Jones...and hope for the best! I have seen enough from him to not question him. He has it . now can we win a sb with him idk. but to me he is a starting qb. multiple 4 td games says he can throw and find the endzone. curb his turnovers a bit and we with a good D we will win quite a few games. You see enough of Mayfield?
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Post by FundamentallySoundJones on Mar 19, 2020 20:09:59 GMT -5
I have seen enough from him to not question him. He has it . now can we win a sb with him idk. but to me he is a starting qb. multiple 4 td games says he can throw and find the endzone. curb his turnovers a bit and we with a good D we will win quite a few games. You see enough of Mayfield? thats a good point , i havent watched many browns games to tell.
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Post by Delicreep on Mar 19, 2020 20:25:09 GMT -5
You see enough of Mayfield? thats a good point , i havent watched many browns games to tell. I'm just saying these rookie QB's shouldn't be be crowned and they shouldn't be trashed after what is really a handful of games. Like I said...happy with what I have seen so far from Jones.
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Post by FundamentallySoundJones on Mar 19, 2020 20:33:40 GMT -5
thats a good point , i havent watched many browns games to tell. I'm just saying these rookie QB's shouldn't be be crowned and they shouldn't be trashed after what is really a handful of games. Like I said...happy with what I have seen so far from Jones. i hear you , i just feel 4 4td or more games in no fluke. we saw his mechanics and accuracy all year. still he may go through a sophomore slump , i hope fans will be patient
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Post by Delicreep on Mar 19, 2020 20:57:36 GMT -5
I'm just saying these rookie QB's shouldn't be be crowned and they shouldn't be trashed after what is really a handful of games. Like I said...happy with what I have seen so far from Jones. i hear you , i just feel 4 4td or more games in no fluke. we saw his mechanics and accuracy all year. still he may go through a sophomore slump , i hope fans will be patient I think most will me.
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Post by jimmieray on Mar 20, 2020 5:28:48 GMT -5
thats a good point , i havent watched many browns games to tell. I'm just saying these rookie QB's shouldn't be be crowned and they shouldn't be trashed after what is really a handful of games. Like I said...happy with what I have seen so far from Jones. I can gush also over his ball delivery, there were times watching last season where it got me pumped up. But the fumbles, which can be the biggest game killers at the wrong time or field position, were not concentrated upon adequately in my mind. Since the commotion over why Williams was acquired at such an odd time and cost is still being beaten loudly by many, I feel it was similarly foolish to not dial back the stats Jones produced in a season lost so early, and get the issue corrected for this season's hopes. I know, we'll have a different coaching staff, line personnel, maybe better blocking from other positions... but how will the camps go on?
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Post by BigBlueDog42 on Mar 21, 2020 20:04:13 GMT -5
I am more in the camp , How the journey leads to the destination. The journey is not over yet with LW. I do not see how it could be a bad or good decision . If it has not played out. Yeah I get that.... I guess I am falling into the public outcry of what the Giants gave up to get him was a "dumb" idea. I agree that if he winds up playing great for the NYGs for the next 5 years or so then yeah its ultimately a very good move As a fan hope he kills it earns the money.
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Post by Morehead State on Mar 22, 2020 9:16:14 GMT -5
The jury is still out on the kid but I like where he is. But really, Minchew was better last year than Jones and he was a late round pick. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gardner_MinshewNFL statistics Year Team Games Passing Rushing Fumbles GP GS Comp Att Pct Yds Avg TD Int Rtg Att Yds Avg TD Fum Lost 2019 JAX 14 12 285 470 60.6 3,271 6.9 21 6 91.2 67 344 5.1 0 13 7 Career 14 12 285 470 60.6 3,271 6.9 21 6 91.2 67 344 5.1 0 13 7 en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Jones_(American_football)Danial Jones Source: NFL Season Team Games Passing Rushing Fumbles GP GS Cmp Att Pct Yds Y/A TD Int Rate Sck SckY Att Yds Avg TD Fum Lost 2019 NYG 13 12 284 459 61.9 3,027 6.6 24 12 87.7 38 295 45 279 6.2 2 18 11 Total 13 12 284 459 61.9 3,027 6.6 24 12 87.7 38 295 45 279 6.2 2 18 11 Giants Franchise records Most Games started (rookie season): 12 (2019) Most Completions (rookie season): 284 (2019) Most Pass Attempts (rookie season): 459 (2019) Highest Completion Percentage (rookie season): 61.8% (2019) Most Passing Yards (rookie season): 3,027 (2019) Most Passing TDs (rookie season): 24 (2019) Most Passer Rating (rookie season): 87.7 (2019) Most Pass Yds/Game (rookie season): 232.8 (2019) Most Losses (rookie season): 9 (2019) Most 4th Quarter Comebacks (rookie season): 1 (2019) (tied with 6 other players) Most Game Winning Drives (rookie season): 2 (2019) NFL records Most passing touchdowns in a single game by a rookie quarterback: 5 (December 22, 2019 vs. Washington Redskins) (tied with Ray Buivid, Matthew Stafford, Jameis Winston, and Deshaun Watson)[31] First rookie to have three games with 4 touchdown passes and no interceptions.[32] As usual, you are not making a point here. So I guess I will since you are not able....yet again.
I like the kid. I'm encouraged by his abilities. He makes a lot of plays.
My concern isn't just the fumbles. It's the lack of pocket awareness that I believe is a major contributor to those fumbles. He has to be better and more aware of his surroundings in the pocket. he has to start feeling the rush or the fumbles will continue.
My hope is that he will but that is a high hurdle.
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Post by GameTime on Mar 22, 2020 9:24:57 GMT -5
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gardner_MinshewNFL statistics Year Team Games Passing Rushing Fumbles GP GS Comp Att Pct Yds Avg TD Int Rtg Att Yds Avg TD Fum Lost 2019 JAX 14 12 285 470 60.6 3,271 6.9 21 6 91.2 67 344 5.1 0 13 7 Career 14 12 285 470 60.6 3,271 6.9 21 6 91.2 67 344 5.1 0 13 7 en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniel_Jones_(American_football)Danial Jones Source: NFL Season Team Games Passing Rushing Fumbles GP GS Cmp Att Pct Yds Y/A TD Int Rate Sck SckY Att Yds Avg TD Fum Lost 2019 NYG 13 12 284 459 61.9 3,027 6.6 24 12 87.7 38 295 45 279 6.2 2 18 11 Total 13 12 284 459 61.9 3,027 6.6 24 12 87.7 38 295 45 279 6.2 2 18 11 Giants Franchise records Most Games started (rookie season): 12 (2019) Most Completions (rookie season): 284 (2019) Most Pass Attempts (rookie season): 459 (2019) Highest Completion Percentage (rookie season): 61.8% (2019) Most Passing Yards (rookie season): 3,027 (2019) Most Passing TDs (rookie season): 24 (2019) Most Passer Rating (rookie season): 87.7 (2019) Most Pass Yds/Game (rookie season): 232.8 (2019) Most Losses (rookie season): 9 (2019) Most 4th Quarter Comebacks (rookie season): 1 (2019) (tied with 6 other players) Most Game Winning Drives (rookie season): 2 (2019) NFL records Most passing touchdowns in a single game by a rookie quarterback: 5 (December 22, 2019 vs. Washington Redskins) (tied with Ray Buivid, Matthew Stafford, Jameis Winston, and Deshaun Watson)[31] First rookie to have three games with 4 touchdown passes and no interceptions.[32] As usual, you are not making a point here. So I guess I will since you are not able....yet again.
I like the kid. I'm encouraged by his abilities. He makes a lot of plays.
My concern isn't just the fumbles. It's the lack of pocket awareness that I believe is a major contributor to those fumbles. He has to be better and more aware of his surroundings in the pocket. he has to start feeling the rush or the fumbles will continue.
My hope is that he will but that is a high hurdle.
i think it may be a combo of some lack of awareness and some toughness by standing in there and taking the hits to possibly make a play. Either way it needs to be cleaned up. The issue is every single fumble, and there will be more, will be magnified 10x unitl he gets it under control
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